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2021/06/15 08:18:51
Subject: Destruction army confusion.
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Liche Priest Hierophant
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Hello
I am trying to figure out the posabilaties of running a destruction army.
As far as I can tell the posabilaties for battleline are:
Stabbas
Shootas
Ogor Gluttons
Savage Orruks
Is that the complete list?
Further where can I find the rules for playing a destruction army? I thought I had the book, but I can not find it.
Lastly, what am I giving up doing it? Ogor (in my case) warlord trait and artifacts. But the respective units stil have their special rules and spell lores right?
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2021/06/15 10:48:47
Subject: Re:Destruction army confusion.
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Angered Reaver Arena Champion
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This is only applicable if you are running a Grand Alliance Destruction force. Most often the rules for those are found in the General's Handbook but I am not sure if that remains the case in the 2021 book.
If you are not running pure Ogors you lose out on their Battle Traits/Allegiance Abilities which can give you bonuses in various ways. Abilities like Trampling Charge, Ravenous Brutes and Might Makes Right. You also don't get the Everwinter Prayers.
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This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/06/15 10:54:11
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2021/06/15 11:36:45
Subject: Destruction army confusion.
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Locked in the Tower of Amareo
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You lose a TON of stuff. Ogors get no ogor charge MW's, no 1 model=2 model, no monster=10(aos3 at least has it on 5). No spells, prayers, artifacts, command traits. Gloomspite same. No moon either. Orruks ditto. You basically have just warscrolls + generic command traits/artifacts from GA: destruction and that could go away though at least aos3 has generic enchantments.
Basically you want to play AOS: extra hard mode...
Not saying you shouldn't do it but do keep in mind you give up tons of abilities.
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2024 painted/bought: 109/109 |
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2021/06/15 12:55:14
Subject: Destruction army confusion.
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Gargantuan Gargant
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Yeah, it's pretty much common consensus that most Grand Alliances aren't optimal at this stage in AoS. They pale in comparison to the army and subfaction specific allegiances/abilities you get and the lack of DESTRUCTION keyword synergy beyond guys like Gordrakk means you can't do much beyond basic command abilities. I doubt the new edition will make Grand Alliances any more viable than they are now.
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2021/06/15 13:11:08
Subject: Destruction army confusion.
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Veteran Wolf Guard Squad Leader
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Niiai wrote:Hello
I am trying to figure out the posabilaties of running a destruction army.
As far as I can tell the posabilaties for battleline are:
Stabbas
Shootas
Ogor Gluttons
Savage Orruks
Is that the complete list?
Further where can I find the rules for playing a destruction army? I thought I had the book, but I can not find it.
Lastly, what am I giving up doing it? Ogor (in my case) warlord trait and artifacts. But the respective units stil have their special rules and spell lores right?
When playing Grand Alliance, you only use warscrolls and that's it. Anything else you find in battletomes is not available to you (any allegeance abilties, artfiacts, spell lores for example).. There are Allegiance Abilities, command traits, and Artifacts in the Core Rulebook, but I don't know how that is changing in AOS 3.
You give up all the bonuses for specalizing, but the benefit is you have access to the whole range of destruction models, so can cherry pick the best units/ go wild.
Generally, take Stabbas as a cheap battleline and then fill up on monsters and meaty stuff.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/06/15 13:12:01
Wolfspear's 2k
Harlequins 2k
Chaos Knights 2k
Spiderfangs 2k
Ossiarch Bonereapers 1k |
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2021/06/15 13:14:13
Subject: Destruction army confusion.
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Locked in the Tower of Amareo
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Yep. You need to be creative and come up with list that doesn't care about allegiance as warscroll combo's carry you. Haven't seen ga's do well. One rare one had morathi&teclis(and even teclis is hurt by lack of access to spell lores. But endless, mw bome, his ward aura that affects friendly models rather than lumineth etc and mystic shield/arcane bolt just about doable losing just some of his power. Goal is morathi and other stuff(too bad don't recall what) compensates lack of alliance bouses.
You also need more than 400 of separate factions or mix of forces you normally can't mix as ally(like some ko boats to lumineth) or you would be better take 1600+ pts normally and resw as allies.
Losing faction bonuses really cramps on allies in aos.
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2024 painted/bought: 109/109 |
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2021/06/15 15:07:54
Subject: Destruction army confusion.
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Liche Priest Hierophant
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Hmmmm.
Are the destruction artifacts available to destruction subfaction armies? In say a pure ogor army.
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2021/06/15 15:33:55
Subject: Destruction army confusion.
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Horrific Hive Tyrant
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Niiai wrote:Hmmmm.
Are the destruction artifacts available to destruction subfaction armies? In say a pure ogor army.
Currently no.
We'll know more about how all this will work when 3e launches and the General's handbook is released.
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2021/06/15 16:34:18
Subject: Destruction army confusion.
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Liche Priest Hierophant
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There is one destruction artifact that is rather good.
I know some more competitive death players have used one of the death artifacts in their lists.
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2021/06/15 18:17:31
Subject: Destruction army confusion.
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Horrific Hive Tyrant
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Niiai wrote:There is one destruction artifact that is rather good.
I know some more competitive death players have used one of the death artifacts in their lists.
Question is: is there any possible list where that artefact is a better choice than all your allegiance abilities and one faction artefact?
This is another one definitely want to wait on the new General's Handbook on anyway, Grand Allegiances have been poorly supported in 2e and its entirely possible that they get removed from matched play.
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2021/06/15 18:43:33
Subject: Destruction army confusion.
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Veteran Wolf Guard Squad Leader
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Stux wrote: Niiai wrote:There is one destruction artifact that is rather good.
I know some more competitive death players have used one of the death artifacts in their lists.
Question is: is there any possible list where that artefact is a better choice than all your allegiance abilities and one faction artefact?
no, no there isn't.
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Wolfspear's 2k
Harlequins 2k
Chaos Knights 2k
Spiderfangs 2k
Ossiarch Bonereapers 1k |
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2021/06/15 19:16:46
Subject: Destruction army confusion.
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Liche Priest Hierophant
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Hammerblade, exchange a tyrants bite attack or a stonehorns kicks with it. Seems quite good to me once you get stuck in.
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2021/06/15 19:21:50
Subject: Destruction army confusion.
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Fixture of Dakka
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Stux wrote: Niiai wrote:There is one destruction artifact that is rather good.
I know some more competitive death players have used one of the death artifacts in their lists.
Question is: is there any possible list where that artefact is a better choice than all your allegiance abilities and one faction artefact?
Well....
In our Escalation League I wanted to run Death units from as many sources as possible - LoN/ NH/ FEC/ OBR/Legends (Tomb Kings) & FW.
And I needed a combination of bodies + power in the early weeks .
The only way I could make that work was GA: Death
I currently have:
FEC - Ab. Ghoul King - this guy I didn't actually want, but I need a FEC wizard to cast FEC Endless Spells.... So.
FEC - x10 Crypt Ghouls - they get summoned by the King
FEC - Endless Spell (Corpsemare Stampede) - when I saw this model, I knew I had to include it - thus a ghoul king....
FEC - Royal Zombie Dragon
LoN - Coprse Cart (balefire)
LoN - x10 zombies
LoN - x20 Skeletons (sword & shield)
LoN - Tomb Wraith - mostly because I love the model I've got painted up. He'd be in the list no matter what.
LoN - Banshee
NH - The Black Coach
OBR - x1 Mortek Crawler
Legends - x10 Skeleton Archers (Tomb Kings)
* FW - x1 MournGhul - when this guy enters play I'll combine the King & Z.Dragon to be a GK on ZD in order to save just enough pts. (sadly I'll lose the summoned ghouls)
So what's the artifact? Death has a magic blade (can't think of its name atm) that once per game lets you summon 2d6 wounds worth of a summonable unit. I use it to put 1-6 Hexwraiths into play. These guys have earned their paint.
I think this is the best I could offset the loss of a more faction specific set of bonuses. Perfect? No. But it's been effective since week #1.
My WL trait extends the range of my Deathless Minions ability.
While this list is working well in our league environment where people are building forces kind of ad-hoc, it'd likely suffer vs a dedicated 2k list.
And you're probably thinking that it's the Crawler that's carrying the list. Nope. It's only been moderately effective. Draws alot of attention though.... The MVPs to date are the Crypt Ghouls & Hexwraiths (these guys steal the objectives), the Endless Spell (so awesome when it gets to run amok over the enemies), & the Skellies (archers & sword) - who combined always pass just enough minion saves.
Stux wrote:This is another one definitely want to wait on the new General's Handbook on anyway, Grand Allegiances have been poorly supported in 2e and its entirely possible that they get removed from matched play.
As long as they exist, that'll be enough for some of us. Not all of us are worried about always being matched play/tourney compliant. In my circles we're using Legends, GH stuff, FW, etc etc etc. We're happy to call it "open - with 98% of matched play/2% other." )
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2021/06/15 19:24:56
Subject: Destruction army confusion.
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Locked in the Tower of Amareo
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Not bad. Of course with another artifact(or was it command trait) ogor tyrant does same as that if it has 11 models nearby. Plus what other charging ogors do.
Frostlord rerolling to hit, wound and save is pretty mean. Even if mount benefits only from save reroll.
But yea need to wait for ghb. No idea is that still in aos3. It's in ghb2021 if it is
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2024 painted/bought: 109/109 |
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2021/06/15 21:51:52
Subject: Destruction army confusion.
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Liche Priest Hierophant
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The death artifact I mentioned earlier is a clock where you can move your model out of combat. Very strong.
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2021/06/16 03:50:51
Subject: Destruction army confusion.
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Locked in the Tower of Amareo
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That is genuinely good one! Not sure worth allegiance abilities loss but evens it. And gives you something allegiance abilities don't which is good. Weapon of Ultimate Doom while could be good is still just more damage. Ogor allegiance abilities give for example bucketload of mw's and normal wounds army wide. Only close to similar i can think of for destruction are hand of gork for gitz but that restrlcts to 9" charges and can be dispelled/screened out. Ironjawz can do even better in some situations(charge in hero phase, fall back, pile in) but only applles on when you start close to enemy on your turn but not in combat.
Pure retreat and charge? Don't recall, can't find one. So def good artifact to use if you go for the route. Assuming playing as ga: destruction gives you anything in aos3 and this one in particular.
Interesting to see how it's handled. Gw been focusing away from ga's and death got split even further with removal of legion of nagash
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2024 painted/bought: 109/109 |
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