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Just an observation. I was thumbing through old White Dwarfs and found the movie marines release they did, which happens to be online.

https://1d4chan.org/images/1/16/CodexMovieMarines.pdf

I remember seeing these and actually playing a game with them. It was crazy OP

Primaris marines are very close to this. Keep in mind this was when BS/WS had the weird chart, so 5 is more like a 2+.
Primaris hit on 3s and often have reroll 1's or misses buffs.

Guns are assualt 4 with Rending, which is basically the Bolter Rules and Tactical Doctrine.
They both have 2 wounds, though the toughness is a bit higher for the move marines, but it only matters on weapons that are STR 5,6 which is fairly sparse.
Attacks are on part, leadership is on par, initiative isnt even used.

The only main thing they are missing are the 10 "wounds" think Shield Drones like. Which for the new Iron hands healing, FnP abilities is not much more a stretch.

It seems we have power crept to damn near movie marines.

Thoughts?

 Dynas wrote:

Just an observation. I was thumbing through old White Dwarfs and found the movie marines release they did, which happens to be online.

https://1d4chan.org/images/1/16/CodexMovieMarines.pdf

I remember seeing these and actually playing a game with them. It was crazy OP

Primaris marines are very close to this. Keep in mind this was when BS/WS had the weird chart, so 5 is more like a 2+.
Primaris hit on 3s and often have reroll 1's or misses buffs.

Guns are assualt 4 with Rending, which is basically the Bolter Rules and Tactical Doctrine.
They both have 2 wounds, though the toughness is a bit higher for the move marines, but it only matters on weapons that are STR 5,6 which is fairly sparse.
Attacks are on part, leadership is on par, initiative isnt even used.

The only main thing they are missing are the 10 "wounds" think Shield Drones like. Which for the new Iron hands healing, FnP abilities is not much more a stretch.

It seems we have power crept to damn near movie marines.

Thoughts?

“Power crept.”
Don’t you mean raised to what marines should be?

 Apple Peel wrote:

“Power crept.”
Don’t you mean raised to what marines should be?

Flatly superior to baseline units of every other faction? No.

Tough as an Ork, with armor and skill equivalent to a heavy Aspect Warrior, stronger than either.

Not double the wounds of a Necron Immortal, that's stupid.

 Insectum7 wrote:

 Apple Peel wrote:

“Power crept.”
Don’t you mean raised to what marines should be?

Flatly superior to baseline units of every other faction? No.

Tough as an Ork, with armor and skill equivalent to a heavy Aspect Warrior, stronger than either.

Not double the wounds of a Necron Immortal, that's stupid.

I'd be fine with elite infantry for other factions being bumped to 2 wounds myself. the days when toughness 4 meant your infantry was uber tough are looooong gone

BrianDavion wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:

 Apple Peel wrote:

“Power crept.”
Don’t you mean raised to what marines should be?

Flatly superior to baseline units of every other faction? No.

Tough as an Ork, with armor and skill equivalent to a heavy Aspect Warrior, stronger than either.

Not double the wounds of a Necron Immortal, that's stupid.

I'd be fine with elite infantry for other factions being bumped to 2 wounds myself. the days when toughness 4 meant your infantry was uber tough are looooong gone

You'd have to bump a LOT of other things if you do that, making that a dangerous proposition. Do you bump Bolters to do 2W, for example?

T4 never really meant your models were "uber tough". Just somewhat better odds against basic weapons.

Yeah, I use my Primaris with Deathwatch rules to get even closer to "movie marine" status. SIA really pushes their bolt rifles into movie quality. Having Aggressors & Inceptors in each unit also make then feel tougher. Once you get down to 2 Intercessors + 1 Aggressor + 1 Inceptor, the unit is T5, making them get a more "last men standing" feel

I even have a WatchMaster in a Drop Pod use the Beacon to pull a unit to him so it has the same affect as them disembarking fromt he DP

-

Now all they need to do is cost themlike Movie Marines!

I'd be down for that, if they're really that amazing, you should only need a few of them.

Not even close. Just like inflation you'd have to compare the Movie Marines to what they were facing...and then convert that to modern stats, etc.

Marines just became rather stupidly strong, but they're not movie marines in any sense.

I'm not sure how you can link to the Movie Marine rules and then say Primaris are Movie Marines with a straight face. They aren't even half a Movie Marine.

Just run each marine with dreadnought stats if you really want to get your kicks off.

 Insectum7 wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:

 Insectum7 wrote:

 Apple Peel wrote:

“Power crept.”
Don’t you mean raised to what marines should be?

Flatly superior to baseline units of every other faction? No.

Tough as an Ork, with armor and skill equivalent to a heavy Aspect Warrior, stronger than either.

Not double the wounds of a Necron Immortal, that's stupid.

I'd be fine with elite infantry for other factions being bumped to 2 wounds myself. the days when toughness 4 meant your infantry was uber tough are looooong gone

You'd have to bump a LOT of other things if you do that, making that a dangerous proposition. Do you bump Bolters to do 2W, for example?

T4 never really meant your models were "uber tough". Just somewhat better odds against basic weapons.

I don't think we'd have to as as bolters doing 2D that's insane and you know it. I think select units should have more wounds. Like necron immortals, nobz already have 2w etc

It's not too crazy of an idea if it's done conservatively. Nobz can only be taken in groups of 10 for instance. Tyranid Warriors with 3w can only be taken in groups of 9. Anyway, the game is really killy and it's not a crazy idea if done properly

 Dynas wrote:

Just an observation. I was thumbing through old White Dwarfs and found the movie marines release they did, which happens to be online.

https://1d4chan.org/images/1/16/CodexMovieMarines.pdf

I remember seeing these and actually playing a game with them. It was crazy OP

Primaris marines are very close to this. Keep in mind this was when BS/WS had the weird chart, so 5 is more like a 2+.
Primaris hit on 3s and often have reroll 1's or misses buffs.

Guns are assualt 4 with Rending, which is basically the Bolter Rules and Tactical Doctrine.
They both have 2 wounds, though the toughness is a bit higher for the move marines, but it only matters on weapons that are STR 5,6 which is fairly sparse.
Attacks are on part, leadership is on par, initiative isnt even used.

The only main thing they are missing are the 10 "wounds" think Shield Drones like. Which for the new Iron hands healing, FnP abilities is not much more a stretch.

It seems we have power crept to damn near movie marines.

Thoughts?

The Movie Marine list? OP? Did you ACTUALLY play against it? It was tremendously bad.

 Insectum7 wrote:
Just run each marine with dreadnought stats if you really want to get your kicks off.

***cough** Iron Hands Strat*** Cough***


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Dynas wrote:

Just an observation. I was thumbing through old White Dwarfs and found the movie marines release they did, which happens to be online.

https://1d4chan.org/images/1/16/CodexMovieMarines.pdf

I remember seeing these and actually playing a game with them. It was crazy OP

Primaris marines are very close to this. Keep in mind this was when BS/WS had the weird chart, so 5 is more like a 2+.
Primaris hit on 3s and often have reroll 1's or misses buffs.

Guns are assualt 4 with Rending, which is basically the Bolter Rules and Tactical Doctrine.
They both have 2 wounds, though the toughness is a bit higher for the move marines, but it only matters on weapons that are STR 5,6 which is fairly sparse.
Attacks are on part, leadership is on par, initiative isnt even used.

The only main thing they are missing are the 10 "wounds" think Shield Drones like. Which for the new Iron hands healing, FnP abilities is not much more a stretch.

It seems we have power crept to damn near movie marines.

Thoughts?

The Movie Marine list? OP? Did you ACTUALLY play against it? It was tremendously bad.

Back in 5th when it came out yeah. I played as it. We ran a game, it was crazy OP.

So getting +1 A and W is the same as +2 T +2 W +3 A +1 WS/BS? Come on, this is ridiculous. The basic primaris guys are scary, but not that scary, there are much more scary things in Codex SM 2.0.

GW should have just squatted the old Marine sculpts and done true-scale Marines with Primaris stats instead of the primaris business. Come out with an upgrade kit so people can upgrade the arms, legs and torsos of their old models.