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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Final list based on feedbacks: updated after ork buggy nerf

Patrol- klan: Goff
Beastboss on squig- warlord trait:Brutal but kunnin, relic1:beasthide

Beastsnagga x10- on Killrig
Beastsnagga x10- on Killrig

Nob on smashasquig w/killchoppa relic3 -1cp
3x squigriders
3x squigriders

Killrig- frazzle, spirit of gork
Killrig- frazzle, squiggly curse

Patrol-deathskulls -2cp
Warboss on bike- relic2:killaklaw, boss trait:ard as nails -2cp
Bigmek in mega armor w/Kff- obj secured

5x kommandos-obj secured
5x kommandos-obj secured

3x scrapjet
3x squigbuggy

Auxillary- snakebite -2cp
Mozrog

5cp left over

The below variant is what I’m going to play it’s a little less competitive due to the fact it’s easier to get assassinate secondary points but it’s what i plan to buy or own.
Spoiler:

Patrol- klan:Goff
Beastboss on squig-warlord trait:Brutal but kunnin, relic1:beasthide

Beastsnagga x10- on Killrig
Beastsnagga x10- on Killrig

3x squigriders
4x squigriders
Nob on smashasquig w/killchoppa relic3 -1cp

Killrig- frazzle, spirit of gork
Killrig- frazzle, squiggly curse

Outrider-deathskulls -3cp
Warboss on bike- relic2:killaklaw, big boss trait:Ard as nails -2cp
Bigmek in mega armor w/Kff- obj secured

5x kommandos-obj secured nob w pk
5x kommandos-obj secured nob w pk

3x scrapjet
3x squigbuggy
1x kustom boosta blasta (pyromaniac specialist)
5x stormboys- obj secured

6cp remaining

This message was edited 108 times. Last update was at 2021/11/10 14:07:20


 
   
Made in dk
Longtime Dakkanaut




Danmark

you can only cast Frazzle once per turn, so i dont see why both kill rigs have frazzle

Hope, is the first step on the road to disappointment.

- About Dawn of War 3 
   
Made in it
Waaagh! Ork Warboss




Italy

Probably because one rig will definitely die turn 1 being priority target for the enemy anti tank.

Same reason why players used to give da jump to two psykers, just for being able to cast the power even if a model died.

 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




What he said… one is going to die

This message was edited 26 times. Last update was at 2021/09/28 16:07:55


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Variant list without Ghaz
It’s been reworked

This message was edited 90 times. Last update was at 2021/10/04 17:00:44


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Second list is what k have model wise to play..

This message was edited 7 times. Last update was at 2021/11/10 14:00:11


 
   
Made in se
Fresh-Faced New User




How can you use Discipline spells in this list? Where or who is your Psyker?
   
Made in ca
Foolproof Falcon Pilot




Ontario, Canada

Piggelin wrote:
How can you use Discipline spells in this list? Where or who is your Psyker?

Kill Rigs are Vehicle Psyker Character Transport Weirdboy Beast Snaggas. They're basically everything.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/08/21 20:48:43


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




What he said… faq out done tinkering…

This message was edited 6 times. Last update was at 2021/09/14 17:08:21


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Faq out done tinkering better luck with the campaign book .

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/11/10 14:00:38


 
   
Made in fr
Mekboy Hammerin' Somethin'






gungo wrote:
Faq out done tinkering better luck with the campaign book . use list 1 to play with ghaz and Makari or list 2 for a better list without ghazkull.


If you re going to play makari, it seems a shame to not have at least a unit of Goff mech gunz who would get makari’s 6 moral value if maka is with 12 of them.

I think your list lacks shooting and the first turn will be brutal for you as you don’t have much alpha strike threat. Reinforced by the fact that with no kff the staying power will not be optimal.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/09/23 21:51:52


Ere we go ere we go ere we go
Corona Givin’ Umies Da good ol Krulpin they deserve huh huh 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




I mean you’re right the list is limited in shooting and I think a freebooter clan shooting based list with Dakkajet is stronger overall but I wouldn’t ignore the shooting potential of the killrigs with Thier reroll to hit rokkits or auto hitting main gun and psychic powers. Plus being backed up by deathskull buggies.

Makari is likely not going to babysit the Mek guns and instead follow ghaz and friends to the front line. Mostly because he has a move 7 and gives his fnp to the killrigs or whatever goff unit or squigrider is close enough.

Honestly the first list is just a way to have fun with ghaz. The second list is more competitive.

I added the basic big Mek instead of painboss.. it’s just better

Do you like list #2 more now…

This message was edited 6 times. Last update was at 2021/09/28 16:06:56


 
   
Made in fr
Mekboy Hammerin' Somethin'






gungo wrote:
I mean you’re right the list is limited in shooting and I think a freebooter clan shooting based list with Dakkajet is stronger overall but I wouldn’t ignore the shooting potential of the killrigs with Thier reroll to hit rokkits or auto hitting main gun and psychic powers. Plus being backed up by deathskull buggies.

Makari is likely not going to babysit the Mek guns and instead follow ghaz and friends to the front line. Mostly because he has a move 7 and gives his fnp to the killrigs or whatever goff unit or squigrider is close enough.

Honestly the first list w ghaz and Makari is just my attempt to make ghaz and Makari useful.. I’m going to play that list soon as I can get my Killrig and beastboss on squig built but it’s undeniably worse then the second list.

The basic big Mek w kff is probably the only change I’d make to the second more competitive list And drop the painboss. I’m just annoyed the strat burns the Kff but you are right it’s better so I changed the second list to add him instead…..

And I’m not planning on buying more buggies to spam more squigbuggies or scrapjets when they are bound to get point adjusted at some point.

Do you like list #2 more now… mind you the first ghaz list is more for fun to use ghaz.. the second is just it make the first list stronger…


I like your second list a lot, good stuff ! I don't see how you can fit a mega armour KFF big mek in it instead of the "bare bones" KFF big mek, so I would just leave as is. I don't like the idea of paying so much for a KFF dude that does nothing else, but the mega armour version is quite exensive too so...

I think I will try a similar one but with only one kill rig. I scratch built one, and before I get my hands on the real model and paint it, it will be close to 2022 I think :(

Anyway good job, I don't see a better way to field ghaz, even though I think it is a shame to not have at least 2 Kustom Mega Kanon mech gunz (instead of 3 sguig riders for example and 15 points to find) but hey, my mech gunz don't always do much for me so

Let me know how it works out for you once you can field the army, concept seems very interesting (fielding ghaz is just so complicated !)

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/09/24 09:03:55


Ere we go ere we go ere we go
Corona Givin’ Umies Da good ol Krulpin they deserve huh huh 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Thanks for the feedback

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/09/28 16:07:32


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




I rejiggered the list to tighten up some units into bigger threats. The original idea was always to have a strong TAC list with every unit being hard to take down, high mobility and multiple high value threats.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2021/10/02 03:34:07


 
   
Made in fr
Mekboy Hammerin' Somethin'






Looking good but yhou give too many assassinate points, so what I would do is this (if you have the models, or like me will soon have because you preordered them):
-> get rid of smasha sguig nob, and with the points left over replace the biker boss with mozdrag.
-> regroup the two "non nitro" sguig lauchers in one squadron, and split the 3 scrapjets into 1 and 2. Because if someone casts a -1 to hit on them, all three of them won't hit anything. If the get bad touched by something tanky, same problem. You are less vulnerable to that with 2 and 1.
Sguigbuggies stay far away so less issue there. We don't cast any buffs so squadrons of 3 have no use really IMHO, but that is just myu opinion really

Ere we go ere we go ere we go
Corona Givin’ Umies Da good ol Krulpin they deserve huh huh 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




I got a decent sized ork collection. So models aren’t a major concern unless it’s something silly like 18 squigbuggies/scrapjets.

To go mozgrod I’ll need to make something snakebite or go for another detachment (including another troop). But I’m with you on that mozgrod is one of the better HQ we got. But is he really better then a beastboss on squig w ard as nails and killchoppa? I can maybe make the goff detachment into snakebite but if going to be dropping more squigriders snakebites really isn’t worth taking at that point. I got to look at it more but I think goff is going to be better especially if you take a beastboss on squig instead.

Regarding buggies you might be right… the only “buff” I was planning for them was using ramming speed on them (or Killrig).

I think I’m screwed regardless in this list on assasinate points. 2 killrigs, 3 HQs. The nob on smasha w relic was mainly because I had to drop a FA slot of squigriders when I went from battalion to patrol. It allowed me to add another harder hitting unit that’s protected by the squigriders in front. Killrigs are awesome but the fact they are high priority characters is going to just add to assasinate. I think a better way to just lower my assasinate chances is just dropping the warboss on bike and nob on smashasquig for a squigboss and taking another squigrider. Again not sure if that’s a downgrade. But it requires my opponent to kill 2x killrigs, beastboss, warbike warboss, and mega Mek to max out assasinate.

Is this list better just to make assasinate points a little harder
And make the second detachment warboss a little more durable… I dunno….
Spoiler:
Patrol- klan: Goff
Beastboss on squig- warlord trait:Brutal but kunnin, relic1:beasthide

Beastsnagga x10- on Killrig
Beastsnagga x10- on Killrig

4x squigriders
4x squigriders

Killrig- frazzle, spirit of gork
Killrig- frazzle, squiggly curse

Outrider-deathskulls -3cp
Beastboss of squig- relic2:killchoppa, bigboss1:ard as nails, -2cp
Bigmek in mega armor w/Kff w x-kustom blasta- relic3-cybork- obj secured -1cp

5x kommandos-obj secured
5x kommandos-obj secured

2x scrapjet
1x scrapjet
1x squigbuggy-nitro squig
2x squigbuggy
5x stormboys- obj secured
5x stormboys- obj secured

6cp left over

Another option is drop the nob on smasha squig and a squigrider and add another scrapjet and give the mega Mek the cybork relic. Makes it Harder to max out assasinate and adds to buggy spam. Overall I think the nob on smashasquig w relic choppa is going to be comparable (worse shooting but better melee) and the most fun and the list below with an extra scrapjet a tiny bit better for tournaments to make it harder to get assassinate off it. I’ll probably play the below list.

Spoiler:
Patrol- klan: Goff
Beastboss on squig- warlord trait:Brutal but kunnin, relic1:beasthide

Beastsnagga x10- on Killrig
Beastsnagga x10- on Killrig

3x squigriders
3x squigriders

Killrig- frazzle, spirit of gork
Killrig- frazzle, squiggly curse

Outrider-deathskulls -3cp
Warboss on bike- relic2:killaklaw, bigboss1:ard as nails, -2cp
Bigmek in mega armor w/Kff w x-kustom blasta- relic3:cybork- obj secured -1cp

5x kommandos-obj secured
5x kommandos-obj secured

2x scrapjet
2x scrapjet
1x squigbuggy-nitro squig
2x squigbuggy
5x stormboys- obj secured
5x stormboys- obj secured

6cp left over

This message was edited 23 times. Last update was at 2021/10/06 16:19:42


 
   
Made in fr
Mekboy Hammerin' Somethin'






I like the first list a lot, I am not huge fan of the warboss on bike, though I understand the appeal.
Mozdrag doesn't break klan benefits, so I plan (when I finish painting the model) to run him in a non snakebite detachment.
He won't haved any klan benefits himself, but his damage 3 klaw, and his 4++ makes me like him a lot. Also, he doesnt require extra CP for relic and WLT.

Though I must say your deathskull beastboss is a neat build I hadn't thought about, entirely worth taking over mozdrag. Perhaps I will try mozdrag and then try your deathskull build.
Mozdrag does lack the 5+++ against mortal wounds, which is a big problem against cetain armies (GK, TS, tyranids possibly, mirro match -orks-, etc.)

BTW, on the ork topic, regarding Tau, I am dropping the subject. At some point, a competent Tau player will table them in 2 turns and they will see the light (might take some time though as comp Tau players seem scarce)
Of course, you are totally right about Ghaz just getting bogged down in chaff (which is why he is much too expensive IMHO, they "forgot" -or sold enough models- to give him a sweep attack). And anyway, it is a weak argument, because very few decent ork lists actually play ghaz. And drones can just absorb is damage 4 punches so...

An ork can down all drones in one turn though, with freebooter dakkajets and sguig buggies. If the Tau player doesn't have first turn that is. Without drones indeed a tau army will crumble quickly. Not saying Tau are top tier though, but I do think they are middle tier.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/10/06 11:21:43


Ere we go ere we go ere we go
Corona Givin’ Umies Da good ol Krulpin they deserve huh huh 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




BBK and beast mantle squigboss is an absolute blender. Beast choppa and mantle each give an extra atk for 7 atks plus 3 squig atks for 10 base atks not counting goff exploding 6s. Each of those that don’t do damage grants another atk. That’s a LOT.

The killchoppa Beastboss with ard as nails and 5++ vs mortal. May be slightly more durable then mozgrod and cheaper point wise. But it honestly comes down to if you want to save 2 more cp or save some points. I still prefer the warboss on bike though mainly because even though he’s slightly less durable (no damage reduction and 2 less wounds) his movement 14 plus auto 6 adv makes him the only reliable first turn charge in this list… I also like saving the 30points and taking another scrapjet instead for 7 buggies (or nob on smashasquig w relic and another squigrider).

Actually what do you think is better?
Another scrapjet for 7 buggies and cybork on mega Mek.
Or
Nob on smashasquig w relic choppa and another squigrider.

Comparing the 2x squigs to the scrapjet we lose shooting from the deathskull scrapjet.
But gain more and better melee atks from squigriders that benefit from the Waagh being core units. This allows them to adv and charge making them faster then the scrapjet plus benefit from beastboss aura (+1 hit) and beastboy buffs (+1 hit veh/monster and 6++ instead of ramshackle). While squigs seem slightly better damage potential; Taking the scrapjet instead will make assassinate secondary harder to max.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2021/10/06 16:35:32


 
   
Made in de
Krazy Grot Kutta Driva





Honestly i wouldn`t bother with Nobs on Smasha Squigs. While it is a great model and does enough for its points - especially if you give him a relic or WL trait, it`s a really easy to kill character and in lists with killrigs and Squigbosses you want to make assassinate as hard as possible.
(I would spam 3 of them kombined with 15 Squighog Boys and 3 Squig Bosses in a Squig themed semi-competetive list though.^^)

Sure 3 HQ`s and 2 Killrigs can still give maximum VP for assassinate, but any game that happens will probably be a loss anyway. It`s more like i don`t want 3 of those points be that easy to get for my opponent.

Thats why i prefer the Squigboss over the Warboss on Bike in that list as well. While you loose speed and that sweet D3 relic, you can somewhat mitigate that damage with Mozdreg (D3) or Beastboss (more attacks) if you are willing to trade those 4" extra inch (or about 7" if you aim for that turn 1 charge).


Actually what do you think is better?
Another scrapjet for 7 buggies and cybork on mega Mek.
Or
Nob on smashasquig w relic choppa and another squigrider.

What about squeezing in a second Squigboss?
Since you probably want to go for a regular Waaagh with that list i`d rather go for more melee instead of another Scrapjet.
Otherwise Scrapjet > Nob.

That would mean to go down to 5 Buggies und 2 x 3 Squighog Boys though + loosing another 2 CP.


Patrol- klan: Goff
Beastboss on squig- warlord trait:Brutal but kunnin, relic1:beasthide

Beastsnagga x10- on Killrig
Beastsnagga x10- on Killrig

3x squigriders
3x squigriders

Killrig- frazzle, spirit of gork
Killrig- frazzle, squiggly curse

Outrider-deathskulls -3cp
Warboss on bike- relic2:killaklaw, bigboss1:ard as nails, -2cp
Bigmek in mega armor w/Kff w x-kustom blasta- relic3:cybork- obj secured -1cp

5x kommandos-obj secured
5x kommandos-obj secured

2x scrapjet
2x scrapjet
1x squigbuggy-nitro squig
2x squigbuggy
5x stormboys- obj secured
5x stormboys- obj secured

6cp left over

Overall i really like that one.
I think that list has 2 or 3 options to switch stuff that won`t change the way it plays too much:

a) Switch 2 Scrapjets for Mozdreg or Beastboss + another Squighog Boy (just 4 CP left then)
b) Switch 2 Scrapjets for 6-7 more Squighog Boys if you want some Squig action
c) Switch 1 Scrapjet for a few more Squighog Boys

On the other hand you really want some D3 rokkits in that list to get to the stuff you can`t charge right away.
So for overall flexibility i`d keep the 4 Scrapjets i guess.



   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




I’m with you on everything you said. I think the extra scrpajet list is more tourney competitive the the nob on smashasquig w relic choppa list …im just probably going to play the nob on squig more for fun games as I’ll probably get bored with that much buggy spam if that’s all I play. 7 buggies and 2 killrigs is going to be a lot

I played around with triple warboss/beastboss lists I just end up feeling the opportunity cost isn’t worth it..

I think my list is going to be set for a bit unless we get a sweet campaign book army of renown.

Just to actualy compare here is your triple warboss list in all its glory. Essentially trading the scrapjet, 5x stormboys (w/obj secured), and 2cp for an unoptimized Beastboss. I know our strat suck too but between smokescreen strat -2, boost KFF strat -2, and ramming speed -2; I think ~6 is the sweet spot.. with any gain in game going to rerolls or careen or an emergency auto morale pass.
Spoiler:

Patrol- klan: Goff
Beastboss on squig- warlord trait:Brutal but kunnin, relic1:beasthide

Beastsnagga x10- on Killrig

3x squigriders
3x squigriders

Killrig- frazzle, spirit of gork

Outrider-deathskulls -3cp
Warboss on bike- relic2:killaklaw, -1cp
Bigmek in mega armor w/Kff w x-kustom blasta- obj secured

5x kommandos-obj secured
5x kommandos-obj secured

2x scrapjet
1x scrapjet
1x squigbuggy-nitro squig
2x squigbuggy
5x stormboys- obj secured

Patrol- clan:Evil suns -2cp

Beastboss on squig-, relic3:rezdmekka armor or relic killchoppa, boss trait:ard as nails-1cp

Beastsnagga x10- on Killrig

Killrig- frazzle, squiggly curse

4cp left over

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/10/12 14:56:37


 
   
Made in de
Krazy Grot Kutta Driva





Yeah the Mini Boss on Squig is perfectly fine for more casual games, I've used him as well and together with Squighog Boys you get to play more fun games than simple buggy spam.

About those 4 CP: If you just buy 1 extra relic & trait you would have 5 CP and thus be able to use all 3 strats turn one. The Relic choppa is nice but I think it's the first relic/ trait you'll leave home if you need to safe CP.

If you can get free 25 points you could take Mozrog instead of the regular Squigboss, but in that list it means loosing Kommandos, another Scrapjet or degrading the MA Mek to a regular one.
After I used him a few times it feels bad to play without him - you really get your worth out of those extra points and safe out on relics & traits on him.
That white Squig has done some good biting so far.


   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




But is mozgrod better then a goff Beastboss w mantle and BBK
Or
An evil son beastboss w Rezmeka armor and ard as nails?

An evilsun beastboss is essentially m13 with +1 adv that forces whomever he’s in engagement range with to fight last.. that’s close to the warboss on bike threat range.

All mozgrod gets really is +1 invul and a better squig proc on a 6

Making that third detachment evil subs instead of snakebite also makes the Killrig carrying the beastsnaggas into a better frazzle bomb vehicle.. you can move and adv, cast frazzle, fire all your weapons without any penalties for advancing. I’m just not feeling snakebite clan.. the transhuman ability does nothing for the beastboss (and killrig). And only works on snagga boys on str 6/7. And the squig atk only works on mozgrod.. which is a nice buff. If I was going to play 15 squigriders, 2-3 nobs on smashas and mozgrod… snakebites would be strong.
   
Made in de
Krazy Grot Kutta Driva





Mozrog also has +1 S and D3 instead of D2.
But yeah agree on the snakebite clan it's not that great.
Unless you spam Squig units of course, in which case it becomes quite nasty.
Too bad Mozrog can not be taken in Clan detachments like Ghazzi.

But overall I think its good, that the HQ options are that close and you can take both with each having his own ups & downs.
I guess mantle and BBK are still the best combination with ard as nails being close second, but after that I think it's just a question of CP / points and what you want in your list.

And of course which clan your Warlord is from, because you can only use that clans strat & relic.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Mozgrod just requires me to add a detachment and use 2cp… but he is better

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/11/11 17:13:24


 
   
Made in de
Krazy Grot Kutta Driva





The last sentence in the rules for specialist mobs says you cannot upgrade named characters using these rules.
It`s a bit hidden because the 2 lines before the relevant text are about crusade so it`s easy to miss.

   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Ya your right mozgrod definitely out of this list then.. to be fair he’s better in snakebite detachment.
   
Made in de
Krazy Grot Kutta Driva





Since your list is very similar, i`m gonna sneak in mine for a upcoming game next week - thoughts?



Death Skulls Patrol Detachment:

Warboss on Bike (Warlord, Killa Klaw, BBK)
10 Beast Snagga Boys
5 Kommandos
5 Stormboys
Kill Rig
(Frazzle, Roar of Mork)

Auxiliary Detachment:

Mozrog

Blood Axes Outrider Detachment:

Beastboss on Squigosaur (Ard as Nails, Beasthide Mantle)
MA Big Mek (KFF, Ded shiny Shoota)
10 Beast Snagga Boys
1 Scrapjet
1 Scrapjet
1 Scrapjet
1 Squigbuggy
(Nitro Squigs)
2 Squigbuggies
2 Squigbuggies
Kill Rig
(Frazzle, Squiggly Curse)

No Squighog Boys here, but Speedwaaagh + a few more Buggies to get a bit more shooting.
I played a similar list without the second Killrig and Beast Snagga Boys but 15 Squighog Boys instead last week using a regular Waaagh, not sure if its enough Dakka to get the most out of the Speedwaaagh.
Exactly 2000 points but just 4 CP left and just one squad of Kommandos and Stormboys each. Changing the MA Big Mek to a regular one would free up 1 CP and 30 points but to get another Scrapjet or something else i don`t know what else to cut.

I`d love to have 1-2 more Scrapjets in that list, but unless i skip Mozrog that means loosing the Beast Snagga Boys.





   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




I did like your list but Nerfs make this convo irrelevant

This message was edited 9 times. Last update was at 2021/11/11 17:14:39


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Changes!!! Nerfs and all that.. since this is essentially the list I am playing regularly and I don’t have or intend to buy 21x warbikers (only own 12x) in my speedmob list. Bumpity bump… I plan on taking a harder look at bloodaxes when the campaign book drops and see if anything there combos better then deathskull klan for this list…
   
 
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