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Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





I’ve seen the preview of the Tau codex stating that you will now be able to field a whole army of kroot if you want. Not a huge range of models, unless there more in the codex, so will anyone bother?
   
Made in gb
Automated Rubric Marine of Tzeentch




dorset

in a matched play "competitive" game? very unlikely.

same as its now techincally possible to have a full sisters of silence detachment.

However, the option for some crazy narritive/crusade/for the lulz force is nice to have, i suppose, along with the fact that the kroot option ALSO lets to field all the kroot sub-species as "slotless" units, so your not penalised too much for having them (beyond using points on sub-optimal choices)

To be a man in such times is to be one amongst untold billions. It is to live in the cruelest and most bloody regime imaginable. These are the tales of those times. Forget the power of technology and science, for so much has been forgotten, never to be relearned. Forget the promise of progress and understanding, for in the grim dark future there is only war. There is no peace amongst the stars, only an eternity of carnage and slaughter, and the laughter of thirsting gods.

Coven of XVth 2000pts
The Blades of Ruin 2,000pts Watch Company Rho 1650pts
 
   
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yup, already have STL files printing in batches. building my new kroot only army one build plate at a time.

10000 points 7000
6000
5000
5000
2000
 
   
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Longtime Dakkanaut




Depends how they update Vespid so we can pretend they're winged Kroot like the days of yore
   
Made in ca
Stormin' Stompa






Ottawa, ON

If I can bring the kroot character from the blackstone fortress, then yes.

Ask yourself: have you rated a gallery image today? 
   
Made in ca
Fireknife Shas'el






2 shapers, 40 Carnivores, 12 Hounds, 6 Krootox = 500pt combat patrol. I think I'd want Knarlocs to come out of Legends before I went any bigger than that on Kroot.

   
Made in gb
Boosting Space Marine Biker




Northampton

If you use Ro3 and the legends options (knarloc riders and great Knarlocs) i think you can eke out a max of 2700 or so points of kroot only using a Brigade. the limit of 3 shapers is what prevents you going any bigger.

James has in the past published at least one, and i think two, Kroot mercenary lists in old WD's where the options were expanded quite a lot, and i'm fairly certain they were where the inspiration for the FW minis,

I'm not sure how popular they were, but i've seen some awesome converted armies. Sadly, since James doesn't like to publish rules for minis it doesn't make, I think it unlikely a future Kroot mercenary list will be made.

Now as to whether we will see them? Yes, imo, definitely. Firstly, there will be people who love kroot and will field their armies regardless, especially now they are legal with shapers being HQ choices and having WL traits. They are also one of the most efficient units in the Tau codex. they are fast and can quickly get up the board, especially if they are Dal'yth. they aren't super good at CC but are better than a lot of similarly priced units, and they have decent shooting. they can have a 4+ save in cover to boot. so i would expect them to see a lot of use in competitive lists for the early board control if for nothing else.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/28 23:45:30


 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut






Like the Mercenaries list, pure Kroot is still basically just a meme army.

they're cripples by the Rule of Three, and their Forgeworld units basically don't exist, being Legends.
   
Made in us
Shadowy Grot Kommittee Memba






I am as we speak printing up 8 additional krootox for my buddy so he can return to monke.

"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"

"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"

"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"

"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!"  
   
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Denison, Iowa

With the Blackstone Fortress guy and some of the FW units I could see this actually working. I wish they'd have brought back Angkor Prok, he was awesome for 75 points.
   
Made in ca
Discriminating Deathmark Assassin





Stasis

Yes.

I played a Kroot Mercenary army way back. Knarlock Riders and Great Knarlocks still have rules via Legends, feth, I've got 9 Great Knarlocks I converted from Dino's, as I was hoping to make reptilian Kroot.

People get really pissy when I remind them that Legends exist and are valid, especially in Matched Play.

213PL 60PL 12PL 9-17PL
(she/her) 
   
Made in ca
Longtime Dakkanaut





xerxeskingofking wrote:
in a matched play "competitive" game? very unlikely.

same as its now techincally possible to have a full sisters of silence detachment.

However, the option for some crazy narritive/crusade/for the lulz force is nice to have, i suppose, along with the fact that the kroot option ALSO lets to field all the kroot sub-species as "slotless" units, so your not penalised too much for having them (beyond using points on sub-optimal choices)


I am exactly that crazy / narrative / crusade player. I plan to have both a Kroot AND an SoS Crusade. Start at 25 PL... Maybe get to 50, maybe not.

The Kroot will be Dahyak Gekh's pack (Herd?); after his work on the BSF, he will return home. I'll use his 8th ed PL cost and profile- I don't think he's been updated for 9th. I think he'll be blooded to start in order to represent his time on the BSF. His battle Honour might be a piece of Archeotech from the actual BSF game- I'll go through the cards and see if any of them show up as Crusade Relics in either the BRB or T'au list. If any do, I'll choose the coolest one.

I think I will convert one Kroot Hound out of the pack to represent his own personal hound- maybe give it a harness or something to distinguish it from the other wilder hounds. Their reunion will be cool. I think the Shaper will be new... the shaper Dayak remembers died while he was away. Opens up the potential for internal schism once the story gets rolling.

The SoS will be a team that Greyfax keeps on standby for days when she needs to curb-stomp witches harder than usual. I haven't done the math because I don't have the dex yet, but I'm looking for a rhino with five Witchseekers to scout move it. In the beginning they'll share the rhino with five Vigilators while Grey Fax and the Centura advance with on foot with a Prosecutor meat shield. Once the rhino has proven itself in battle, and gains some survivability, I can star swapping out the Vigilators to make room for characters in order to get them to forward positions. This force might grow a bit bigger over time, as it may be called upon to serve as an escort to some Greyshields in a Torchbearer fleet. I'm not sure if I can squeeze that into the overall narrative.

The main rivals for Greyfax and her SoS will be the descendants of the Witch Cult of Mnestteus, risen once more after 4000 years of hiding since their ancestors Martyred Saint Katherine. The BSF Rogue Psykers will play a major role in that cult- probably the Firebrand and Chaos Ogryn too. Hopefully Danie Ware's Triumph of Saint Katherine will shed some light on them so that I have a bit more information to work with. If not, I think I'll use Corpse Grinder models as the basis for the cult troops. The cult will be trying to stop a Triumph from gathering the relics, with a particular eye to the desecration of Saint Katherine's Praesidium Protectiva.



   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka




NE Ohio, USA

xerxeskingofking wrote:
in a matched play "competitive" game? very unlikely.

same as its now techincally possible to have a full sisters of silence detachment.

However, the option for some crazy narritive/crusade/for the lulz force is nice to have, i suppose, along with the fact that the kroot option ALSO lets to field all the kroot sub-species as "slotless" units, so your not penalised too much for having them (beyond using points on sub-optimal choices)


With the news that Kroot can be a stand alone force? I'm absolutely considering making this for our next Crusade (along about June I expect).
Why?
A) Uniqueness.
Tau, maybe with (some) Kroot? People will certainly field Tau. But I'm almost 100% certain that no one else at the shop will actually do all Kroot.... They aren't competitive enough for many of our players.
B) The challenge.
C) It's a force I don't have.

I've also got no qualms about throwing it against someone in non-tourney matched.

   
Made in us
Never Forget Isstvan!






One of the tau cepts has a buff to auxillery units, so you take that one.

Kroot have HQ's, troops, FA, and Elite so you can certainly run a full army of them. Going to 2k points will be tough though as they are quite cheap and rule of 3 will mean you have to take battalion/patrol to get extra troop slots to fill your points.

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Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

Takes a very special kind of person to have enough patience to deal with that many Kroot kits.

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Trustworthy Shas'vre





Cobleskill

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Takes a very special kind of person to have enough patience to deal with that many Kroot kits.

Or you do what I did and use Ork Shoota boyz as stand ins for Kroot.
As for why? Headcanon. My custom sept were asteroid miners. Kroot can't survive vacuum, while orks can.

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'THE ENEMY!!!'
Racerguy180 wrote:
rules come and go, models are forever...like herpes.
 
   
Made in ca
Fireknife Shas'el






 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Takes a very special kind of person to have enough patience to deal with that many Kroot kits.


Could very well get quite expensive as well. Even though Kroot boxes are cheap enough on a per model basis, 80 Kroot (5 boxes) is still only 480 points.

   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Eihnlazer wrote:
Kroot have HQ's, troops, FA, and Elite so you can certainly run a full army of them. Going to 2k points will be tough though as they are quite cheap and rule of 3 will mean you have to take battalion/patrol to get extra troop slots to fill your points.

Why tough? You could easily convert light vehicles (I'd not take anything heavy or any battlesuit, but converted piranha with all-Kroot crew, or high shaper on a hover drone using ethereal rules, why not?) to pad it a bit. Who says whole army needs to walk?
   
Made in ca
Discriminating Deathmark Assassin





Stasis

 Irbis wrote:
 Eihnlazer wrote:
Kroot have HQ's, troops, FA, and Elite so you can certainly run a full army of them. Going to 2k points will be tough though as they are quite cheap and rule of 3 will mean you have to take battalion/patrol to get extra troop slots to fill your points.

Why tough? You could easily convert light vehicles (I'd not take anything heavy or any battlesuit, but converted piranha with all-Kroot crew, or high shaper on a hover drone using ethereal rules, why not?) to pad it a bit. Who says whole army needs to walk?


Because we've had to proxy things as Kroot for 4 editions, and are tired of it!
We're glad we can finally play the army we started the game with again (assuming Legends), or at least something close.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/30 03:12:51


213PL 60PL 12PL 9-17PL
(she/her) 
   
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Infiltrating Broodlord





United States

So, what would a Kroot only army make up look like?

I'm curious...

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/30 03:50:36


Ayn Rand "We can evade reality, but we cannot evade the consequences of evading reality" 
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka




NE Ohio, USA

 BuFFo wrote:
So, what would a Kroot only army make up look like?

I'm curious...


My guess?
Shaper x3
Kroot character from Blackstone Fortress x1
Maxed out Krootox unit x3
Maxed out Kroot Hound unit x3
Maxed out Gnarloc Rider unit x3
Great Gnarloc x3
Fill in all remaining points with Kroot squads.

Relics, WL traits, strats = ???



   
Made in us
Infiltrating Broodlord





United States

ccs wrote:
 BuFFo wrote:
So, what would a Kroot only army make up look like?

I'm curious...


My guess?
Shaper x3
Kroot character from Blackstone Fortress x1
Maxed out Krootox unit x3
Maxed out Kroot Hound unit x3
Maxed out Gnarloc Rider unit x3
Great Gnarloc x3
Fill in all remaining points with Kroot squads.

Relics, WL traits, strats = ???





Thank you.

Ayn Rand "We can evade reality, but we cannot evade the consequences of evading reality" 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





Denison, Iowa

LOL, I just found the STL files for the "Kroot chicken", if anyone remembers that limited edition FW model. It would be funny to run a bunch of those as a kroothound unit.
   
Made in gb
Boosting Space Marine Biker




Northampton

 BuFFo wrote:
So, what would a Kroot only army make up look like?

I'm curious...


There are 7 potential units you can use in a Kroot army, 2 of which are legends. 1 is unique. and matched play generally Ro3 outside of troops, so the largest you can go by my calculations...

Brigade:

3x Shaper
1x Dahyek Grekh
12x 20 Kroot
3x 12 Kroot hounds
3x 3 Krootox
3x 6 Knarloc roders
3 Great Knarloc.

which is about 2700 points

If you aren't using Legends units you will need to use a battalion and Patrol, and the army will be smaller of course


   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Blndmage wrote:

Because we've had to proxy things as Kroot for 4 editions, and are tired of it!
We're glad we can finally play the army we started the game with again (assuming Legends), or at least something close.

Why tho? No one tells you to proxy battlesuits, light vehicle (or a big monster with 2 gunners) is something that Kroot use in fluff. Ditto with using Ethereal rules, they fit Kroot genetic modifications much more than the stupid concept of Tau becoming immune to bolters because dude in a funny hat (who is melee expert like Kroot and has no guns to make it even fluffier) told them to. If rules fit what the army should be using, it's not really a proxy, it's doing the army justice.
   
Made in us
Shadowy Grot Kommittee Memba






 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Takes a very special kind of person to have enough patience to deal with that many Kroot kits.


...isnt a kroot 6ppm and the kit comes with 16 models?

so like the same kind of person whod make a guard, nids, gsc, etc list?

"Got you, Yugi! Your Rubric Marines can't fall back because I have declared the tertiary kaptaris ka'tah stance two, after the secondary dacatarai ka'tah last turn!"

"So you think, Kaiba! I declared my Thousand Sons the cult of Duplicity, which means all my psykers have access to the Sorcerous Facade power! Furthermore I will spend 8 Cabal Points to invoke Cabbalistic Focus, causing the rubrics to appear behind your custodes! The Vengeance for the Wronged and Sorcerous Fullisade stratagems along with the Malefic Maelstrom infernal pact evoked earlier in the command phase allows me to double their firepower, letting me wound on 2s and 3s!"

"you think it is you who has gotten me, yugi, but it is I who have gotten you! I declare the ever-vigilant stratagem to attack your rubrics with my custodes' ranged weapons, which with the new codex are now DAMAGE 2!!"

"...which leads you straight into my trap, Kaiba, you see I now declare the stratagem Implacable Automata, reducing all damage from your attacks by 1 and triggering my All is Dust special rule!"  
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Still absorbing the new book, but I'm looking forward to fielding an army with a heavy kroot presence (though not a purely kroot force). Their rules seem to make them a pretty solid counter-charge and scoring element that compliments the bad-in-melee elements of your army, but they don't really have the durability or anti-tank needed to win games on their own.

Now, if you give me a Codex: Kroot that fills in a few of their gaps, I'd love to run an all-kroot army for the fluff and modeling opportunities.


ATTENTION
. Psychic tests are unfluffy. Your longing for AV is understandable but misguided. Your chapter doesn't need a separate codex. Doctrines should go away. Being a "troop" means nothing. This has been a cranky service announcement. You may now resume your regularly scheduled arguing.
 
   
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The Great State of New Jersey

Once upon a time I owned 120 kroot, I eventually sold them all. I'm not buying new Kroot until a new kit is released.

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Wargamers hate two things: the state of the game and change.
 
   
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Longtime Dakkanaut





Pure Kroot army will probably be a meme list. But some Kroot should be fine. They are cheap as chips anyway.

Pure kroot army though... feels like it gives up too much of Tau's strengths.

I will say this. If fielding an army of T3 bodies with 6+ saves can win a tournament now, we would have seen CSM lists fielding hordes of cultists already. Because they have Abaddon in addition to make a cultist army fearless. But the fact is, we haven't really seen such lists. And this is despite cultists being even cheaper than Kroot at 5 points a pop.

In the same vein, we haven't seen mass infantry+conscript lists win tournaments either. And IG has the best infantry in 40k, because these get orders, can move move move massive distances and really swarm the board even on turn 1.

I mean, if even a 170 model wrack list couldn't win LVO, that tells you how hard it is. And wracks get 6++ and a 5+++ FNP.

I counted up the number of shots (big and small ones) in my draft new codex Tau army. And it has 200 shots in total (if the whole army gets to shoot).
   
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Eldenfirefly wrote:
Pure Kroot army will probably be a meme list. But some Kroot should be fine. They are cheap as chips anyway.

Pure kroot army though... feels like it gives up too much of Tau's strengths.

I will say this. If fielding an army of T3 bodies with 6+ saves can win a tournament now, we would have seen CSM lists fielding hordes of cultists already. Because they have Abaddon in addition to make a cultist army fearless. But the fact is, we haven't really seen such lists. And this is despite cultists being even cheaper than Kroot at 5 points a pop.

In the same vein, we haven't seen mass infantry+conscript lists win tournaments either. And IG has the best infantry in 40k, because these get orders, can move move move massive distances and really swarm the board even on turn 1.

I mean, if even a 170 model wrack list couldn't win LVO, that tells you how hard it is. And wracks get 6++ and a 5+++ FNP.

I counted up the number of shots (big and small ones) in my draft new codex Tau army. And it has 200 shots in total (if the whole army gets to shoot).


Your end result is probably correct, but the premise of Cultists winning before Kroot while Kroot have Elite and FA options is flawed.

My WHFB armies were Bretonians and Tomb Kings. 
   
 
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