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Made in us
Been Around the Block







Dead Earth Games is proud to present The Drowned and the Damned, our new 1:600 scale fantasy naval battle game!

We'll be coming to Kickstarter soon with our dwarf and elf fleets and, of course, the game rules.

Find out more by joining the group on Facebook

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/11/11 16:42:12


   
Made in ie
Dakka Veteran




Ireland

I take it the first ships shown are Elves and the second lot are Dwarves? The Elves have a very nice clean design to them, the Dwarves look a little bit too high out of the water. Could do with having a few millimeters shavesd off.

I don't do Facebook, so will have to rely on updates in here.

The objective of the game is to win. The point of the game is to have fun. The two should never be confused. 
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block





 stonehorse wrote:
I take it the first ships shown are Elves and the second lot are Dwarves? The Elves have a very nice clean design to them, the Dwarves look a little bit too high out of the water. Could do with having a few millimeters shavesd off.

I don't do Facebook, so will have to rely on updates in here.


Thanks. Yes, you are correct, top picture elves, lower picture dwarves. I think the dwarves will look good if based with water around them, but you're not the first to say they look too high! I'll be considering this.

We are on Twitter and Instagram as Dead Earth Games. Whilst I will update here too, it is easy for small companies/projects to get missed!

   
Made in us
Stone Bonkers Fabricator General






A garden grove on Citadel Station

To base them with water, would we have to pour water effects resin in for a centimeter of depth or something? Or perhaps one would cut off or sand off the bottom of the dwarf ships?

If your ship is sitting in the water.... you are not going to see the bottom half of that propulsion wheel. Or the keel bottom.

This seems like kind of a fundamental plan issue... are some factions going to be modeled sitting on top of the waves, and some partially submerged in the water?

ph34r's forgeworld Phobos blog
+From Iron Cometh Strength+ +From Strength Cometh Will+ +From Will Cometh Faith+ +From Faith Cometh Honor+ +From Honor Cometh Iron+
The Polito form is dead, insect. Are you afraid? What is it you fear? The end of your trivial existence?
When the history of my glory is written, your species shall only be a footnote to my magnificence.
 
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block





 ph34r wrote:
To base them with water, would we have to pour water effects resin in for a centimeter of depth or something? Or perhaps one would cut off or sand off the bottom of the dwarf ships?

If your ship is sitting in the water.... you are not going to see the bottom half of that propulsion wheel. Or the keel bottom.

This seems like kind of a fundamental plan issue... are some factions going to be modeled sitting on top of the waves, and some partially submerged in the water?


Ah, you're right, it doesn't make sense for different factions to be based differently. We are hoping to make "waterline" versions of the dwarf ships available too, for those that prefer.

   
Made in us
Battlefield Tourist




MN

Fantasy Naval seems to be a thing lately.

I welcome it!

Do you like Free Wargames?
http://bloodandspectacles.blogspot.com/ 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




To me they look non functional as boats even by fantasy boat standards. If this is something you want to bring to Kickstarter I’d say take it back to the woodshed so to speak.
   
Made in us
Courageous Space Marine Captain





SoCal

So, are we talking resin or metal?

   
Made in us
Been Around the Block





 Easy E wrote:
Fantasy Naval seems to be a thing lately.

I welcome it!


Given how long it takes to get these things up and running it is a coincidence indeed that we and Mantic are both bringing out this type of game at the same time.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
So, are we talking resin or metal?



Plastic, actually. They will be available printed or to print at home for those with the tech.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/12 08:24:57


   
Made in us
Tail-spinning Tomb Blade Pilot






 DeadEarthRich wrote:
Plastic, actually. They will be available printed or to print at home for those with the tech.
Oh, printable files? Now you have my attention.

"Wir sehen hiermit wieder die Sprache als das Dasein des Geistes." - The Phenomenology of Spirit 
   
Made in us
Speed Drybrushing





San Francisco, CA

Groovy! I'll be watching this space for more info. The Mantic boats look pretty excellent, but more variety is always good! Make sure you sell them waterlined; I'm not sure what the reason you'd have them floating above the water would be and suspect those ("air boats") won't sell well.

Don't know if it's an issue with the photographs or the models, but do try to exaggerate, at least a little, the details on the ships so they paint up nicely. The details on some of the ships look very faint - a more expert painter would be able to bring these details out, but most of us will struggle to make these look nice on the table!

Good luck, this looks neat.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/12 15:16:51


I play...

Sigh.

Who am I kidding? I only paint these days... 
   
Made in us
Courageous Space Marine Captain





SoCal

Mantic boats need targets.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The elf ships look fun as-is. The dwarf ships need something, some je-ne-sais-quoi.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/12 18:32:17


   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




South New Jersey

 BobtheInquisitor wrote:

Automatically Appended Next Post:
The elf ships look fun as-is. The dwarf ships need something, some je-ne-sais-quoi.


They're steam-powered, so maybe more tubing? And add the prow figure and anchors of the large ship to the smaller ones?

And remove the faux-masts, unless there's actually meant to be sails there.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/12 19:51:40


   
Made in us
Courageous Space Marine Captain





SoCal

Removing the masts would help. They might also just need to be longer (or lower, maybe) to avoid that bathtime toy look.

   
Made in us
Speed Drybrushing





San Francisco, CA

yea, the littler Dwarf ships, the ones with jus the cannon on top... Do need a little detailing to make them stand out better. The details look like they're painted on, I'd recommend adding more details to ensure the cabin shows windows, doors, whatnot - so the painter has an easier time of it.

They look like a cool STL 'first draft', and I'm intrigued to see what comes!

I play...

Sigh.

Who am I kidding? I only paint these days... 
   
Made in gb
Sword-Bearing Inquisitorial Crusader





London, England

My main problem with the dwarf ships was brought up earlier. They look like they're hovering above the water rather than floating in it.
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block





Hi all. Thanks for all the discussion and thoughts.

You might be able to see some more detail on the dwarf ships here:

The masts can be removed pretty easily if they aren't to your taste - also the turrets on the Ironclad are interchangeable with mortar and gattling gun variants.

I also hear what is being said about the waterline. Does this look better to you all?




   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

I think you need to go study ship design in more depth.


I'd look at games like Man O War and Uncharted Seas; however also look at real world ships. If you go look at the steam boats and ships likely all the way up to WWI you'll get some very solid ideas of how ships look at sea (you've already responded to critique on this) as well as what details and features there are on ships.

Right now your ships seem very "toy boat" design. Which is simplistic and often missing key details or features or even just a general functional shape. Eg the smaller dwarf ships you are showing don't appear to have any where for a crew to stand or command the ship. You've got two armoured sides and a rear to a massive cannon, but no bridge, engine room or anything else. Even accepting that some features are below the waterline it still looks ilke its missing a lot. For a cannon that size at the fore you'd likely expect the ship to be at least two or three times as long as it is to then have room behind the gun for the breach and loading/magazine and then further back for the funnel and engineroom and then a bridge overhead.

I think more study would also give more thought to the reasons for the masts, right now you've thus duel mast design, but it just seems to be "there" for the sake of it.

There's also other practical considerations to design, eg the battleship for the dwarves appears to have a bridge, but its so low that the window is looking at the back end of the fore-gun. So they'd never be able to see to sail let alone fire. Plus there's no side vision in evidence, which means they can't see out to fire the port or starboard guns nor even to find enemies to turn toward.




I see similar issues with the elf ships at the top. They not only appear to be a different scale (the dwarf ships suggest very tiny people but the size of the sail and bolt thrower on the elf ship suggest they are closer to small boats with large standing crew). But the sail appears to be crowded in and so close to the bolt thrower that any crew operating the ship would have vision and movement heavily curtailed with a high chance that as they are aiming and trying to fire; they'd be bashed in by the sail flapping in the wind and the rigging.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/14 15:37:01


   
Made in gb
Been Around the Block





Whilst they are, of course, completely fantastical ,the dwarf ships were inspired by the early ironclads such as the 1862 USS Monitor, and retaining the masts like slightly earlier vessels such as the 1845 HMS Birkenhead. The masts are there in case of running out of fuel.

   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka






Elf ships are... ok?

Dwarf ships are terrible. They look like those toys you pull back along the floor and let go to see them move. Pointless masts that don’t even look functional and they apparently displace zero water and magically paddle across the surface.

Overall they do a good job at selling Mantic’s models.

"The Omnissiah is my Moderati" 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka




CL VI Store in at the Cyber Center of Excellence

 DeadEarthRich wrote:
Whilst they are, of course, completely fantastical ,the dwarf ships were inspired by the early ironclads such as the 1862 USS Monitor, and retaining the masts like slightly earlier vessels such as the 1845 HMS Birkenhead. The masts are there in case of running out of fuel.


May want to re-look at pictures of the Monitor and see how high above the water the ship sat...


Every time a terrorist dies a Paratrooper gets his wings. 
   
Made in us
Speed Drybrushing





San Francisco, CA

The clear dwarf model that is waterlined above certainly does look better.

But like others say, they look too comical, too simplistic (like a dime store toy). I'd reduce the size of the forward cannon, and try to add more details like a bridge, fantastical steam engines and piping (imagine the 1862 USS Monitor made love to a Warmachine WarJack and they had a fantastical baby...)

Think about what approximate scale these are (about 1/600?) and what size the cannons should be, the bolt throwers, etc. Can you add features like a hatch/door to get in and out of the bridge? That would add a lot. I kinda like the bigger dwarf boat, but the little ones really don't do it for me.

But I'm following along, and curious to see where this goes!

I play...

Sigh.

Who am I kidding? I only paint these days... 
   
Made in us
Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus





United States

 DeadEarthRich wrote:
 Easy E wrote:
Fantasy Naval seems to be a thing lately.

I welcome it!


Given how long it takes to get these things up and running it is a coincidence indeed that we and Mantic are both bringing out this type of game at the same time.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
So, are we talking resin or metal?



Plastic, actually. They will be available printed or to print at home for those with the tech.


potential commercial license for printed sales? Just curious at this point

I play: AOS Death, AOS Cities of Sigmar, 40K imperial soup.

I make bases, movement trays, texture material, and other items.

myself and a business partner also rent out our 3D printers. if you need print time, message me. 
   
Made in se
Hacking Interventor





Sweden

Love those elven ships with ballistaes!
   
Made in gb
Been Around the Block





 lord marcus wrote:
 DeadEarthRich wrote:
 Easy E wrote:
Fantasy Naval seems to be a thing lately.

I welcome it!


Given how long it takes to get these things up and running it is a coincidence indeed that we and Mantic are both bringing out this type of game at the same time.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
So, are we talking resin or metal?



Plastic, actually. They will be available printed or to print at home for those with the tech.


potential commercial license for printed sales? Just curious at this point


I don't see why not, the way postage costs have increased, in particular to the USA, this would make it a lot easier for some people to get involved.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Sikil wrote:
Love those elven ships with ballistaes!


Thanks! Check out our other elf ships on our Twitter or Facebook- just search The Drowned and the Damned.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 pancakeonions wrote:
The clear dwarf model that is waterlined above certainly does look better.

But like others say, they look too comical, too simplistic (like a dime store toy). I'd reduce the size of the forward cannon, and try to add more details like a bridge, fantastical steam engines and piping (imagine the 1862 USS Monitor made love to a Warmachine WarJack and they had a fantastical baby...)

Think about what approximate scale these are (about 1/600?) and what size the cannons should be, the bolt throwers, etc. Can you add features like a hatch/door to get in and out of the bridge? That would add a lot. I kinda like the bigger dwarf boat, but the little ones really don't do it for me.

But I'm following along, and curious to see where this goes!


Hello, thanks for being constructive with your critique. They are indeed 1/600 scale. I know the cannon size is not realistic, nor are the ballista and I do get that some people like their fantasy to seem workable, but for me, it's part of the point of doing fantasy that we can have a massive dwarf cannon, and those ballistas made me think of Game of Thrones last season (although I don't actually want to think too much about the last season...) I think the "comical" or toy aspect is because they are DWARF ships, so aspects are scaled differently to the other races.
I'm the writer and owner of the game, not the sculptor, but I will certainly bear in mind in ideas of hatches and piping in future sculpts.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/11/17 13:51:18


   
Made in us
Courageous Space Marine Captain





SoCal

Depending on the costs, I could easily see buying a couple of those elf ships (and maybe one at 2-up size) to paint red and black as corsairs.

And then I can use those cuneiform decals from the Kickstarter....

Er, depending on the costs.

   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





They look very nice, but then again I'm easily impressed. I'd probably go for the Elven ships.

Casual gamer, casual fun! 
   
Made in us
Been Around the Block





 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Depending on the costs, I could easily see buying a couple of those elf ships (and maybe one at 2-up size) to paint red and black as corsairs.

And then I can use those cuneiform decals from the Kickstarter....

Er, depending on the costs.


Are you after pre-printed or print at home? I can tell you the prices...

   
Made in us
Courageous Space Marine Captain





SoCal

Pre printed. I was also planning to see if Twin Idiots Printing Service was likely to sell prints, as they are in the US.

   
Made in us
Been Around the Block





 BobtheInquisitor wrote:
Pre printed. I was also planning to see if Twin Idiots Printing Service was likely to sell prints, as they are in the US.


Fleets of 8 ships each are £55, the printable versions will be less and also have the advantage that yoh won't have to pay the ridiculous shipping to the States, which went up a lot in July.
If lots of people only want a few ships, I'll add lower pledge levels to accommodate.

   
 
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