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So the Necrons deny the nids any organic matter to reinforce losses due to conflict. They are the Nids but they are better. Does the Lore ever talk about directing the NEcrons at the nids like they do with the Orks on occasion?
   
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 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So the Necrons deny the nids any organic matter to reinforce losses due to conflict. They are the Nids but they are better. Does the Lore ever talk about directing the NEcrons at the nids like they do with the Orks on occasion?


The silent king is currently trying to reunite the entire necron race to fight the tyranids. He knows that the galaxy is doomed otherwise.

The tyrainds seem to actively avoid the necrons (null fields), but are also known to raze entire tomb worlds if they have to.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2020/03/18 04:39:40


Tyranid fanboy.

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Necrons. The necrons have the power to literally delete star systems and basically kind of just edit the Universe. They are OP.

The nids are overrated. Nids fans will squeal about how their true numbers cannot be resisted, but they also can't tell you how many there actually are and instead just expect you to believe their number is basically infinite on faith. They have been repelled by the Imperium, admittedly with heavy costs, many times by a few chapters, nothing like the combined force of the imperium.

That, and everything in the galaxy hates them, including chaos and the orks. If they truly do have enormous numbers, basically everything in the universe would fight them concomitantly.
My Money is on the Necrons.

Edit: Not a Necrons player.
Double edit: Chaos is probably the most potent force of destruction in the universe
Triple edit: Not a chaos player.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/03/18 04:58:03


 
   
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Roberts84 wrote:
Necrons. The necrons have the power to literally delete star systems and basically kind of just edit the Universe. They are OP.

The nids are overrated. Nids fans will squeal about how their true numbers cannot be resisted, but they also can't tell you how many there actually are and instead just expect you to believe their number is basically infinite on faith. They have been repelled by the Imperium, admittedly with heavy costs, many times by a few chapters, nothing like the combined force of the imperium.

That, and everything in the galaxy hates them, including chaos and the orks. If they truly do have enormous numbers, basically everything in the universe would fight them concomitantly.
My Money is on the Necrons.

Edit: Not a Necrons player.
Double edit: Chaos is probably the most potent force of destruction in the universe
Triple edit: Not a chaos player.


The silent king gak his metal pants when he saw the tyranid fleet when traveling beyond the galaxy. And he also knows that he has to reunite the entire necron race if they are to stand a chance.

Tyranid fanboy.

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 Andersp90 wrote:
Roberts84 wrote:
Necrons. The necrons have the power to literally delete star systems and basically kind of just edit the Universe. They are OP.

The nids are overrated. Nids fans will squeal about how their true numbers cannot be resisted, but they also can't tell you how many there actually are and instead just expect you to believe their number is basically infinite on faith. They have been repelled by the Imperium, admittedly with heavy costs, many times by a few chapters, nothing like the combined force of the imperium.

That, and everything in the galaxy hates them, including chaos and the orks. If they truly do have enormous numbers, basically everything in the universe would fight them concomitantly.
My Money is on the Necrons.

Edit: Not a Necrons player.
Double edit: Chaos is probably the most potent force of destruction in the universe
Triple edit: Not a chaos player.


The silent king gak his metal pants when he saw the tyranid fleet when traveling beyond the galaxy. And he also knows that he has to reunite the entire necron race if they are to stand a chance.


Uh-huh.

The necrons have weapons that can instantly atomize planets. They can press a buton on a console and cause suns to supernova. If the Necrons were able to be unified under the silent king, it would be GG for the universe.

The Answer is Necrons. Definitely.


Orks are as dangerous as Nids.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/03/18 05:34:00


 
   
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Roberts84 wrote:


The necrons have weapons that can instantly atomize planets. They can press a buton on a console and cause suns to supernova. If the Necrons were able to be unified under the silent king, it would be GG for the universe.


That is true.

Yet, it is still stated in the lore that the silent king has to reunite the necron race if they are to stand a chance of preventing the galay from being nommed. He might even be too late (stated by the man himself)

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/03/18 05:48:35


Tyranid fanboy.

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 Andersp90 wrote:
Roberts84 wrote:


The necrons have weapons that can instantly atomize planets. They can press a buton on a console and cause suns to supernova. If the Necrons were able to be unified under the silent king, it would be GG for the universe.


That is true.

Yet, it is still stated in the lore that the silent king has to reunite the necron race if they are to stand a chance of preventing the galay from being nommed. He might even be too late (stated by the man himself)



In the lore Kaldor Draigo soloed a bloodthirster and shooed away Mortarion.
   
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Roberts84 wrote:
 Andersp90 wrote:
Roberts84 wrote:


The necrons have weapons that can instantly atomize planets. They can press a buton on a console and cause suns to supernova. If the Necrons were able to be unified under the silent king, it would be GG for the universe.


That is true.

Yet, it is still stated in the lore that the silent king has to reunite the necron race if they are to stand a chance of preventing the galay from being nommed. He might even be too late (stated by the man himself)



In the lore Kaldor Draigo soloed a bloodthirster and shooed away Mortarion.


"I dont like that bit of lore, so lets ignore it, and go with my headcannon instead"

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Necrons cannot win against the Tyranids alone either. The lore is rather clear that unless all the factions of the Milky Way unite they stand no chance against the comming swarm of Tyranids. That's why the Time of Ending used to start when the Nids arrived in the Milky Way. The Silent King is actually doing his part and tries to unite his race to give himself a chance to survive. The Necrons have the technology to destroy planets and star systems, but it also specifically mention that it's not a tool to play with without great care as it's likely to backfire and cause all sorts of unintended consequences. It might be, at best a recepe for mutual destruction and at worst a Necron suicide buttons as it's not even said that destroying all life in the Milky Way would kill the Tyranids. To be fair though, Necrons are the most adapted to fight off the Tyranids and potentially survive until the galaxy is devoured. Both are, ironically, well suited to ignore each other.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/03/18 06:32:29


 
   
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epronovost wrote:
Necrons cannot win against the Tyranids alone either. The lore is rather clear that unless all the factions of the Milky Way unite they stand no chance against the comming swarm of Tyranids.


Where is that stated?

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 Andersp90 wrote:
Roberts84 wrote:
 Andersp90 wrote:
Roberts84 wrote:


The necrons have weapons that can instantly atomize planets. They can press a buton on a console and cause suns to supernova. If the Necrons were able to be unified under the silent king, it would be GG for the universe.


That is true.

Yet, it is still stated in the lore that the silent king has to reunite the necron race if they are to stand a chance of preventing the galay from being nommed. He might even be too late (stated by the man himself)



In the lore Kaldor Draigo soloed a bloodthirster and shooed away Mortarion.


"I dont like that bit of lore, so lets ignore it, and go with my headcannon instead"


I don't have any headcannon. My point is that the lore is often incredibly schit. I'm sure you'll enjoy the canon if/when it turns out the Nids are creations of the Necrons, which is entirely possible.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Let's see; Silent King returns to the galaxy as Nids arrive. Nids only eat bioforms, avoid tomb worlds, confrontation with the Necrons, and are only surface-feeders leaving the tombs buried in the center of planets unscathed.

Hmmmm...

Nope, can't imagine how that benefits the Necrons at all.
It's quite possible you're being Dante'd.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/03/18 07:04:55


 
   
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Roberts84 wrote:

Let's see; Silent King returns to the galaxy as Nids arrive. Nids only eat bioforms, avoid tomb worlds, confrontation with the Necrons, and are only surface-feeders leaving the tombs buried in the center of planets unscathed.


The tyranids will raze entire tomb worlds if there is biomass to be gained.

Tyranids 8th edition:

"Hive Fleet Scitalis winds its way into the Eastern Fringe, embedding itself deep into sectors held by the T’au Empire. Hive Fleet Arachnae has found itself embroiled in a long war against the Necrons of the Novokh Dynasty, as it attempts to consume and despoil planets that the Overlords have long claimed as their own"

Necrons 8th edition.

"Much of the territory once ruled by the Charnovokh Dynasty lies far to the galactic south east. Many of its dormant tomb worlds were devoured by Hive Fleet Behemoth, and countless others have been ravaged during the Imperium’s counter attacks against the Tyranids."

You can read about one such battle if you buy: https://www.blacklibrary.com/all-products/devourer-ebook.html

Roberts84 wrote:

tombs buried in the center of planets unscathed.


The tombs are not thousands of kilometers under the surface.. We are talking a few km at most. So they are not safe from the tyranids (as mentioned above).

"The devastation of Baal"

Spoiler:
‘They take even the metal,’ said Erwin.
The Servile of the Watch looked up from his podium over the augur pits, where baseline humans less fortunate than he laboured in unbreakable communion with the ship, their eyes and ears removed and sensory cortexes plugged directly into the auspectoria’s cogitators.
‘They take minerals of every kind, my lord,’ said the servile. ‘I have compared spectrographic analysis of this world with records of how it was. It shows massive depletion of all main range elements. The devourer remakes the worlds it consumes. Although I notice a small inconsistency with the oldest records of tyrannic-stripped worlds.’
‘Small enough for me to ignore?’ asked Erwin. The Servile of the Watch was an earnest fellow, genuinely fascinated with his work. He had been known to bore his masters with unnecessary detail.
The servile pulled a neutral expression, making his slave tattoos shift across his face, a sense of motion exaggerated by the low light of the command deck. The Servile of the Watch was unusually expressive for one of his breed. ‘Whether it is relevant or not I shall leave to your deep percipience, my lord.’
Erwin grunted. ‘Edify me then.’
‘The older worlds show a larger loss of mass. The tyranids spent longer on each, digesting parts of the planetary crust.



This message was edited 6 times. Last update was at 2020/03/18 08:42:44


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I hope the nids aren't a Necron creation, they already ruined the Alien franchise with that nonsense.

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Tyranids have always remained something from outside the Galaxy.


As for Tyranids VS Necrons note that the Necrons, whilst wanting to destroy all life, also don't seem to want to destroy all planets at the same time. Furthermore their planet destroying technology appears to have functional and practical limitations.

In addition if they started going on a campaign of blowing up all the planets to defeat the Tyranids purely by denial of resources, you can bet other races would take notice. It's the kind of mega event that gets the Imperium charging in; Chaos would not like the idea of losing worlds that they could otherwise corrupt; Orks would see it that the Necrons were being the biggest baddest thing and that means you gotta go WAAARGH and stomp em. Eldar would have some shadowy secret reason it shouldn't happen etc...


Even when the Imperium was only torching its own worlds that campaign hit a political wall; and that was only Exterminatus burning off the surface of planets.


In short denial of resources to Tyranids is not really a solution to the invasion. It'as a last-ditch option that would only work if you obliterate all organic and mineral matter in the Galaxy. At which point whilst the Tyranids don't get to feed, you've also lost anyway.






The problem with any discussion on Tyranids is that

1) We don't actually know their end-game in any way. Note all the lore for them is written from other factions points of view; we get hints here and there, but even studies are very basic. The whole "they exist only to feed" is clearly a gross simplification as tyranids display advanced tactics and target selection. If anything they are conducting their own war of resource denial on the rest of the Galaxy - more so than focusing on feeding alone.

2) We don't know their total numbers in any shape nor form. What we encounter might be splinterfleets; scouting fleets; the full invasion force. You can't measure how well you're doing against the race because you've utterly no concept of their numbers. You can only measure how well your'e doing against known entities in the Galaxy. This sets most forces (including Necrons) at a disadvantage because you can't measure your reactions. Is that hive fleet a major fleet worth sacrificing whole systems over; or is it just a small fleet that's not even worth paying attention too whilst you reinforce for a bigger threat somewhere else?

3) We don't know their distribution of their total numbers outside the Galaxy. If you knew there'd be about 1 hive fleet every x number of years you can measure reactions to counter and cope. However you've no idea of distribution so its again very hard to measure a reaction to them.

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 Overread wrote:

1) We don't actually know their end-game in any way.


Not this again.. They literally nail it to the wall in the 8th edition codex.

"Vast swathes of the galaxy have already been stripped of life, and with every passing year the hive fleets push deeper into regions of populated space. Even as the prey races direct their forces to repel these threats, still more Tyranid fleets approach from the intergalactic void and emerge from their aeons-long slumbers. The thought processes of the Hive Mind are gathering pace as more Tyranids wake and recall the age-old purpose of their kind – feed, grow, survive."

Note all the lore for them is written from other factions points of view


That simply isn't true. The codexes are clearly presented by an all-knowing 3rd person wirter. Ditto with BL books like "The devastation of baal".

In both cases we are being fed information that the races of the galaxy are not aware of, which means that it cant be from their point of view..

This message was edited 7 times. Last update was at 2020/03/18 16:58:24


Tyranid fanboy.

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I can't believe this is seriously up for debate, obviously the Drukhari win.

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So, honest question: How come the Arch magos Rulesareforchumps mclorebreak hassn't developed some kind of galactic raid/ant poison that deletes the core of their species starting with a single drone?
   
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 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So, honest question: How come the Arch magos Rulesareforchumps mclorebreak hassn't developed some kind of galactic raid/ant poison that deletes the core of their species starting with a single drone?


Because every hive fleet isn’t connected. The bio toxin route has been done successfully at least twice, by the Blood Ravens and the Farsight Enclaves. In each case they took down their primary target.
   
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Sterling191 wrote:
 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So, honest question: How come the Arch magos Rulesareforchumps mclorebreak hassn't developed some kind of galactic raid/ant poison that deletes the core of their species starting with a single drone?


Because every hive fleet isn’t connected. The bio toxin route has been done successfully at least twice, by the Blood Ravens and the Farsight Enclaves. In each case they took down their primary target.

Ultramarines also pulled it off.

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 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So, honest question: How come the Arch magos Rulesareforchumps mclorebreak hassn't developed some kind of galactic raid/ant poison that deletes the core of their species starting with a single drone?


Because there is no way to infect all Tyranids simultaneously with a poison capable of killing all their organism which are varied and from different species. "Tyranid" is an entire taxonomical class not a single species, genus or even family. It has been attempted before with limited success, but since Tyranids have a super intelligence governing and uniting them all, the first thing all Tyranids do is develop a defense mechanism against such a venom just like insects do, but a lot more efficiently and quickly. In turn, that poison becomes known to them and they can play with it to harm humans in turn.
   
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pm713 wrote:
Sterling191 wrote:
 FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
So, honest question: How come the Arch magos Rulesareforchumps mclorebreak hassn't developed some kind of galactic raid/ant poison that deletes the core of their species starting with a single drone?


Because every hive fleet isn’t connected. The bio toxin route has been done successfully at least twice, by the Blood Ravens and the Farsight Enclaves. In each case they took down their primary target.

Ultramarines also pulled it off.


Indeed. Was pretty sure there were other instances, but those two were the only ones I could recall with certainty.
   
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Necrons, really. Even if Tyranids 'won' and stripped the galaxy of life then moved on the Necrons would still be there. Heck some of them probably wouldn't even wake up!

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There are so many lore "outs" the writers could do. "Anti-Nid Psychic crud, or some form of Emperor class weapon psychic weapon that could cut the link between the hive mind(s?) and the troops. I am betting if Cain can single handidly take down lictors and mawlocs with just a chainsword and a laspistol, then the writers can do whatever they want, lore be damned.
   
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The Orkz had some sort of device that interfered with the Hive Mind. If I remember correctly, the Mechanicus has it now and is trying to make it work. So I'd say the Necrons could probably figure out something similar.
   
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 flandarz wrote:
The Orkz had some sort of device that interfered with the Hive Mind. If I remember correctly, the Mechanicus has it now and is trying to make it work. So I'd say the Necrons could probably figure out something similar.


I bet you the hive mind will figure out a counter.

From "the devastation of baal".

"Every machine and psychic ability the Imperium had geared towards detection, the lictor could evade. The hive mind had consumed far more advanced races than mankind. Infiltrating Baal was child’s play. There was no need for it to employ a fraction of its considerable talents."

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Necrons, really. Even if Tyranids 'won' and stripped the galaxy of life then moved on the Necrons would still be there. Heck some of them probably wouldn't even wake up!


The necrons will be trapped in their metal bodies for eternity if the tyranids pick the galaxy clean of life.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/03/18 23:16:20


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I assume the easiest fix would be to make the psychic connection between its parts stronger than the device could interfere with. That's assuming it's just some sort of psychic static, of course. If it's instead "flooding the airwaves with Orky thoughts" boosting your own signal may make you susceptible to those thoughts, which I figure would be pretty bad for the Hive Mind.
   
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 Andersp90 wrote:
 flandarz wrote:
The Orkz had some sort of device that interfered with the Hive Mind. If I remember correctly, the Mechanicus has it now and is trying to make it work. So I'd say the Necrons could probably figure out something similar.


I bet you the hive mind will figure out a counter.

From "the devastation of baal".

"Every machine and psychic ability the Imperium had geared towards detection, the lictor could evade. The hive mind had consumed far more advanced races than mankind. Infiltrating Baal was child’s play. There was no need for it to employ a fraction of its considerable talents."

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Necrons, really. Even if Tyranids 'won' and stripped the galaxy of life then moved on the Necrons would still be there. Heck some of them probably wouldn't even wake up!


The necrons will be trapped in their metal bodies for eternity if the tyranids pick the galaxy clean of life.

It's really easy to just grab some meat things and store them. Hell even if the Tyranids ate everyone now they could just use Trazyn the Hoarders 'gallery'. Necrons aren't threatened by Tyranids at all.

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pm713 wrote:
Necrons aren't threatened by Tyranids at all.


You might want to read up on the 7th-8th edition lore..

Necrons 7th edition.

"The Silent King returns from his self-imposed exile having encountered the Tyranids in the intergalactic void. Realising the threat they pose to the Necrons, he sets about stirring tomb worlds yet to revive. Though he takes pains to conceal his true identity, his influence can be felt throughout the Necron Empire"

Then expanded on in the 8th edition codex:

"In c.744.M41, the Silent King enters the bounds of the galaxy once more. Having encountered the Tyranids in the intergalactic void, he realises that if these horrifying creatures are left unchecked they may consume every living thing in the galaxy before the Necrons can achieve their apotheosis. Returning from his self-imposed exile, the Silent King begins a pilgrimage across the galaxy, stirring tomb worlds yet to revive and speeding the recovery of those already awakened. Though he takes pains to conceal his true identity–working through Triarch Praetorians or unwitting Crypteks and Overlords – the Silent King’s influence is felt from one side of the galaxy to the other. Slowly, he pursues his great work from the shadows, hoping that it is not already too late to atone for his past failures."

This message was edited 7 times. Last update was at 2020/03/19 01:31:05


Tyranid fanboy.

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 Andersp90 wrote:
pm713 wrote:
Necrons aren't threatened by Tyranids at all.


You might want to read up on the 7th-8th edition lore..

Necrons 7th edition.

"The Silent King returns from his self-imposed exile having encountered the Tyranids in the intergalactic void. Realising the threat they pose to the Necrons, he sets about stirring tomb worlds yet to revive. Though he takes pains to conceal his true identity, his influence can be felt throughout the Necron Empire"

Then expanded on in the 8th edition codex:

"In c.744.M41, the Silent King enters the bounds of the galaxy once more. Having encountered the Tyranids in the intergalactic void, he realises that if these horrifying creatures are left unchecked they may consume every living thing in the galaxy before the Necrons can achieve their apotheosis. Returning from his self-imposed exile, the Silent King begins a pilgrimage across the galaxy, stirring tomb worlds yet to revive and speeding the recovery of those already awakened. Though he takes pains to conceal his true identity–working through Triarch Praetorians or unwitting Crypteks and Overlords – the Silent King’s influence is felt from one side of the galaxy to the other. Slowly, he pursues his great work from the shadows, hoping that it is not already too late to atone for his past failures."


All that proves is that Johnny Tightlips is worried they'll kill everything before he does and steal his thunder.
   
 
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