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Made in de
A Skull at the Throne of Khorne




Hi all,

I played 40k a long time ago when Carnifex still looked completely different.
Played Nids at that time.
Haven't played the game even once during the last 15 years.

A few months ago however I started reading codex books again and since then I've been watching lots of battle reports and Auspex Tactics vids on YouTube.
I really like the models of a few armies: AdMech, Adepta Sororitas and World Eaters.

Without any actual experience I tried to build an army with BattleScribe yesterday, using the models I really like.
Here it is:


++ Battalion Detachment 0CP (Chaos - Chaos Space Marines) [98 PL, 12CP, 1,996pts] ++

+ Configuration +

Battle Size [12CP]: 3. Strike Force (101-200 Total PL / 1001-2000 Points)

Detachment CP

Legion: World Eaters

+ HQ +

Daemon Prince [8 PL, 160pts]: Daemonic axe, Khorne, Talisman of Burning Blood

Khârn the Betrayer [8 PL, 115pts]: Warlord

+ Troops +

Chaos Space Marines [8 PL, 114pts]: Mark of Khorne
. Aspiring Champion: Bolt pistol, Combi-plasma
. 4x Marine w/ boltgun: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Boltgun, 4x Frag & Krak grenades
. Marine w/ heavy or special weapon: Reaper chaincannon

Khorne Berzerkers [9 PL, 180pts]: Icon of Wrath
. Berzerker Champion: Bolt pistol, Chainsword
. 9x Chainsword and bolt pistol: 9x Bolt pistol, 9x Chainsword, 9x Frag & Krak grenades

Khorne Berzerkers [9 PL, 180pts]: Icon of Wrath
. Berzerker Champion: Bolt pistol, Chainsword
. 9x Chainsword and bolt pistol: 9x Bolt pistol, 9x Chainsword, 9x Frag & Krak grenades

+ Elites +

Chaos Decimator [8 PL, 220pts]: Mark of Khorne, 2x Soulburner petard

Chaos Decimator [8 PL, 220pts]: Mark of Khorne, 2x Soulburner petard

+ Fast Attack +

Blood Slaughterer of Khorne [9 PL, 180pts]: Slaughter blade

Blood Slaughterer of Khorne [9 PL, 180pts]: Slaughter blade

+ Heavy Support +

Hellforged Deredeo Dreadnought [14 PL, 275pts]: Butcher cannon array, Greater havoc launcher, Mark of Khorne, Twin heavy bolter

+ Dedicated Transport +

Chaos Rhino [4 PL, 86pts]: Combi-bolter, Combi-bolter, Havoc launcher, Mark of Khorne

Chaos Rhino [4 PL, 86pts]: Combi-bolter, Combi-bolter, Havoc launcher, Mark of Khorne

++ Total: [98 PL, 12CP, 1,996pts] ++

I love the look of the Blood Slaughterers!

Would this army stand a chance in 9th edition if I'd play it well enough? Does the list make any sense at all?
I'd really appreciate any feedback. Thanks.

   
Made in de
A Skull at the Throne of Khorne




Not a single yay or nay? No World Eaters players out there?

In most battle reports I see Maulerfiends which seem to fulfill a similar role to Slaughterers. Are Maulerfiends strictly better than Slaughterers?
   
Made in se
Regular Dakkanaut




Welcome back!!
I’m not a typical world eater player but I have some insight on them. Right now you’re kharn have to go up the board as you have 10 zerkers in each rhino so remove one from a unit and add him.

The most obvious thing I can see with your list is that you have both Decimators and slaughters which is both daemon Engines. I would suggest to replace the Decimators with contemptors or more deredos. They are simply better and/or cheaper.

Daemon engines love the HQ “lord Discordant” as he buff them with +1 to hit and can give them +2M if he’s the warlord or field commander.

Maulerfiends are (I think) 40pts cheaper but I think the slaughter is a little bit better.

Can write more when I have time and sitting at my PC but a little feedback for now.
   
Made in de
A Skull at the Throne of Khorne




Thanks, Tazberry.
That's exactly the kind of feedback I was looking for!

So with four Demon Engines it would make sense to cut the Demon Prince and instead run a Discolord as Warlord?
Regarding Khârn, I'd just need to cut one Berzerker so that he can ride with the other nine, right?
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Los Angeles

Not since 4th edition? A lot has changed.

Stevomat wrote:
Chaos Space Marines [8 PL, 114pts]: Mark of Khorne
. Aspiring Champion: Bolt pistol, Combi-plasma. 4x Marine w/ boltgun: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Boltgun, 4x Frag & Krak grenades. Marine w/ heavy or special weapon: Reaper chaincannon

One of things that changed was the Min/Max dynamic. It went away as effective some where in 6th edition. And, 5 Space Marines just won't hold up for long, and the combi-plasma and Reaper Chain Cannon's points will go to waste quickly. The game's offensive output is higher and nastier that it's ever been. I'd recommend a unit with no upgrades as 5 CSM can be swept away in one go by a lot of popular, basic enemy units.

Stevomat wrote:
Khorne Berzerkers [9 PL, 180pts]: Icon of Wrath. Berzerker Champion: Bolt pistol, Chainsword. 9x Chainsword and bolt pistol: 9x Bolt pistol, 9x Chainsword, 9x Frag & Krak grenades
I MathHammered out the better performance comparing ChainAxes and ChainSwords. The axe's -1AP works out a bit better than an extra swing against most types of enemy units.

Stevomat wrote:
Chaos Decimator [8 PL, 220pts]: Mark of Khorne, 2x Soulburner petard
Blood Slaughterer of Khorne [9 PL, 180pts]: Slaughter blade

I'm not familiar with these.

Stevomat wrote:
Hellforged Deredeo Dreadnought [14 PL, 275pts]: Butcher cannon array, Greater havoc launcher, Mark of Khorne, Twin heavy bolter
I have been butchered and carved up by these a lot. I hate them!

It's a good unit.

Stevomat wrote:

Chaos Rhino [4 PL, 86pts]: Combi-bolter, Combi-bolter, Havoc launcher, Mark of Khorne
Chaos Rhino [4 PL, 86pts]: Combi-bolter, Combi-bolter, Havoc launcher, Mark of Khorne
Again, because the game has become so deadly, I'd skip the points spent on the Havoc Launcher and extra combibolter.

Stevomat wrote:
Would this army stand a chance in 9th edition if I'd play it well enough? Does the list make any sense at all?
I'd really appreciate any feedback. Thanks.

World Eaters suffers from lack of fire power, of course, being a h2h army. Chaos SM fire power can be tapped with the new Obliterators, but acquiring the new models is really expensive. With points saved here or there, a unit of havoks with Reaper Chain Cannons, a full 10 men? Go with another Deredeo Dread? Lords Discordant are also an 8th edition favorite, for shooting, speed and h2h (hand-to-hand).

I recommend watching 8th edition videos on how to maximize your Charge, Consolidate and Pile in ... 9th has become an even tighter dance to get it done well, but watching this will really help you max the KhorneB's performance. This is one video I liked.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yXsZFlk6lY

Keep in mind that when he talks about inches, 9th is now at half an inch (so 1.2 cm since you're in Europe ?) for parts of the fight phase. And the coherency phase will invalidate some of the content where models are strung out in the 'conga-line'.

There is a 8th edition character unit called the Exalted Champion, in the codex. I recommend using him as he gives a reroll to wound element, called 'Aspire to Glory', likely better than Kharne the Betrayer. This is not a strong recommendation, as he has no Invulerable Save and now the coherency rules might make it harder to use his 'Aspire to Glory' bubble. But he's a cheaper HQ, and his reroll to wound bubble is not just s. And since any model in your collection can stand in for this guy ...

Don't bother with the Dark Apostle as his mechanic is too uncertain. He's basically a Chaos Chaplain, but the Litanies of Hate mechanism is now based on a 3+ dice roll, which can't be done, if he starts the round in the rhino.

Lame and near useless.

- - - - - - -
Finally, I have not yet played a game of 9th. Damn you, Covid 19. In 8th, I played various builds of 3 to 5 rhinos worth of Khorne Bs, oblits, and Daemon detachments, and lost most games. Iron Hands were nuts Over-Powered late last year, and I got 60 to 80% blown off the table before I could get to the enemy.

The table is smaller now, but we also lost the 'toe in' element of disembarking from a rhino. Now disembarking is entirely, wholly, within 3 inches. So, while the battle field shrunk, so did the assault distance of the last additions. I know you might be going, "Wait, I can charge up to 12 inches?! Great!" Instead of the flat 6 inches back in 4th. Even with the Icon of Wrath, it can be dicey.

If I wanted to have fun at a tournament (again, screw you covid19!) I'd take World Eaters, and lose most games playing with the "kiddie pool" casual players. For a serious chance at going 3-3 or or better at a GT, I'd take SM or Tau. I'll confess though, I'm a medium to poor performing tourney player. My list advice is good, but I get sloppy at the table. When Serpent Spam was good, and WraithKnights were new, I went 4-2 at a GT in 6th, and won an RTT. Heh, that was a push-button army.

Good luck and get ready to spend all that money you saved these last 15 years.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/08/02 23:59:26


"You can bring any cheesy unit you want. If you lose. Casey taught me that." -Tim S.

"I'm gonna follow Casey; he knows where the beer's at!" -Blackmoor, BAO 2013

Quitting Daemon Princes, Bob and Fred - a 40k webcomic 
   
Made in gb
Death-Dealing Devastator



UK

Hi and welcome back to the game!

Just saw a batrep featuring a similar style world eaters army to your list which may be of interest:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCPMlvlFtw0

For some feedback on your list though, there are a lot of forge world units in there, and these are all apparently about to be on the receiving end of updated rules as all rules making passes over to GW proper; this could just mean a few point changes or it could be more extreme if they continue the policy of no model no rules as technically the chaos versions of some units don't exist - so if you haven't already got these it might be worth waiting. The only glaring issue I can with the list to improve for playing with rules as they currently stand are the berzerkers being chainsword/pistol only, sword/chainaxe on the marines and sword/powerfist on the champions is pretty much the best way to run these - dropping the chaincannon model from the basic marine unit would pretty much cover the cost of this.
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




I like it. Slaughterers are better from my experience but less accessible as models go.

Not sold on the nilla marines at all, or the deredeo in this edition. I'd get more zerks and change their weaponry as mentioned above. I think the deredeo pretty over costed sadly since they were great. Now consider you can get 2 defilers for 5 pts more. I would also lose the havoc launchers personally.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/08/03 04:25:45


 
   
Made in de
A Skull at the Throne of Khorne




Thanks a lot for all of your feedback!

@Brothererekose:
Should I use Sword+Axe for the Zerkers or Pistol+Axe?
Chaos Rhinos should be used at minimal point cost, check.
I watched the vid and it seems very helpful, but the complexity of the rules is pretty intimidating.
I needed several years to master the rules of MtG and to become a pretty good player. Thinking about how I need to start from 0 again when it comes to 40k makes me wonder if I really wanne do this...
And then there's the money aspect. The figures are expensive af and since I suck at painting figures I'd pretty much have to order my army at Siege Studios or Den of Imagination and I guess that 2000 pts will cost me 2000 € then. Has anyone here used their service?

@Insularum:
I actually watched that vid before I wrote this post
Loved it!
Does anyone know when the FW datasheets will be FAQd for 9th edition? I guess it really doesn't make sense for me to buy anything before then.

@dominuschao:
The nilla marines were pretty much in there as the cheapest way to get a mandatory third core unit. Would you suggest to use a small Zerker unit instead or another 10 (even without a third Rhino)?
Regarding the Defilers, you might be right about them power-per-point-ratio-wise but I don't like these models at all so I can't play them.

One more question:
What would be the cheapest (CPs and points) way to include an awesome demon model like Skarbrand in this army?
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Los Angeles

Stevomat wrote:
Thanks a lot for all of your feedback!

@Brothererekose:
Should I use Sword+Axe for the Zerkers or Pistol+Axe?
Sword + Axe gets those extra swings in, but I choose Pistols + Axe for the slightly more variable shooting. Plus, not hard to do, but it's a little extra effort to say, 'these black dice are the swords, and these blue ones are the axes.' Eh, not complicated, but at the time, the game was playing way too long and I decided on some expediency in speed of play. Further, and rarely pans out - the pistols could kill a couple models allowing consolidate shenanigans when the fight phase rolls around. Usually doesn't though.

Stevomat wrote:

Chaos Rhinos should be used at minimal point cost, check.
I watched the vid and it seems very helpful, but the complexity of the rules is pretty intimidating.
I watched it three times. And with KBs getting to fight twice, yeah, there's a lot of strategic brain to put into the movement.

Stevomat wrote:

I needed several years to master the rules of MtG and to become a pretty good player. Thinking about how I need to start from 0 again when it comes to 40k makes me wonder if I really wanne do this...
And then there's the money aspect. The figures are expensive af and since I suck at painting figures I'd pretty much have to order my army at Siege Studios or Den of Imagination and I guess that 2000 pts will cost me 2000 € then. Has anyone here used their service?


I've been playing since 2004 and I still suck at it. I go 1w&2l at 3 game tourneys. In 6th, I managed to win 2 RTTs though. Or maybe 2w/4/ at 6 game GTs. Then again, I went 5-0 in a heat of the local league last year (scaled opponents too, the baby-seals were in another group, and the cut-throat, really good players were in yet another group). At tourneys, beer might be a factor. I have seen 'new' players quickly over take my skill level and they're just better at the game.

Money: While buying the models is gonna cost ya, good painting might just double the army's cost. I would advise some easy paint schemes instead. There's a literal world of advice to be gleaned when you ask in the right places.

For KBs -
a. Prime paint white and no need to bother with $18 spray cans of 'hobby' paint. I used OSH, Orchard Supply and it works fine, though I think the company folded.
b. I did use GW's Mephy red, very watered down, and slopped it all over the models, yielding darker recesses and thinner flats. A second coat was needed for some flat areas. I'll post some pix.
c. The gold trim took one coat, but I used a non-GW gold, basically from Michael's Art.
d. Eyes, guns, backpacks, I finished off with GW stuff. KBs are not the hardest models to paint.

You asked about :

Stevomat wrote:
The nilla marines were pretty much in there as the cheapest way to get a mandatory third core unit. Would you suggest to use a small Zerker unit instead or another 10 (even without a third Rhino)?
Cultists will get that slot filled for 10 less points, double the bodies. And at $2 a dude, one of GW's cheaper models:

https://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Chaos-Cultists-2019

They would be my go to; a back field unit that might well get erased by wyverns, whirlwinds or other 'indirect' shooting, but they're the cheap option.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/08/04 17:41:42


"You can bring any cheesy unit you want. If you lose. Casey taught me that." -Tim S.

"I'm gonna follow Casey; he knows where the beer's at!" -Blackmoor, BAO 2013

Quitting Daemon Princes, Bob and Fred - a 40k webcomic 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




OP- I would also suggest cultists if you don't take another zerk squad. But then I'd just take a patrol instead and bring in another patrol for whatever it is you want.. Bloodletters for example.

If you don't like defilers I get it. I didn't either until I owned one. Soul grinder models are usually fine as a stand in for the players I've met. If neither works then I'd suggest contemptors which are still solid. If not then forge fiends! Haha basically I can't recommend the deredeo anymore and I loved mine in 8th.

Skarbrand I also would not recommend. But if you want him then go with the above suggestion of double patrols. A super greater daemon (forgot the strat name) would be another option..

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/08/05 02:24:37


 
   
Made in de
A Skull at the Throne of Khorne




Here's a second try:

Configuration
Battle Size [12CP] Strike Force (101-200 Total PL / 1001-2000 Points)
Battalion Detachment
World Eaters
HQ
Khârn the Betrayer [8 PL, 115pts]
Zhufor the Impaler [8 PL, 120pts]
Selections: 3. Unholy Fortitude, Warlord
Troops
Chaos Cultists [6 PL, 66pts]
Selections: Mark of Khorne
10x Chaos Cultist w/ autopistol and brutal assault weapon
Cultist Champion w/ autopistol and brutal assault weapon
Khorne Berzerkers [9 PL, 176pts]
Selections: Icon of Wrath
Berzerker Champion
Selections: Bolt pistol, Power axe
8x Chainaxe and bolt pistol
Khorne Berzerkers [9 PL, 176pts]
Selections: Icon of Wrath
Berzerker Champion
Selections: Bolt pistol, Power axe
8x Chainaxe and bolt pistol
Elites
Chaos Decimator [8 PL, 195pts]
Butcher cannon, Mark of Khorne, Soulburner petard
Chaos Decimator [8 PL, 195pts]
Butcher cannon, Mark of Khorne, Soulburner petard
Fast Attack
Blood Slaughterer of Khorne [9 PL, 180pts]
Slaughter blades
Blood Slaughterer of Khorne [9 PL, 180pts]
Slaughter blades
Dedicated Transport
Chaos Rhino [4 PL, 83pts]
Havoc launcher, Mark of Khorne
Chaos Rhino [4 PL, 83pts]
Havoc launcher, Mark of Khorne
Super-Heavy Auxiliary Detachment -3CP
World Eaters
Lord of War
Kytan Ravager [25 PL, 430pts]
Total: [107 PL, 9CP, 1,999pts]

Biggest changes (besides the basic stuff like Axes and Cultist like mentioned above) are: Zhufor & Kytan Ravager
I like Zhufor because he offers at least some protection against Psykers, he can teleport, and he seems very tough.
The huge Ravager adds a lot of firepower and should be very hard to take down. If the opponent concentrates his firepower on Ravager he'll get obliberated by the Berzerkers, Slaughterers and Decimators.
Does this version look stronger than the first try?
(Note: The Rhinos still have launchers because I didn't know what to do with the points. With another Berzerker I end up at 2001 pts.)
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Los Angeles

Stevomat,
You've included many FW models I'm not familiar with, so I'm not qualified to comment.

However, it's good you're giving the KBs all chain-axes.

From here, I'd advise find the couple dudes you know are going to be covid19 smart, set up a table outside (still summer in Europe) and play.

Masks and no dice sharing.

That ought to really make the OCD* "Don't Touch My Dice" folks happy.



*Obessive Compulsive Disorder

"You can bring any cheesy unit you want. If you lose. Casey taught me that." -Tim S.

"I'm gonna follow Casey; he knows where the beer's at!" -Blackmoor, BAO 2013

Quitting Daemon Princes, Bob and Fred - a 40k webcomic 
   
 
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