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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/06/26 20:13:37
Subject: Ultramarine atrocities during the Great Crusade
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Pestilent Plague Marine with Blight Grenade
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Maybe I'm just not as up on the lore as I should, but I've read that during the Great Crusade, the Ultramarines were actually one of the most brutal of the legions, purging several planets and having no qualms about it. Granted, they did work to put good governments in place and they weren't as nihilistic as legions like the Night Lords and World Eaters, nor as fanatical as the Word Bearers. But is it true that they were noted for an unusual level of savagery?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/06/26 20:21:04
Subject: Ultramarine atrocities during the Great Crusade
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[MOD]
Solahma
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Can you cite a source?
The XIII Legion’s performance during the Great Crusade was notably efficient and effective. When the Emperor censored Lorgar and the XVII Legion on Monarchia, the Ultramarines were present partially as an example of what he expected of the Word Bearers going forward. Undoubtedly, the Ultramarines devastated planets that doggedly resisted compliance; that was the very nature of the Great Crusade. Labeling those atrocities seems a mite precious given the context.
If the XIII Legion was guilty of some particularly egregious exploit, it must have been invented pretty recently.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/06/26 20:25:47
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/06/26 20:22:55
Subject: Ultramarine atrocities during the Great Crusade
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Ultramarine Librarian with Freaky Familiar
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I've not seen anything that indicated that, from my understanding. Even before Guilliman, they were fairly level headed and tactically minded, being one of the first Legions to attack Luna.
What you might be confusing this for is that they were founded from the children of particularly rebellious warlords that the Emperor had subjugated violently, so their original name was the War-Born (born out of war-wracked groups) - however, they were still a pretty level headed Legion. They might not have had much qualms about exterminating many worlds, but then, I think most Legions felt the same, even the Salamanders (who, for all their humanitarianism - well, is just that - HUMANitarian).
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They/them
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/06/26 20:24:00
Subject: Ultramarine atrocities during the Great Crusade
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Pestilent Plague Marine with Blight Grenade
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Manchu wrote:Can you cite a source?
The XIII Legion’s performance during the Great Crusade was notably efficient and effective. When the Emperor censored Lorgar and the XVII Legion on Monarchia, the Ultramarines were present partially as an example of what he expected of the Word Bearers going forward. Undoubtedly, the Ultramarines devastated planets that doggedly resisted compliance; that was the very nature of the Great Crusade. Labeling those atrocities seems a mite precious guven the context.
It's really just bits and pieces that I've read here and there. I didn't know if it was canon or not, or just fan speculation. I do know that the Ultras were considered a model legion.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/06/26 20:26:26
Subject: Ultramarine atrocities during the Great Crusade
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[MOD]
Solahma
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It sounds like someone on the internet trying to be a bit edgy.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/06/26 20:28:19
Subject: Ultramarine atrocities during the Great Crusade
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Ultramarine Librarian with Freaky Familiar
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ArcaneHorror wrote:It's really just bits and pieces that I've read here and there. I didn't know if it was canon or not, or just fan speculation. I do know that the Ultras were considered a model legion.
Nah, from my understanding, it's not canon, and I've not really even heard much fan discussion on it. In terms of pre-Primarch and post-Primarch, the Ultramarines never really changed all that much, bar becoming even more organised and strategic.
The Blood Angels had some incredibly serious brutality issues, more comparable to Butchers Nails World Eaters than the idolised golden warriors they became.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/06/26 20:38:38
Subject: Ultramarine atrocities during the Great Crusade
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[MOD]
Solahma
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Like the IF, the BA sloughed off their problem children into successor chapters.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/06/27 15:28:04
Subject: Ultramarine atrocities during the Great Crusade
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Terrifying Doombull
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ArcaneHorror wrote: Manchu wrote:Can you cite a source?
The XIII Legion’s performance during the Great Crusade was notably efficient and effective. When the Emperor censored Lorgar and the XVII Legion on Monarchia, the Ultramarines were present partially as an example of what he expected of the Word Bearers going forward. Undoubtedly, the Ultramarines devastated planets that doggedly resisted compliance; that was the very nature of the Great Crusade. Labeling those atrocities seems a mite precious guven the context.
It's really just bits and pieces that I've read here and there. I didn't know if it was canon or not, or just fan speculation. I do know that the Ultras were considered a model legion.
Fan stuff, but somewhat understandable.
Keep in mind that, with few exceptions, everyone during the Great Crusade was completely down with alien genocide. There are a couple cases where they don't bother, the aliens are too strong to be anything but a major campaign on their own (eldar), or are harmless enough (or surrender fast enough), but quite often if a legion found xenos on a 'human' world, they were slaughtered to the last offspring. To a modern mindset that constitutes an atrocity.
And of course, if a human society was too far 'in error,' they got brutalized into compliance until they accepted Imperial Truth. That's definitely an atrocity.
Picture a world that had reverted to the industrial era and Greek myth as religion. The Great Crusade would have found that unacceptable and 'fixed' it. Even doing it the nice way like Salamanders or Ultras (rather than Word Bearers or World Eaters), you're still butchering a group's culture.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/06/27 15:30:10
Efficiency is the highest virtue. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/06/27 16:50:13
Subject: Re:Ultramarine atrocities during the Great Crusade
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Slaanesh Chosen Marine Riding a Fiend
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I've also never read anything to that effect in reation to the Ultramarines.
Two Legions that did acquire a bad reputation were the Dark Angels and Space Wolves, who carried out "bio-pogroms" that left entire human-inhabited sectors lifeless in order to clear any possible Rangdan taint.
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VAIROSEAN LIVES! |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2020/06/29 04:16:37
Subject: Ultramarine atrocities during the Great Crusade
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Enigmatic Chaos Sorcerer
The dark hollows of Kentucky
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Sgt_Smudge wrote: ArcaneHorror wrote:It's really just bits and pieces that I've read here and there. I didn't know if it was canon or not, or just fan speculation. I do know that the Ultras were considered a model legion.
Nah, from my understanding, it's not canon, and I've not really even heard much fan discussion on it. In terms of pre-Primarch and post-Primarch, the Ultramarines never really changed all that much, bar becoming even more organised and strategic.
The Blood Angels had some incredibly serious brutality issues, more comparable to Butchers Nails World Eaters than the idolised golden warriors they became.
Actually, I would say that the early Blood Angels were worse that Butchers Nails World Eaters, due to their peculiar dietary habits.
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