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Made in us
Slippery Ultramarine Scout Biker






Hey guys, getting back into warhammer in general after a break (lets be honest just painting up models while in quarantine ) Before I left warhammer I had been interested in 30k (BaC had come out) and picked up Guilliman as a model and some other hq elements w/ 20 breachers before putting them on a shelf for a few years, now I'm interested in getting my UM legion finished off and getting another legion for variety and guest games with other people. So I'm gonna get another primarch I might as well make a couple of lists built around elite primarch and their retinues smashing into each other for fun

UM legion list is pretty locked down:
Spoiler:

++ Crusade (Legiones Astartes: Age of Darkness Army List) [2,000pts] ++

+ HQ [505pts] +

Primus Medicae [105pts]: Artificer Armour [10pts]
. . Primus Medicae [45pts]

Roboute Guilliman [400pts]
. Primarch: Warlord

+ Troops [1,495pts] +

Breacher Siege Squad, Legion [450pts]: 19x Breacher Siege Space Marines[285pts]
. 19x Power Sword [95pts]
. Breacher Siege Sergeant, Legion [5pts]: Power Sword [5pts]

Invictarus Suzerain Squad , Compulsory [485pts]: 7x Invictarus Suzerains [175pts]
. Land Raider Phobos [235pts]: Frag Assault Launchers [10pts], 2x Twin-linked Lascannon Sponsons

Invictarus Suzerain Squad , Compulsory [560pts]: 10x Invictarus Suzerains [250pts]
. Land Raider Phobos [235pts]: Frag Assault Launchers [10pts], 2x Twin-linked Lascannon Sponsons

+ Allegiance +

Legion and Allegiance: XIII: Ultramarines, Loyalist

Rite of War: Primarch's Chosen


But the other legion I'm not too sure on, I was thinking alpha legion b/c Alpharius is bitchin, and so are lernean termies but i feel that at 2k points your really missing out on CotH rite, apharius gets pretty obvious with his location, and the other fun nonsense that AL brings. For refrence of what I was kinda going for heres the list I had:

Spoiler:

+ HQ [557pts] +

Alpharius [415pts]
. Primarch: Warlord

Warmonger [142pts]: On Foot, Psi-resonant Pentacles [5pts], Relics of the Dark Age of Technology, Volkite Charger [7pts]
. Cataphractii Pattern Terminator Armour [35pts]: Terminator Armour [35pts]
. Consul [45pts]
. . Warmonger [45pts]
. Power Weapon: Power Sword

+ Elites [435pts] +

Lernaen Terminator Squad [435pts]
. Harrower [10pts]: Power Dagger [5pts], Power Fist [5pts], Volkite Charger
. Lernean Terminator [40pts]: Power Axe, Volkite Charger
. Lernean Terminator [40pts]: Power Axe, Volkite Charger
. Lernean Terminator [40pts]: Power Axe, Volkite Charger
. Lernean Terminator [40pts]: Power Axe, Volkite Charger
. Lernean Terminator [40pts]: Power Axe, Volkite Charger
. Lernean Terminator [40pts]: Power Axe, Volkite Charger
. Lernean Terminator [40pts]: Power Axe, Volkite Charger
. Lernean Terminator [40pts]: Power Axe, Volkite Charger
. Lernean Terminator with Special Weapon [40pts]: Power Axe, Volkite Charger

+ Troops [480pts] +

Terminator Squad, Legion (Compulsory) [240pts]: Primarchs Chosen: Troops only when taken as Compulsory
. Cataphractii Pattern Terminator Armour
. Terminator Sergeant, Legion [17pts]: Power Dagger [5pts], Power Fist [5pts], Volkite Charger [7pts]
. Terminators, Legion [42pts]: Power Fist [5pts], Volkite Charger [7pts]
. Terminators, Legion [42pts]: Power Fist [5pts], Volkite Charger [7pts]
. Terminators, Legion [42pts]: Power Fist [5pts], Volkite Charger [7pts]
. Terminators, Legion [42pts]: Power Fist [5pts], Volkite Charger [7pts]

Terminator Squad, Legion (Compulsory) [240pts]: Primarchs Chosen: Troops only when taken as Compulsory
. Cataphractii Pattern Terminator Armour
. Terminator Sergeant, Legion [17pts]: Power Dagger [5pts], Power Fist [5pts], Volkite Charger [7pts]
. Terminators, Legion [42pts]: Power Fist [5pts], Volkite Charger [7pts]
. Terminators, Legion [42pts]: Power Fist [5pts], Volkite Charger [7pts]
. Terminators, Legion [42pts]: Power Fist [5pts], Volkite Charger [7pts]
. Terminators, Legion [42pts]: Power Fist [5pts], Volkite Charger [7pts]

+ Fast Attack [320pts] +

Headhunter Kill Teams [320pts]: 9x Combi-bolter with Banestrike, 9x Headhunter [225pts], Heavy Bolter and Suspensor Web with Banestrike [10pts]
. Headhunter Prime [10pts]: Bolt Pistol, Power Axe [10pts]

+ Heavy Support [190pts] +

Sicaran Venator Tank Destroyer [190pts]

+ Allegiance +

Legion and Allegiance: Traitor
. XX: Alpha Legion: Counter-attack

Rite of War: Primarch's Chosen


So what would you guys think about a 2k fun primarch v primarch lists to fight eachother? Other then the models i first mentioned above I currently don't have anything (no land radiers, suzerains etc. nothing AL) , nor do I have plans on buying all this for about 6 months (turns out buying 4 invictarus suzerains squads in the US costs more then a ing ps5 digital, $404 vs $399) so yeah budgeting for it.

Some nice things I'd like to keep in the lists:
Primarch
Big ol' squad of Legion specific elites, pref. Primarch's retinue for fluffyness
Lower model count, mostly to keep games simpler and shorter.
Minimized blast weapons; Not a fan of them.

   
Made in us
Gore-Soaked Lunatic Witchhunter







Alpharius' location is obvious if you're taking that kind of small model count Terminator-based list, yeah. Do more mechanized power armour in Rhinos, and the shell game becomes more interesting. For fluffiness Alpharius should be able to pop up from anywhere at any time, and popping out of a random Tactical squad is much scarier than popping out of a Terminator squad you expected to be scary in melee.

Balanced Game: Noun. A game in which all options and choices are worth using.
Homebrew oldhammer project: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/790996.page#10896267 
   
Made in us
Rogue Grot Kannon Gunna





Atlanta, GA

Alpharius is great largely because he's such a force multiplier due to giving all infantry Preferred Enemy: Everything. Note that from what I remember, this doesn't work though if he's hidden in a unit or in a transport, so he HAS to be on the table to give all those benefits.
   
Made in us
Monstrous Master Moulder




Cleveland, Ohio, USA

I love showcasing legion specific units within Primarch's Chosen lists. Loosely for Dark Angels what I had was;

Lion El'Jonson
10x Deathwing Companions

2x5 Inner Circle Knights Cenobium

2x5 Dreadwing Interemptors

Garnish with transports to you liking. I'd follow similar trends, especially for casual lists, with other legions. Lerneans and Headhunters for Alpha Legion, Contekar / Raptors / Terror Squads for Night Lords, Immortals and Gorgons for Iron Hands, etc. Legions without as many units can easily slot in another "big dumb fun thing" like Leviathans.

They are my bulwark against the Terror. They are the Defenders of Humanity. They are my Space Marines, and they shall know no fear. 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Abel





Washington State

The problem with Primarchs in a 2000 point list is that you end up with a Death Star and that's about it. The game boils down to which Death Star assaults first (usually on Turn 2 or 3) and that pretty much decides the game. Every Death Star list is:

Primarch
Unit of "Special" Terminators (or rare cases, power armor special units like IF Templar Brethren or something)
Apothocary (usually in Terminator armor)
Spartan Land Raider

2x MSU Troops (Most Primarchs make the special unit a troops choice, so you just add another special unit and call it good)

Whatever points you have left over (won't be much if any) are typically Reaper (Rapier)? Quad Launchers because cheap, no line of sight artillery.

The second drawback is that there are very much tiers of Priamrchs, with the highest tier S being significantly stronger and better in game then the low tiers. Some Primarchs are 100% support, with no chance in combat, but huge synergistic effects on the army (Guiliman). Others are 100% beat sticks in combat that do nothing for the army (Russ). I love the Imperial Fists, but cringe at seeing Dorn on the Battlefield unless it's a 3,000 point game and there are fortifications all over the table. Conversely, if I see Horus or Magnus on the table, I know the game is pretty much over at 2,000 points.

What do you do for the always vocal minority that insist on playing non-Space Marine Legions in the HH? The Custodies, Mechanicum, Daemon, IG armies?

I think your best bet in a "casual" League would be a 2,000 point army with "free" Primarchs, or 2,500 points with Primarchs. Even then, it's just hard to get around the Death Star.

Kara Sloan shoots through Time and Design Space for a Negative Play Experience  
   
Made in us
Gore-Soaked Lunatic Witchhunter







 Tamwulf wrote:
...What do you do for the always vocal minority that insist on playing non-Space Marine Legions in the HH? The Custodies, Mechanicum, Daemon, IG armies?...


Custodes and AdMech at least have Primarch-tier characters; Valdor won't take a Primarch 1v1 unless you roll really well, but his deathstar's a lot scarier than most Primarchs', Scoria's usually weaker or a toss-up 1v1, but he's got Patris Cybernetica so his deathstar's T7 MCs. Daemons...I have yet to do the math, the monsters won't 1v1 a Primarch, no, but the deathstars are horrifying with the turn 1-2 +1 S/T. Guard are pretty boned, though, yeah.

Balanced Game: Noun. A game in which all options and choices are worth using.
Homebrew oldhammer project: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/790996.page#10896267 
   
Made in us
Monstrous Master Moulder




Cleveland, Ohio, USA

I'll voice support for writing your lists at 2500 points when Primarchs are an accepted factor. I find 2500 to be a more comfortable points range in general for the Horus Heresy. "Free" Primarchs are interesting - but the value of "free" varies wildly with the above-mentioned tiers of power (and deviations between said tiers) when dealing with Primarchs.

They are my bulwark against the Terror. They are the Defenders of Humanity. They are my Space Marines, and they shall know no fear. 
   
 
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