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Made in au
Towering Hierophant Bio-Titan





Time for a thread now that we have moved on from the index. I'll update the OP with tactica closer to release.

For now, here's a heavy breakdown from ITC vet and playtester, InControl. Definitely worth the watch even if you think you've kept up with all the leaks so far, he pretty much goes through everything.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34wConvy5p0

Post discussion in here. Vigilus included.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/02/02 13:07:30


P.S.A. I won't read your posts if you break it into a million separate quotes and make an eyesore of it. 
   
Made in it
Dakka Veteran




Aberrants are our premiere CQC unit now, If not taking Twisted Helix (why wouldn't you?) you're forced to pay for the Anointed Throng formation to unlock a quasi-attack again stratagem (otherwise it's not needed because the 3 CP ones from Twisted Helix is far superior in most if not all circumstances).

By the way they raised the cost of Seismic Cannons up to 12 (from 10)...did they change anything about them? Mining Laser and Heavy Mining Lasers received hefty buffs and also minor discounts...there must be some odd reason for increasing the cost of already underpowered guns like Seismic Cannons...

Also R.I.P Abominant, Price increase and -1 to Hit killed him
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





Very happy that Ridgerunners are a 1-3 option, and given their cheapness we may be running a lot of them.

Painting Warhammer 40,000 Conquest a P and M blog : https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/763491.page 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut






HATE Club, East London

Strat_N8 updated the Index tactica front page primer post 92 times, most recently on two days ago

Shuppet, do you want the responsibility of doing the same, or would it be better to let Strat_N8 make a new thread instead of this one?

Though guards may sleep and ships may lay at anchor, our foes know full well that big guns never tire.

Posting as Fifty_Painting on Instagram.

My blog - almost 40 pages of Badab War, Eldar, undead and other assorted projects 
   
Made in es
Longtime Dakkanaut





Some pics:
https://imgur.com/a/EJXxpZC

With acolytes with saw for 17 points im not sure if aberrants are necessary.

I was thinking in play only neophytes on table with some characters as patriarch (and some mortars) and the other 1000 points in ambush acolytes with some characters.

But maybe its better play full acolytes, ork style, with 100 acolytes on ambush and 100 on table.
In the end the neophytes do not shoot very well, and for 2 points more you have acolytes..
   
Made in us
Storm Trooper with Maglight





CO

Those screenshots reveal the webber automatically hits now ...

5k Imperial Guard
2k Ad Mech 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Colonel Cross wrote:
Those screenshots reveal the webber automatically hits now ...


Its very cheap which is nice - but its still so marginal that its probably not worth thinking about unless you are trying to get a list exactly to the points limit. Its about as useful as stormbolter.
   
Made in de
Dakka Veteran






5 jackals with demo charges, rusted claw and using the two grenade strats can kill most vehicles in the game in one round for 75 points.
Unfortunately the only way to use them apparently
   
Made in au
Towering Hierophant Bio-Titan





zamerion wrote:
Some pics:
https://imgur.com/a/EJXxpZC

With acolytes with saw for 17 points im not sure if aberrants are necessary.

I was thinking in play only neophytes on table with some characters as patriarch (and some mortars) and the other 1000 points in ambush acolytes with some characters.

But maybe its better play full acolytes, ork style, with 100 acolytes on ambush and 100 on table.
In the end the neophytes do not shoot very well, and for 2 points more you have acolytes..

A horde of 4 armed Emperor Neophytes in a Deliverance Broodsurge detachment seems like it might be something tough. A blob of screens that effectively deploys in your opponents face and then has to make an 8" re-rollable charge? I think that's like a 70% success rate or something. Turn 2 deepstrike stops it from locking them in DZ or anything but I still think it's pretty good as far as hordes go, they don't really pay much to do this, 5ppm and a CP for the detachment is no big deal. And then you will be able to turn those Neophytes into a ton of CP for Vecting every thing should you choose.

P.S.A. I won't read your posts if you break it into a million separate quotes and make an eyesore of it. 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




In the rumor thread the Warhammer team verfied that blips don't count as reserves so you can deploy the entire army by blip if you wish. They are going to add it into our FAQ in a few weeks to stop any arguments that might occur.
   
Made in us
Haemonculi Flesh Apprentice






Anyone notice if Neophytes can take a chimera any longer, or is that just for brood brothers now?

   
Made in de
Dakka Veteran






 Red Corsair wrote:
Anyone notice if Neophytes can take a chimera any longer, or is that just for brood brothers now?


Just for brood bros.
   
Made in no
Liche Priest Hierophant





Bergen

I am a bit confused about the brood brother things and our troop choises?

The old index had 1 units you could build from 2 differnet kits. The miner kits, with 2 special weapons and 2 mining weapons. And one that could take an IG heavy weapon.

Is this two seperate units now? And one of them (the miners) benefit from army wide traits, while the other (the one from the IG kit) does not benefit from amry wide trait? Is that correct. Please comment. I am very confused.

   
Made in us
Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend




Uppsala, Sweden

 Niiai wrote:
I am a bit confused about the brood brother things and our troop choises?

The old index had 1 units you could build from 2 differnet kits. The miner kits, with 2 special weapons and 2 mining weapons. And one that could take an IG heavy weapon.

Is this two seperate units now? And one of them (the miners) benefit from army wide traits, while the other (the one from the IG kit) does not benefit from amry wide trait? Is that correct. Please comment. I am very confused.


Yeah, as far as I've understood things you are right. We now have three Troops choices. First acolytes. Second the miners, Neophytes, 5p each, they get the <cult> trait and mining weapons and can ride in the goliath vehicles. Third Brood Brothers, 4p each, they are pictured built from the cadian models with neophyte heads, they get heavy weapon teams and can ride in the chimera.
   
Made in no
Liche Priest Hierophant





Bergen

OK. I converted some of my neophytes into a IG heavy weapon thim. This needs some readjusting and removing some Green stuff.

Edit: Also, who can ride in the chimera? Only the long raged IG squad? :-/

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/02/02 21:34:25


   
Made in us
Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend




Uppsala, Sweden

The chimera says it transports "Brood Brother infantry". And that's only the brood brothers squad and the brood brothers heavy weapon squads (they are exactly like the AM HWTs) and any infantry you have in an allied AM detachment.
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




Thats a bummer, the chimera was always better than the goliath for transporting acolytes and aberrants. I’m really liking the look of the rock grinder though. Its got +1 ws and s over the index and the clearance incinerator is 2d6 instead of d6 hits. Should pack a nice punch whilst ferrying a strike team of acolytes. Bonus points if you have demo charges and auto detonate using the stratagem
   
Made in no
Liche Priest Hierophant





Bergen

I saw the video with the cpdex explained where ther jackslad squad is pressented as not that impressive. I had two thoughts on this: use it to deliver a flamer and use the throw grenade stratagem?

Also, regarding cult creeds, are there some units in the codex that do not benefit from it? Like genestealers or the guardsmenn?

   
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CO

I think the biggest let down is the fact the Chimera can no longer transport any infantry models. Both because of the effectiveness in game as well as the hurt on my wallet now that I need to get more goliath trucks/grinders :(

5k Imperial Guard
2k Ad Mech 
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




I couldn’t see any limit on the amount of demo charges a bike squad can take, so I’m thinking a squad of 5 all with demos with the grenadier strat and the drive by strat should do the trick to most things. With Jackal support, thats a 50% of a knights health on average
   
Made in us
Haemonculi Flesh Apprentice






C4790M wrote:
I couldn’t see any limit on the amount of demo charges a bike squad can take, so I’m thinking a squad of 5 all with demos with the grenadier strat and the drive by strat should do the trick to most things. With Jackal support, thats a 50% of a knights health on average


Yea and they get to cult ambush, so with the 2 CP Lying in Wait strat that lets you appear 3" away it wouldn't be too hard to pull off. In fact with three units you could do it multiple turns in a row lol. Thats not bad for a 75 pt unit.

Edit: BTW that is a bummer about chimeras. I only have 2 but I converted them to look like construction vehicles, they basically look like a bull dozer with no plow. I suppose I could switch the gear and treat them as trucks though. I have 3 grinders and only 1 truck, that truck kit is cancer to assemble. I might pick two more up though.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/02/03 01:54:42


   
Made in no
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Bergen

 Red Corsair wrote:
C4790M wrote:
I couldn’t see any limit on the amount of demo charges a bike squad can take, so I’m thinking a squad of 5 all with demos with the grenadier strat and the drive by strat should do the trick to most things. With Jackal support, thats a 50% of a knights health on average


Yea and they get to cult ambush, so with the 2 CP Lying in Wait strat that lets you appear 3" away it wouldn't be too hard to pull off. In fact with three units you could do it multiple turns in a row lol. Thats not bad for a 75 pt unit.


Was it not something like you can take weapons from a list but no two models can take the same one? And then some numbered restriction like medium weapon and the car weapon?

   
Made in us
Haemonculi Flesh Apprentice






 Niiai wrote:
 Red Corsair wrote:
C4790M wrote:
I couldn’t see any limit on the amount of demo charges a bike squad can take, so I’m thinking a squad of 5 all with demos with the grenadier strat and the drive by strat should do the trick to most things. With Jackal support, thats a 50% of a knights health on average


Yea and they get to cult ambush, so with the 2 CP Lying in Wait strat that lets you appear 3" away it wouldn't be too hard to pull off. In fact with three units you could do it multiple turns in a row lol. Thats not bad for a 75 pt unit.


Was it not something like you can take weapons from a list but no two models can take the same one? And then some numbered restriction like medium weapon and the car weapon?


Can you clarify that, I am not sure I understand what your asking?

   
Made in au
Towering Hierophant Bio-Titan





 Red Corsair wrote:
C4790M wrote:
I couldn’t see any limit on the amount of demo charges a bike squad can take, so I’m thinking a squad of 5 all with demos with the grenadier strat and the drive by strat should do the trick to most things. With Jackal support, thats a 50% of a knights health on average


Yea and they get to cult ambush, so with the 2 CP Lying in Wait strat that lets you appear 3" away it wouldn't be too hard to pull off. In fact with three units you could do it multiple turns in a row lol. Thats not bad for a 75 pt unit.

If that's true they might actually be good. But I think only twice as everything has to be down by turn 3. Also 225 pts feels significantly more to me than 150.

P.S.A. I won't read your posts if you break it into a million separate quotes and make an eyesore of it. 
   
Made in us
Shadowy Grot Kommittee Memba






Tyel wrote:
 Colonel Cross wrote:
Those screenshots reveal the webber automatically hits now ...


Its very cheap which is nice - but its still so marginal that its probably not worth thinking about unless you are trying to get a list exactly to the points limit. Its about as useful as stormbolter.


Yeah, i actually like it. nice little way to bump up the firepower of a neophyte squad vs infantry without having to take them out of their 12" rapid fire comfort zone.

"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"

"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"

"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"

"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!"  
   
Made in no
Liche Priest Hierophant





Bergen

So the jacklayt entry: The leader and two jackals can take weapons from the jackal list. The same model can not have the same weapon twice. every four Grenade launcher etc.

Any jackal can take 1 of 4 weapons (no grenade pack though)

The car can replace the stubber with such and such.

Where does it say they can take the big boom grenades?

   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




I'm having a little bit of a hard time envisioning what a solid army looks like, while avoiding the things it feels like we're punished for taking.

Heavy support slot is pretty slim without LRs, elite slot feels pretty over-packed. FA I guess will be bikes, though their exact role seems kind of scattered brained at this point?

Troops...seem solid~ish? But they're more or less deep striking IG but without orders and more expensive? That isn't bad, I guess, but no one is really running guard hordes exactly.

It feels like the better build is going to be a patrol or small brigade of kraken stealers (because ours are awful?), a supreme command of tank commanders are the real "base" of the army. And then I guess we build from there? Hard to see at the moment though outside of I guess DS'ing aberrants and character assassins we really bring to the fore.
   
Made in us
Shadowy Grot Kommittee Memba






So...so bikes. Looking at the unit entry i've confirmed they can take 2 waepons from the atalan weapon list, which does include both an autogun and a shotgun. So, you can have one of each, 1 in 4 gets a GL, and you can take a flamer on the quad.

Theyre just a fast, somewhat more durable per wound version of neophytes. If you have to fill fast slots for brigades, I think you could take either them or sentinels.

"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"

"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"

"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"

"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!"  
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Connecticut

Helix Brigade, Broodsurge

Primus, Icon, Patriarch

6x 10 Acolytes

Nexos, Clamavus, Kellermorph

3x4 Bikes
3x3 HWT

Helix Throng

Magus, Abom
3x10 BB

1x10 Abbs, 8 Picks/2 Improvised

Rusted Claw Batt

Icon, Magus

3x10 Neo

Sanctus, Knife

This is the list I'm working with

Patriarch is the Helix WT and Helix Relic, Primus is +3" Aura WT, Magus is +1 LD and Crouchling, Iconward is the Broodsurge relic and WT, and we then enable the Patriarch Combo.

LD+3 Makes him LD13, enables the mind war combo against anything LD7-9 quite successfully, while also being a monster in combat.

60 Helix Acolytes w/ reroll charges when near the Iconward, 12 Bikes with Cultists Knives and Shotguns taking late and forward objectives, while some brood brother hold ground in deployment, Rusted Claw Neophytes go midfield or backfield for further objectives, their Icon helping them with FNP to their 3+ in cover. Meanwhile the Rusted Claw Sanctus can take the Amulet to help deny overwatch while using perfect ambush to make easy charges, and making him a 2+ against shooting it ap- and 1, in case he deletes a lone character or stays around after an assault he's more defensive and likely to leave the table again.


The single Abb squad let's me focus on keeping them Alice and double fighting, since I have 20CP and the Nexos package to Regen 5-6 more over the course of a game, we have some flexibility with our aggression and monstrous vigor, which is also rerolling 1s with the Iconward, and our Kellermorph is showing up when the time is right to give everyone reroll 1s on top of their +1 from the Primus and his 9" auras.

That's how I see it. Lemme know how you see it!

Sanctus, Knife

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/02/03 02:37:52


Blood Angels, Custodes, Tzeentch, Alpha Legion, Astra Militarum, Deathwatch, Thousand Sons, Imperial Knights, Tau, Genestealer Cult.

I have a problem.

Being contrary for the sake of being contrary doesn't make you unique, it makes you annoying.

 Purifier wrote:
Using your rules isn't being a dick.
 
   
Made in us
Haemonculi Flesh Apprentice






 SHUPPET wrote:
 Red Corsair wrote:
C4790M wrote:
I couldn’t see any limit on the amount of demo charges a bike squad can take, so I’m thinking a squad of 5 all with demos with the grenadier strat and the drive by strat should do the trick to most things. With Jackal support, thats a 50% of a knights health on average


Yea and they get to cult ambush, so with the 2 CP Lying in Wait strat that lets you appear 3" away it wouldn't be too hard to pull off. In fact with three units you could do it multiple turns in a row lol. Thats not bad for a 75 pt unit.

If that's true they might actually be good. But I think only twice as everything has to be down by turn 3. Also 225 pts feels significantly more to me than 150.


Well don't forget the drill and return to the shadows will allow extra units to enter reserve from the table and I am pretty sure they get past the turn 3 restriction. Two units is probably fine though. I would actually consider keeping a third more bare bones and possibly larger for the first turn, as it is nice having a fast unit to mow down screens and tie forward threats down.

It's ludicrous BTW that hand flamers are only 1ppm. It might be even better to just pop up 10 acolytes with hand flamers for only 80 pts. that will average you 35 s3 hits lol.

   
 
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