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Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




Hi,

How often do you guys see non GW models in armies. There are lots of companies that are clearly making their own version of 40k medley designed to fit the codexes and then there are others that would spice an army up nicely.

Do people argue about the use and improvisation of non GW models? Do people ever try and use them to justify their home brew characters etc
   
Made in ca
Legendary Master of the Chapter





The only time you're going to see objections to third party minis, is going to be game store owners who want you to use stuff purchasable through them in their store (like a GW store demanding you use GW minis) which is... honestly pretty reasonable, or a case where the mini isn't remotly like what you wanna use it for. 40k is a game wherre customization is understood to inherantly be part of the game

Opinions are not facts please don't confuse the two 
   
Made in gb
Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus




United Kingdom

The most common ones I see are Thunderfire cannons and Whirlwind turrets. They're generally not a problem as long as they're the right size and it's obvious what they are.
   
Made in es
Hardened Veteran Guardsman





Out of my 6 Imperial Guard regiments, the only ones that are majority GW are Catachans.
   
Made in gb
Fixture of Dakka




UK

It will vary region to region as there's a few factors that come into play

1) GW stores - as noted GW store will want you to use their products since its only buying their products that pays for the shops upkeep and staff wages and such. Typically there will be some wriggling room which will vary on the store manager (and somewhat with countries, from what I can tell USA staff managers, at least in the past, were far more pushy for GW only). The typical things allowed would be things like parts rather than whole models. Heads, weapons, upgrade bits and such.
You might also get away with the odd model here and there as well.

2) 3rd party stores. These might have less pressure on it being "GW models only" but might have limits to models sold in their store. Ergo they typically won't mind within the same boundaries as noted above, but a whole army might not be welcome. Again this will vary a lot store to store - some will care and some wont' care and some might prefer you to buy through them etc...

3) Access - whilst the internet is far more commonly used today its still not used by all for everything. Groups with a larger portion of younger players might not have as much access to money they can use online to buy whole 3rd party armies or lots of parts. Plus as many of the bits sites are often sold through small scale websites, some parents might not feel comfortable buying through them etc.... You might also see fewer kickstarter style armies - again becaues of the financial limits.

4) Group culture. Different groups have different cultures and some cultures can encourage or even discourage certain practices. A group with a very powerful competitive angle might force ownbrand models only and discourage conversions or 3rd party options. Often citing that people will use it to abuse things (even though in practice that is often an isolated situation).

Similarly other groups might be super open to using your own stuff and might, again, even encourage you to diverge to other options.

A Blog in Miniature - now featuring reviews of many new Black Library books (latest Novellas) 
   
Made in us
Heroic Senior Officer





Murray, Kentucky

mrFickle wrote:
Hi,

How often do you guys see non GW models in armies. There are lots of companies that are clearly making their own version of 40k medley designed to fit the codexes and then there are others that would spice an army up nicely.

Do people argue about the use and improvisation of non GW models? Do people ever try and use them to justify their home brew characters etc

Pretty often considering the only pure GW army I own at the moment is my admech and knights.

For reference I have about 15k in guard split across 4 infantry companies and a tank company that vary from mostly GW metal Cadians, to 50/50 catachans GW/Mad Robot, till you get down to my Valhallans where I have exactly 1 GW model out of about 130. Not to mention Lamenters/Black Templar/and Alpha Legion where I'll happily mix in bits whenever I feel the need.

As for how areas treat it and react to it. I've never had a problem, but I also would never take a heavily converted 3rd party army into a GW store. 3rd party stores usually don't care, if they can even tell at all, and some even sell 3rd party bits. In my experience, you're far more likely to be considered ok if you did a good job building and painting them as well. It's one thing when you have a beautiful custom army with 3rd party bits. It's another when it's a half assembled grey mess that you clearly only did to save money and had no intention of making look good.

'I've played Guard for years, and the best piece of advice is to always utilize the Guard's best special rule: "we roll more dice than you" ' - stormleader

"Sector Imperialis: 25mm and 40mm Round Bases (40+20) 26€ (Including 32 skulls for basing) " GW design philosophy in a nutshell  
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Denison, Iowa

Most of my armies have a number of 3rd party models in them, not to mention conversion bits. My general rule: Put down a painted GW army, and then place a painted (same color scheme) 3rd party miniature down next to it. If 95% of players can tell exactly what it is supposed to be without explanation you are totally fine.

I have a VOID sniper that you have to look REALLY close at to tell he's not a Catachan.

   
Made in de
Pestilent Plague Marine with Blight Grenade




I couldn't field any of my armies in a GW tournament, as most of my 40K models use some kind of conversion Bits or are outright 3rd party models. For me that's also an important Part of the Hobby. I started Nurgle because I saw all these cool and diverse approaches to the concept from numerous sources - and I can say I'm about to get most of them. Also, before GW released DG in 8th Edition you had no choice but to convert all of your CSM to show the Mark of Nurgle (yeah, you could have simply painted them green like GW did, but no self-respecting follower of Papa is that lazy).
If I ever started an IG army I'd probably only use GW tanks, but would take all infantry models from other sources, either historical ones because of costs or Viktoria / Anvil miniatures because of style, since GWs IG models are severely outdated and expensive.
So to answer the question, of course I support alternative models to a point where I'm even surprised when people don't (like buying 4 kits of Havocs for these chaincannons instead of simply getting them from Kromlech).
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Denison, Iowa

Sgt. Cortez wrote:

So to answer the question, of course I support alternative models to a point where I'm even surprised when people don't (like buying 4 kits of Havocs for these chaincannons instead of simply getting them from Kromlech).


Oh, hell yeah. I have a "counts as Deathwatch" army that has 16 Frag cannons in it. That would have gutted me to pay GW for all those kits, and even if I ebayed those bits I would have been an arm or leg. Anvil Industries' Frag Launcher fit perfectly.
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut





Hi,

Don’t see non GW models in armies - play mainly in stores.

No arguments vis use of such (see above).

As for custom characters, there is nothing that doesn’t use GW bits, and they don’t affect the rules.

So saying, GW has had a long history of releasing figures - any figure _could_ be GW. Just old or from an exotic range (looking at you Space Farers).
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





I have a good chunk of Starfleet Marines that I'm using for my Guard army. It's not a matter of not having enough official GW stuff, as I have ~300+ Guard models, it's just that's the only way I can use them in anything.

You'll never see a single one in a GW store or 40k tournament.
   
Made in gb
Rotting Sorcerer of Nurgle






Arcanis161 wrote:


You'll never see a single one in a GW store or 40k tournament.


Wrong on both counts. GW stores tend to operate on the ol’ “Don’t ask, don’t tell” policy. I’ve seen plenty a 3rd party mini used in GW stores over the years as a lot of the staff might struggle to identify minis from their own company’s back catalogue, let alone a 3rd party one.

As for “40k tournaments”. Unless it’s played at Warhammer World or the Cafe then anything goes. No such rule exists for model restrictions on tourneys outside of the above places.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/02/08 20:45:28




A GW fan walks into a bar, buys the same drink as yesterday but pays more.

""Unite" is a human word, ... join me or die."

If you break apart my or anyone else's posts line by line I will not read them. 
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut




I don't think I have seen anyone use actual GW assains imperial models used around here. Everyone uses either 3ed party models or infnity models, and one dude has a kitbash sniper that looks mind blowing good, but cost him like 100$ to make. There aren't even recasts of the assassins used.

also thunder cannons, everyone has the kromlech ones and no one has a GW one.
   
Made in gb
Wicked Warp Spider





The local 40k mob down my way are fairly loyal, the only one I've seen in the last decade was a Mierce Kull (Krull?) that someone picked up cheap counting as a Bloodthirster, about 7-8 inches tall which towered over the GW ones of the time, nobody had a problem because a) Bloodthirsters are fairly generic and b) it was awesome

"AND YET YOU ACT AS IF THERE IS SOME IDEAL ORDER IN THE WORLD, AS IF THERE IS SOME...SOME RIGHTNESS IN THE UNIVERSE BY WHICH IT MAY BE JUDGED." 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Denison, Iowa

Karol wrote:


also thunder cannons, everyone has the kromlech ones and no one has a GW one.


My Rapier Laser Destroyer is (I think) a Kromlech set of tracks, an old 2nd edition HK missile mount, and a FW rapier weapon that I got as a bunch of FW parts in an Ebay auction.
   
Made in au
Hissing Hybrid Metamorph





'Straya... Mate.

I see non-GW models and bits all the time, I think its great as it adds variety. As long as its close to right size (I mean really close), and its clear what everything is, then go for it.

 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




 Grimtuff wrote:
Arcanis161 wrote:


You'll never see a single one in a GW store or 40k tournament.


Wrong on both counts. GW stores tend to operate on the ol’ “Don’t ask, don’t tell” policy. I’ve seen plenty a 3rd party mini used in GW stores over the years as a lot of the staff might struggle to identify minis from their own company’s back catalogue, let alone a 3rd party one.

As for “40k tournaments”. Unless it’s played at Warhammer World or the Cafe then anything goes. No such rule exists for model restrictions on tourneys outside of the above places.

That's because the hobby isn't WH40K, but buying GW models.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in ca
Painlord Titan Princeps of Slaanesh





Hamilton, ON

I hope you warmed up properly before performing that massive stretch.

The Fall of Kronstaat IV
Война Народная | Voyna Narodnaya | The People's War - 2,898pts* painted (updated 11/01/20)
Волшебная Сказка | Volshebnaya Skazka | A Fairy Tale (updated 29/12/19, ep10 - And All That Could Have Been)
Kabal of The Violet Heart (updated 02/02/2020)
* as of Chapter Approved: 2018. Not a typo.

All 'crimes' should be treasured if they bring you pleasure somehow. 
   
Made in us
Powerful Phoenix Lord






I use a lot of 3rd party bits, and support 3rd party models 100%, assuming they match the actual theme/style/aesthetic of the 40K game. You want to make a custom Imperial Guard regiment? Awesome. You want to substitute My Little Pony miniatures for your Space Marines? No sir.

 
   
Made in us
Decrepit Dakkanaut




 Excommunicatus wrote:
I hope you warmed up properly before performing that massive stretch.

Those were Kirby's words not mine. Their attitude would also show it too.

CaptainStabby wrote:
If Tyberos falls and needs to catch himself it's because the ground needed killing.

 jy2 wrote:
BTW, I can't wait to run Double-D-thirsters! Man, just thinking about it gets me Khorney.

 vipoid wrote:
Indeed - what sort of bastard would want to use their codex?

 MarsNZ wrote:
ITT: SoB players upset that they're receiving the same condescending treatment that they've doled out in every CSM thread ever.
 
   
Made in gb
Irked Necron Immortal




I own nearly the entire official GW product range for Necrons (at max unit size). Obviously frequently multiple units-worth. All assembled and painted.

Due to the dearth of official releases for Necrons, I’ve spent a couple hundred on 3rd party releases the last couple years.

The day I show up for a game of 40k and my opponent objects to 3rd party models will be the shortest game of 40k I ever play.
   
Made in gb
Dakka Veteran





Don't see too many alternatives in GW games at my lfg, it's not that we wouldn't allow it, we just don't seem to do it.
I have in the past used model kits of ww2 Pak40's and 88s as ork artillery pieces, suitably converted of course, but don't even use them anymore.
I can remember one guy proxying a whole Daemon list using kids toys but no body knew what model was supposed to be what, maybe this is why we stopped.

I've been playing a while, my first model was a lead marine and my first White Dwarf was bound with staples 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





 Grimtuff wrote:
Arcanis161 wrote:


You'll never see a single one in a GW store or 40k tournament.


Wrong on both counts. GW stores tend to operate on the ol’ “Don’t ask, don’t tell” policy. I’ve seen plenty a 3rd party mini used in GW stores over the years as a lot of the staff might struggle to identify minis from their own company’s back catalogue, let alone a 3rd party one.

As for “40k tournaments”. Unless it’s played at Warhammer World or the Cafe then anything goes. No such rule exists for model restrictions on tourneys outside of the above places.


I thought I made it obvious I was referring to MY 3rd party models and MY refusal to bring any to a GW store or tournament.

But ok...
   
Made in us
Dive-Bombin' Fighta-Bomba Pilot






in my meta lots of people have 3rd party bits and in some cases mostly 3rd party models. usually its imperial guard players wanting to play regiments that look like something other than Catachan or Cadian. Some of them even use more appropriate looking tanks for the armies based on the culture of that guard regiment. In many cases i like the 3rd party guard models better than anything GW has done.

On the bits front even GW stores seem ok with some aftermarket bits on armies. I got aske dplaying my little terminato models where i got my custom shoulder pads from. I explained I had my own 3d printer and made them myself. to represent my "blue steel" legion

10000 points 7000
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Made in us
Dakka Veteran




I own nearly the entire official GW product range for Necrons (at max unit size). Obviously frequently multiple units-worth. All assembled and painted.

Due to the dearth of official releases for Necrons, I’ve spent a couple hundred on 3rd party releases the last couple years.

The day I show up for a game of 40k and my opponent objects to 3rd party models will be the shortest game of 40k I ever play.


This, this right here.

Sadly I see a lot of Chinaforge also at the local store. While I do not condone it, I believe GW has only themselves to blame for that. Given their already high prices, charging 30 percent more because you live in the US seems a bit much. Personally I use third party bits all the time. Less so on full models, but I have a fair few of those as well.

   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




Chinaforge? Where do I find this forge. Yes not really ripping off IP or encouraging it but GW does charge a lot. I know nothing about the process of making models but I would guess that it doesn’t cost much to actually make the models in their in assembled form.
   
Made in us
Dive-Bombin' Fighta-Bomba Pilot






on China or russian cast... I ordered an imperial knight to have another so i could work on making 3 magnetized all up. I bought the renegade box and one off of Ebay. the sprue was different on the ebay one and turns out after research it was almost certainly a recast... but it was literally the same model and same quality as the GW one. once built I cannot tell you which one was the recast and only cost $30 shipped. If i had not bought them at the same time and had the real imperial knight sprue to see I would not have known it was a recast.

10000 points 7000
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Made in cn
Wing Commander





Dallas, TX

I use appropriate 3rd party bits, sometimes whole figures for my IG and friends, because you can only do so much kitbashing with Cadian and Catachan. My go to bits sites are madrobot miniatures and Victoria miniatures.

I would like to use 3rd party for my Tau, but wargaming exclusive sculpts just doesn’t do it for me, a bit too humanistic expression in the faces and too busy on the armor plates; plus their scale are slightly bigger than GW Tau counterparts.

I wish I was orky enough to kitbash with my orks, but my mind just doesn’t work that way, in fact I had joined the ork specific forum, after a month or two I deleted my account there, the half legible ork speech on the forum was too much for my mind to take.

Concerning recasters: it’s mainly from China and Russia, it’s a gamble, but if you take a closer look at the posted image you should be able to tell their quality, sometimes their recasts are better than FW original, no joke! The light grey resin tend to be higher grade cast than dart grey counterparts. With FW purging their product line 3-6 months after release, I see no problem with buying recasts, especially so for OOP or limited or special event models.
   
Made in gb
Been Around the Block




I have a couple of Fireblades and marksman of a 3rd party on my TAU army
   
 
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