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lumineth - is the mortal wound spam as good as it sounds?  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
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Made in us
Evasive Eshin Assassin






so im really considering getting in to lumineth as i really like the models but i keep trying to talk myself out of it... lol

i keep going back to the sunmetal weapon mortal wound on a 6+ 5+ rule.

while a slightly different mechanic but similar i keep telling myself to run the kruleboys that i have.
it seems odd how expensive pointswise they are compared to say a warden or other orruk but i digress...

can anyone with experience tell me if the sunmetal weapon rule works as good in practice as it does in my head?
   
Made in gb
Horrific Hive Tyrant





Can't help you with Lumineth, but as far as comparing them to Kruleboyz: remember Kruleboyz don't have a tome yet, and will have more abilities once they do.

How much stronger this will make them is anyone's guess, but they should be at least a little stronger than now and possibly significantly so. Shouldn't be long until we find out too!
   
Made in ca
Pestilent Plague Marine with Blight Grenade





The Frozen North

No, it's far stronger than it sounds.

Triggerbaby wrote:In summary, here's your lunch and ask Miss Creaver if she has aloe lotion because I have taken you to school and you have been burned.

Abadabadoobaddon wrote:I too can prove pretty much any assertion I please if I don't count all the evidence that contradicts it.
 
   
Made in us
Monstrous Master Moulder




Cleveland, Ohio, USA

Kruleboyz currently need another HQ per squad that wants to bump their mortal wounds from 6+ to 5+. The squad that does this from range has a max of 24" reach and a max squad size of 6 (9 as of the battleline-capable sub-clan in today's article).

Lumineth can self-cast a spell that does the same thing, on every squad that has sunmetal weapons. The squad that does this from range has a max of 30" reach ignoring line of sight and a max squad size of 30.

They are my bulwark against the Terror. They are the Defenders of Humanity. They are my Space Marines, and they shall know no fear. 
   
Made in us
Evasive Eshin Assassin






Does this make lumineth one of the highest mortal wounds generating armies?

Feels like it should


This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/07/27 23:35:32


 
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






The Lumineth MWs aren't so much about quantity--other armies/lists can blast out multiple times as many with ease. But as mentioned the Sentinels are doing it at 30" range no los required, allowing them to snipe off characters with no means of stopping it. Lumineth are also dealing consistent amounts of MWs with their battleline and those units are generating the MWs themselves without needing a support character to buff them. They also don't need a spell to go off to do it; instead the spell just buffs what is already there.

It adds up to Lumineth MW output being powerful because it is reliable and consistent. And as any tourney veteran will tell you: consistency trumps potential.

Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page

I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.

I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka




NE Ohio, USA

Lumineth MW abilities are excellent.

So if you're looking for some downside that'll dissuade you from this force? Well you'll just have to keep looking. Because unless your criteria is "I don't like effective things", this isn't it.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Lots of factions have chip MW damage that they can put out lots of - a d3 here, a d6 there. Lumineth is different because they can select a particular target almost anywhere on the board and just absolutely drown it in mortal wounds, 10+ a turn even solely from distance and double that if you can charge it with some wardens as well. And MW are usually much more effective when concentrated on a particular target than when spread around. Some other factions can match or exceed Lumineth's MW per turn output in the aggregate, but nobody else can deliver it against a single target with such reliability and ease.

This and other factors (hello Total Eclipse!) also mean they're far and away the most disliked opponent for players to fight against, though, so that is something to keep in mind depending on your play group. Nobody says "oh awesome, you brought LRL? This'll be a fun and rewarding game for me for sure!" Though if the group's competitive obviously whatever goes, and LRL aren't necessarily the most powerful faction, just the most frustrating to play against.
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka




NE Ohio, USA

yukishiro1 wrote:
Lots of factions have chip MW damage that they can put out lots of - a d3 here, a d6 there. Lumineth is different because they can select a particular target almost anywhere on the board and just absolutely drown it in mortal wounds, 10+ a turn even solely from distance and double that if you can charge it with some wardens as well. And MW are usually much more effective when concentrated on a particular target than when spread around. Some other factions can match or exceed Lumineth's MW per turn output in the aggregate, but nobody else can deliver it against a single target with such reliability and ease.


The Lumineth have the initial advantage in range & not needing LoS, but my Beasts of Chaos disagree with you.
You ever see what 2-3 Cocketrices & a Chimera can do to a target when working together? The Cockitrices do their MW 50% of the time vs the elves 1/3 & the Chimera doesn't roll to hit period with its flame breath. Just get in range & let the MW wash over the target.
Oh, and the elves don't come back once slain. My Cockitrces, and sometimes the Chimera? I can (and do) summon more of them.



yukishiro1 wrote:
This and other factors (hello Total Eclipse!) also mean they're far and away the most disliked opponent for players to fight against, though, so that is something to keep in mind depending on your play group. Nobody says "oh awesome, you brought LRL? This'll be a fun and rewarding game for me for sure!" Though if the group's competitive obviously whatever goes, and LRL aren't necessarily the most powerful faction, just the most frustrating to play against.


That's not true. I love seeing these elves on the table - even when they're riddling my own forces with indirect MW fire.


   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






One can protect units from being hit by chickens & chimera; the limited range of their MW ability and need for los sees to that. Additionally, they are far more random and will miss outright with some regularity. No one is saying Lumineth are dealing the highest number of MWs, but sentinels are several orders of magnitude above what you describe in terms of reliability.

If it were just about putting MWs on a single target Skarbrand in the context of a Khorne army is happy to roll in and deal 32 MWs for the cost of a command point (or more, if any of those dice roll 6s).

Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page

I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.

I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka




NE Ohio, USA

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
One can protect units from being hit by chickens & chimera; the limited range of their MW ability and need for los sees to that.


I did acknowledge that the elves have the advantage of range & indirect fire.

That said, my threat range is is 22" with the chickens & 24" for the chimera after movements factored in. And I'm fine with burning down &/or meleeing units blocking my path.
It's also very easy to get a summoned chicken into position to hit those "protected" units.


   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






How are you getting primordial call points to summon?

Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page

I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.

I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




A cockatrice's average MW output is 1.75 MW per shooting phase, at 10" range, for 95 points, with super unreliable output. It's not great, and not even in the same conversation as sentinels. The value of ranged MW spam is being able to reliably delete the stuff you need to delete, cockatrices don't do that. They're MW slot machines.
   
 
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