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Made in gb
Liberated Grot Land Raida






Northern Ireland

Ahoy!

Welcome to a new P&M blog where I attempt to build a small fleet of WW2 era ships to use in little air combat games where my (ever growing selection of) 1:300 scale WW2 planes can attempt to score dive-bombing hits, Torpedo hits, possibly even kamikaze hits if things are getting that desperate.

Now obviously if I were attempting to make ships at 1:300 scale to be in scale with the planes they’d be MASSIVE. Even at half the scale they’d be too big for tabletop gaming use. So I suppose what I want is something about an inch long for a frigate or maybe up to 5 inches long for a really big battleship or carrier. That way they’ll fit neatly onto my hex board and the little planes can fly rings around them all day.

So what to do? I could buy some little boats if I can guess the scale correctly but who has cash for that? I’m flat broke and gaming on a budget is how I roll. So it’s off to the tool-box for a rummage to try and rustle up some scrap materials to scratch-build my gaming dreams into reality.



So first thing was to lay down some lollipop-stick keels (just like they used to do in the early 20th Century) Here we have a couple of really big ones for a battleship and a carrier, one smaller Cruiser sized ship, two destroyers and three submarines. Then I’ve also made three convoy transports to target too. I’ve begun to fill some of them out with milliput already. Starting with the cargo ships to get a feel for it before I tackle the larger ones.

Just think of all the possible scenarios we could play with some of these on the table!

Hope you’ll join me as I build my fleet and launch them into action.


This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2022/09/24 17:38:28


   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Very nice start.

I do wonder if a less-pricey air-dry clay could work for this, save the milliput (along with brass rod and other doodads) for detailing?

CHAOS! PANIC! DISORDER!
My job here is done. 
   
Made in gb
Liberated Grot Land Raida






Northern Ireland

Nah I’ve got an old box of the stuff sitting here drying out and I’m happy that it’s reasonably suitable for the job and won’t crumble to bits on me.

Here’s the first of the cargo ships almost built.

Some spru bits, plasticard, staples and paper clip wire.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/09/23 12:19:20


   
Made in gb
Fighter Ace





Edinburgh

That looks really good!

   
Made in gb
Liberated Grot Land Raida






Northern Ireland

Cheers Ragsta. Thanks too Vulcan.

Here’s some progress on the next two.

The second convoy ship and one of the submarines both coming together.

   
Made in gb
Liberated Grot Land Raida






Northern Ireland

Here’s my progress so far.

Three convoy ships more or less completed and three submarines done. The putty hulls of both destroyers have also been smooshed onto the lollipop keels.


Apologies to anyone who knows anything about WW2 ships. These are the product of a mix photo reference, material necessity and imagination, and likely don’t bare any resemblance to any ship that ever sailed.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/09/25 09:38:51


   
Made in gb
Hurr! Ogryn Bone 'Ead!




chigwell, essex

these are wonderful.will watch this like a hawk!
   
Made in us
The Marine Standing Behind Marneus Calgar





Upstate, New York

I was going to ask if these were going to be from a specific nation, but you answered that in your last post. Some navies had pretty different build philosophies, with corresponding visual distinctions.

Those are coming along quite nicely. Full speed ahead!

   
Made in gb
Liberated Grot Land Raida






Northern Ireland

More shipmates! Welcome Aboard!

I have been planning these for quite some time, or rather pondering the notion that it would be nice to have some little ships. In preparation for this I had purchased a few bits along with my aircraft along the way including.


A life raft full of survivors. Could be from a downed bomber or a sunk vessel. I have three of these.


Man overboard! Or more likely a downed fighter pilot in need of a lift home.


Torpedos in the water. Could be launched by submarine in the Atlantic or by a Swordfish over Taranto harbour.



And then anyone who’s been following my collection over the years will know there are any number of maritime patrols, ship-launched spotters and air-sea rescue planes that could play a role in one of these games.



If you have any ideas for playable scenarios, especially ones with interesting historical context, I’d be very interested to hear them.

   
Made in us
Armored Iron Breaker




Charlotte, NC

For starters they do look good for what you are using them for. Originally I was thinking that a scale model of matching ships like the USS Enterprise would be about 2'7" which is not that large to model. Then I need to keep in mind that flight operations make things a lot smaller at 10,000 feet. You would have to have your planes flying on a third story in order to have everything to scale. If all that you are doing is dog fighting, then these little ships are perfect for the job.

My Hobby Blog: https://tinylegions.blogspot.com/

http://www.classichammer.com- New Games with old Rules 
   
Made in us
The Marine Standing Behind Marneus Calgar





Upstate, New York

Going to do any periscope depth submarines? It would be useful to have “hidden” markers for any sub-hunt scenario.

Or have 3 tiers:

Blank counters (open sea) with numbers on the flip side for possible submarine locations.
Periscope counter for detected, but still running silent.
And the actual sub mini for active/attacking.

Thinking about it, you could probably combine the first two. Scenario is the basic one side blind. The sub player knows which token is the correct one, the opposing player is trying to figure out which one it is before it can attack/escape.

   
Made in gb
Liberated Grot Land Raida






Northern Ireland

I like the idea of a periscope depth marker. It should probably be a thing and would likely come into effect but I’d need to think of how best to work it into the game.

The funny thing is I’m really thinking primarily of an air-combat game but with these ships as objectives/scenario pieces.

I do envisage submarine attacks on convoys with beaufighter patrols trying to sink the subs. But having never played a naval combat game I’m not sure how best to incorporate the naval ship-on-ship action.

   
Made in us
The Marine Standing Behind Marneus Calgar





Upstate, New York

 theCrowe wrote:
I like the idea of a periscope depth marker. It should probably be a thing and would likely come into effect but I’d need to think of how best to work it into the game.

The funny thing is I’m really thinking primarily of an air-combat game but with these ships as objectives/scenario pieces.

I do envisage submarine attacks on convoys with beaufighter patrols trying to sink the subs. But having never played a naval combat game I’m not sure how best to incorporate the naval ship-on-ship action.


If you want to keep it air focused, you can just ignore ship-to-ship stuff. The pilot’s job is to find the sub before it gets into attack position. Just assume that if it gets there, the convoy gets sunk, mission fail.

   
Made in gb
Liberated Grot Land Raida






Northern Ireland

Yeah that might work though the sad demise of the convoy would be less spectacular happening off stage. I like the idea of subs hitting the convoy though.
How’s this for a scenario? Let’s say the convoy moves at full steam ahead 3 hexes per turn. The subs are trying to get into position but thanks to intercepted radio signals swiftly decoded, Coastal Command have dispatched a Sunderland to attempt to save the convoy.

Thee ships, three boats and a depth-charge dropping patrol plane.

   
Made in us
The Marine Standing Behind Marneus Calgar





Upstate, New York

I’m not familiar with air combat games, so have no idea what core mechanics you are working with.

Scenario sounds like a plan though. Mission building generally need to start as a rough draft, and then play and tweak until it feels right.

   
Made in gb
Mad Gyrocopter Pilot





Northumberland

Wow these are brilliant.

I hear yer a scale modeller now father.

One and a half feet in the hobby


My Painting Log of various minis:
# Olthannon's Oscillating Orchard of Opportunity #

 
   
Made in gb
Liberated Grot Land Raida






Northern Ireland

 Olthannon wrote:
Wow these are brilliant.

I hear yer a scale modeller now father.


Cheers Olthannon. Love Father Ted. Glad that one didn’t miss.

Spoiler:
In fact my paraphrasing of Father Ted quotes in a gaming context goes way back and on one occasion a long time Dakka hero by the name of Buttery Commisar produced this one.



This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/09/25 22:36:05


   
Made in ca
Fixture of Dakka





Surrey, BC - Canada

Wonderful work there theCrowe.

Cheers,

CB

   
Made in gb
Liberated Grot Land Raida






Northern Ireland

Thanks Cap. Your oft messages of encouragement are like digital high fives.

Progress for tonight.


Clamped the belt sander to the workbench and saved me oodles of time shaping these hulls with a small hand file. Don’t try this at home kids!


Time saved to get my first Destroyer almost complete.

   
Made in gb
Liberated Grot Land Raida






Northern Ireland

My two destroyers are complete.







And here’s the whole fleet so far.

   
Made in gb
Mad Gyrocopter Pilot





Northumberland

 theCrowe wrote:


Spoiler:
In fact my paraphrasing of Father Ted quotes in a gaming context goes way back and on one occasion a long time Dakka hero by the name of Buttery Commisar produced this one.






Eee man that's superb

"Are you sure you won't have this cake commissar? It's got daemon blood in it!"

"What?!"

"No not daemon blood, what are those things called? Raisins"

Father Ted is just one of those shows which is unmissable. Nothing comes close to it.

Great updates there. Is it just XPS foam you're using?

One and a half feet in the hobby


My Painting Log of various minis:
# Olthannon's Oscillating Orchard of Opportunity #

 
   
Made in gb
Liberated Grot Land Raida






Northern Ireland

I’m using Icelolly sticks, milliput, XPS foam, paper clips, plastic sprue, cable ties, kids air-dry plastic clay stuff, paper, string, plasticard and lots of superglue.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/09/30 17:25:10


   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Looking good. Nice generic ships that can work for any faction.

CHAOS! PANIC! DISORDER!
My job here is done. 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





Ships with significant AAA presence could have a radius of "dangerous airspace" around them, representing airspace being saturated with flak. A hazard for both hostile and friendly aircraft to fly into.
   
Made in gb
Liberated Grot Land Raida






Northern Ireland

Thanks Vulcan.

Yes, Hank. An idea might be to have a zone of every one surrounding hex for smaller destroyers and maybe two hexes for the bigger battleships and cruiser.

My game rules have always been a D6 roll of a 6 for a successful AA hit. Which would make a full length straff on a battleship a fairly risky prospect. I may have to colour code the painting of the ships to mark specific zones for AA positions. Say a blue dot per AA gun to limit the amount of flack appropriately.

The other thing I was thinking was the difference between a straffing run, a dive bombing attack, a depth-charge attack and a torpedo drop. I can see ships trying to manoeuvre to avoid presenting a wide target to an oncoming torpedo bomber or trying to do the opposite to avoid giving a dive bomber a good long area for their bombing run.

But timing for shipping movement compared to aircraft movement may be tricky.

Lots to think about.

Never mind the fact that I haven’t gotten any further with my cruiser build.

   
Made in gb
Liberated Grot Land Raida






Northern Ireland

The fleet is growing. My heavy cruiser has left the slip-way.


   
Made in gb
Mad Gyrocopter Pilot





Northumberland

 theCrowe wrote:
I’m using Icelolly sticks, milliput, XPS foam, paper clips, plastic sprue, cable ties, kids air-dry plastic clay stuff, paper, string, plasticard and lots of superglue.


My fault, I meant to say "is it just XPS foam you are using on the bottom" I did suspect that there was more to it than foam! It's a hell of a list and it really looks great. Nice work on the heavy cruiser!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/10/10 18:14:51


One and a half feet in the hobby


My Painting Log of various minis:
# Olthannon's Oscillating Orchard of Opportunity #

 
   
Made in gb
[MOD]
Villanous Scum







Another cool thread Crowe!
Lovely little ships, wish my eyes worked well enough to scratch build at that scale. Look forward to seeing more/paint/games etc.

On parle toujours mal quand on n'a rien à dire. 
   
Made in gb
Liberated Grot Land Raida






Northern Ireland

Thanks ing, I’m being a bit of a hobby butterfly these days. Got two figures on the painting block for the monthly challenge, just done sculpting a sheep and some imps for kids, trying to complete my airplanes and write-up for Polish Airforce Part 2 and also sculpting a cocker spaniel archer, not to mention making my little ships. Flip, I wonder do I ever do anything but hobby?!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 Olthannon wrote:
 theCrowe wrote:
I’m using Icelolly sticks, milliput, XPS foam, paper clips, plastic sprue, cable ties, kids air-dry plastic clay stuff, paper, string, plasticard and lots of superglue.


My fault, I meant to say "is it just XPS foam you are using on the bottom" I did suspect that there was more to it than foam! It's a hell of a list and it really looks great. Nice work on the heavy cruiser!



Thanks Olthannon. The stick bases really just set the shape and carry the milliput hull. I’ll roughly shape the putty and leave it to set before I hit it on the belt sander to try and get some nice smooth curves and flat lines.

Then I’ll use XPS foam to cut tiny blocks to shape based on some photos. I’ve got some round things and sprue plastic that gets chopped up for funnels and turrets and wire for masts and guns. I’m also using some small cable ties for the racks of depth charges at the back. Paper and string too where possible in the rigging.

Got the last two big ships laid down in putty, so hopefully they’ll come together soon.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/10/10 21:08:24


   
Made in gb
Liberated Grot Land Raida






Northern Ireland

The big battleship is now starting to take shape.



It’s taking much longer than the other smaller ones. I can see why they don’t build these monsters anymore.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The build on the big battleship is complete.

Here she is alongside the heavy cruiser and one of the destroyers.




Just the carrier to complete now. That’ll be something a bit different.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/10/15 19:10:41


   
 
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