Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

SamusDrake wrote:
As the Acastus provides firepower to rival a titan, maybe the Rapier is the titan's answer to the speedy-melee advantage of the knights?

That would fit in with the rumour the Raiper is supposed to represent the uncorrupted Questor and Subjugator Slaanesh Scout Titans. A pair of powerclaws would do some work:

 zedmeister wrote:
To be honest, we're not going to see another Titan release until at least the next book so January at the earliest. The next Engine Kill will probably have a teaser.

These knights are to fill the gaps. Shame they haven't done some of the more esoteric Titan Weapons or even just a Reaver Carapace Plasma Blastgun for example or the Saturnyne Lascutter for the Warlord

We could see a new warbringer anytime seeing as they've shown it with other arm weapons.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 zedmeister wrote:

SamusDrake wrote:
As the Acastus provides firepower to rival a titan, maybe the Rapier is the titan's answer to the speedy-melee advantage of the knights?

That would fit in with the rumour the Raiper is supposed to represent the uncorrupted Questor and Subjugator Slaanesh Scout Titans. A pair of powerclaws would do some work:

Yeah if it was cc for arms and center gun it'd be cool. In terms of reactor and shield track, it'd have to be the same as warhound or risk being too light imo.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

SamusDrake wrote:

 Crablezworth wrote:

I dunno, I find warlords too unwieldly most of the time, so warbringer has certainly become my preference over warlord. Rapier sounds cool but warhound is about as light a titan as I want, unless it's just the same as a warhound with lighter armour/faster movement. Something conceiveable between warhound and reaver but I dunno.

Thats a good point as the Warhound and Acastus make up that fine line between titan and knight. As the Acastus provides firepower to rival a titan, maybe the Rapier is the titan's answer to the speedy-melee advantage of the knights?

A titan between the hound and reaver would be ideal. The reaver and hounds are our preferred titans but we'd like another option. If such a titan is released and uses weapons from either the Warhound or Reaver, we'll be pleased.

Glad to hear you have taken a shine to the Warbringer. Its point value is still steep( for a low point game ) but its stats do look good. Was hoping its price would have been inbetween the Reaver and Warlord, but sadly not to be. Still, its one we keep in mind just incase...

I've liked the warbringer more since upgrading the top to belicossa volcano cannon.

Gotta love that "Wind in the Willows" look. If the update looks anything like that its going to be called "Toad of Toad Hall" when painted.

Atropos Knights next week from Forgeworld

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/12/06/sunday-preview-underhive-brains-and-underground-games/

Probably 40 quid a pair.

 zedmeister wrote:

SamusDrake wrote:
As the Acastus provides firepower to rival a titan, maybe the Rapier is the titan's answer to the speedy-melee advantage of the knights?

That would fit in with the rumour the Raiper is supposed to represent the uncorrupted Questor and Subjugator Slaanesh Scout Titans. A pair of powerclaws would do some work:

A power-clawed Scout Titan would be wonderful for my Audax. Not sure that we're going to get that, but I'd absolutely love it and my opponents would probably...not.

That it then, the last of the Forge World knights. Only things that remain from the Imperial Knights book are the Questoris Preceptor and the two Dominus class.

Not sure the preceptor will see the light of day since it’s literally an Errant but with a worse gun and a special rule for buffing Warmigers, which also aren’t appearing.

So maybe just the Dominus as a plastic kit, with one of each class and we can finally get to some new Titans?

There’s still the Asterius to come...

And a 2nd version of the Nemesis Warbringer. But yeah uncharted seas on the horizon

Fingers crossed for Chaos and/or Xenos!

I’d really love to know the volume of sales of resin knight kits and plastic knight kits.

I'm beginning to wonder if there's a creative reason for no other Titan designs out (and a preponderance of Knights).

After all, a new Titan design is something their creative team would want to get right. Perhaps it's caught up in revisions and approvals...

There're still no melee focused Titan in the game. There're easy spot for new Titans, just not much.

Design wise the whole line is outdated as Titans carry less guns than tiny Imperium vehicle. That's why Imperial Knight can outgun Titans so easily, because they're not outdated.

 schoon wrote:
I'm beginning to wonder if there's a creative reason for no other Titan designs out (and a preponderance of Knights).

After all, a new Titan design is something their creative team would want to get right. Perhaps it's caught up in revisions and approvals...

My guess is the general state of 2020 combined with the Indomitus release probably played hell with the production schedule. I reckon they've got 1-2 designs either laid down in tooling or on the drawing board, but are stuck in a queue somewhere.

Release for this game had been slow since 2019 (AI release) and had nothing to do with 2020. They showed plastic upgrade sprue for Questoris and in interview said plastic acheron and castigator was done but release the questoris upgrade 6 months later, and Cerastus knight in 2020.

AI eat all the manpower and resource needed for AT, and AI got lots of release in such short window of time.

Chopstick wrote:
There're still no melee focused Titan in the game. There're easy spot for new Titans, just not much.

Design wise the whole line is outdated as Titans carry less guns than tiny Imperium vehicle. That's why Imperial Knight can outgun Titans so easily, because they're not outdated.

Wut?

Reavers can focus on melee and do it well, though I do agree it would be funky to see one precisely meant for melee.

Titan guns blast other vehicles to bits and knights do not outgun titans in any way outside the Acastii, who have borked rules disconnected from their fluff. Every other type of knight gets plastered over the nearest wall in a shoot-out with the big fellas.

They can just start releasing the Titan Legions / Space Marine weapons if they want to give further specialisations to existing chasis types

 Sherrypie wrote:

Chopstick wrote:
There're still no melee focused Titan in the game. There're easy spot for new Titans, just not much.

Design wise the whole line is outdated as Titans carry less guns than tiny Imperium vehicle. That's why Imperial Knight can outgun Titans so easily, because they're not outdated.

Wut?

Titan guns blast other vehicles to bits and knights do not outgun titans in any way outside the Acastii, who have borked rules disconnected from their fluff. Every other type of knight gets plastered over the nearest wall in a shoot-out with the big fellas.

Avenger Gatling cannon power were nerfed, even though this thing have the same caliber round as the titan vulcan cannon because it'll be too much for a titan to handle (easy fluffy rule fix without nerfing the gun into being useless)

A single Questoris carry 4 guns, 5 if you also count the other anti-infantry only weapons on RFBC and Avenger. A Leman russ have 4 guns. The biggest battle machine ever made have 2/3/4+4 guns. The Warbringer was made recently so at least they have some sense to put 2 Hydra turret and 3 Anti infantry turret on it, but it's still a puny amount guns for a Titan. Dominus and new primaris tanks pack so much firepower it make the titan look embarrassingly bad, like a thing forever stuck in the past.

An equally pointed banner of knight have enough firepower to out gun any Titans, if you count fluff the Doom of molech start with banners of Knight errant blasting an Emperor titan to bits by attacking its reactor.

Not only that but Titan without support by knight/secutarii and air force are extremely vulnerable to boarding and air strike due to lack of turrets and anti air, T'au force destroyed a warhound in a single dive with a AX-1-0, meanwhile in one of the Titan comic a genestealer(or maybe a gaunt) manage to breach into the hull of a warlord and almost butcher the whole crew (actually one of the other titan got boarded and infested by nid) This should not have been a thing if they redesign the titan to modern standard.

In art, and probably some book, warhound was depicted with gun in their mouth, decade later and there're still no such thing in any kit.

TL: DR : modernize the titans so a tiny tank don't have more guns than it.

So, more guns is just flat out better huh? I'm guessing you're pretty pleased that every new vehicle design from GW has a minimum of 9 stubber variants stuck on it before it can progress past the concept phase.

 Mr_Rose wrote:
That it then, the last of the Forge World knights. Only things that remain from the Imperial Knights book are the Questoris Preceptor and the two Dominus class.

Not sure the preceptor will see the light of day since it’s literally an Errant but with a worse gun and a special rule for buffing Warmigers, which also aren’t appearing.

So maybe just the Dominus as a plastic kit, with one of each class and we can finally get to some new Titans?

If they were willing to to a swarm base, similar to rippers and scarabs in 40k, I reckon you could just about squeeze armigers in.

 schoon wrote:
I'm beginning to wonder if there's a creative reason for no other Titan designs out (and a preponderance of Knights).

After all, a new Titan design is something their creative team would want to get right. Perhaps it's caught up in revisions and approvals...

I mean what do you call the Warbringer if not a new titan design?

I disagree that titans need a lot more guns. They are more like post Dreadnought battleships with multiple heavy gun mounts and point defense compared to Knights, which carry a larger mix of various smaller calibre guns.

I would like to see the Warhound and Reaver pick up some point defense though like the warlord and Warbringer carry. It would be pretty easy to mount a pair of mauler bolters on the reaver, say on the forward side of the shoulders where they merge into the body, just below the shoulder plates. On the warhound, either on the chin or a rear mounted mauler would be nice.

Rules wise, the lascannons on the 40k warlord need to go back to 2 shots. Why did they drop to 1?

Well, since the Reaver got its variant box (Jan 2019?) to finish off the big three chassis, I *think* Knights have had five new kits to the Titans' two. Titans received a lot of weapon bits during that time also, but I don't think it's unreasonable for people to feel that Titans have been taking a backseat for a while now. Clearly there isn't going to be a new Titan every quarter, mind you.

I still say the issue is clearly about manufacturing capacity during COVID and other games getting priority...even within SG. It's highly possible that we would have had the Warbringer variant by now if times were normal. I'd lay money that they have completed Titan designs that are sitting on ice.

Whatever the new Titan designs end up looking like, I hope they don’t follow this trend of sticking guns on every available surface.

The newer 40k Knights look horrible imho, with guns stuck all over the shoulders, armpits and back. Every new marine vehicle gets countless grenade/missile launchers and stubbers stuck all over the chassis. It’s horrible design.

 Nostromodamus wrote:
Whatever the new Titan designs end up looking like, I hope they don’t follow this trend of sticking guns on every available surface.

The newer 40k Knights look horrible imho, with guns stuck all over the shoulders, armpits and back. Every new marine vehicle gets countless grenade/missile launchers and stubbers stuck all over the chassis. It’s horrible design.

Reminds me of my toy soldier converting philosophy when I was 14.

"So, how do we make this better? More guns, or bigger guns?"

"Why not both??"

All that said, I think the Dominus Knights (if that's what you mean by 'Newer Knights') in 40K look fine. Better than the Questoris even.

I, too, am dismayed by this trend of sticking guns everywhere. The ridiculous overgunning of models in the last 10 or so years is the basis for 40k's crappy gameplay.

 gorgon wrote:
Well, since the Reaver got its variant box (Jan 2019?) to finish off the big three chassis, I *think* Knights have had five new kits to the Titans' two. Titans received a lot of weapon bits during that time also, but I don't think it's unreasonable for people to feel that Titans have been taking a backseat for a while now. Clearly there isn't going to be a new Titan every quarter, mind you.

In that case the Titans are enjoying the back seat of a Limousine!

Chopstick wrote:

 Sherrypie wrote:

Chopstick wrote:
like a thing forever stuck in the past.

isn't that kinda supposed to be the point? the Mechanicum is abhorrent to change and since the titans predate most everything else in the Imperial Arsenal, they see no reason to improve upon that which is Godlike. I would rather them have a sort of FNP/plus 1 to voids to regular knight class weapons.

JWBS wrote:They can just start releasing the Titan Legions / Space Marine weapons if they want to give further specialisations to existing chasis types

I would be 1000% down for this

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
I disagree that titans need a lot more guns. They are more like post Dreadnought battleships with multiple heavy gun mounts and point defense compared to Knights, which carry a larger mix of various smaller calibre guns.

Funny you brought that up because Battleships carry A LOT OF GUNS. This isn't "toy maker's philosophy" this is common sense, if something is big, it need defense to cover the weak spot, and to make up for the huge size. Otherwise we'll just stick to fast moving vehicle or aircraft with 1 or 2 big guns.

A resdesign solve the problem of adding new Titan chasis because every new chasis will be comapred to the trio-OG titans. Why is warbringer have AA while warlord didn't have any? Warbringer have 3 underside turrets, and WL have 4, shouldn't Reaver have 2 and Warhound have 1 by that logic?

And then you realized that they had to remove the Vulcan bolter from the arioch claw for this game because it'd be too good, why can't any other weapons ultilize this sub-weapon system like that? I'm surprised people was ok with "pretending a gun didn't exist" for balance instead of having thing properly designed so we can reenact a proper titan battle without "rules patch" for "balance reason". And maybe we can even play with aircrafts too, because all titans would have AA.

But it look like another 20 years+ before the resin mold at FW broke and they had to make a new titans design for the OG trio, maybe a new "pattern" like what they did to the Lightning.

The Questoris can have more weapons than either of the other two types of knights, but are generally weaker. Same when comparing the Warbringer to the Warlord; only the carapace weapon matches a Warlord's for might.

One other consideration is what weapons are available to a titan or knight; the Reaver, Warlord and Questoris enjoy being jacks-of-all trades. The remaining units however are more limited in their roles.