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Made in ca
Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





So, I made this list for fun for a casual 40k league I just joined, I wanted something way outside what I normally play (Space Marines or Necrons) and I've always loved the Kroot. I also specifically chose them for this league as they allow Legendary units so (after much online hunting) I was able to field some of the discontinued Forge World models. It was originally just a theme list that I expected to lose a lot with,but it's actually been really strong so far, I'm completely surprised and loving it!

1 Battalion Detachment Dal'Yth Sept: (999 Points, 51 PL, 6CP) (I plan to use this list for Crusade (or Krootsade if you will ) and cut a Disk of one Ethereal to make 50PL and just give him the Ghost Walks Among Us WT to compensate.)

HQ
1 Ethereal on Disk with 2 Marker Drones. (WT: Gunship Diplomat, Relic: Seismic Destabilizer) 80 Points, 5 PL.

1 Ethereal on Disk with 2 Marker Drones. 80 Points, 5 PL.

Elites
2 Kroot Shapers with Pulse Rifles: 50 Points, 4 PL (Total).

4 Individual Krootox: 112 Points, 4 PL (Total). (So I just assume I'm giving up 15 VP to attrition anyway and set these guys up first on a backfield objective to get a sense of my opponent's deployment before setting down the bulk of my army. However, in both my games so far, they haven't even been shot at. Also if they did want to take them out, they have to spend a bit more firepower to do so as they'll likely overkill the models or fall just short of killing them.)

Troops
6 Units of 10 Kroot Carnivores: 360 Points, 18 PL (Total).

Fast Attack
12 Kroot Hounds: 72 Points, 3 PL.

2 Units of 3 Knarloc Riders: 180 Points, 8 PL (Total)

Heavy Support
1 Greater Knarloc with Kroot Bolt Thrower/Kroot Rifle: 65 Points, (4PL)

The general strategy is to use the pregame move and your units speed to plunk blobs of 2-3 squads of Carnivores with a Shaper for attack re-rolls and an Ethereal for 6+ FNP to get to your objectives turn 1 and just sit on them. (7" pregame move, plus 1st turn move, plus advance (Shapers can allow advance re-rolls for 1CP if needed).) If they are in cover, a 1CP stratagem gives them an additional -1 to be hit and +1 sv on top of whatever cover gives them, add that to the Etheral's 6+ FNP and 9 Ld aura give you a bunch of very tanky 60 point units. The Knarlocs and Hounds charge up and take on whatever you want to put pressure on. The Knarloc's auto advance 6" on top of their 7" move and the hounds move 12" so they are in combat by turn two easy. I always use Engage on all fronts and will often even use Domination since I can stick to the objectives so well and can usually score 3 points on that turn one.

So, I've played two games so far and much to my surprise, I crushed them both.

Game 1 was against Blood Angels: They used 1 Captain on Bike, 10 Sanguinary Guard (and gave them Obsec) plus a Sanguinary Banner Bearer of some kind (I don't know BA that well), 7 or 8 Assault Intercessors, an Invader ATV with the Chaingun, and a Repulsor. We played Center Ground.

Turn 1: I went second, but since his Sanguinary Guard were in Deep Strike, I only lost about a dozen models to shooting and lost 2 of my Greater Knarloc's 9 wounds. I got onto all four objectives, (managing to take out all but 3 Intercessors after shooting a little over half my army into them with marker lights. The 5 models of a Carnivore squad that got in range took it from them and I got both my Hounds and Greater Knarloc into charging the Repulsor that was holding down the east objective (re-rolling the 9" charge on my Knarloc thanks to the 1CP stratagem from charging first with the hounds and brought it down to 3 wounds.)

Turn 2: He failed the charge on the deep striking Sangiunary guard into my Krootox (as well as the re-roll), but did take out most of a carnivore squad in their shooing. The Captain tried to take another objective, but 2 Carnivores survived his attack and held it. The tank and remaining Intercessors went down to the Greater Knarloc and Knarloc Riders respectively and I still held all four objectives; so he scooped up his models (but was really cool about it all and said he was looking forward to another game against me).

Game 2 was against an Imperial Guard Tank list.

This was basically the perfect match for me and I scored a perfect 100 VP (first time ever for me). He ran 4 Leman Russ (2 Executioners, 1 Battle Tank, and 1 Punisher) with 2 Techpriests in the Crossfire Mission. I got my Knarlocs into the Executioner early and took it down with the weight of all of them while loosing about half. After that, he just didn't have the weight of firepower to dislodge all my infantry from all the objectives as my remaining riders and hounds took on one of the Executioners while the rest of my army slowly plinked away at the other two. I scored 15 points on Domination, Engage on All Fronts, and Raise the Banners High, plus holding three objectives every turn.

This was basically my perfect matchup though as there just wasn't enough weight of firepower to take on my near 100 model count once I had the Punisher under control.

So that's where I'm at so far. It's a pretty causal league, but the list is still far surpassing my expectations. I'm playing against Tau this weekend and am looking forward to how I stack up against a much more shooty list. I think I'll be fine again with my ability to grab objectives so fast.

So far, the only think I think I might change is removing 1 Krootox for an additional Shaper so I can have 1 to run with the advancing Knarlocs and Hounds to give the re-roll 1's to wound and still have 1 for each of the Carnivore blobs. I also think that another Greater Knarloc would be fantastic, it's just such a good unit for only 65 points, however, I sadly only own 1 and they're not easy to track down. (I'm also not too sure what I'd cut).

I feel like my toughest matchups would be against close combat focused infantry armies that can beat me in melee while contesting the objectives, but I consider myself an advanced Intermediate at best when it comes to 40k strategy. What do you all think? Any particular armies that you think I'll have a really hard time against and should plan for?

This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2021/12/02 22:25:58


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Made in us
Dark Angels Neophyte Undergoing Surgeries




I'd say the guard list doesn't provide much insight into the efficacy of the list because guard are in such a bad spot right now, but the efficacy into BA is very interesting. I'd say at 1k your biggest issue would be board control/anti horde armies. Things like DE and Ravenwing might give you some issues. Not sure how to go about mitigating it but I'd say have a plan for that
   
Made in ca
Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





Finished game 3 and won 99-36, now 3-0. I ended up swapping out 1 Krootox for another Shaper but other than that, kept the list the same.

Tau ran a Farsight Enclaves list with a Coldstar, Riptide, 3 man crisis team, Broadside a Strike Team and a Breacher Team as well as various accompanying drones.

Ran Center Ground again, I hopped on 3 of the four objectives turn one scoring 3 for Domination, and 2 for Engange on All Fronts (couldn't quite get into the 4th quarter based on how the terrain was) while raising the banners on them and picking off a couple breachers. He threw almost everything into my Greater Knarloc to kill it and took out 4 hounds as well.

Over the next two turns I lost my riders, hounds, and a shaper but took out his Fire Warriors and Crisis Teams. After that, there was no way for him to dislodge my 52 remaining Carnivores with supporting Ethereals, Shapers, and Krootox from the objectives and elected to fall back his last 3 models and get 15 points from While We Stand, We Fight, rather than consign them to a death by a thousand cuts.

Oh also, once again, the Krootox didn't even get shot at, they haven't exactly been exciting, but they're holding down the backfield and knocing off a few wounds here and there 48" RF 1, which is all I really need.

I'm hoping to face a few more top tier armies in the coming weeks to really see how the list stacks up. I'm really liking it so far.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/09/12 02:01:58


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Made in us
Nurgle Chosen Marine on a Palanquin





Livermore, Ca

I'm shocked that a farsight list did not do very well against you.

Here's the first thing I was thinking...

After you choose hidden hunters at the start of the opponents shooting phase.... A battlesuit unit can spend a cp to ignore it when it is selected to shoot. (the order is important)

Now if those crisis suits weren't running missiles and the broadsides weren't running missiles, and the riptide ran a ion cannon and he didn't use the "MultiSpectrum sensor Suite" to nullify hidden hunters and he didn't respect your speed or 60 kroot guns, then yeah I can see how he got mulched.

I think also, no one has much experience against kroot, and to a lesser extent Tau, so you are getting some play there . And your list is as good as you can with kroot, so you've got a lot going right now in your favor.

Have you tried strategic reserve + 3d6 reroll charges? Let me know, I did that once and found that kroot hounds didn't do much, but your forgeworld units can't not do better :-)



   
Made in ca
Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





 Sazzlefrats wrote:
I'm shocked that a farsight list did not do very well against you.

Here's the first thing I was thinking...

After you choose hidden hunters at the start of the opponents shooting phase.... A battlesuit unit can spend a cp to ignore it when it is selected to shoot. (the order is important)

Now if those crisis suits weren't running missiles and the broadsides weren't running missiles, and the riptide ran a ion cannon and he didn't use the "MultiSpectrum sensor Suite" to nullify hidden hunters and he didn't respect your speed or 60 kroot guns, then yeah I can see how he got mulched.

I think also, no one has much experience against Kroot, and to a lesser extent Tau, so you are getting some play there . And your list is as good as you can with kroot, so you've got a lot going right now in your favor.

Have you tried strategic reserve + 3d6 reroll charges? Let me know, I did that once and found that kroot hounds didn't do much, but your forgeworld units can't not do better :-)


Oh, well I've been using that wrong... whups. I'd been using it in response to being shot. Didn't realize it was at the start of the phase, I'll have to be more careful with that. Good to know. Thanks.

The crisis team had 2 with plasma and one with Fusion. The Riptidee ran the giant burst cannon which did a lot less than I thought, but would have done a bit more had I not used Hidden Hunters Wrong.

Yeah, the lack of exp against it is certainly a contributing factor. For example, I think in the match against the Blood Angels, if he's started with his Sanguinary Guard on the table instead of deep striking them, it would have been much closer.

I have not. The first two turns are where the army really shines, getting far enough ahead fast enough. I can't afford to reserve anything.

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Made in us
Nurgle Chosen Marine on a Palanquin





Livermore, Ca

 Tawnis wrote:
 Sazzlefrats wrote:
I'm shocked that a farsight list did not do very well against you.

Here's the first thing I was thinking...

After you choose hidden hunters at the start of the opponents shooting phase.... A battlesuit unit can spend a cp to ignore it when it is selected to shoot. (the order is important)

Now if those crisis suits weren't running missiles and the broadsides weren't running missiles, and the riptide ran a ion cannon and he didn't use the "MultiSpectrum sensor Suite" to nullify hidden hunters and he didn't respect your speed or 60 kroot guns, then yeah I can see how he got mulched.

I think also, no one has much experience against Kroot, and to a lesser extent Tau, so you are getting some play there . And your list is as good as you can with kroot, so you've got a lot going right now in your favor.

Have you tried strategic reserve + 3d6 reroll charges? Let me know, I did that once and found that kroot hounds didn't do much, but your forgeworld units can't not do better :-)


Oh, well I've been using that wrong... whups. I'd been using it in response to being shot. Didn't realize it was at the start of the phase, I'll have to be more careful with that. Good to know. Thanks.

The crisis team had 2 with plasma and one with Fusion. The Riptidee ran the giant burst cannon which did a lot less than I thought, but would have done a bit more had I not used Hidden Hunters Wrong.

Yeah, the lack of exp against it is certainly a contributing factor. For example, I think in the match against the Blood Angels, if he's started with his Sanguinary Guard on the table instead of deep striking them, it would have been much closer.

I have not. The first two turns are where the army really shines, getting far enough ahead fast enough. I can't afford to reserve anything.



I know nothing of blood angels, but I seem to recall they have a jump pack stratagem that allows them to charge easier off a deepstrike.
   
Made in us
Perturbed Blood Angel Tactical Marine




 Sazzlefrats wrote:
 Tawnis wrote:
 Sazzlefrats wrote:
I'm shocked that a farsight list did not do very well against you.

Here's the first thing I was thinking...

After you choose hidden hunters at the start of the opponents shooting phase.... A battlesuit unit can spend a cp to ignore it when it is selected to shoot. (the order is important)

Now if those crisis suits weren't running missiles and the broadsides weren't running missiles, and the riptide ran a ion cannon and he didn't use the "MultiSpectrum sensor Suite" to nullify hidden hunters and he didn't respect your speed or 60 kroot guns, then yeah I can see how he got mulched.

I think also, no one has much experience against Kroot, and to a lesser extent Tau, so you are getting some play there . And your list is as good as you can with kroot, so you've got a lot going right now in your favor.

Have you tried strategic reserve + 3d6 reroll charges? Let me know, I did that once and found that kroot hounds didn't do much, but your forgeworld units can't not do better :-)


Oh, well I've been using that wrong... whups. I'd been using it in response to being shot. Didn't realize it was at the start of the phase, I'll have to be more careful with that. Good to know. Thanks.

The crisis team had 2 with plasma and one with Fusion. The Riptidee ran the giant burst cannon which did a lot less than I thought, but would have done a bit more had I not used Hidden Hunters Wrong.

Yeah, the lack of exp against it is certainly a contributing factor. For example, I think in the match against the Blood Angels, if he's started with his Sanguinary Guard on the table instead of deep striking them, it would have been much closer.

I have not. The first two turns are where the army really shines, getting far enough ahead fast enough. I can't afford to reserve anything.



I know nothing of blood angels, but I seem to recall they have a jump pack stratagem that allows them to charge easier off a deepstrike.


They killed that strat with 9th ed supplement. Now the best they can do is a strat that ignores negative modifiers to charges out of deepstrike.

It sounds to me like the list is sitting in the 1000pt sweet spot where the number of obsec bodies combined with mobility on the smaller table size is really giving your opponents trouble. Even if they have dangerous shooting threat, if you can keep tagging them to prevent them from shooting your objective holders, they'll just run out of time to make a difference.

If that Blood Angels player dumps that Repulsor for a few more squads of assault intercessors to compete for the objectives or some incursors to move block your early movements, you might find yourself with a tougher match up.
   
Made in ca
Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





So, the league is back on and the premils are over first match was earlier today vs Custodes, and the Kroot remain undefeated, though it was easily the closest match yet. Man those golden boys are tough, this is my first time facing them and it felt like fighting Marines in the fluff.

So for the league proper the rounds are 750, then two games of 1000, then two of 1500, then the last at 2000. So for this match I only ran 750 points, cutting 2 squads of carnivores, 3 knarloc riders, a disk and 6 hounds.

The Custodes player was playing Shadow Keepers and had his shield Captain on bike, a Relic Contemptor, a 3 man with shields, a 3 man with spears, and a single dude that gave a -1 to be hit aura. This was my first time ever playing against Custodes (I got back in early 9th after taking a break in 7th.) so all I really knew about them that they were small in number and very hard to kill. \

We played the mission Raid from the Grand Tournament pack. I took the secondaries Engage of All Fronts, Stranglehold, and Raise the Banners High, while he also took Stranglehold and Raise the Banners High, opting for To The Last as his third.

Turn 1: I got the first turn, getting over half way up the board with my pregame plus regular move, scoring 6 at the end and bannering up for objectives while leaving 4 Krootox in the backfield, two on each objective. His whole army was hidden so there wasn't any shooting to be had. For his turn he bannered up one of his two objectives (shooting to shoot with no effect on the other unit) while keeping most of his army in cover, his shield captain and dreadnaught came out. The Dreadnaught failed his charge and lost a wound to overwatch while the Shield Captain got in and killed a few Carnivores.

Turn 2: I scored 19 between primary and banners, fell back my carnivores and hounds (that he had also connected with) markered his captain and shot everything I had into it.... this would have actually been pretty good if he didn't pop a pair of stratagems. Grim Responsibility turned all my 4S shooting into 3, making me wound on 6's for the majority of my army, and The Emporers' Auspice, taking away my re-roll 1's to hit form Markerlights and re-roll 1's to wound from my Shapers. He made 8 saves and lost no wounds. So I threw my Knarlocs at him, making 3MW's on the charge, one of which he shrugged, then saved all the regular attacks after using a CP re-roll. I picked up 6 more VP at the end of my turn. On his turn, he scored 5 on primaries and 1 for banners. The Dreadnaught finally got into the big blob of fighting and took out a few Carnivores, he also bannered up his other objective, but other than that, nothing much happened.

Turn 3 was basically just a bunch of fighting in the middle. The Krootox did take out a Guardian Spear in Shooting before they charged into help their allies. Once the Spears got into the mix, they helped their friends clean up the objective. by the end, one spearman had lost 2 wounds and all that was left of my troops were a shaper and two hounds, the shaper was just barely contesting the Dread which was his only model in range of the objective.

Turn 4 I pulled them my three models out of combat and shot what I had left into the Spearmen, succeeding it taking the last wound of the injured model, but accomplishing little else. His Captain and Dread moved up to knock my Krootox off one of the backfield objectives while his remaining Spearman held the middle. With 4 objectives under his control he finally started wracking up the points, but it was a turn too late.

Turn 5 A hero Krootox one shot his last Spearman and I advanced some carnivores up to contest a backfield objective. This got me both 3 for Stranglehold as I'd killed his last Spearman in the midfield, 2 for engage as I was back into three quarters, and took his banner off. He cleaned up my carnivores in his backfield, but even max scoring his last turn couldn't catch him back up.

Final score was 95-72 as he did get his full 15 from To The Last.

Even though the Custodes were essentially unkillable, they just didn't have enough attacks to eat through all the bodies I threw at them in enough time. The Krootox were once again the subtle backbone to the army, they are certainly not flashy but they are really growing on me. Being effective in killing two Custodian spearmen while holding down both backfield objectives for only 108 points was well worth it. The Greater Knarloc didn't do as much work in this game but that's only because turn after turn I kept rolling 2's to would on 3+ re-roll 1's.

So quick addendum that no one seemed to notice previously and I only caught by accident at the end of my game. I asked my opponent why he didn't take Grind the Down as he probably would have scored better. He told me that you can't take 2 secondaries from the same category. I totally did not know that being new to 9th, so I can't actually take both Stranglehold and Engage on All Fronts. Fortunately, all my games so far were won by more than 15VP, so the end result wouldn't have changed at all, but I would not have scored as high (at -14 I got from Engage on All Fronts would have been 81-72, MUCH closer of a game). Hard to say what I would have got on this match as there wasn't another decent secondary, I may have taken the mission one which would have really shaken up how I played it, so it's impossible to say. As for the previous ones In both Crossfire and Center Ground, I had the mission secondaries with ease, so I don't think the score would have changed much on those. So yeah, live and learn, I felt pretty bad, but at least it didn't make or break the game, will know better next time.

Next match should be in about 2-3 weeks, I'll keep updating with how the all Kroot Army does for those who are interested.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/10/11 03:38:45


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Made in ca
Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





Double posted by accident, see above. XD

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/10/11 01:57:01


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Made in ca
Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





5 Games and still undefeated. Played against Necrons today.

He ran a Command Barge, The Nightbringer, a Technomancer, 20 Warrior and 10 Flayed Ones. We played the Re-supply mission from GT2021. I took the Stranglehold, Banners, and Secure Landing Sites (the mission secondary). He took the two Necron ones, Code of Combat and Purge the Vermin, as well as Secure Lading Sites.

He got the first turn and advanced into the midfield with his whole army (but kept the Flayed Ones in Deep Strike). He killed my Greater Knarloc, 8 hounds, 1 Krootox, and a few Carnivores in Shooting. My turn 1 I made the questionable spending of 2CP to auto pass morale on my hounds (not a tonne of Stratagems I have access to at all Kroot) and threw everything I had into his warriors, shooting all my guns and charging the hounds and both Knarloc Rider units into them. 19 were dead after a failed Ld. I also got on all three midfield objectives. However I was only able to banner up two objectives as he'd gotten midfield ahead of me.

Turn 2 he brought in his Flayed Ones, but failed the charge and re-roll. The Nightbringer got into the center killing and handful of Carnivores and a Shaper with powers but wiffing in Melee only taking a 2 wounds off a rider and 2 off an Ethereal. (However he made up for it by saving all 5 of my Knarloc Riders D2 swing backs on 4 ups.) His command Barge cleared out most of the right flank, but I had just enough left to hold the objective. On my turn, I fell back my riders and Ethereal. picked off the remaining two warriors (one came back from the Technomancer), a couple of Flayed ones, his Technomancer, three wounds of the Nightbriner and two off the barge. At end of turn I held all 5 objectives.

Turn 3 he got his flayed ones into combat finally, chopping up one of my carnivores after loosing two in overwatch. The Nightbringer took finished off my Ehtereal and two riders, while his barge toasted the other Ethereal still holding down the east objective. Knowing that the midfield objective would be the first one gone (and taking a banner with it), I moved the two squads I had there out, one contesting the objective is command barge was on and another moving on the Flayed ones, I took 3 out in shooting, but the last 2 held. I held 2 of (what was about to be) the 4 remaining objectives at the end of the turn.

Turn four his Flayed Ones charged my lone rider on their objectives, dealing two wounds but dying to the crack back. The Nightbringer intercepted obsec carnivores on the way to help taking out one of the two squads and the barge cleaned up the squad that moved to contest its objective that was about to disappear. Knowing where he was at and how far in he was, my opponent conceded.

Final score: 87-34. I missed 3 points on Stranglehold end of turn 3, and only got 5 on banners as he beat me to the midfield. He maxed Code of Combat for 15, but only got 5 from primaries and 4 from Purge the Vermin, and 3 from Secure Landing Sites.

Takeaway: The Nightbringer and Command Barge were scary, but could only mathematically kill so many models. Turn two showed me that I could kill the Nightbringer if I really tried, but at that point, it wasn't obsec and I was more concerned with the Flayed Ones, who were, were pushing the most important midfield objective so I focused on them instead. Once anything that could contest objectives was dead, there wasn't much he could do other than kill 10-20 models a turn, but when you have 91 models on the table, you've got plenty to spare. I did only have 20 models left at the end of it all.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/10/31 06:56:01


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Made in fi
Hooded Inquisitorial Interrogator






I don't check up on lists often but an all-Kroot army instantly made me want to check what's going on. Their limited unit entries don't leave much space for imagination but I believe you've made a really good army list. Having those rare Forge World units is what enables you to have an army of 1000 points, which is more than most can muster.

The war stories were an interesting read too. I have some experience on 1000 point games and they can get quite tactical which is what your list aims for. Most unprepared opponents can't keep up with the points tally pregame moves enable.

I applaud your bravery for choosing this army and your skills on the battlefield but I can see some similarities in all of your wins. The first opponent had 300+ points of his army doing nothing for two turns. The second was a low-model count army ill-suited to defend against 80 bodies. The third had a riptide but that unit might be really effective even in a small game. The fourth was another extremely elite army and the last game had the Nightbringer.

I played a game against daemons with an almost unkillable exalted Lord of Change and I could ignore it the whole game doing my missions. I hope you can get a game against a more "balanced" army to see who, if anybody, can break your streak. You might still end up scoring tons of VPs despite getting shot off the table.
   
Made in ca
Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





Game 6 done and another win for the Kroot, this time against a Salamanders army that had me pretty scared when I saw it hit the table. He ran: Adrax Agatone, a Librarian, a Chief Apothecary, 5 Aggressors with flamers (yikes), 7 Eradicators with Melta Rifles, and 5 Intercessors with Bolt Rifles. We played Forward Push.

While I think we both had a solid change of winning from the outset, the game was essentially decided by the end of turn 1. I knew that if I couldn't kill the Aggressors I was done for, those flamers with the Salamanders buff would just rip right through me. He got the first turn, but I moved up some Kroot with their pre-game move to make a tantalizing target for the Aggressors that was just out of their range. On his first turn, he moved them out of cover to burn the squad down while taking out my Greater Knarloc and a pair of Riders with his Melta Rifles. On my turn, I threw everything I had into the Aggressors. Even thought they were backed by the Apothacary between shooting and assault I managed to just barely clear them all off the table, leaving his Apothecary with nothing to heal/revive.

At the end of the round he looked at the table and said "huh, I don't think I can win now" just due to the number of bodies I had left and his strong but limited shooting, which was very much the case. We still played it out and I walked away with 97 VP, however had my even one of those Aggressors lived (with the Apothecary healing it and reviving another), I could have seen things turning out VERY differently.

So that's it for the ALL Kroot army, next round is 1,500 points and I'm out of Kroot models. I've been trying to decide between one of two ways to go for the next round.

For sure I'm taking a Farsight Enclaves Detachment with:
1 XV8 Crisis Commanders with 3 Fusion Blasters, 1 Shield Gen, and 2 Shield Drones
WT: Hero of the Enclaves, Relic: Fusion Blades.

What I'm debating is either moving two Krootox into this detachment as a vanguard and going with:
6 XV8 Crisis Suits with 5 Fusion Blasters, 8 Plasma Rifles, 5 Shield Gens, 2 Marker Drones (-2 Kroot Hounds for points)

Or, going all in on the infantry aspect with a patrol detachment of: (Again -2 hounds for points)
20 Breachers each with the Invul Drone and Shield Drones.
5 Fire Warriors with no drones
5 Pathfinders with 1 Ion Rifle

While the Crisis team gives me much more firepower to down elite and heavy units, I've gotten by pretty well with just ignoring those, taking my lumps and focusing on their troops. I think this will leave my carnivores much more vulnerable if I don't play it exactly right.

The infantry route give me much more of the same, more bodies to lock down the objectives, more marker lights to make my shooting all the things much better and some decent stopping power with the Breachers. Either they'll absorb a lot of the fire first, or they'll be able to dish out a decent amount of firepower with their close range weapons/stratagems. The Breachers back up the Carnivores advancing up the board and are also covered by the Ethereals (yes that works even though they are different "Septs", I make sure) while the fire warriors and Pathfinders back up the Krootox in the backfield.

I'm leaning towards the latter with brining in the battlesuits in the 2k version, but I'm still undecided for the moment.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Zaephyr wrote:
I hope you can get a game against a more "balanced" army to see who, if anybody, can break your streak. .


Me too, I'd love to have a game against another horde army and see how that goes.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/11/19 17:27:48


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Nurgle Chosen Marine on a Palanquin





Livermore, Ca

fusion blades are..... terrible. 2 Attacks that are only worth money on multi-wound models with no invulnerable save.

the 6 xv8's is interesting. How will you protect them? Just shield gens? there is also the iridium armor and the relic airburst
   
Made in ca
Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





 Sazzlefrats wrote:
fusion blades are..... terrible. 2 Attacks that are only worth money on multi-wound models with no invulnerable save.

the 6 xv8's is interesting. How will you protect them? Just shield gens? there is also the iridium armor and the relic airburst


I've heard that that a lot, but the matches I've played they've been pretty good. Besides, with hero of the Enclaves, you re roll all hits and it's already WS 3+, then S8 is really good so either 2+ or 3+ to wound, chances are solid to get both through with a CP re-roll and even on a 4+ invul their probably only saving 1. D6 damage is a lot. Yeah I've seen them wiff for sure, but I've also diced up a Hive Tyrant in two rounds of combat. I guess we'll see. My thought was that taking them now on the Infantry side, it only cost me 1CP and I can gauge their effectivness. When I use the Crisis suits, I'll be giving them Cross Linked Stabalizing Jets for sure, so that will make the Fusion Blades more on an investment if I still wanted to go that route.

For this, I'm thinking I'll go infantry on the first round and the crisis once it gets to 2k, that way I can drop a blob of 9, but yeah, gens and shield drones.




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This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/11/23 15:31:53


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Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





Game 7 at 1500 points is in the bag and with some Farsight Enclaves assistance, the Kroot are victorious again, this time against the Death Guard. I decided to go the route of additional infantry rather than the crisis suits and the logic of just more obsec bodies was sound as once again, I couldn't be removed from the objectives fast enough. Though the addition of the Breachers, Fusion Commander, and more markerlights allowed me to punch back a lot harder than in previous games.

He ran the big boy himself, Mortarion, a Malignant Plaugecaster, 2 units of 10 Poxwalkers, a unit of 5 Plauge Marines, a Tallyman, a Foul Blightspawn, 5 Blightlord Terminators, and 2 Plagueburst Crawlers.

We played Surround and Destroy: I took Stranglehold and Raise the Banners like usual, and decided to gamble on the mission secondary Surround Them as there wasn't much else that looked like it would score me very high. He took Strangelhold, To the Last, and the Death Guard Specific Spread the Sickness. I reserved my Crisis Commander while he reserved his Terminators. I got the first turn and pre-game moved up all my Carnivores.

Turn 1: I got pretty much everything into the midfield. Weary of Mortarion in the middle of his deployment zone, I swung all my Knarlocks and hounds along the far left flank to keep them away from him, but to bait him to that side specifically. I left behind my strike squad and a pair of Krootox on one objective and my Pathfinder and two other Krootox on another. I bannered up all four objectives I now had and took a few pot shots that killed off a handful of Poxwalkers and a Plauge Marine.

On his turn one he contaminated an objective, then brought back his Poxwalkers with a stratagem and took Mortarion right onto my left objective (loosing two points from a FTGG overwatch that was out of his range to turn off), he cut down what was left of two squads of Kroot I had on it, but my Shaper still stood, contesting the objective. My Great Knarloc also went down after both his Plaugeburst Crawlers and his Foul Blightspawn poured their fire into it.

Turn 2: I decided just to ignore Mortarion, concede the midfield objective and push into the back to go for Surround Them. I got a little overzealous with my shooting and cleared off the poxwalkers I wanted to charge on the left, but managed to make a long bomb charge into his Tallyman and just barely tag the objective. One of my Breacher squads cleaned up all but one of his Plauge Marines, while on the other side of the table, I got smart and killed all but one of his Poxwalkers, and put the rest of my shooting into his Malignant Plaguecaster and charged the Carnivores into his Poxwalker to secure the other backfield objective. My Crisis Commander came down just barely in between his two Plaugeburst Crawlers, taking 5 wounds off one in shooting, then charging it and taking another 4 wounds off with his Fusion Blades.

On his turn two, he was left with few models remaining, Mortarion, one free tank, a couple characters, and his Terminators, just coming in. Mortarion continued to crush the left flank taking out another full squad of Kroot and my Warlord and Shaper, who were shielding my Breachers from his charge. The free tank and his Fould Blightspawn managed to clean up most of my hounds and a pair of riders, but I still managed to hold the backfield on the left. The right was down to two squads of Carnivores in melee with his Malignant Plaguecaster and not too much happened there. His Terminators managed a couple kills in shooting, but failed their charge out of Deep Strike and the re-roll.

Turn 3: I shifted around a few things, but mostly just held onto what I had. I did move what was left of both squads of breaches out to take on the terminators, dealing 8 unsaved wounds after they were all marker lighted up, killing 2 and bringin another down to 1. I pulled back my Commander and used Mont'Ka to shoot the other Plagueburst Crawler, taking it down to 5 wounds, then finished it off by charging it with the Fusion Blades. I also plinked 2 more wounds off Mortarion with some shooting that couldn't go anywhere else.

On his turn, Mortarion cleared out the last of the Knarloc Riders, securing one of his backfield objectives, the Terminators moved up and killed a few in shooting, but sadly, once again failed to charge anything. His Malignant Plaugecaster finally died in close combat to the Carnivores after taking a total of 9 of them with him (from 3 rounds of combat and 2 psychic attacks). His remaining Paluge Marine died to overwatch attempting to charge a squad of Breachers.

Turn 4: My Crisis Commander Shot and Charges his last Plagueburst Crawler, but he made all his 5+ invuls, and I inflicted no damage. I poured my infantry fire into the Terminators, almost finishing them off, but leaving one at a single wound.

He fell back his Plagueburst crawler and brought Mortarion down onto my Crisis Commander and just barely managed to one shot him through the drones. His terminator failed to charge again. Much like like Plague Marine his Tallyman died to overwatch trying to charge some Breachers.

Turn 5: I cleaned up his Terminator and Plagueburst crawler with my remaining Breachers and just held fast on objectives. He could have run onto some objectives and got 10 more points but he knew it was over and went down swinging, cutting up another Ethereal, and the remnants of a Breacher and Kroot squad with Mortarion and his Foul Blightspawn.

End game score was 100-28. This could have been quite a bit higher for him as he could have gotten +10 on his last turn. He missed contaminating a couple objectives that could have gotten him +3 more if he'd rolled 4+ or taken D3 mortals on his last Plague Marine. Had he not taken stranglehold and gone for Assassinate, he could have got +10 for three characters and my warlord. 51 seems like less of a blow out and wouldn't have functionally changed anything about the game. Also, he could have reduced my points a fair bit if he'd brought his Terminators into the backfield and cleared out one of my objectives, thus preventing me from getting Surround Them on turn 4 and 5. (Incidentally I only reported 99 as I didn't realize banners scored at end of game as well, which would also have given me 100 in my previous game too.)

Having the Breachers protected by the 5+ invul and shielded by Kroot in front of them really allowed them to punch back really hard, they did a lot of the Heavy lifting against his units, while the Fusion Blades turned out to be pretty solid when combined with the re-rolls from Hero of the Enclaves. Going to run that again next game and we'll see if it's worth staying around for the 2k game when I have less CP to play with. Taking out his Poxwalkers early was a huge deal, it removed most of his obsec and if they'd gotten into my squishy Kroot, they would have just kept replenishing their numbers and could have overwhelmed me.

So that was game 7, two games left to go. I'm really hoping to test my mettle against Drukhari before this league is over as I've never played against them before and they sound like an army that can match me for speed.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/11/29 18:23:34


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Ultramarine Chaplain with Hate to Spare






Lol! Hearing about Kroot success has made for a really fun read. The Carnivore's in particular are such cool models. I miss seeing them on tables.

And They Shall Not Fit Through Doors!!!

Tyranid Army Progress -- With Classic Warriors!:
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/743240.page#9671598 
   
Made in ca
Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





So, the Kroot are officially in the finals, though sadly not in the way I would have preferred. My opponent didn't show up for our scheduled match and there wasn't a day I had available to reschedule before the end of the round, so I was given the win by default. I do know there was a Drukhari player near the top as well from what I heard from some other players, so fingers crossed that will be my final match, would love to test the Kroot against them.

However, I didn't want to go without a game to talk about, so I arranged another 1000 point game with a friend of mine who wanted was is still pretty new, but wanted to go up against the Kroot that I won't shut up about. XD To help balance out the skill gap, we played the Mission Ascension which disallows pre-game moves, to give a bit of a handicap. I also helped him design his list to counter mine to see how well I'd do against something designed against me. Here's what we came up with for him to run what we had available for his Custom Space Marine Chapter.

Patrol Detachment
Chapter Tactics: Bolter Fusillades, Long Range Marksmen.

HQ
Captain in Gravis Armour with MC Bolt Rifle / Power Sword (WT: The Imperium's Sword.)

Troops
Intercessors x5 with Bolt Rifles, Plasma Pistol / Power Sword.
Assault Intercessors x5, Plasma Pistol / Power Fist.
Heavy Intercessors x5 with Hellstorm Bolt Rifles & Hellstorm Heavy Bolter.

Elites
Terminators x5 with Hvy Flamer (Would have gone with Agressors, but neither of us own any and we're big on WYSIWYG.)
Apothecary (Relic: Pergatius)

Fast Attack
Inceptors with Assault Bolters x3

Heavy Support
Eradicators x3

I took Banners, Stranglehold, and the mission specific, Ascension. He took Banners, No Prisoners, and Ascension. He also got the first turn and decided not to Deep Strike anything. I did manage to Deploy my Great Knarloc well enough away from his Eradicators that I had high hopes it would actually get to do something this game.

On my left flank he had is Captain, Apothacary, Eradicators, and Hvy Intercessors, center he had his remaining Intercessors, and on the right the Terminators and Inceptors. I had my Knarloc Riders on the left (to bait him into deploying the Eradicators there) and my Great Knarloc and Hounds on the far right. Krootox held the back middle objective with solid LoS and Carnivores were everywhere as ususal.

Turn 1:
He moved everything up, but wasn't close enough to grab any of the midfield objectives and shot out 2 of my Knarloc Riders and a handful of my carnivores and a single Krootox, but I had a lot in cover and didn't take too many casualties.
My turn one, I did the Kroot thing, moved everything up, advancing where necessary and bannered up all three midfield objectives, though I was just barely in range of the center after some poor advance rolls. I threw a bunch of fire into his Eradicators, and after failing a 9/10 3+ saves after re-rolls and only keeping 1 alive due to his Apothacary's 6+ FNP, I thought I could finish them off before he could revive any models so I charged my Karloc Riders into them. Now he rolled amazing though (5 5+'s)and I didn't do any damage, while his Captain intervened and cut my riders to pieces, only leaving one left on two wounds. On the right, some shooting with both my Great Knarloc and a squad of Carnivores brought down one of the Inceptors, and my Hounds were able to charge them and kill a second one.

Turn 2:
Between his Hvy Intercessors, and his charging Captain, he cleared out a large portion of my left flank while his Apothecary and revived Eradicators finished off my rider. I held the objective, but only by the skin of my teeth. He took the center, knocking over my banner and killing off the few carnivores in range with his Assault intercessors, but because of some creative unit placement on my part, he would have gone past the objective had he charged me, and elected to stay put. On the right, he shot my Great Knarloc with the Terminators and then finished it off my Assault (One day it will do something again XD), while my hounds killed his last Inceptor.
For my turn, I cut my losses on the left objective and fell back my 7 surviving carnivores to the midfield. I took down 3 of his Assault Intercessors in shooting and reclaimed the center objective. (Killed a full one with 2 6's on my seismic destabilizer XD). On the right, I knew I just had to tie up the Terminaotrs since they weren't obsec and he had nothing else in range. I charged one squad of carnivores in to eat the over watch and then my hounds as well. (The melee on the right objective would last for the remainder of the game. Had we access to Aggressors, this likely would have turned out very differently.)

Turn 3:
He bannered up the left objective while pushing into the center. His Eradicators knocked off a pair of my remaining Krootox, and nearly finished off another squad of Carnivores between his Intercessors all shooting. He charged in to the fleeing carnivores, and I plinked 2 wounds off his Captain with FTGG, but I doubted I'd manage to down him by this point. With all my heavy hitters pretty much dead, I just had to hold on.

My turn three , I fell back the unit in combat with the Assault Intercessors and tried to finish them off, but left the Sargent with a single wound remaining. I did manage to knock off a Hvy Intercessor with my last Krootox though. I killed a single Terminator, but was loosing a fair few models in the process though I still managed to barely hold three objectives at the end of the turn.

Turn 4
He took down my last Krootox, clearing me off my backfield objective, and pushed harder into the center, clearing out a handful of carnivores and my marker drones, but was just shy of securing the objective after I killed his Assault Intercessor Sargent and one of his Hvy Intercessors.
I fell back a unit of 4 remaining carnivores and was just able to get them in cover behind my backfield objective to re-secure it. Things were looking grim on the right flank, so I ran my last free unit of Carnivores into the melee to keep the objective locked down (but not before taking out an intercessor in shooting).

Turn 5
Was mostly cleanup for him at this point, he shot nearly everything else off the board, but didn't have quite enough to clear out the right objective. This was the end of the midfield for me, as he finally secured the objective by killing everything except my Warlord.

At the end of the game all I had left on the table were my 2 Ethereals, a single Marker Drone, and 6 Carnivores (split between a squad of 2 and 4.)

So final score, Kroot: 86, Space Marines: 69, really close game, there were couple times I held and objective by just one or two bodies, so a few rolls a little different could have really changed the outcome. I feel like having Agressors over those Terminators would have tipped the balance and given him a win. (Though he did make A LOT of saves with them and the lower save on the Aggressors would have mattered, though I'm not sure by how much. I certainly would have focused them over the Inceptors early on, so I guess it is still hard to say.)

Lastly, I wanted to update you all on the final list. A unit of 9 Crisis suits will be joining the team for the 2k point finals as follows:

XV8 Crisis Battlesuits x9: 225 points (2CP Veteran Cadre Upgrade, 1CP Cross Linked Stabilizer Jets).
7 Fusion Blasters: 105 points
12 Plasma Rifles: 96 points
8 Shield Generators: 40 points
4 Shield Drones: 60 points.

To make that fit, I'm going to cut one of the drone units form the Breachers and just clump the two units close so they can both get the 5+ invul from a single drone. I'm also strongly looking at cutting the Fusion Blades and just having my Commander hang back, though dropping him into the backfield with the ability to melee was really good before (would have really liked to try it out again before deciding), I'm just not sure it's 2CP good now that I'm taking the Jets and using an extra 2CP for Vet Cadre, that would put me down to starting with only 4CP.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/12/20 17:08:19


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Made in us
Nurgle Chosen Marine on a Palanquin





Livermore, Ca

"The kroot thing".. the 7" special move before the first turn right? Just making sure you are not doing that on turn 1.
   
Made in ca
Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





 Sazzlefrats wrote:
"The kroot thing".. the 7" special move before the first turn right? Just making sure you are not doing that on turn 1.


No, didn't have the 7" special move because of the scenario, just had to advance some units instead. I consider "The Kroot Thing" to just be gumming up all the midfield objectives with a tide of bodies as that's how my games with them typically go.

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Fresh-Faced New User




I decided to try your Kroot list out on Table Top Simulator to see how it fared. The TLDR of the story is I lost, badly if you count how many of my models vs my opponents were destroyed, although point wise the game was close.

My opponent ran this list (He let me use the legends stuff so I returned the favor):

++ Patrol Detachment 0CP (T'au Empire) [57 PL, 6CP, 996pts] ++
+ Configuration +
Battle Size [6CP]: 2. Incursion (51-100 Total PL / 501-1000 Points)
Detachment Command Cost
Sept Choice: Sa'cea Sept
+ HQ +
Cadre Fireblade [4 PL, 55pts]: 2. Through Unity, Devastation, Warlord
. MV7 Marker Drone
+ Troops +
Breacher Team [5 PL, 110pts]: MV36 Guardian Drone
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui: Pulse blaster, Pulse pistol
. 9x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Pistol: 9x Photon grenades, 9x Pulse blaster, 9x Pulse pistol
. MV7 Marker Drone
Strike Team [5 PL, 115pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui: Markerlight, Pulse rifle
. 9x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle: 9x Photon grenades, 9x Pulse rifle
. 2x MV1 Gun Drone: 4x Pulse carbine
Strike Team [5 PL, 115pts]
. Fire Warrior Shas'ui: Markerlight, Pulse rifle
. 9x Fire Warrior w/ Pulse Rifle: 9x Photon grenades, 9x Pulse rifle
. 2x MV1 Gun Drone: 4x Pulse carbine
+ Elites +
XV25 Stealth Battlesuits [10 PL, 114pts]
. Stealth Shas'ui w/ Burst Cannon
. Stealth Shas'ui w/ Burst Cannon
. Stealth Shas'ui w/ Burst Cannon
. Stealth Shas'vre: Burst cannon
. . Markerlight + Target Lock: Markerlight, Target lock
XV25 Stealth Battlesuits [10 PL, 114pts]
. Stealth Shas'ui w/ Burst Cannon
. Stealth Shas'ui w/ Burst Cannon
. Stealth Shas'ui w/ Burst Cannon
. Stealth Shas'vre: Burst cannon
. . Markerlight + Target Lock: Markerlight, Target lock
+ Fast Attack +
TX42 Piranha [Legends] [3 PL, 59pts]
. TX-42 Piranha w/ 2x Rail rifle: 2x Rail rifle
TX42 Piranha [Legends] [3 PL, 59pts]
. TX-42 Piranha w/ 2x Rail rifle: 2x Rail rifle
+ Heavy Support +
TX7 Hammerhead Gunship [9 PL, 195pts]: 2x Smart missile system, Twin swiftstrike burst cannon [Legends]
+ Flyer +
DX-6 Remora Stealth Drones [3 PL, 60pts]: DX-6 Remora Stealth Drone
++ Total: [57 PL, 6CP, 996pts] ++


The first problem I ran into was the mission we rolled called for table quarter deployment and on an incursion sized map I was barely able to fit all the models in the deployment zone. I was honestly sweating that I was going to have to spend CP to put stuff in reserves.

The second problem I ran into was he used his stealth teams to effectively limit my carnivores pre game move by parking them on the mid board objectives. Thanks to this my carnivores were able to move only 3 inches which caused further problems by trapping other stuff in the deployment zone.

I got first turn and manged to get two squads of carnivores on each mid field objective and effectively held both until turn 4. The kroot hounds and great knarloc were both wiped on turn one, the kroot hounds via some really good overwatch roles from his troops and the great knarloc was wiped off the board by the Hammerhead during my opponents turn 1 shooting.

His stealth teams proved to be a pain to remove because of how hard they are to hit even in melee and the melee profile of the kroot rifle isn't very impressive.

In the end I only had two of the 4 krootox left and one squad of kroot with 6 survivors holding the back field objective. My krootox managed to kill one of his piranhas when it decided to try and sneak up the back field and one of the knarloc rider squads killed the other. My other knarloc rider squad managed to wipe out his breacher team though at heavy cost thanks to the point blank volley strategem. It took two squads of kroot carnivores two turns in melee to kill one of his stealth teams.

The final score was 69 to 75 in my opponents favor. I was ahead in primaries for most of the game but he surpassed me at the end thanks to his secondaries (assassination and take no prisoners).

My main take away from this game was this list is good at playing to the objectives, but that can only take you so far when the kroot are terrible at killing stuff and terrible at surviving being shot at. Also things like stealth teams that can be set up midfield during deployment really throw a wrench in the kroots pre game move.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/03 15:22:25


 
   
Made in ca
Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





Dad Gamer 1978 wrote:
I decided to try your Kroot list out on Table Top Simulator to see how it fared. The TLDR of the story is I lost, badly if you count how many of my models vs my opponents were destroyed, although point wise the game was close.

The first problem I ran into was the mission we rolled called for table quarter deployment and on an incursion sized map I was barely able to fit all the models in the deployment zone. I was honestly sweating that I was going to have to spend CP to put stuff in reserves.

The second problem I ran into was he used his stealth teams to effectively limit my carnivores pre game move by parking them on the mid board objectives. Thanks to this my carnivores were able to move only 3 inches which caused further problems by trapping other stuff in the deployment zone.

I got first turn and manged to get two squads of carnivores on each mid field objective and effectively held both until turn 4. The kroot hounds and great knarloc were both wiped on turn one, the kroot hounds via some really good overwatch roles from his troops and the great knarloc was wiped off the board by the Hammerhead during my opponents turn 1 shooting.

His stealth teams proved to be a pain to remove because of how hard they are to hit even in melee and the melee profile of the kroot rifle isn't very impressive.

In the end I only had two of the 4 krootox left and one squad of kroot with 6 survivors holding the back field objective. My krootox managed to kill one of his piranhas when it decided to try and sneak up the back field and one of the knarloc rider squads killed the other. My other knarloc rider squad managed to wipe out his breacher team though at heavy cost thanks to the point blank volley strategem. It took two squads of kroot carnivores two turns in melee to kill one of his stealth teams.

The final score was 69 to 75 in my opponents favor. I was ahead in primaries for most of the game but he surpassed me at the end thanks to his secondaries (assassination and take no prisoners).

My main take away from this game was this list is good at playing to the objectives, but that can only take you so far when the kroot are terrible at killing stuff and terrible at surviving being shot at. Also things like stealth teams that can be set up midfield during deployment really throw a wrench in the kroots pre game move.


Oof, yeah I can see that doing it. High volume of low AP shots is what's been hitting me the hardest in the closer games. Still, glad to see the points were close, I've rarely gotten close on model kill count myself so points is really where you have to win it.

Yeah, on the small maps, it can get pretty hard, I've never had to reserve anything, but it has gotten close.

Makes sense on the small maps vs pre-game deployment, I hadn't come up with that in the smaller ones myself, and it matters less on the larger ones. Still on the smaller ones, as you said, you were able to make it to the midfield on the first turn.

What secondaries did you choose? If you held the midfield until turn 4, how did you only end up with only 69 VP? That's 10 by default, 45 from Primaries, and at least 12 from Stranglehold which is already 67. Were you not able to get them bannered because of his forward deployment, even if you only had one backfield objective, that should still have been at least another 5 VP. What was the mission secondary (that's usually what I end up taking as there isn't really that good of a 3rd one for the army, but even of another random one, you should have been able to scrounge up a couple VP.)

At 8 total wounds and -1 to be hit, it doesn't surprise me that it took them 2 turns to kill the stealthsuits in melee. It's more about them being obsec and holding the objective. Killing whatever they are in combat with is a nice bonus if it happens.

Yeah, that's pretty much it. Great at objectives, not great at killing. What I've found (at least in my local meta) is that many of the armies are teched to handle high armour multi wound models like Space Marines, which makes them (for their points investment) pretty bad against Kroot. The list he played against you was pretty much exactly what I would have picked against my Kroot army to hard counter it, and considering how close it was, I think you piloted the army quite well TBH. (That Legends Hammerhead is nuts BTW, almost as much anti light infantry firepower than a Nova'd Riptide at far less points. XD)

How I would have tried to handle this one would have been to focus on the Fire Warriors first if possible. Move everything up and clear out as many of them as I could to reduce the volume of incoming fire. Then tag the stealthsuits in close combat to keep their burst cannons in check. If you could clear out most of the Fire Warriors, the only real threat is the Hammerhead because the Stealth Teams are trapped in melee and the Rail Rifles will do little to your infantry blob.

Thanks for taking the time to try it out. It was really cool to read someone else's experience with the list.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2022/01/04 19:06:42


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Mounted Kroot Tracker







This was a fascinating read, especially as I attempted a Dal'yth Kroot list in a crusade league and went 0-3. I think my mistake was trying to kill things rather than gum up objectives, as I leaned heavily into knarlocs and krootox and skimped on the carnivores (10 man units that died immediately).



It sounds like you really have a knack with your list. If you do another league, I think you should add an Orca for laughs. It can transport up to 48 Kroot in it- I'd like to think that many models disembarking behind something the size of a shoebox would be difficult to move around.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/01/04 22:40:31


   
Made in ca
Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





 Oaka wrote:
This was a fascinating read, especially as I attempted a Dal'yth Kroot list in a crusade league and went 0-3. I think my mistake was trying to kill things rather than gum up objectives, as I leaned heavily into knarlocs and krootox and skimped on the carnivores (10 man units that died immediately).

It sounds like you really have a knack with your list. If you do another league, I think you should add an Orca for laughs. It can transport up to 48 Kroot in it- I'd like to think that many models disembarking behind something the size of a shoebox would be difficult to move around.


I'd love to do another league if the world co-operates and I can actually do one. I'm also really hoping that Kroot get at least a little love in the new codex, though I imagine they won't get <Core> so they playstyle will likely get shaken up for sure. If they are not restricted from Mont'ka, that's going to be pretty good at least.

I like your army, looks cool. Honestly, if I'd had the old FW models to run more Knarlocs and riders I probably would have tried that from the outset rather than go objective crazy, so it was more luck than skill that it happened that way. Though once I realized why it was working, I was all over it for sure.

The Orca sounds cool, but aside from it being another discontinued model that is probably going to be a pain to track down, at 300 points, I don't think it does enough. At 300 points, it essentially has no firepower and Kroot are already plenty fast at getting across the table already. Maybe if I was in a 3k point game and had the model, I'd give it a whirl, but I can't see it in anything smaller than that.

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Fresh-Faced New User




 Tawnis wrote:
Dad Gamer 1978 wrote:
I decided to try your Kroot list out on Table Top Simulator to see how it fared. The TLDR of the story is I lost, badly if you count how many of my models vs my opponents were destroyed, although point wise the game was close.

The first problem I ran into was the mission we rolled called for table quarter deployment and on an incursion sized map I was barely able to fit all the models in the deployment zone. I was honestly sweating that I was going to have to spend CP to put stuff in reserves.

The second problem I ran into was he used his stealth teams to effectively limit my carnivores pre game move by parking them on the mid board objectives. Thanks to this my carnivores were able to move only 3 inches which caused further problems by trapping other stuff in the deployment zone.

I got first turn and manged to get two squads of carnivores on each mid field objective and effectively held both until turn 4. The kroot hounds and great knarloc were both wiped on turn one, the kroot hounds via some really good overwatch roles from his troops and the great knarloc was wiped off the board by the Hammerhead during my opponents turn 1 shooting.

His stealth teams proved to be a pain to remove because of how hard they are to hit even in melee and the melee profile of the kroot rifle isn't very impressive.

In the end I only had two of the 4 krootox left and one squad of kroot with 6 survivors holding the back field objective. My krootox managed to kill one of his piranhas when it decided to try and sneak up the back field and one of the knarloc rider squads killed the other. My other knarloc rider squad managed to wipe out his breacher team though at heavy cost thanks to the point blank volley strategem. It took two squads of kroot carnivores two turns in melee to kill one of his stealth teams.

The final score was 69 to 75 in my opponents favor. I was ahead in primaries for most of the game but he surpassed me at the end thanks to his secondaries (assassination and take no prisoners).

My main take away from this game was this list is good at playing to the objectives, but that can only take you so far when the kroot are terrible at killing stuff and terrible at surviving being shot at. Also things like stealth teams that can be set up midfield during deployment really throw a wrench in the kroots pre game move.


Oof, yeah I can see that doing it. High volume of low AP shots is what's been hitting me the hardest in the closer games. Still, glad to see the points were close, I've rarely gotten close on model kill count myself so points is really where you have to win it.

Yeah, on the small maps, it can get pretty hard, I've never had to reserve anything, but it has gotten close.

Makes sense on the small maps vs pre-game deployment, I hadn't come up with that in the smaller ones myself, and it matters less on the larger ones. Still on the smaller ones, as you said, you were able to make it to the midfield on the first turn.

What secondaries did you choose? If you held the midfield until turn 4, how did you only end up with only 69 VP? That's 10 by default, 45 from Primaries, and at least 12 from Stranglehold which is already 67. Were you not able to get them bannered because of his forward deployment, even if you only had one backfield objective, that should still have been at least another 5 VP. What was the mission secondary (that's usually what I end up taking as there isn't really that good of a 3rd one for the army, but even of another random one, you should have been able to scrounge up a couple VP.)

At 8 total wounds and -1 to be hit, it doesn't surprise me that it took them 2 turns to kill the stealthsuits in melee. It's more about them being obsec and holding the objective. Killing whatever they are in combat with is a nice bonus if it happens.

Yeah, that's pretty much it. Great at objectives, not great at killing. What I've found (at least in my local meta) is that many of the armies are teched to handle high armour multi wound models like Space Marines, which makes them (for their points investment) pretty bad against Kroot. The list he played against you was pretty much exactly what I would have picked against my Kroot army to hard counter it, and considering how close it was, I think you piloted the army quite well TBH. (That Legends Hammerhead is nuts BTW, almost as much anti light infantry firepower than a Nova'd Riptide at far less points. XD)

How I would have tried to handle this one would have been to focus on the Fire Warriors first if possible. Move everything up and clear out as many of them as I could to reduce the volume of incoming fire. Then tag the stealthsuits in close combat to keep their burst cannons in check. If you could clear out most of the Fire Warriors, the only real threat is the Hammerhead because the Stealth Teams are trapped in melee and the Rail Rifles will do little to your infantry blob.

Thanks for taking the time to try it out. It was really cool to read someone else's experience with the list.



For secondaries I picked banners, engaged, and bring it down. I didn't think stranglehold was viable, which proved correct. We only had 4 objectives and I didn't see getting the one in his deployment zone, especially since he kept his troops and hammerhead parked back there for most of the game. I got engaged for most of the game at least, but because of the stealth suits I never got a chance to raise banners on the mid field objectives. Bring it down probably wasn't the best choice in retrospect, but his list didn't really give up any obvious secondaries. It was fun though and my friend was shocked at how close the game was.
   
Made in ca
Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





Dad Gamer 1978 wrote:


For secondaries I picked banners, engaged, and bring it down. I didn't think stranglehold was viable, which proved correct. We only had 4 objectives and I didn't see getting the one in his deployment zone, especially since he kept his troops and hammerhead parked back there for most of the game. I got engaged for most of the game at least, but because of the stealth suits I never got a chance to raise banners on the mid field objectives. Bring it down probably wasn't the best choice in retrospect, but his list didn't really give up any obvious secondaries. It was fun though and my friend was shocked at how close the game was.


Ah, okay that makes more sense. Though, if you had 4 objectives, for Strangle you just need 3 and more than your opponent, so if you had the 2 midfield and your own, you would have gotten it. But if you only had one midfield, then yeah, no go there. Still, I found Engage works pretty well too (I'd take them both if I could), so you probably didn't loose out on much there.

Yeah, those two Stealth teams sound like they would have been a big hastle.

Glad you had fun with it.

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Made in ca
Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





Final match of the league is done. I played against Thousand Sons. He took 1 Infernal Master, 2 Sorcerers and 1 Exalted Sorcerer. 1 unit of 10 Scarab Occult Terminators, and another of 5. 2 Hellbrutes, 3 units of 5 Rubric Marines, one with all Warpflamers. A unit of 5 Chaos Spawns and 2 units of 1. We played The Scouring, he took the secondaries Stranglehold, Assassinate, and Warp Ritual. I took the Stranglehold, Banners, and the mission secondary, Strategic Scan.

Turn 1: He rolled the first turn and teleported his Infernal Master, 10 Terminators, and the 5 Warpflamers into the center. He moved the rest of his forces onto his two objectives and unloaded a torrent of fire, killing about 30 carnivores, 5 of my riders, and 4 breachers, as well as a handful of drones. On my turn 1, I knew my screen wouldn't last much longer and had to clear out the center. I moved what I could spare onto my two side objectives and used my characters to banner and scan while I threw everything else into the middle. With full markers lights, I was able to wipe out most of it in shooting, killing 8 of the 10 terminators. (I made a big mistake here, forgetting to roll 2D6 and choose this highest for my Fusion Blasters, otherwise I likely would have killed all 10.) I charged my Great Knarloc into the Terminaotrs, killing one with 3 mortals, but then wiffed the attack and left the Sorcerer alive. A unit of 5 hounds took a miraculous 3 wounds off the Infernal master, but couldn't quite kill him. I used my other unit of hounds to eat the warpflamers overwatch and then charged my battlesuits into them, using the Furtious Assault Stratagem to inflict 7 mortals, and took another 2 off them in combat, again leaving the sorcerer alive with a single wound.

Turn 2: He teleported his Infernal Master of combat, performed the ritual then teleported him to safety behind his lines. The other two he kept in combat, smiting my guys. This is where I realized my inexperience against Thousand Sons as he started using psychic powers so snipe my characters performing actions and finish off my Great Knarloc, I got banners up on both sides, but my shaper scanning the objective went down. He follow up shooting that cleaned up most of my remaining carnivores (removing my obsec from the center objective) and after bumping up his Terminators in the psychic phase, charged my remaining units on my right objective, killing my Shaper that was scanning and knocking over my banner. For my turn, I moved my Ethereal over to my objective to scan it while using my remaining Kroot as meat shields, I fell back my Crisis suits and dropped in my Crisis commander, using Mont'ka to allow them to shoot. They took down a Hellbrute that was moving to the center as well as a squad of Rubric Marines that were moving up. I shuffled my breachers over to the right and unleaded into the Terminators, taking 2 down. Post shooting, I realized my second big mistake. I should have advanced my breachers within range of the objective and dropped my commander in range to Mont'ka both them and the crisis team, realising I'd loose the objective, I sadly had to charge them in to contest it and just hope they would live. My last rider and shaper joined a unit of 4 carnivores in attacking the Terminator sorcerer in the center and managed to finish him off as well.

Turn 3: He moved up his unit of spawn in the back to try and tack back the center, but otherwise was content to just sit back and use psychic powers and shooting to wear me down, and it was finally really taking it's tool. Though my Ethereal barely survived to scan the objective, most of that flank was now gone. Mortals ate through my remining drone screen and downed 3 of my 6 crisis suits. Shoting took out my Knarlc rider and the remnants of my carnivres, save the 4 in the center and my breachers were slowly getting chopped up. Even so, I did manage to barely hold three objectives, giving me a big 15, and keeping me in the game (he was still only managing 5 a turn). I moved my crisis team, and remaining Kroot into the center, and tried to shoot down the spawn, but only managed to knock off 2 of the 5. I had my last Shaper scan while shielding him with my Carnivores.

Turn 4: Here's were the lack of being able to kill his Psyker characters really showed, he quickly sniped out my Ethereal, then through everything into my suits, rolling really well and downing all of them. The spawns cleaned up the carnivores, but my Shaper did get the scan off. For my turn, I did my best to try and re-take the center, bringing in my Crisis commander and last marker drone, then killing a spawn in shooting to secure the objective. The breachers barely held on, still holding the right objective by a single model.

Turn 5: And then the fat lady sung, I didn't have much left, and the rest fell to psychic powers and shooting, though he still only got 5 VP on objectives that turn.

So, final score 20/20 on primaries, but he held me off secondaries much better, 69-49 was the final score with the Thousand Sons claiming victory.

I really feel like my two misplays cost me the game there (and/or not getting first turn, but that's not up to me XD). Had I finished off that terminator in my first round of shooting, my Greater Knarloc would have been able to tag the Infernal Master and finish him off. That would have cut down on psychic attacks for the whole game, removed one of his three Warp Rituals, and given me 2 objectives on my turn 2, so 10 points made up right there. If I hadn't hat to charge my breachers and had actually managed to clean up that objective, it would have been game changing for sure, even with the mess up in the middle, that was my biggest blunder for sure. I think having a unit of stealth suits to forward deploy and screen for things like teleport shenanigans would be super useful to have next time too.

Even so, the game was super close and I had a blast. Learned a lot in the process too. Not sure how I can counter this in the future having no pysicic defense against attacks in my buffing/objective units, I guess just avoiding action objectives and trying to go for other ones will have to do.

Thanks to everyone who was interested enough in all this to stay tuned for the whole thing, I hope you had a good read. I'll post a new list once the new codex drops. I'm really looking forward to all the Kroot buffs!

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/01/18 04:45:39


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Crazed Spirit of the Defiler




Hopefully only relevant for a few more weeks(!), but you can't 8th ed Montka from deepstrike, start of your turn only. You have to be in position the previous turn to be able to Montka the next.

I'm glad you've finally faced a mildly competent opponent and hopefully now you realise the glaring weakness of Kroot spam.

Your opponent sounds like they also made some mistakes in their play. My personal experience of Thousand Sons into weaker factions (Tau, Deathguard) is that the match up gets easier and easier with practice as you dial in your efficiency. It can be quite depressing for an opponent if you play them regularly as it doesn't take long to realise they are in an almost unwinnable game (assuming equal skill).

Did he fully buff the 10 Scarabs with -1 to hit all phases, 4++, +1 to hit all phases and +1S in shooting? Did he use the 3CP -1 damage in shooting strat (might not have bothered if only the 7 fusion are more than D1 in your list)? Did he remember +1 armour save All Is Dust against all your D1 shooting?

Did he need to put his 10 Scarabs 12" away from your deployment to get line of sight to what he killed on his first turn? If not, he would have been much better putting a sacrificial unit on the middle and holding them back until he had thinned you out a bit more. As the terminators are just as deadly at 24" as 12" but you are not.
   
Made in ca
Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





EightFoldPath wrote:
Hopefully only relevant for a few more weeks(!), but you can't 8th ed Montka from deepstrike, start of your turn only. You have to be in position the previous turn to be able to Montka the next.

I'm glad you've finally faced a mildly competent opponent and hopefully now you realise the glaring weakness of Kroot spam.

Your opponent sounds like they also made some mistakes in their play. My personal experience of Thousand Sons into weaker factions (Tau, Deathguard) is that the match up gets easier and easier with practice as you dial in your efficiency. It can be quite depressing for an opponent if you play them regularly as it doesn't take long to realise they are in an almost unwinnable game (assuming equal skill).

Did he fully buff the 10 Scarabs with -1 to hit all phases, 4++, +1 to hit all phases and +1S in shooting? Did he use the 3CP -1 damage in shooting strat (might not have bothered if only the 7 fusion are more than D1 in your list)? Did he remember +1 armour save All Is Dust against all your D1 shooting?

Did he need to put his 10 Scarabs 12" away from your deployment to get line of sight to what he killed on his first turn? If not, he would have been much better putting a sacrificial unit on the middle and holding them back until he had thinned you out a bit more. As the terminators are just as deadly at 24" as 12" but you are not.


Ohh, so you can't move things, then Mont'ka, you have to Mont'ka, then move. Whups. Good to know, thanks.

Yeah, that blob of 10 had like 4 buffs on it from his first turn.

Yeah, we remembered the +1 from All is dust, that was a big pain vs my breachers. He did not use the -1 Damage strat though.

When we talked start at the end, he was worried that if he let me have the center he wouldn't have been able to shoot me off of it in time. Honestly I think he did make the right call there as that's how many of my other games went, but no way to know for sure.

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