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Made in gb
Dominating Dominatrix






Title says it all

+++++There are currently NINETY SEVEN (97) documents required to play Warhammer 40,000 8th edition+++++ (Discord: BaconCatBug#0294)
Disclaimer: My YMDC answers are from a "What the rules, as written (or modified by Special Snowflake FAQ) in the rulebooks, actually say" perspective, not a "What I wish the rules said" perspective. Even GW agrees with me, send an email to 40kfaq@gwplc.com for a confirmation reply "4. Apply The Rules As Written. If you still don’t have a satisfactory answer, use the rule just as it is written if you possibly can, even if you are not completely happy with the effect the rule has."
Because some people get their knickers in a twist, I'll list these RaW 'oddities' in my sig. Sadly GW's promise of fixing their broken rules has itself been broken. Zoom in to read them.
RaW you cannot advance and then fire assault weapons, you can't shoot pistols if within 1" of an enemy; "minimum" ranges don't work; the game simply breaks if you ever have more than one wounded model in a unit; the game also breaks if a single rule ever tries to do multiple things simultaneously; Librarians on Bikes are locked to the Index power list, Howling Banshees can't declare a charge further than 12"; Spore Mines have an infinite range; Shroudpsalm technically doesn't do anything, only enemy models, not friendly models, have permission to move on top of a Skyshield Landing Pad; T'au have access to stackable Ignore Wounds (albeit against Mortal Wounds only); the T'au Early Warning Override Support System only works if a unit is "teleporting to the battlefield", not just arriving mid-battle; you can only ever use the Deathwatch Teleportarium Stratagem "once", and then never again in any battle after you use it; if a model splits fire, each weapon must target a different unit; a Tyrant Guard with Lashwhip can absorb an infinite amount of damage via Shieldwall between the time they die and the time they fight; Codex Leman Russ's can take an infinite amount of Hunter-Killer Missiles, Storm Bolters and Heavy Stubbers; Imothekh's 'Lord of the Storm' ability hits the "target unit" twice; Wave Serpents cannot be legally charged at by any model with a standard base; Slab Shields, along with the 'Take Cover!' stratagem no longer have any effect; and vehicles that are "slain" by a special effect do not trigger the "Explodes" ability; Taking any Forge World Space Marine Named Characters denies the use of a Chapter Tactic; Vectored Manoeuvring Thrusters may be used to move within 1" of an enemy unit during the Movement Phase and does not benefit from FLY; and Scout Sentinels may use "Go! Recon!" to move within 1" of an enemy unit during the shooting phase.
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Made in gb
Resolute Ultramarine Honor Guard




Nottingham

Agreed. It's arguably even more distinct from 40k than Kill Team is.

Read the history of the Charadon Crusade: The Crusade of Fury was at an end.
Join the Crion Crusade: I think it's the combination of butt jokes, democratic necrons, explosions, and mind-fething that draws people to this Crusade like moths to a bug zapper - War Kitten
Rippy wrote:Never forgetti, template spaghetti.
DR:90S++G++MB+IPw40k07-D++A++/sWD366R++T(F)DM+ 
   
Made in us
Mighty Chosen Warrior of Chaos





The Wastes of Krieg

Perhaps just have a subsection for Apocalypse in general
   
Made in us
Major General






Florence, KY

DeathKorp_Rider wrote:
Perhaps just have a subsection for Apocalypse in general

Apocalypse (or any game) won't have its own forum until it has proven to have enough sustained discussion to warrant one.

'It is a source of constant consternation that my opponents
cannot correlate their innate inferiority with their inevitable
defeat. It would seem that stupidity is as eternal as war.'

- Nemesor Zahndrekh of the Sautekh Dynasty
Overlord of the Crownworld of Gidrim
 
   
Made in us
Douglas Bader






Disagree. It's a better 40k game than 40k is and is pretty much a straight replacement.

There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices. 
   
Made in us
Blood-Drenched Death Company Marine






Hardly, give it a month and You and BCB will have ripped it into pieces. I'm sure BCB alone will generate enough post about rules to justify a separate Apocalypse forum.

“You know, the very powerful and the very stupid have one thing in common, They don’t alter their views to fit the facts. They alter the facts to fit their views.” -- The Doctor 
   
Made in gb
Dark Angels Librarian with Book of Secrets





Cardiff

...with not a single game played between them.


FWIW I agree with OP that Apocalypse should have its own space.

 Stormonu wrote:
For me, the joy is in putting some good-looking models on the board and playing out a fantasy battle - not arguing over the poorly-made rules of some 3rd party who neither has any power over my play nor will be visiting me (and my opponent) to ensure we are "playing by the rules"
 
   
Made in gb
Resolute Ultramarine Honor Guard




Nottingham

Peregrine wrote:Disagree. It's a better 40k game than 40k is and is pretty much a straight replacement.
That doesn't mean it's any different to Kill Team in terms of being a different game mode. It absolutely should be treated as a specialist game, like Kill Team, even if you believe it's superior.

Read the history of the Charadon Crusade: The Crusade of Fury was at an end.
Join the Crion Crusade: I think it's the combination of butt jokes, democratic necrons, explosions, and mind-fething that draws people to this Crusade like moths to a bug zapper - War Kitten
Rippy wrote:Never forgetti, template spaghetti.
DR:90S++G++MB+IPw40k07-D++A++/sWD366R++T(F)DM+ 
   
Made in us
Douglas Bader






 Sgt_Smudge wrote:
Peregrine wrote:Disagree. It's a better 40k game than 40k is and is pretty much a straight replacement.
That doesn't mean it's any different to Kill Team in terms of being a different game mode. It absolutely should be treated as a specialist game, like Kill Team, even if you believe it's superior.


Kill team is a very different game because it's a 10-model skirmish game. Apocalypse is more like 8th edition replacing 7th, it's a direct and superior substitute for the old version of the game.

There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices. 
   
Made in gb
Dark Angels Librarian with Book of Secrets





Cardiff

No, no it isn’t. It’s even marketed as a third style of 40K. Stop trying to pretend your preference (after playing zero games) is fact. Apocalypse is demonstrably not a replacement for 8th edition.

 Stormonu wrote:
For me, the joy is in putting some good-looking models on the board and playing out a fantasy battle - not arguing over the poorly-made rules of some 3rd party who neither has any power over my play nor will be visiting me (and my opponent) to ensure we are "playing by the rules"
 
   
Made in ie
Norn Queen






Dublin, Ireland

In principle I'd agree with its own subsection but I'd give it 2-3 months to see it really takes off before building one.

Could be dead by later this year if GW dont keep up with the support for it.

Dman137 wrote:
goobs is all you guys will ever be

By 1-irt: Still as long as Hissy keeps showing up this is one of the most entertaining threads ever.

"Feelin' goods, good enough". 
   
Made in gb
Resolute Ultramarine Honor Guard




Nottingham

Peregrine wrote:
 Sgt_Smudge wrote:
Peregrine wrote:Disagree. It's a better 40k game than 40k is and is pretty much a straight replacement.
That doesn't mean it's any different to Kill Team in terms of being a different game mode. It absolutely should be treated as a specialist game, like Kill Team, even if you believe it's superior.


Kill team is a very different game because it's a 10-model skirmish game. Apocalypse is more like 8th edition replacing 7th, it's a direct and superior substitute for the old version of the game.
But if you play 40k at a smaller points level, Kill Team is more like 40k than Apocalypse is. On paper, they're both just expansions of the base 40k game, you shouldn't have Kill Team relegated to Specialist Games, and not Apocalypse.

Just because you like it (and who knows, I might like Apocalypse if I sat down and played it) doesn't mean it's any more than what Kill Team is - an expansion.

Read the history of the Charadon Crusade: The Crusade of Fury was at an end.
Join the Crion Crusade: I think it's the combination of butt jokes, democratic necrons, explosions, and mind-fething that draws people to this Crusade like moths to a bug zapper - War Kitten
Rippy wrote:Never forgetti, template spaghetti.
DR:90S++G++MB+IPw40k07-D++A++/sWD366R++T(F)DM+ 
   
Made in us
Veteran Knight Baron in a Crusader




Neither are expansions. They're separate rule sets (entirely so, in the case of Apocalypse). The old cities of death was an expansion, the new Apoc is a completely different game.

Which is why it should be in a separate section. An expansion wouldn't be.

Efficiency is the highest virtue. 
   
Made in us
Horrific Hive Tyrant






While apoc is marketed as a new game all the talk is about apoc being used in place of 8th. Not just by me here but in my local shops.

I agree we should wait and see how active a topic it becomes before a new section is created. But dont discredit the idea that its a new edition of the base game by another name if thats how people are going to use it.


These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.

 JohnHwangDD wrote:

The Nazis were right. It's better to be a Nazi than a fan.

Thank you for getting me on the side of Milo and the Nazis.

 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
[***]






Svalarheima, MA

 Lance845 wrote:
While apoc is marketed as a new game all the talk is about apoc being used in place of 8th. Not just by me here but in my local shops.

I agree we should wait and see how active a topic it becomes before a new section is created. But dont discredit the idea that its a new edition of the base game by another name if thats how people are going to use it.


Where can I find this talk - or better yet, a review?

I was thinking of using the new Apocalypse rules as a basis for a new "40K Epic" game, but maybe I should be looking at it to replace 40K 8th straight up?

Nil nos tremefacit.
 
   
Made in us
Douglas Bader






 Alpharius wrote:
 Lance845 wrote:
While apoc is marketed as a new game all the talk is about apoc being used in place of 8th. Not just by me here but in my local shops.

I agree we should wait and see how active a topic it becomes before a new section is created. But dont discredit the idea that its a new edition of the base game by another name if thats how people are going to use it.


Where can I find this talk - or better yet, a review?

I was thinking of using the new Apocalypse rules as a basis for a new "40K Epic" game, but maybe I should be looking at it to replace 40K 8th straight up?


https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/777567.page

TL;DR: some balance issues (like any GW game) but the core rules are promising and the few issues can probably be fixed by a "normal 40k" set of house rules.

There is no such thing as a hobby without politics. "Leave politics at the door" is itself a political statement, an endorsement of the status quo and an attempt to silence dissenting voices. 
   
Made in us
Horrific Hive Tyrant






 Alpharius wrote:
 Lance845 wrote:
While apoc is marketed as a new game all the talk is about apoc being used in place of 8th. Not just by me here but in my local shops.

I agree we should wait and see how active a topic it becomes before a new section is created. But dont discredit the idea that its a new edition of the base game by another name if thats how people are going to use it.


Where can I find this talk - or better yet, a review?

I was thinking of using the new Apocalypse rules as a basis for a new "40K Epic" game, but maybe I should be looking at it to replace 40K 8th straight up?


I would say yes. Replace it straight up. My 2k nids list is 126pl. 100-150 pl in apoc is what people seem to be playing. Ive had 2 games so far and i have 2 more planned for this weekend. This literally revitalized my interest in playing 40k.


These are my opinions. This is how I feel. Others may feel differently. This needs to be stated for some reason.

 JohnHwangDD wrote:

The Nazis were right. It's better to be a Nazi than a fan.

Thank you for getting me on the side of Milo and the Nazis.

 
   
Made in nz
[MOD]
Villanous Scum






Can we please keep all 40k Apocalypse conversation (except N&R and P&M) to the Specialist Games forum and tag it appropriately. If it generates enough conversation we can look at adding an exclusive forum for it but until then that's the place to post it.

Thanks all,
ingtaer.

On parle toujours mal quand on n'a rien à dire.
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