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Made in gb
Annoyed Blood Angel Devastator




If I've told the person at the beginning of the game that I have a strat that for example allows my Sanguinary guard to heroically intervene 6", would it be considered a 'Gotcha' moment if I then didn't remind them about it when they move a unit within 6“ of said Sanguinary Guard unit? Or is that fair play to let them do it and capitalize?

At the last tournament I was at, I kept finding myself reminding people about it and I wasn't sure if I was giving my opponents too much help and thus putting myself at a disadvantage as a result.
   
Made in gb
Preparing the Invasion of Terra






If you told them it was a possibility then absolutely not.
That being said, you're in a competitive environment where you're both trying to win, "gotcha" moments are just a part of that. You've not cheated or been a prat, you've laid a trap and sprung it.
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

In a competitive game you are not required to divulge your strategy. Nor are you required to point out if your opponent makes a strategic mistake.


You are required to point out if they make a rules mistake of course, but not strategic ones.

You are also required to have the army list and also give them free access to information on your units abilities and such when asked, but you don't have to offer it up front.




Otherwise spotting if your opponent makes a mistake and capitalising on it is part of competing in a wargame. If they do something daft you take advantage to win, who knows they might have sprung their own trap on you and its part of their strategy; perhaps its a poor move but the only valid one for them or perhaps they've less experience and this is simply going to result in them ranking lower in the event.

That's part of competitive events



Outside of competitive events it totally depends on the relationship between you and your opponent and what you both want from the game you are playing.

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Made in us
The Marine Standing Behind Marneus Calgar





Upstate, New York

Including it in the army brief at the start of the game should be enough for anything other then a casual/learning game.

It really is very meta dependent though. Depends a lot on the mood of your store and the unwritten social contracts of the local scene.

   
Made in no
Liche Priest Hierophant





Bergen

I think the definition of a 'gotchyou' moment is poorly defined here. You certainly did get them.

I shot my ork opponent tanks open. Only for the warlord to be in heoric intervention range of me after he disembarked. I had to remind him as he is not to good in the rules. He certainly did get me.

In a tournament it is up to you if you want to remind people of things like that. I would not. I would just give a general rundown at the beginning of the game, but even then you are very generous. But it saves on time. It saves on your opponent looking through your list of stratagems etc. The one time I played in a tournament we went out of time. So anything that sawes is good.

If it was a cassual game (like said Ork game) it can be fun to do gotch you ments. But it can also be fun to point it out.

It is up to you. But don't feel bad for not helping your opponent make optimal strategic desissions.

   
Made in gb
Raging-on-the-Inside Blood Angel Sergeant





Luton, England

At home playing casually with my mates I would totally point it out when they were making the move - we have alot of time and noone wants to be smashed for forgetting a rule.

In a tournament it would be different, there is alot of time pressure and mental load in trying to remember all your rules and your opponents rules and the event pack and such that I'm not also going to put it upon myself to remember things for my opponents - I will however tell them about it before the game or the first time it comes up if it wasn't mentioned before the game. That's only fair.

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Made in us
Been Around the Block




answer: yes. If you're watching your opponent make a strategic blunder knowing full well that they would not do so if they remembered your rule... that's the definition of a gotcha moment.

The next question is how much do you care? Like others have said, at a tourney you're not really expected to give your opponent the tactical rundown. But that doesn't mean it isn't a gotcha moment.
   
Made in us
Confessor Of Sins





Tacoma, WA, USA

If a gotcha moment is anytime you get an advantage over your opponent due to unknown information, it may be a gotcha moment depending on how well the opponent knows your army.

That being said, constantly reminding your opponent of something is obnoxious and tedious. So telling them once at the beginning of the game and the first time it comes up should be enough to not fell like you are taking advantage of your opponent.
   
Made in us
Damsel of the Lady




fatbudda319 wrote:
If I've told the person at the beginning of the game that I have a strat that for example allows my Sanguinary guard to heroically intervene 6", would it be considered a 'Gotcha' moment if I then didn't remind them about it when they move a unit within 6“ of said Sanguinary Guard unit? Or is that fair play to let them do it and capitalize?

At the last tournament I was at, I kept finding myself reminding people about it and I wasn't sure if I was giving my opponents too much help and thus putting myself at a disadvantage as a result.


If an opponent asks, tell them the honest answer. Even if your opponent asks multiple times. If you covered it in pre-game and the opponent did not ask a question, you don't need to bring it up again. The point is to have a fair game, not to play the game for your opponent.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/12/09 15:09:45


 
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle





In My Lab

Technically a gotcha, sure, but I’d say your pregame warning was sufficient that it was on them to remember, not on you to remind them.

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Made in dk
Loyal Necron Lychguard






@Niiai "Units cannot declare a charge or perform a Heroic Intervention in the same turn that they disembarked from a destroyed TRANSPORT model."
fatbudda319 wrote:
If I've told the person at the beginning of the game that I have a strat that for example allows my Sanguinary guard to heroically intervene 6", would it be considered a 'Gotcha' moment if I then didn't remind them about it when they move a unit within 6“ of said Sanguinary Guard unit? Or is that fair play to let them do it and capitalize?

At the last tournament I was at, I kept finding myself reminding people about it and I wasn't sure if I was giving my opponents too much help and thus putting myself at a disadvantage as a result.

Yes, a gotcha IMO just requires someone to be disadvantaged by a rule they are not aware of in the moment they take an action.

Not taking advantage of gotchas is not part of the rules, what level of gotcha gameplay your group is comfortable with should be discussed, if you are playing with a stranger then it is a good idea to take a minute to clear the air about this sort of stuff before the game begins, you should also cover take-backsies and forgetting to do something like bringing in reserves and that sort of stuff. Nobody wants to have 300 pts of Terminators be automatically destroyed because they forget or lose out on a Movement phase because they did their deep strikes before movement, playing that hardcore is straining and quickly becomes unfun.

I am sure your opponents were very thankful that you were such a great sportsman, anyone who doesn't want reminding will probably say so, although in general I'd say you shouldn't remind your opponent of your Stratagems in a tournament. Tournament players should be asking their own questions, but if your opponent agrees to something more laid back then reminding people of this sort of stuff is absolutely my favourite way to play even if we are bringing competitive lists or at a tournament. Sometimes being upfront about one rule can mask keeping a second rule hidden, you don't want to be accused of that if you forget to tell about a second Stratagem but remind them of the heroic intervention Stratagem. Tell people what is on your army list and overexplain when they ask questions. If they ask whether you can advance and charge you should tell how you can increase your melee threat range for example, even if it is by rolling 3d6 for charge and discard the lowest dice instead of just advance and charge.
   
Made in ca
Poisonous Kroot Headhunter





fatbudda319 wrote:
If I've told the person at the beginning of the game that I have a strat that for example allows my Sanguinary guard to heroically intervene 6", would it be considered a 'Gotcha' moment if I then didn't remind them about it when they move a unit within 6“ of said Sanguinary Guard unit? Or is that fair play to let them do it and capitalize?

At the last tournament I was at, I kept finding myself reminding people about it and I wasn't sure if I was giving my opponents too much help and thus putting myself at a disadvantage as a result.


I think that you were more than fair in telling your opponent at the beginning of the game it was even an option. You can't take the time to review everything you could possibly do.

People get too salty about something unexpected throwing off their perfectly laid out battle plans which I find terribly ironic as that is something that a wargame simulator SHOULD be simulating. There should be these unexpected gotcha moments that players have to adapt to on the fly. But that's a whole other story.

Short answer, no, don't feel bad.

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Made in no
Liche Priest Hierophant





Bergen

Cheers mate.

   
Made in gb
Annoyed Blood Angel Devastator




Cheers guys, I'm fairly new to the tournament scene and whilst the games I usually play are competitive, they're also friendly so I'm used to giving my opponents a bit more leeway than is probably necessary!
   
Made in fi
Locked in the Tower of Amareo





fatbudda319 wrote:
If I've told the person at the beginning of the game that I have a strat that for example allows my Sanguinary guard to heroically intervene 6", would it be considered a 'Gotcha' moment if I then didn't remind them about it when they move a unit within 6“ of said Sanguinary Guard unit? Or is that fair play to let them do it and capitalize?

At the last tournament I was at, I kept finding myself reminding people about it and I wasn't sure if I was giving my opponents too much help and thus putting myself at a disadvantage as a result.


As a rule of thumb i tend to verfify opponent was doing what he wanted intentionally. Generally i prefer to win without silly oopsies. Like yesterday on aos tournament i made sure to ask does opponent really want to move 8.4" or so from unit he needed charge. 8" charge but i could redeploy for d6 away. If he stays 9.1" away i can't redeploy and his charge roll same as it would be minimum and possibly lot easier.

Game result is fairer and game is also going to be LOT faster this way. Gw neeps making game slower and slower. No need for players to slow it down even further.

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