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Made in gb
Battleship Captain




So: quick query.

The Agent of the Imperium rule is as follows:


If your army is Battle-forged, you can include one AGENT OF THE IMPERIUM unit in each IMPERIUM (excluding FALLEN units) Patrol, Battalion and Brigade Detachment in your army without those units taking up slots in those Detachments. The inclusion of an AGENT OF THE IMPERIUM unit does not prevent other units from their Detachment benefiting from Detachment abilities (e.g. Chapter Tactics, Defenders of Humanity etc.), and it does not prevent other units from your army benefiting from abilities that require every model in your army to have that ability (e.g. Combat Doctrines). An AGENT OF THE IMPERIUM unit included in a Patrol, Battalion or Brigade Detachment in this manner is ignored for any rules that state all units from that Detachment must have at least one Faction keyword in common (e.g. in a matched play game), and when determining your Army Faction.


Now, that's pretty clear that I can only include one AGENT OF THE IMPERIUM without taking up a detachment slot. Fine.

But can I field a detachment with one AGENT that doesn't use a slot and then a bunch of other AGENTS that do?

For the sake of example: a rogue trader and voidsmen.

The rogue trader can be chosen to take up no slot, can I put the voidsmen at arms in free troop slots? Obviously they can't be in compulsory slots because of their unit rule, but can I still take them as troop choices 4 through 6 and claim AGENT OF THE IMPERIUM means they're ignored for faction-related detachment special rules?


Termagants expended for the Hive Mind: ~2835
 
   
Made in us
Confessor Of Sins





Tacoma, WA, USA

No. Please note the two highlighted sentences:
Agent of the Imperium wrote:If your army is Battle-forged, you can include one AGENT OF THE IMPERIUM unit in each IMPERIUM (excluding FALLEN units) Patrol, Battalion and Brigade Detachment in your army without those units taking up slots in those Detachments. The inclusion of an AGENT OF THE IMPERIUM unit does not prevent other units from their Detachment benefiting from Detachment abilities (e.g. Chapter Tactics, Defenders of Humanity etc.), and it does not prevent other units from your army benefiting from abilities that require every model in your army to have that ability (e.g. Combat Doctrines). An AGENT OF THE IMPERIUM unit included in a Patrol, Battalion or Brigade Detachment in this manner is ignored for any rules that state all units from that Detachment must have at least one Faction keyword in common (e.g. in a matched play game), and when determining your Army Faction.
This means you cannot include more than one Agent of the Imperium unit on a detachment unless those units have a common Faction keyword with the rest of the detachment (with the normal exclusions).

So you could in theory create a Navis Imperialis detachment with Cartographia Rogue Traders, Voidsmen-At-Arms, and Imperial Navy Breachers, you would lack a legal HQ choice due to the CRT being fobidden from being in a compulsory detachment slot.
   
Made in us
Tzeentch Aspiring Sorcerer Riding a Disc






Southern New Hampshire

So basically, GW screwed up being able to take all the Starstriders together.

"There are no problems that cannot be solved with cannons." - Chief Engineer Boris Krauss of Nuln

Kid_Kyoto wrote:"Don't be a dick" and "This is a family wargame" are good rules of thumb.


DR:80S++G++M--B+IPwhfb01#+D+++A+++/fWD258R++T(D)DM+++
 
   
Made in us
Stealthy Warhound Titan Princeps






Spoiler:
I don't see anything that stops you from taking multiple AGENTS OF THE IMPERIUM units in one detachment, just only 1 unit per detachment can optionally not use a slot in that detachment.

For example, I could take a Space Marine Captain, a Librarian, and a Chaplain, plus 3 units of tactical marines and 2 units of Voidsmen-at-arms and the Rogue Trader unit, with the Rogue Trader unit not using a slot.


Nope, I was wrong, I get it now, I think.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/10/01 01:14:04


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Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




It is better to die for the Emperor then to live for one's self!....j/k = p
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut



Glasgow

You take a navis imperialis patrol (which counts as an astra cartographica detatchment)

1 rouge trader

1 unit of voidsmen

2 units of either voidsmen or navy breachers

1 agent of the imperium unit


I think the point people get stuck on is that an astra cartagraphica detatchment is not the same as an astra cartagraphica detatchment

(A detatchment where all units have the astra cartagraphica keyword)

(A detatchment with atleast two astra cartagraphica units and no units other than astra cartagraphic agent of the imperium or unaligned)

The rouge trader can be taken in the above as an hq because all voidsmen or navy breachers have the agent keyword and so you only need to make it an astra cartographica detatchment which one unit of voidsman +Rouge trader is.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2022/10/07 00:22:22


 
   
Made in gb
Battleship Captain




That's what I'm asking - the wording of agent of the imperium doesn't seem to get you around the rule that all units in a Patrol must be of the same faction.

The rule has a specific exception for slot-less agents, but they obviously can't be used to fill a compulsory slot, and for that matter the troops version of voidsmen, and breachers can only be compulsory troops if it's declared to be a NAVIS IMPERIALIS detachment which that isn't.

Termagants expended for the Hive Mind: ~2835
 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut



Glasgow

They are the same faction they all have navis imperialis

It is a navis imperialis detatchment

If you meet the above It is also an astra cartagraphica detatchment


Unfortunately I just noticed that rule

Master and Commander: If your army is Battle-forged, you can include a maximum of one Cartographica Rogue Trader model in each Detachment in your army.
This model cannot be taken in a compulsory Battlefield Role slot.

so your short an hq
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut





My first attempt at getting around that rule was to take a Inquisitor as the required HQ choice. The Agent of the Imperium rule got in the way.

It does look like the Agent of the Imperium rule does not apply to Vanguard and other similar detachments. So for a navis imperialis army we would need to take a Inquisitor and 3 assassins, then we can fill out with navy troopers and a RT.
   
Made in us
Confessor Of Sins





Tacoma, WA, USA

This doesn’t work because the Inquistor and Assassins lack the Agent of the Imperium faction keyword. They have it as a non-Faction keyword.

Oh, GW
   
 
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