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Hey all

I'm wondering how to improve my experience with airbrushing Citadel paints.

I have some of their "Air" range, Mephiston Red springs to mind, but whilst they're great for brush painting I've never been able to get them to spray nicely, the pots I have seem to be too thick for airbrushing and thinning them is a guessing game at best!

I've also tried thinning their normal Base and Layer paints, with varying degrees of success.


I have, a Harder & Steenbeck Ultra with 0.2mm and 0.4mm nozzles/needles. I also have a Chinese clone of an Iwata, it has 0.2mm, 0.3mm and 0.5mm nozzles/needles, this is the airbrush I use mostly for acrylics and has served me well for 3 or so years now. My compressor is typically set to about 25psi, although I use a MAC valve to lower that when needed.

I mostly use my airbrushes for scale modelling and typically use Tamiya and Gunze paints for that, with the odd Vallejo Model Air thrown in. I thin the Tamiya/Gunze with Gunze Self Levelling Thinner, and they spray very well, it's like night and day compared with any other paints.

With Citadel paints I've tried a homebrew water/IPA/retarder/flow improver mix (in a 2 parts water:1 part IPA:1 drop flow:1 drop retarder ratio per 60ml), straight water, Vallejo thinners, and I think 99% IPA, but they just do not spray as well as the Tamiya/Gunze paints no matter what I thin them with. I usually thin them 50/50. They spray worse than Vallejo Model Air paints do.

Clogging seems to be a prominent issue, and often they seem too thin (and not in a good way like MRP lacquer paints for example), even at 50/50 paint to thinners.


What can I do?

Thanks in advance.

The difference you're seeing between citadel and tamiya through an airbrush is because one is acrylic and the other is alcohol based acrylic, so have different properties.

Water based acrylics will never spray as well as the acrylic lacquers from Tamiya or the pure lacquers from Mr.Hobby or the like.

Citadel paints are finicky and I tend to mix them in a plastic cup or tray for transferring to the airbrush cup as the paint is generally not all the same. As a result, you can't use specific ratios and you'll eventually get a feel for the right consistency through trial and error. People say skimmed milk is a good thing to work from. I've been airbrushing for nearly three years now and I have only gotten my usual paint:thinner recipes down from repetition.

If you want to airbrush, I highly recommend contrast paints. I put akhelion green through my cheap Chinese airbrush for an alpha legion paint scheme and it was smooth as silk. I put a tiny bit of contrast medium in as a thinner but it probably wasn't even necessary.

I’m suprised to hear that citadel air paints are too thick, but haven’t tried them myself.

In my experience of thinking down acrylic paints, each paint is different so requires different amounts of thinning.

However try this http://www.greenstuffworld.com/en/auxiliary-paints/1086-acrylic-thinner-240-ml.html

Ive used this and it work really well for thinning. I think it goes a long way too but that depend maybe on how much airbrushing you do. But I think the best thing about it is you just need this and paint and the. You can keep adding drops until you get the right mix/consistency for the paint you are using.

There should be plenty of on lie shops in the Uk selling it

I just started airbrushing, with a cheap Chinese clone. I've been using the Vallejo cleaner and thinner, and I've found citadel paints to airbrush much nicer than others such as scale75 or Vallejo. I believe that this is due to the fact that citadel paints are quite satin compared to other brands. However, I always thin my paints a good bit more than necessary, better safe than sorry. I've also come to love Vallejo's flow improver, which might help your problem.

mrFickle wrote:
I’m suprised to hear that citadel air paints are too thick, but haven’t tried them myself.

I wouldn't call them thick, they're about the consistency of "two thin coats" or maybe a bit thinner. However when I tried to put Citadel Air Mephiston Red through my airbrush when I painted my Ork Aeronautica Imperialis models in 2019/2020 (whenever it was) it just wouldn't spray right as though it was too thick for the airbrush. Then I had to play a guessing game at how much water to put in to thin it down, and for some reason it didn't like having water added to it (probably due to whatever GW put in the Air paints besides pigment)!

I ended up with more red paint on my work surface where I was having to unclog my airbrush and test spray, than I put onto any of the 3 models!!

I just don't spray Citidel paint. They require too much work to shoot, and there is no one recipe for the paint line. I've never seen a paint line that required so many different recipes of water and flow improver to shoot well.

I only use water and flow improver in my acrylic paints. For Tamiya paints, I'll use Tamiya Thinner, but that's the only time I'll use a thinner in a paint. The paints that shoot the best for me are Vallejo Air, Privateer Press P3, and Monument Hobbies Pro Acryl paints. I have tried Reaper and Secret Weapon through my AB and just wasn't that impressed. Wasn't bad, wasn't good. They just required a different way of spraying. I have some Scale 75, but haven't used it in my AB yet.

IMHO, GW is about at the bottom of the list (right above acrylic craft paint) for shooting through my AB. Too much work to get it right, and I always end up with all the problems- tip dry, clogging, and a PITA to clean up. Like, I just can't dump out the excess and run some water and/or AB cleaner through the AB between colors. It's a full on break it down, soak, and scrub with GW paints. I also find it stupid hard to mix GW colors in my AB when I'm trying to shade or highlight. It's like they just refuse to mix. Far too difficult to work with considering how much they cost and that stupid paint pot (worst in the industry!).

Cue the "I've never had any problems with GW paints!" crowd... most likely because they have never tried anything else but GW paints. At least GW paints has taught me all about recognizing AB problems (tip dry, clogging, spattering, spidering) and how to properly clean my AB. Seriously, get some Monument Hobbies Pro Acryl, add some water, add some flow improver, and shoot that. Dump out the excess, run water through the AB until it's clear, then move on to the next color. It's that easy.

As a side note- Air Brush Ready Paints are a marketing gimmick. I've never seen a brand that you can shoot straight out of a bottle without adding something to it. AB Ready Paints are just regular paints with whatever added to them to make them somewhat thinner then regular paints. You still end up having to add something to them to make them spray! What you are really doing is buying less paint, for more money, that you still have to add more stuff to it to shoot properly. Don't fall for the marketing gimmick!

Tamwulf, I have absolutely never experienced the issues you've had with Citadel paints where you can't wash them out with a bit of cleaner and change colour, and really, I've never had problems with GW paints, and I've used a whole host of brands through the airbrush. Mind you, I use Vallejo thinner and flow improver in my mixes, but even when I use water I don't seem to have the issues you mention.

Each paint range have their own methods of getting them right, it sounds to me like you've not found it yet with citadel, to which I'll also direct that to the OP.

I’ve always found that you have to use airbrush thinner to get citadel paints to work through an airbrush. Citadel are probably the least consistent brand I’ve used but I wouldn’t say they were completely bad.

Rob Lee wrote:

mrFickle wrote:
I’m suprised to hear that citadel air paints are too thick, but haven’t tried them myself.

I wouldn't call them thick, they're about the consistency of "two thin coats" or maybe a bit thinner. However when I tried to put Citadel Air Mephiston Red through my airbrush when I painted my Ork Aeronautica Imperialis models in 2019/2020 (whenever it was) it just wouldn't spray right as though it was too thick for the airbrush. Then I had to play a guessing game at how much water to put in to thin it down, and for some reason it didn't like having water added to it (probably due to whatever GW put in the Air paints besides pigment)!

I ended up with more red paint on my work surface where I was having to unclog my airbrush and test spray, than I put onto any of the 3 models!!

As someone else has said I think you should use proper airbrush thinner and not water for this task. I don’t know why ha, I just think so .

I use vallejo airbrush paints, and their airbrush thinner, which works fine with regular citadel paints, and citadel airbrush paints. Some citadel airbrush paints need thinning, it all depends on your nozzle size and air pressure.

 Tamwulf wrote:
Cue the "I've never had any problems with GW paints!" crowd...

Me, Me! I use 1:1 car windscreen wash. Cheap and easy to use. I mix it in a pot before dropping into the airbrush.

 Tamwulf wrote:
most likely because they have never tried anything else but GW paints. At least GW paints has taught me all about recognizing AB problems (tip dry, clogging, spattering, spidering) and how to properly clean my AB.

Yep, I've not tried anything else. Yet. These threads are pointing me to adjust though, since I do get it collecting at the tip and clogs quite easily.

Best advice I have is to expect to clean out your brush pretty frequently. I've done most everything from water to flow improver to retarder and more but citadel always jams my brush.

If none of you mind me asking, are you mixing your paint in the airbrush cup or in another vessel before putting the paint in the cup? The latter will give you significantly less issues with clogging as you aren't dumping any possible lumps of paint in the airbrush or not getting a proper mixed paint.

The collection of paint at the tip is pigment related and generally colour related too. Anything with white pigment in it will get more dry tip than a paint without.

And just for reference, I use mostly citadel through the airbrush and I've not done a deep clean in ages and have no issues with clogging or the like.

 Tyranid Horde wrote:
If none of you mind me asking, are you mixing your paint in the airbrush cup or in another vessel before putting the paint in the cup? The latter will give you significantly less issues with clogging as you aren't dumping any possible lumps of paint in the airbrush or not getting a proper mixed paint.

I mix in the cup, but I always add the thinner to the cup first and (if using a dropper) drip the paint at the rear or side of the cup so that I don't get unmixed paint through the passages. If I'm not using dropper bottle paint, I just pull it out of the pot and mix it in with an old hairybrush, then spray for a few seconds to clear the unmixed thinner and what's left in the actual cup will be pretty well mixed.

Mixing in a separate cup just seems like a waste of time and paint to me, lol. Plus I so often end up tweaking the mixture from my initial guess.

ALWAYS mix outside the cup and transfer to the cup for airbrushing.
You can also put a fine mesh (hosiery works well) to strain out any clumps from your pre-mix to the airbrush.
(this is an old FX painter's trick).

I always mix inside the cup of my airbrush. You always lose paint when you mix outside.

The honest truth is. every single paint needs different ratios.
We dont know the pigments they used.
You will have to get a feel for it.
But, anything thin enough can be shot through an airbrush, i have shot Thing Body acrylics through.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 p5freak wrote:
I always mix inside the cup of my airbrush. You always lose paint when you mix outside.

The problem with that is you can get an unseen gunk of dried paint. if you mix to the side, that is less likely to happen.
when i started to mix then poor in i got alot less clogs.

 chromedog wrote:
ALWAYS mix outside the cup and transfer to the cup for airbrushing.
You can also put a fine mesh (hosiery works well) to strain out any clumps from your pre-mix to the airbrush.
(this is an old FX painter's trick).

When I get paints that clog or clump I stop trying to airbrush with them. I've only had it happen a couple of times, once with an old Vallejo Air paint (and I don't just think that was clumps in the paint as it still seemed smooth initially, I think the mix went bad) and a couple of my old citadel paints started forming clumps so I don't try to airbrush with them any more (and usually it's the base paints that do it, which I tend to avoid airbrushing in the first place).

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

The problem with that is you can get an unseen gunk of dried paint. if you mix to the side, that is less likely to happen.
when i started to mix then poor in i got alot less clogs.

Yes, it can happen, but never happened to me.

is it weird that I've had some success with citadel's paints using windex? it's weird and don't worry the blue doesn't show up, but i used to thin with some windex. I know everyone suggests actual paint thinners, but ive had success using it before. I dont know, you could try it if you like.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
it's probably cheaper than getting actual paint thinner too. like other's said, you can try any number of thinners and ratios to get it to work. What works for one person is not always going to work perfectly for another

Les Bursley from AwesomePaintJob used to use windex frequently as a flow improver and it's something I've been meaning to try too.

Anytime I’ve mixed in the cup it has been a disaster. Mix outside the cup would be my advice

you might want to buy some of these too:
http://www.greenstuffworld.com/en/airbrushing/1438-airbrush-cup-strainers-x2.html

 bubber wrote:
you might want to buy some of these too:
http://www.greenstuffworld.com/en/airbrushing/1438-airbrush-cup-strainers-x2.html

They do everything!