Switch Theme:

How to fix Tau in 9th  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in us
Fresh-Faced New User




I had some ideas on how to do it and I want to run it by you guys. However, this may turn into a series of threads (since they need to be improved quite a bit, again), so for this one, I'd like to start out with their Troops and their weapons. Let's jump in (and let me know if this thread needs moved).

Strike Teams: Overall, as far as stats, they're fine. However, when it comes to options, they are lacking. Opening up access to ion and rail rifles would be good. Maybe for every 6 guys they get one of these options. Pulse weapons;

-Pulse Rifle range can be increased to 36". Heavy Intercessors' Heavy Bolt Rifles have it and they're a Troop choice, so I don't see the issue with doing it here (and keeping it rapid fire). Only thing I wouldn't be sure about doing is increasing the AP by 1. Personally, I like the idea, but for balance purposes having no AP is fine (but, then again, look at Primaris).

-Pulse Carbines could be bumped to 24" and assault 3 or given a similar treatment of a grenade launcher upgrade (look at Intercessors on that). Makes them a little more effective and keeps them on the move.

-Pulse Pistols should be standard, period. If they need to stay in close combat for a turn or two (for WHATEVER the reason), these will help.

Breacher Teams: Like Strike Teams, stats are decent enough, but, again, lacking in the options department. Flamers of some sorts wouldn't be a bad idea, nor would smaller Fusion Blaster-esque weapons (shorter range and/or weaker power), getting one of these for every 5 guys you have. If not Gives them a little more pop. Pulse Blasters should (almost) be 12", AP-2, and either a flat 2D or 1D with half range adding +1D. Where Strike Teams should be about support fire, Breachers should be about taking out heavier infantry.

Kroot: Make them 2A and maybe even S4. Another add on would to upgrade one into a squad leader with an additional pt of Ld and A (with access to better melee weapons and other goodies), instead of just relying on a Shaper for all their other needs. Kroot Rifles are fine, other than taking out the +1S for melee. Melee options should be available, as well as ranged options. For every 5 guys or the entire squad, they get either a melee or ranged option. Sniper rounds (go back a few editions ago) and combat blades that have an AP modifier, of some sorts, and additional attack would be good.

There might be more coming, but what would you do with their Troops?
   
Made in dk
Grisly Ghost Ark Driver






There was a Tau update thread a while back. https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/795793.page

-Pulse Rifle range can be increased to 36". Heavy Intercessors' Heavy Bolt Rifles have it and they're a Troop choice, so I don't see the issue with doing it here (and keeping it rapid fire). Only thing I wouldn't be sure about doing is increasing the AP by 1. Personally, I like the idea, but for balance purposes having no AP is fine (but, then again, look at Primaris).

Why not just decrease points cost? Just because you can increase range does not make it a good idea. AP-1 instantly makes them lots better against 2+ and 3+ Sv units, making them fill roles that other units are supposed to fill and forcing other units to fill the role they are supposed to fill.

I agree adding pulse pistols to all non-auxiliary infantry is a good idea, it's kind of insane to not have a side-arm when you're a weakling fighting monsters. Adding other weapons is far more difficult, GW would at the very least have to release an upgrade kit if not update kits to include the options. I also think it is a bad idea for thematic reasons, XV8s should bring special weapons.

I think flying battlesuits need the ability to shoot in melee to balance out the faction and give it more options to play around objectives. For thematic gameplay reasons the JSJ Strat should be universal and Mont'ka should not allow units to fall back and shoot. Other than those and giving Kroot an extra attack I think Tau mostly need help in the missions with some easy Tau Empire objectives, it'll be interesting to see how they and AM do in the new Maelstrom format if anyone runs tournaments in the format. I would also nerf Saviour Protocols to a +1 Toughness aura for Battlesuits and Infantry, maybe allow the current shenanigans for CHARACTERS, I think it'd be less frustrating to play against this way and would not require making a bazillion look-out-sir and FNP rolls. I find it weird how Drones can perfectly duck out of cover to intercept 83% of lascannon shots but never accidentally get hit by a boltgun, so that's why I'd rather go with my super abstract suggestion.
   
Made in gb
Wing Commander





Bristol (UK)

I don't think you need to massively overhaul what equipment Tau have.
Just by adjusting points and some special abilities they can be brought up to par.

It'd be tempting to give pulse weapons AP1 because Primaris escalated small arms to the point S5 alone isn't as impressive anymore, but I think AP1 would be too much so it's best to just leave it.
Maybe give pulse carbines their photon grenade launcher again.

Related, IMO Fireblades should give another ability. I don't think standing still to increase their power is very in-keeping with the Tau lore, and ultimately leads to the castling.
I don't like Greater Good much as an ability either, perhaps that could be the Fireblade's thing?

A major change I think Tau should have is the return of Jump Shoot Jump. It would make their close range mobile firepower style that their battlesuits are supposed to employ a lot more viable.
Additionally, it would give Tau the ability to clear and objective with shooting, and then move in to take it in the ensuing charge phase - partly what makes melee so good at the moment is the ability to clear and take an objective in the same turn which Tau severely lack.
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




I like the ability to use carbines in close-combat, like pistols are used
   
Made in nl
Annoyed Blood Angel Devastator




netherlands

puls pistols is a good option, but no special weapons for fire warriors thats for the suits and the pathfinders. they need to have the jump shoot jump trick back and the markerlights system has to be redone

full compagny of bloodangels,
5000 pnt imperial guard
5000 pnt orks
2500 pnt grey knights
5000 pnt gsc 
   
Made in us
Second Story Man




Astonished of Heck

 skeleton wrote:
puls pistols is a good option, but no special weapons for fire warriors thats for the suits and the pathfinders. they need to have the jump shoot jump trick back and the markerlights system has to be redone

I always felt like the Shas'ui's Marklerlight was Fire Warrior's Special Weapon option, especially when linked with the Target Lock. They could just fire off the Markerlight at a hard target while the rest of their unit fires at softer targets. A following unit could use that Markerlight token to fire off a Seeker to hit on a 2+.

Too bad that's gone away over time.

Are you a Wolf, a Sheep, or a Hound?
Megavolt wrote:They called me crazy…they called me insane…THEY CALLED ME LOONEY!! and boy, were they right.
 
   
Made in us
Pewling Menial





Superior, Wisconsin

Slapping a bunch of special weapons on troops choices doesn't really fix any core issues with the book. Giving Kroot reliable melee output does improve the ability to participate in a different phase though, and is always a good thought.

Really though, the core issues with the Tau book as its written is endemic to how the markerlight system is written requiring an investment for random chances to get specific bonuses, weapon profiles that didn't transition to 8th in a very satisfying way, and just an overall aversion GW has to making regular crisis suits actually a reliable, customizable damage output device. Base infantry though? Make Kroot hit harder in the fight, job's a good 'un. Outside of that, you're mostly trying to make infantry like everyone else's infantry which isn't really the Tau 'way'

There is no Overkill, only "Open Fire," and "I need to Reload."
When someone tries to kill you, just kill them right back. 
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




I'd rather not see T'au jogging to keep up with Primaris in the statline arms race of basic infantry guns; there was a time when Gauss Flayers and Pulse Rifles were genuinely scary just for being better than basic boltguns, which was a clear sign of the technological prowess of those Factions. That time has passed, and it's best to accept it and move on.

Instead, I'd suggest that T'au need more in the way of structural reworks, to avoid being such a bland, static gunline.
  • Make Kauyon and Mont'ka into interesting, dynamic army-wide rules along the lines of Combat Doctrines or Command Protocols, and add extra Philosophies that a Commander can pick up and deploy.
  • Make Markerlights into a "resource" system, like Miracle dice. Each Shooting phase, all your Markerlight-armed models can place Marker tokens on enemy models they can target, and you can expend these throughout that phase for powerful benefits. Use it to encourage focused fire and combined arms, along with Stratagems similar to Holy Trinity.
  • Force T'au to proactively neutralize enemy threats, rewarding them for focusing fire and getting all their ducks in a row for a planned turn's shooting, rather than just responding as necessary. Offer active debuffs that can suppress enemy units, even if they're not destroyed.
  • Give all T'au transports the Assault Vehicle rule from Impulsors, to allow Fire Warriors to quickly disembark in Rapid Fire range and lay down a barrage of double-tap shots. Offer powerful bonuses for being within half range - or even closer - to encourage this aggressive, risk-taking behaviour.
  • Similarly, revive the old Jet Pack rules to allow Battlesuits to make a free (smaller? random?) move at the end of your Shooting phase - then offer strong benefits for shooting at half-range to encourage them to move in close, unload, and back off into cover or within Greater Good range of more allies.
  • Include powerful positioning-based Stratagems, Auras, and Unit/Detachment/Army abilities, which encourage setting crossfire, outmanoeuvring or surrounding or isolating enemy units. Can you draw a line between two allied units that passes through an enemy unit? They both get a bonus when shooting it. Are there more allies within 6" of an enemy unit than there are other enemy units? It gets photon grenade'd for free.
  • T'au aren't a melee army, that's fine, but provide more interesting counter-attack or retreat responses for those later assault-focused turns. T'au should flow like water, always moving; give them interesting options for regrouping and striking back. Allow Crisis Suits to fire into melee, like VEHICLES. Give the Devilfish a "covering fire" bonus against enemy units who an ally just Fell Back from and then embarked. Buff Kroot (and Vespid) in combat, and give Kroot a "counter-charge" ability for rescuing squishy T'au; perhaps a Heroic Intervention equivalent to Greater Good, or even allowing T'au to Fall Back and Advance/shoot if allied Kroot charge.
  • please for the love of god more alien auxiliaries and no more crisis suits, you can even do them as individual elite characters that's absolutely fine
  • This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/04/08 16:02:57


     
       
    Made in au
    Been Around the Block




    I really want to see any Tau aura or abilities have the movement restrictions removed or at least say "did not advance". Mobility is key in 9th and having to keep still to use an ability just promotes castling.

    For example something like Storm of Fire and Kauyon should have that movement restriction completely removed. Though I'd assume they'd become command phase abilities anyway.

    Army Wide Changes:
    - Marker Lights need to become tokens again and put into brackets. Also make them assault profiles rather than heavy.
    1 marker light hit can provide rerolls of 1 against that unit, or launch a seeker missile.
    2 marker light hits can remove cover, or remove modifiers for heavy or assault weapons.
    3 marker light hits can provide +1 to hit rolls, or +1 to wound rolls.

    - Battlesuits become vehicles or monsters. This allows them to now shoot into engagement range.

    - A return of JSJ for Battlesuits would be nice as well.

    - Tactical Support Turrets should just become independent units after they're placed.

    HQ:
    - Cadre Fireblade I'd like to see them become a more martial character. Able to swap out their pulse rifle for an ion rifle or rail rifle. Also give them a pulse pistol.
    - Darkstrider, similar to the Fireblade. I'd like them to be more customisable and actually be able to take advantage of that BS2+.

    Troops:
    - Fire Warriors I'd let them take an ion rifle or rail rifle per 5 models.
    - Breacher Teams as above.
    - Kroot make them better in close combat with at least 2 attacks and AP-1. Then give them something similar to the Imperial Guards wilderness experts. Where they count as getting cover anywhere.
    - Make the basic XV8 battlesuits troops.

    Elites:
    - Firesight Marksman, give them an option for a rail rifle, or a drone uplink.
    - Shaper give them some way to actually buff the kroot they're with. Either +1 toughness, +1 attack, +1 strength, etc. To show how they're actually shaping their brood.

    Heavy Support:
    - MV71 Sniper Drones. Make the longshot versions cheaper, they pay a premium for ignore look out sir and still only hit on 4+ at best. Also bring back the rail rifle versions.
    - XV88 Broadside Battlesuits: Give them back the option to have proper rail guns again.
       
     
    Forum Index » 40K Proposed Rules
    Go to: