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++ Battalion Detachment +5CP (Imperium - Space Marines) [53 PL, 8CP, 986pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

**Chapter Selection**: Iron Hands

Battle-forged CP [3CP]

Detachment CP [5CP]

+ HQ +

Iron Father Feirros [6 PL, 110pts]: Student of History, Warlord

Primaris Lieutenants [4 PL, 69pts]
. Primaris Lieutenant: Master-crafted auto bolt rifle, The Ironstone

+ Troops +

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 86pts]: Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Stalker Bolt Rifle
. 4x Intercessor
. Intercessor Sergeant

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 86pts]: Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Stalker Bolt Rifle
. 4x Intercessor
. Intercessor Sergeant

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 86pts]: Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Stalker Bolt Rifle
. 4x Intercessor
. Intercessor Sergeant

Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 86pts]: Auxiliary Grenade Launcher, Stalker Bolt Rifle
. 4x Intercessor
. Intercessor Sergeant

+ Elites +

Aggressor Squad [5 PL, 111pts]: 2x Aggressor, Aggressor Sergeant
. Auto Boltstorm Gauntlets/Fragstorm Grenade Launcher

Primaris Apothecary [3 PL, 60pts]

+ Dedicated Transport +

Repulsor [15 PL, 292pts]: 2x Storm Bolters, Auto Launchers, Heavy Onslaught Gatling Cannon, 2x Krakstorm Grenade Launcher, Onslaught Gatling Cannon, Storm bolter, Twin heavy bolter

++ Spearhead Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Space Marines) [37 PL, 1CP, 633pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

**Chapter Selection**: Iron Hands

Detachment CP [1CP]

+ HQ +

Captain in Gravis Armor [6 PL, 108pts]: Boltstorm gauntlet, Master-crafted power sword

+ Elites +

Primaris Ancient [4 PL, 69pts]

+ Heavy Support +

Devastator Squad [9 PL, 108pts]
. 2x Space Marine
. Space Marine Sergeant: Boltgun
. Space Marine w/Heavy Weapon: Heavy bolter
. Space Marine w/Heavy Weapon: Heavy bolter
. Space Marine w/Heavy Weapon: Heavy bolter

Eliminator Squad [4 PL, 72pts]
. Eliminator Sergeant: Bolt sniper rifle, Camo cloak
. 2x Eliminator with Bolt Sniper: 2x Bolt sniper rifle, 2x Camo cloak

Land Raider Redeemer [14 PL, 276pts]: 2x Flamestorm cannon, Storm bolter, Twin assault cannon

++ Supreme Command Detachment +1CP (Imperium - Space Marines) [20 PL, , 381pts] ++

+ No Force Org Slot +

**Chapter Selection**: Iron Hands

Detachment CP [1CP]

Relics of the Chapter [-1CP]: Number of extra Relics

+ HQ +

Primaris Chaplain [4 PL, 77pts]: 1. Litany of Faith, Litany of Hate, The Tempered Helm

Primaris Librarian [5 PL, 98pts]: Force sword

Techmarine [4 PL, 45pts]: Boltgun, Chainsword, Servo-arm

+ Elites +

Redemptor Dreadnought [7 PL, 161pts]: 2x Storm Bolters, Heavy Onslaught Gatling Cannon, Icarus Rocket Pod, Onslaught Gatling Cannon

++ Total: [110 PL, 9CP, 2,000pts] ++

Created with BattleScribe (https://battlescribe.net)

What's the actual plan here? You've got a ton of characters, but not a huge amount of units for them to actually be supporting. I have no idea who the Land Raider is supposed to be transporting.

You're spending over a quarter of your army on buff units, but have surprisingly little for them to actually buff, and for an army focused on anti-infantry you don't have nearly as many big guns as I'd expect.

Waaaghpower wrote:
What's the actual plan here? You've got a ton of characters, but not a huge amount of units for them to actually be supporting. I have no idea who the Land Raider is supposed to be transporting.

You're spending over a quarter of your army on buff units, but have surprisingly little for them to actually buff, and for an army focused on anti-infantry you don't have nearly as many big guns as I'd expect.

i think you already answered your own question..!
short answer is : all those buffing characters are going to be buffing the redeemer witch will not transport anything cause i want it for its crazy firepower!

also i only have 3 buffing characters in a 2k list with is normal for marines those days (i am not counting captin-cm and lieutenant ofc)

SIKAMIKA wrote:

Waaaghpower wrote:
What's the actual plan here? You've got a ton of characters, but not a huge amount of units for them to actually be supporting. I have no idea who the Land Raider is supposed to be transporting.

You're spending over a quarter of your army on buff units, but have surprisingly little for them to actually buff, and for an army focused on anti-infantry you don't have nearly as many big guns as I'd expect.

i think you already answered your own question..!
short answer is : all those buffing characters are going to be buffing the redeemer witch will not transport anything cause i want it for its crazy firepower!

also i only have 3 buffing characters in a 2k list with is normal for marines those days (i am not counting captin-cm and lieutenant ofc)

A Redeemer does not have crazy firepower. It has good firepower for a vehicle whose primary purpose is to be a durable transport.

Also, even discounting the captain and lieutenant (which... Why? They're still buff units!) you have four to five buff characters, depending on how you plan on using that Librarian.

I reckon you might get a lot more mileage out of converting one fo your squads of intercessers into a second 3 man of aggressors, and don't bother so much with an apothocary. You end up with 140ish points and spend 111 of it on the 3 extra aggressors.

Your best aspect is anti-infantry dakka. You are weakest on longer range anti-tank. Consider converting that 140 points into a venerable dreadnaught with 2 lascannon and 1 missle launcher, make it a character, and keep it close to the "bubble" around ferrios. It won't by itself drop knights, but it iwll put damage on armor reliably! I use one with just the 2lascannon and a fist in my current list, because I noticed how nice it is to make it a character that can heroically intervene, can't be shot, and punches like a dreadnaught with an extra attack (from march of the ancients). Its very comfortable as an attendant to ferrios, and helps him in melee a lot.

Also, the tempered helm is will likely make back its point for iron hands, you are spending enough cp before the game to get it, and anything beyond that beocmes free cp manufactured.

There is literally 0 reason to take devastator squads. Mortis dreads with 4 HB costs the same and is a lot tougher - not to mention ironstone. Really though when it comes to anti Infantry - just take redemptor dreads or sicarian punishers. Absolutely devastating for their costs.

The idea for a venerable character is good though. You can even make it a standard dread and it will do just as good. Venerable upgrade isn't as valuable as iron hands because you already have 6+ FNP.

Waaaghpower wrote:

SIKAMIKA wrote:

Waaaghpower wrote:
What's the actual plan here? You've got a ton of characters, but not a huge amount of units for them to actually be supporting. I have no idea who the Land Raider is supposed to be transporting.

You're spending over a quarter of your army on buff units, but have surprisingly little for them to actually buff, and for an army focused on anti-infantry you don't have nearly as many big guns as I'd expect.

i think you already answered your own question..!
short answer is : all those buffing characters are going to be buffing the redeemer witch will not transport anything cause i want it for its crazy firepower!

also i only have 3 buffing characters in a 2k list with is normal for marines those days (i am not counting captin-cm and lieutenant ofc)

A Redeemer does not have crazy firepower. It has good firepower for a vehicle whose primary purpose is to be a durable transport.

Also, even discounting the captain and lieutenant (which... Why? They're still buff units!) you have four to five buff characters, depending on how you plan on using that Librarian.

seems you had a good point there after all... i got to win but i found out that i dont need 8 buff chars for 16 untis... to people suggesting forge-world models i forgot to say that i am interested on ETC rules so no forge-world and no index -so no mortis dreads with 2 x twin auto-canons unfortunately witch is the best dread! - but yes i can get 2 las canons and missile launcher!

In that case go redemptor dreads or invictors. They are your best anti chaff options IMO.

 Xenomancers wrote:
There is literally 0 reason to take devastator squads. Mortis dreads with 4 HB costs the same and is a lot tougher - not to mention ironstone. Really though when it comes to anti Infantry - just take redemptor dreads or sicarian punishers. Absolutely devastating for their costs.

The idea for a venerable character is good though. You can even make it a standard dread and it will do just as good. Venerable upgrade isn't as valuable as iron hands because you already have 6+ FNP.

One point of disagreement - There *is* a point to Devestator squads if you're going to put them in a Drop Pod. Four Grav-Cannons in a pod with an Armorium Cherub and the Grav Amplification strat has proven incredibly deadly and useful for me in the past few games.

Waaaghpower wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
There is literally 0 reason to take devastator squads. Mortis dreads with 4 HB costs the same and is a lot tougher - not to mention ironstone. Really though when it comes to anti Infantry - just take redemptor dreads or sicarian punishers. Absolutely devastating for their costs.

The idea for a venerable character is good though. You can even make it a standard dread and it will do just as good. Venerable upgrade isn't as valuable as iron hands because you already have 6+ FNP.

One point of disagreement - There *is* a point to Devestator squads if you're going to put them in a Drop Pod. Four Grav-Cannons in a pod with an Armorium Cherub and the Grav Amplification strat has proven incredibly deadly and useful for me in the past few games.

Sorry I ment to say HB devs. Other dev units do have some case. For example maybe putting 2 dev units with MM in a pod or a grav dev unit like you said. HB devs...no point not durable enough to protect those weapons.

 Xenomancers wrote:

Waaaghpower wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:
There is literally 0 reason to take devastator squads. Mortis dreads with 4 HB costs the same and is a lot tougher - not to mention ironstone. Really though when it comes to anti Infantry - just take redemptor dreads or sicarian punishers. Absolutely devastating for their costs.

The idea for a venerable character is good though. You can even make it a standard dread and it will do just as good. Venerable upgrade isn't as valuable as iron hands because you already have 6+ FNP.

One point of disagreement - There *is* a point to Devestator squads if you're going to put them in a Drop Pod. Four Grav-Cannons in a pod with an Armorium Cherub and the Grav Amplification strat has proven incredibly deadly and useful for me in the past few games.

Sorry I ment to say HB devs. Other dev units do have some case. For example maybe putting 2 dev units with MM in a pod or a grav dev unit like you said. HB devs...no point not durable enough to protect those weapons.

yes but keep in mind that you are keeping your range with heavy bolters and using the mortal wounds stratagem every round cause probably nobody will target them!