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Made in no
Tail-spinning Tomb Blade Pilot






I saw someone on Youtube discuss that when GW introduced Tau originally in the early 2000s or late 90s, the Tau was licensed from the Vau race of Fading Suns. The name, caste system, superior and sleek technology and "minor" allied races etc.

https://fadingsuns.fandom.com/wiki/Vau

Someone claimed there was a rumor floating around back then that GW paid for, rather than was inspired by, the Vau as a creative property. It's all new to me. Anyone else hear this?


Let the galaxy burn. 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





Sounds like complete nonsense to me. That isn't how copyright and licensing works. You don't need a license in order to create something with some of the same basic aspects.

Having a quick at wikipedia the Tau were first thought of in the early 90s, before this "fading suns" even existed. They were called the "the Shishell" originally and the caste system was still part of them, with the idea being a W40K counterpart to lizardmen in the same way eldar were elves. Their name after that was then "Tao" before becoming "Tau".

https://gavthorpe.co.uk/2017/06/26/the-origins-of-the-tau/
   
Made in gb
Ridin' on a Snotling Pump Wagon






Genuinely the first I’ve heard of this.

Can you link to the YouTube vid?

   
Made in de
Battlefield Tourist






Nuremberg

Fading Suns has a lot in common with 40K, they have their own genestealer analogue and a bunch of other stuff. I mean, a lot of it is also just inspired by the same sources that inspired 40K (Dune is a big one).

I dunno if GW ripped off Fading Suns, but Fading Suns definitely ripped off parts of 40K so turnabout is fair play.

But then GW has always been big into ripping stuff off, the setting has always been a mad mishmash of 2000AD, Dune, Starship Troopers and the Holy Roman Empire in spaaaaaace, that's why it's so great and why GW being so po faced about copyright is so funny and darkly appropriate.

   
Made in au
Longtime Dakkanaut




The Vau are not the Tau. If anything, they are thematically closer to the Eldar, in that they fill the role of inscrutable manipulative alien "Other" with advanced technology as contrast to the medieval European themed mainstream human society of the Fading Suns universe.
   
Made in no
Tail-spinning Tomb Blade Pilot






 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Genuinely the first I’ve heard of this.

Can you link to the YouTube vid?


It was a discussion in the comments. I cant re-find it at the moment.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
Iracundus wrote:
The Vau are not the Tau. If anything, they are thematically closer to the Eldar, in that they fill the role of inscrutable manipulative alien "Other" with advanced technology as contrast to the medieval European themed mainstream human society of the Fading Suns universe.


Isnt the Eldar is more of a dying race consisting of specialists rather than castes?

According to GW publications the Tau is inspired by japanese culture. While the Vau is based on China, even to the extent of their leaders being called mandarins, so I can see the thematic similarities.




Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Mentlegen324 wrote:
Sounds like complete nonsense to me. That isn't how copyright and licensing works. You don't need a license in order to create something with some of the same basic aspects.

Having a quick at wikipedia the Tau were first thought of in the early 90s, before this "fading suns" even existed. They were called the "the Shishell" originally and the caste system was still part of them, with the idea being a W40K counterpart to lizardmen in the same way eldar were elves. Their name after that was then "Tao" before becoming "Tau".

https://gavthorpe.co.uk/2017/06/26/the-origins-of-the-tau/



"Gavin Thorpe began developing what eventually became the Tau in the early 1990s. Initially, he conceived them as the counterpart to the Lizardmen faction from Warhammer Fantasy, in the same way the Eldar are the counterpart of the High Elves, and he called them "the Shishell". Like the Lizardmen, the Shishell had a caste-based society. The Shishell had five castes: Earth, Air, Fire, Water, and Spirit. The race was ruled by a caste of psykers. In 1999, Thorpe revisited his Shishell concept when Games Workshop asked him to develop a new army. The caste system became part of the new Tau race.[1] The Spirit caste was renamed "Ethereal", and the Ethereals became non-psychic so as to differentiate them from the Eldar Seer councils.

Whereas most of the races in Warhammer 40,000 are based on Tolkien fantasy races (e.g. the Eldar are based on High Elves), the culture and technology of the Tau were heavily inspired by Japanese science-fiction. This idea was proposed by Jes Goodwin, who is a sculptor at Games Workshop, as a way to attract new players who weren't interested by the overall fantasy-in-space theme of the other Warhammer 40,000 races.

The Kroot were originally conceived as a separate army in themselves, but were eventually merged with the Tau.[1]

According to Andy Chambers, the chief designer at the time, the T'au were intended "to be altruistic and idealistic, believing heartily in unification as the way forward." Graham McNeill was responsible for much of the background material produced for the T'au, developing what Andy Chambers described as "their proud, quiet but determined character [developed] to the point where they actually became a rather likeable, if slightly naive addition to the cosmos.""


Vau were certainly released years before any Tau model was made? I downloaded a few Fading Suns sourcebook pdfs and can certainly see similarities. The eastern influence, the altruistic/good guy/ordered society compared to a decaying human empire. The lack of noses

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/10/28 21:27:33


Let the galaxy burn. 
   
Made in au
Longtime Dakkanaut




You're focusing too much on caste and superficial visual appearance, whereas it is the larger thematic role that is what is more important. Invariably what happens with these "GW copied this" is they seize upon details as evidence when many science fiction races or ideas have similarities or variations on themes, without being copies. Aside from superficial visual appearance, they are actually quite different from an evolutionary point of view, with the Vau being herbivorous and descended from hadrosaur-like creatures, while the Tau are from an arid planet and were originally plains hunters.

The Vau fill the role of the Eldar because the Vau are the mystical elder race with technology bordering on the magical, and which is seen as a stagnant society bound by ritual and mysticism, while manipulating the humans for their own mysterious goals. This is totally different from that of the Tau theme which is that of a rising power with a sense of optimism and manifest destiny threatening the status quo of the decaying stagnation of the Imperium.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/10/30 10:51:52


 
   
 
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