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Looking for clarification on the naming conventions of Militarum Tempestus regiments.

My understanding is that Astra Militarum regiments get named for the planet they come from (e.g. Valhalla) and are divided into companies (which are then divided into platoons, squads, etc.) which are numbered (e.g. Valhallan 49th). The implication is that there is a Valhallan 1st company, followed by the Valhallan 2nd company, and so on for however many companies make up the Astra Militarum regiment of Valhalla.

(This is slightly muddied by the fact that later in the most recent IG codex there's also a reference to the Cadian 180th regiment, which is shown to break down into companies, platoons and squads. I just take this to be because the Cadian Astra Militarum is so big it's arranged one scale bigger than any other regiment, as elsewhere "regiment" seems to refer to the whole thing (so all of the Valhallan Astra Militarum is one regiment), but whatever).

When it comes to Militarum Tempestus regiments though, it seems by implication that there's one entity (the Militarum Tempestus) that's broken down into numbered regiments, rather than that each named regiment is broken down into numbered companies. So, for example, the 133rd Lambdan Lions is not the 133rd company of the Lambdan Lions regiment (of which there would also be a 1st Lambdan Lions, 2nd Lambdan Lions, etc.), but the 133rd Militarum Tempestus regiment, which bears the name "Lambdan Lions". I don't have any direct evidence for this other than the fact that no numbers appear twice in any examples of Militarum Tempestus regiments I can see, nor do any of the names repeat (you never get a 133rd Psian Vipers, or a 130th Lambdan Lions).

Have I got that right?

I think that is not completely correct.

As far as I know the Astra Militarum is devided into Regimentos for each planet (Tallarn, Cadian, Catachan...)
Each Regimento is divided into Regiments (41st Tallarn, 333rd Cadian...)
Each Regiment into Companies (A/B/C..., 1st/2nd/3rd)

At least that is how it is done in the Gaunts Ghosts Novels with Company A-at least H and in the first novel the 1st to 3rd Tanith are mentioned, so 3 regiments for the Regimento Tanith.
Similarly in the Ciaphas Cain Novels we have the Regimento (Valhallan), the regiment (597th) and Companys (1st to 5th).

It also makes sense as any regimento from a hive world most likely raises several thousand regiments with each tithe. I remember doing the maths once... Take a middling hive world of 100 Billion people, assume a military of 1% (equals cold war Western Germany which should not be far of the mark in the setting) = 1 Billion PDF. 10% of those are 100 million soldiers per tithe. In the codex regiments are mentioned to range from 1000-100.000 soldiers, so lets settle for 10.000 for the sake of the argument. That would mean 10.000 regiments per tithe from an average hive world. And assuming around 5 companies per regiment, numbering the companies would not make so much sense.


I always assumed it is similar for the Militarum Tempestus. So the 133rd Lambdan Lions are the 133rd regiment of the Lambdan Lions Regimento and are then devided into several companies.

I had assumed the Scion names referred to their training homeworlds.

With regiments I had assumed as the numbers vary massively it was shorthand for a self contained military group. So the people, gear and logistics to sustain them.

There's simply less lore about the Scions, and so you don't see the repeated numbers, but the Scions roughly follow the organisation of the Guard, with, in my interpretation, less Scions in the regiment (And it's why I call my homebrewed one a Battalion, instead of a Regiment)

Also, Scions are kinda a new thing on the scene. Not to the order of say, Primaris, but certainly new. Before Scions, everyone just had called them Storm Troopers. It wasn't until the Raine books where it actually delved into their lore and kit. The book their talks about their gear, their training, and how they are basically the Best of the Best, trained at the same place as the Commissars. It's funny, because even that book calls them Storm Troopers. No one calls them Scions, maybe it was a marketing thing?

They were featured in the book called Tempestus, the short The Trophy... and that's about it, when it comes to pre-Raine, but post Scion codex appearances, as far as I am aware.

I’ll have a look into the Tempestus codex from 7th edition. See if the answer is there.

Lambdan Lions for example come from a moon surrounding the FW planet of Mezoa. So I doubt it’s a planetary name like the Guard.

I do think there is only a single Militarum Tempestus force still. So using the Lambdan Lions they might likely be the 133rd Militarum Tempestus regiment and earned their own name. Though I think it might be based more on the academy they’re from. Think how schools have their own sport teams today. The west-side bulls, south-side sharks, stuff like that.

My understanding is that the Greek letter part of the regiment name designates the Militarum Tempestus training facility. 'Alphic' regiments are from the Alpha facility, 'Thetoid' regiments are from the Theta facility, and so on.

Numbers are the Xth regiment raised from that particular facility. The 34th Betic Centaurs and the 34th Psian Vipers are each the 34th regiment raised from their respective training facilities (Beta and Psi, obviously).

The animal bit (Eagles, Dragons, Lions and so on) is just an honorific, probably bestowed by the training facility when a new batch of scions are ready to form a new regiment, possibly to indicate some sort of specialism. Dragons might have shown some particular skill with melta weapons (or more broadly anti-armour operations), for example, while Lions might be extra good at quickly improvising battlefield tactics (i.e. a reference to the primarch rather than the long-extinct Terran animal). This is just my speculation, however. It's possible each training facility just cycles through a list of traditional names, so that every 12th regiment are Vipers, or whatever. That's less interesting, but also maybe fits better with the scions' "break down their individuality" training style.

It's a pretty good speculation though. I will include this in my headcanon

As noted, Astra Militarum planets generally produce multiple regiments (with odd examples like the Tanith 1st and Only being due to the destruction of the planet preventing further foundings). Most planets produce dozens or hundreds of regiments. Cadia is not exceptional in this regard. Basically every major planet that has named regiments described in the lore has more than one regiment noted.

Regiments are very variable in size, with specialist and battle-depleted regiments forming around three companies or so at the low end (roughly equivalent to a single real-world battalion in number). The Cadian 180th is an example of this- it has a handful of companies due to combat losses, if I remember correctly. Regiments that shrink below this strength generally get merged with other mauled regiments to create larger units again, or get attached to other regiments as veteran support rather than operating as independent tactical units.

Cadian regiments at full strength have around 20-30 companies. The Cadian 8th infantry regiment (according to the 3.5th edition Imperial Guard codex) had ~24 companies at full muster. The FW order of battle for a Cadian mechanised regiment had a similar number of companies. This equates to ~8,000 troopers, and regiments in this ballpark seem to be the most common. Another example is the Semtexian Bombardiers 3rd regiment, which had 17 companies at initial muster, with a further 4 companies raised late and shipped into the warzone late (so presumably intended to be 21 companies at muster). Most people round this up to 10,000 for estimates, and I think that is a reasonable average regimental size.

At the upper end, there have been Valhallan regiments described as having over 100,000 soldiers, which is enormous. This does not appear to be common though. Valhalla has still produced hundreds of unique regiments based on the mentioned numbers, which is an impressive number of troopers.

Valhallans do mass infantry more than any other Guard Regiment. It's not that they don't use tanks or mechanised, they just prefer it.

 Duskweaver wrote:
My understanding is that the Greek letter part of the regiment name designates the Militarum Tempestus training facility. 'Alphic' regiments are from the Alpha facility, 'Thetoid' regiments are from the Theta facility, and so on.

Numbers are the Xth regiment raised from that particular facility. The 34th Betic Centaurs and the 34th Psian Vipers are each the 34th regiment raised from their respective training facilities (Beta and Psi, obviously).

The animal bit (Eagles, Dragons, Lions and so on) is just an honorific, probably bestowed by the training facility when a new batch of scions are ready to form a new regiment, possibly to indicate some sort of specialism. Dragons might have shown some particular skill with melta weapons (or more broadly anti-armour operations), for example, while Lions might be extra good at quickly improvising battlefield tactics (i.e. a reference to the primarch rather than the long-extinct Terran animal). This is just my speculation, however. It's possible each training facility just cycles through a list of traditional names, so that every 12th regiment are Vipers, or whatever. That's less interesting, but also maybe fits better with the scions' "break down their individuality" training style.

I like this. But is there any evidence suggesting Greek letters survived into 40k?

Jarms48 wrote:

 Duskweaver wrote:
My understanding is that the Greek letter part of the regiment name designates the Militarum Tempestus training facility. 'Alphic' regiments are from the Alpha facility, 'Thetoid' regiments are from the Theta facility, and so on.

Numbers are the Xth regiment raised from that particular facility. The 34th Betic Centaurs and the 34th Psian Vipers are each the 34th regiment raised from their respective training facilities (Beta and Psi, obviously).

The animal bit (Eagles, Dragons, Lions and so on) is just an honorific, probably bestowed by the training facility when a new batch of scions are ready to form a new regiment, possibly to indicate some sort of specialism. Dragons might have shown some particular skill with melta weapons (or more broadly anti-armour operations), for example, while Lions might be extra good at quickly improvising battlefield tactics (i.e. a reference to the primarch rather than the long-extinct Terran animal). This is just my speculation, however. It's possible each training facility just cycles through a list of traditional names, so that every 12th regiment are Vipers, or whatever. That's less interesting, but also maybe fits better with the scions' "break down their individuality" training style.

I like this. But is there any evidence suggesting Greek letters survived into 40k?

Just like Low Gothic would not be English and High Gothic would not be pseudo Latin, they are just stand-ins for whatever language they speak in the far future. 10,000 years is all of recorded history. So in another 10,000 years who knows.

The current lore is kinda all over the place, with Storm Trooper being synonymous with Scion, and vice versa. They are just Hyper Elite Soldiers with super special gear. Which begs the question to me, why weren't they made into Assassins or given to the Astartes as candidates? Or the Sororitas, as many of them are female? I never understood the dividing line between sufficiently superior human talent and gear, and the Sororitas or the Assasin program. Do I recall correctly that Assassins are "made" and Scions are taken from general human stock?

Assassins are taken from the Schola as well. Sororitas only take the most faithful girls and Astartes do their own recruitment as they are largely independent of the Imperium.

Also, Astarte numbers are restricted by the High Lords for fears of another HH.

Jarms48 wrote:
Also, Astarte numbers are restricted by the High Lords for fears of another HH.

Not quite.
Guilliman broke the Legions down into Chapters to prevent control of a Legion under one commander. Of course, this doesn't work because the political and cultural weight a First Founding Chapter can throw around means that 9/10 times a Successor will submit operational authority to a Founder.
The High Lords are nominally the only body that can authorise a new Founding however, the Grey Knights and Sons of Medusa were both created outwith the Founding system by special decrees. There is also the possibility of a Chapter splitting during a crisis and two new Chapters being formed from the ashes, and due to the nature of Imperial bureaucracy these new Chapters are just assumed to have always existed.
Chapters can also declare a Crusade at which point they may increase their numbers to account for casualties while on extended deployment. This is how the Black Templars avoid the Codex restrictions as upon the Chapter's founding its first Chapter Master, Sigismund, declared an Eternal Crusade.

But as for the point about the Schola giving orphans to the Astartes, the Schola is under the command of the Administratum and the Administratum isn't going to give up valuable resources to forces that generally don't serve its needs. Sure the Astartes might show up and help but it's the Astra Militarum that does most of the work in the Imperium, so why should the future elite of the Militarum go to the Astartes?

EDIT

FezzikDaBullgryn wrote:
The current lore is kinda all over the place, with Storm Trooper being synonymous with Scion, and vice versa.

Scions are the evolution/rebranding of the old Stormtrooper Regiment.

That does not nor has it ever been suggested to replace or remove carapace armored, heavy lasgun wielding specialist troopers.

Jarms48 wrote:
But is there any evidence suggesting Greek letters survived into 40k?

Look closely...