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NeedleOfInquiry wrote:
The madness apparently coming from old WH and DH codex matched with newer other codex.

Message to Game Workshops. Update ALL Codex to same edition or come down hard on those who use codex edition differences to ban certain rules. Like not attending those tourneys that do so and withdrawing support for them.

Make a choice.

That's smart, lets further cripple the ancient dexes because the rules that were given to make them a balanced army (As per their reasoning) because it can be exploited.

And Double Lash? Nob Bikers?

CT GAMER wrote:

garret wrote:I dont get it though.

Ever heard the term "front runner"? Some people sort of detest the glee with which so many people jump on the bandwagon of things that are popular...

You also have whole segments of the player population that have been burned (sometimes multiple times) by GW when whole armies and ranges are dropped (I still can't sit straight from when LATD and genestealer cult went bye bye). You also have people like DE players who have been sidelined and neglected while the stuff for SM just keeps getting pumped out one shiny new toy after the other...

What it boils down to is:

The popular kids in school always revel in their own coolness, and those that have been marginalized revel in detesting those cool kids...

Well, that and whilst every army as plastic options to various degrees and a Battleforce, with SM I can't find any metal non-character options without easy conversions from another kit. The Sisters and the Grey Knights havn't got a single plastic option in the entier army.
Part hate the cool kids, part hate their privileges.

---

EDIT: Left out some key words in my last paragraph last time round, Fixed now.

I agree that Dark Eldar should be 1st.
But then Spaz Wolvz 2nd.

Epaminondas wrote:I have both a SoB and GK army. Both of them work fantastically and let me be the first to tell you that neither of them NEED anything changed to their codices.

\

Well I'd like to see the SOB get all that silly WH stuff dropped from there codex if you get my drift...


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Kettu wrote:

Well, that and whilst every army as plastic options to various degrees and a Battleforce, I can't find any metal non-character options without easy conversions from another kit the Sisters and the Grey Knights havn't got a single plastic option in the entier army.
Part hate the cool kids, part hate their privileges.

I'd love some platic SOB. I don't think we will see it in our lifetime however. The SOB are too Niche/2nd tier to get that much love from GW...

CT GAMER wrote:Well I'd like to see the SOB get all that silly WH stuff dropped from there codex if you get my drift...

I'd love some platic SOB.

QFT!

Witch hunters work WELL, IF you know wat you are doing...

They could use a little bit of spit-and-polish but nothing radical. I think their biggest problem is how they work with the inducted guard. (Do Vets Replace Armoured Fists?)

Sure, but C: WH should still return to being C: SoB, and the leftovers mean that C: DH can pick up enough units to become a real Codex.

my two cents:

1) DE by principal
2)ALL inquisition, that means:GK, SoB, deathwatch, and assassins
3)necrons
4)tyranids
5) NEW RACE!!! i'd say make one about the remnants of the old ones.
6)combine chaos, add chaos IG, don't change the stats. add into it the options to make a CSM army, a Daemon army, a chaos IG army, or a mix of them all. (basically four different FoC organizations.) give them the SM chapters treatment, but in-codex.
7)Tau
8)Adeptus Mechanicus (robot soldiers, WITH ROBOTS!!! xD)


all xenos armies are in DIRE need of versatility in comparison to the imperial armies, and alot of armies of the same faction should just be made into one army, i.e. chaos, inquisition.


Just a thought, give the eldar a codex for some of the very different craftworlds?

I'm all for combing chaos marines and demons. It'd be like .... the last chaos codex. If GW is feeling really frisky they could throw traitor guard in there. And how about a HS choice besides oblits that isn't lame?

I say stop all the major imperial codices and work on xenos, chaos, inquisition, etc. Especially now that we have new codices for space marines and IG. Give the fringe armies some love.

Yeah, I am down for a new race. And I hope they never upgrade Space Wolves because they are going to end up giving them some BS like 'evey other marine can take a PW and all SW vehicles count as assault vehicles' and then we are right back where we were in early 2000.

whitestagg wrote:Yeah, I am down for a new race. And I hope they never upgrade Space Wolves because they are going to end up giving them some BS like 'evey other marine can take a PW and all SW vehicles count as assault vehicles' and then we are right back where we were in early 2000.

They'll claim it all started as a simple typo, "All SW vehicles can assault," instead of being assault vehicles, but from there is just snowballed. First Chambers wrote the tactica article proclaiming that the new, improved rhino rush was back, and then the Space Wolf dozer-claw accessory sprue was produced, and there was Jervis, writing up the White Dwarf article between jello-shots. In the words of one of the playtesters, "I think they're quite balanced at WS4 and S6, but 20 quid says that the top rules question is whether the rhino's can charge after moving 12" on a road."

Why can't I sleep? I'm being haunted by the images of giant power claws mounted on the front of rhinos.

@JohnDwangDD: So you're saying instead of Witch Hunters and DeamonHunters there should be SoB and Inquisition?

Interesting, but I think the Codexes work well enough as is. I really don't use them on thier own that match. They just add a heap load of flavour to my guard components.

Yep: standalone Sisters, and Inquisition that can ally with IG or Sisters.

Standalone sistas codex would be about...oh, 10 pages wide. Anyway you can already HAVE a standalone sista army with the Witch Hunter Codex.

the list as I see it

1. Space Wolves. They deserve it. its been a long time.*
2. Dark Eldar. Also been a long time.*
3. Necrons. Uncompetitive and convoluted rules.
4. Nids. Got shafted by the current metagame.
5. whichever codex is then outdated by the metagame shift from the last 4 codices changing the game again.

*NOTE: Space Wolves and Dark Eldar are both still very competitive, so neither "Need" a new codex, however, you must have standards, and if you start talking about how old your codex is, then Space Wolves go first.

Emperors Faithful wrote:Standalone sistas codex would be about...oh, 10 pages wide. Anyway you can already HAVE a standalone sista army with the Witch Hunter Codex.

I know, I mean it isn't like the Daemons got new units with theirs... Or IG... Or SM...

Oh SNAP!

Squats. (NOT Demiurg)

Fifty wrote:Squats. (NOT Demiurg)

ONLY if they don't become MEQs




they need to make the armies more different

Emperors Faithful wrote:Standalone sistas codex would be about...oh, 10 pages wide. Anyway you can already HAVE a standalone sista army with the Witch Hunter Codex.

I believe that you've mistaken C: SoB with Pamphlet: Assassins...

In any case, if you go back to the 2E C: SoB, it was considerably more than 10 pages. Indeed, it was thicker than any 3E Codex printed, because Sisters actually have "Fluff"...

JohnHwangDD wrote:

Emperors Faithful wrote:Standalone sistas codex would be about...oh, 10 pages wide. Anyway you can already HAVE a standalone sista army with the Witch Hunter Codex.

I believe that you've mistaken C: SoB with Pamphlet: Assassins...

In any case, if you go back to the 2E C: SoB, it was considerably more than 10 pages. Indeed, it was thicker than any 3E Codex printed, because Sisters actually have "Fluff"...

Back in 2E, GW actually gave a toss about the background and their players.

Any codex that hasn't been updated in five years or more should be a priority. GW needs to get their act together with their FAQ/Errata though. As an example the DA codex could be brought in line with the current SM codex in less than ten minutes in the FAQ. Hell GW could make money while they're at it. I.E. Dark Angels can use the Thunderfire Cannon See Codex Space Marines. Updating the FAQ would not only take just a few minutes, but wouldn't bump other codexes on the release schedule.

For Armies that don't use (or could possibly use) more than one codex, like Tau, but are still in need of changes despite having a fairly recent codex the FAQ could be used for the few minor tweaks to bring them in line with current codex levesl of power/ utility.

Having to wait for years for a new codex drives people away from the game more than it drives them to purchase a new army. It's bad for the hobby. That, and the release of a codex does not have to correspond with the release of new minis for the army. It's nice, but I'd rather have updated rules to at least make what I already own on equal footing with other armies than have to wait for the artists and production crew to go through the whole process of making a new model. They'd still make the money. People will buy the codex on release and that hot new mini six months down the road when it came out.

I feel for the armies with a 5-9 year old codex.

I was sitting around wondering when I should get the ork codex thinking 5th edition means new codexes for everyone. After reading this thread I went to look at the dates of them. The way GW runs their rules is probably the same way General Motors runs their, well not anymore...Hmm GW ...GM .....

The entry for Sadist from Websters Online Dictionary
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sadist

Pronunciation:
\ˈsā-ˌdi-zəm, ˈsa-\
Function:
noun
Etymology:
International Scientific Vocabulary, from Marquis de Sade
Date:
1888

1: a sexual perversion in which gratification is obtained by the infliction of physical or mental pain on others (as on a love object) — compare masochism2 a: delight in cruelty b: excessive cruelty

Maybe not so much 1 as it describes them better with the other definitions though sometimes I wonder...

Gonna go buy Ork Codex... Cheers
Btw to stay on topic.

Now with more of an informed opinion based on dates and those I play with.

1. Space Puppies (way too damn long)
2. Tau...the LoS is a major issue and friend went into a manic depression...loves the game that hates him. Plus he has a dire hate of krout, Thinks stealth suits should be troop choice.
3. Tyranids....Been awhile and my friend is sick of fielding the same crap etc...
4. Sisters of Battle...The next army I want
5. Necrons...Same reason as Tyranids

Emperors Faithful wrote:Standalone sistas codex would be about...oh, 10 pages wide. Anyway you can already HAVE a standalone sista army with the Witch Hunter Codex.

Sisters codex could easily be expanded on to include more sensical Eclessiarchal allies like bringing back Confessors and Missionaries as HQ options, Fraternis militia and Zealot mobs, include special characters like Uriah Jacobson, etc., etc.

Sisters got shoe horned into codex WH because it was a convientant way to accomplish two things at once:

1. put out some option for an updated list for the sisters players to shut them up

2. solve the issue of the WH codex needing models/units to fill thr role that GK play in the DH codex.

It was a half-hearted gesture at best. IF sisters can be showhorned into an Inquisital codex then all space marines should be in one book since space marines as a whole have far more in common with each other (regardless of chapter) then ordo hereticus and SOB do...

you know what would be cool for a new race? a slann crossover from fantasy to 40k. light, magical, fast and deadly guys. still, remnants of the old ones would make cool armies.

@CT Gamer: True, it could easily be expanded. But as is it would not be very diverse. (only 1 troop choice).

@JohnDwangDD: Yeah, you're absolutley right...exceeeeeeept the little/teensy-weensy fact that assasis can only be used when an Inquisitor is part of the force.

If you want a sista codex, you'll get a sista codex but don't even START to claim that assaisins could EVER be in a sista codex.

I don't understand the issue. Assassins go under Inquisition, rather than Sisters.

If I want an Assassin in my Sisters force, I'd take an allied Inquisitor as well. Same as IG would.

Perhaps you misunderstood something?

U were talking about combining the Assasin dex with the sista one.

Anyway, could the sista army mesh as easily with allies if they had their own dex?

No, I said "standalone Sisters, and Inquisition that can ally with IG or Sisters."

Nowhere does that imply Assassins in the Sisters Codex.

OTOH, if you're going to bring up my comment on "Pamphlet: Assassins", then that simply means that you weren't around back when Codex: Assassins was originally published, so you don't know what I'm talking about.

Emperors Faithful wrote:@CT Gamer: True, it could easily be expanded. But as is it would not be very diverse. (only 1 troop choice).

Zealots (as seen in CA) and fraternis militia (from way back) would bring it to three troop choices and that is just adding in old units that they canned from past SOB lists, etc.

If they want to squeeze out some idea for a foruth so be it, if not those three would easily suffice.

I'd be good with Zealots and Frateris Militia coming back to the Sisters book, tho I'd like to see them tied to HQ Priests, as retinue options.

@JohnHwangDD: Sorry, my mistake.

General: I don't think anyone will HAVE zelots and frateris militia. They seem like grot-fodder. It is a good idea though, what units have they canned from the sista force?

Zealots and Frateris Militia are just nowhere near as dependable as Sistas, or even inducted guard for that matter.