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Made in gb
Incorporating Wet-Blending




UK

"Zombie Apocalypse" has been confirmed by a staffer to be a repack of the Z-Corp, nothing more!


Do you have any of the metal goblins? do you know whether they come in the same parts distribution as the plastics do?
More to the point: could I get a bunch of the metals to form the front ranks for all my units and basically have quite a bit of the good of both worlds?


They all come in the same parts distribution, with enough parts for either 10 goblins or 7 + 3 command (which you'll want a lot of if you're using them for front ranks).

The detail is soooo much better on the metals, the plastics look like goop in comparison.

If they don't release new plastics, I'd actually be fine with them releasing the archers and rabble in metal, as £1.50 per model is still a pretty damn good price for metals.

I really have no idea if there will be anything new in terms of goblin sprues, entirely speculation. If it takes too long, I'll probably do something like buying the metal sharpsticks and the hybrid metal rabble in a 2:1 ratio.. that way I can have all-metal sharpsticks and rabble with only the spitters as plastics.

This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2013/01/01 19:53:11


 
   
Made in us
Haughty Harad Serpent Rider





Richmond, VA

So what's the Mortis?

I personally wouldn't mind if, like, the Mincer was released. I'd still pick up a couple, even if I am getting a few from my KS pledges, as I need more than a few. Like the Orc Chariot/Fight Wagon... I'll be buying a half-dozen at least when they come out in retail despite my freebies from the KS.

"...and special thanks to Judgedoug!" - Alessio Cavatore "Now you've gone too far Doug! ... Too far... " - Rick Priestley "I've decided that I'd rather not have you as a member of TMP." - Editor, The Miniatures Page "I'd rather put my testicles through a mangle than spend any time gaming with you." - Richard, TooFatLardies "We need a Doug Craig in every store." - Warlord Games "Thank you for being here, Judge Doug!" - Adam Troke 
   
Made in ca
Dakka Veteran




 Bolognesus wrote:
@ScarletSquig

I'm not sure what my response would be to better gobbo plastics now. If you say there's a distinct possibility I'll hold off on assembling the spear/shield and hw/shield gobbos I'm just cleaning up the metal parts for - I'd probably be even more unhappy with the 180 rather bad models I already paid for :\
(though I must say they do still paint up surprisingly well for mass-battles effect!)



I got about 50 or so gobbos assembled and primed, tried to paint some, and then got too depressed to do anymore. The rest are mouldering in their box. Still a bit pissed they shipped the sprues when they looked like that. But, then I look at the price and remember I paid nearly nothing for them, so c'est la vie.

I'd really like to see new goblin models.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/01/01 19:49:04


 
   
Made in us
Haughty Harad Serpent Rider





Richmond, VA

czakk, is that a KS pledge? If so, wanna sell me your goblins? I'm looking for more if you're dumping 'em cheap. I like the models enough and need more for my army. PM me if you're interested.

"...and special thanks to Judgedoug!" - Alessio Cavatore "Now you've gone too far Doug! ... Too far... " - Rick Priestley "I've decided that I'd rather not have you as a member of TMP." - Editor, The Miniatures Page "I'd rather put my testicles through a mangle than spend any time gaming with you." - Richard, TooFatLardies "We need a Doug Craig in every store." - Warlord Games "Thank you for being here, Judge Doug!" - Adam Troke 
   
Made in gb
Incorporating Wet-Blending




UK

@judgedoug - I guess the Mortis would be a smaller box of z-corp? No idea on what the model count would be. 16 maybe?
   
Made in us
Haughty Harad Serpent Rider





Richmond, VA

It doesn't have a unit quantity next to it. I'm guessing it's some sort of character/war engine/necromancer/etc that's big and tough enough to have his own $20 box.

"...and special thanks to Judgedoug!" - Alessio Cavatore "Now you've gone too far Doug! ... Too far... " - Rick Priestley "I've decided that I'd rather not have you as a member of TMP." - Editor, The Miniatures Page "I'd rather put my testicles through a mangle than spend any time gaming with you." - Richard, TooFatLardies "We need a Doug Craig in every store." - Warlord Games "Thank you for being here, Judge Doug!" - Adam Troke 
   
Made in nl
Zealous Knight






the Netherlands

 scarletsquig wrote:
"Zombie Apocalypse" has been confirmed by a staffer to be a repack of the Z-Corp, nothing more!


Do you have any of the metal goblins? do you know whether they come in the same parts distribution as the plastics do?
More to the point: could I get a bunch of the metals to form the front ranks for all my units and basically have quite a bit of the good of both worlds?


They all come in the same parts distribution, with enough parts for either 10 goblins or 7 + 3 command (which you'll want a lot of if you're using them for front ranks).


Have 5 command sets from the KS batch already of course, and no way are all my rabble getting command groups!

The detail is soooo much better on the metals, the plastics look like goop in comparison.

...so basically the metal bodies/heads have the same level of detail as the metal bits for the hybrids? cool!

If they don't release new plastics, I'd actually be fine with them releasing the archers and rabble in metal, as £1.50 per model is still a pretty damn good price for metals.
Oh Feth of course, there's no metal bow arms. Ookay, that's a bit of a downer. Still, I'll live

I really have no idea if there will be anything new in terms of goblin sprues, entirely speculation.

Okay, that saves me abit of nerd-rage
I mean, if that happens 2-3 years from now - all good. half a year after receiving this stuff? naah, wouldn't be happy
Guess I might dig up my rubber and resin and recast a bunch of the heads from that metal kit, maybe. see if I get some better detail that way (and more importantly - see if my patience lasts that long ) too. Not feeling guilty at all over that

@Czakk
As you can see I have some issues with the models, just as you do. however, when done right (light color primer, bunch of creative washes) they do work well enough for mass battles work. It's never going to be better than the old "3 feet awesome" standard (and even 3 might be stretching!) but for cheap-as-chips models they might be annoying to paint (and yes, they depress me just as much ) but when I look at the paint scheme tester on my desk from a distance, I do get the idea that, well, yeah - I could do with an army of those.
I'd just prefer some better front ranks
...One good part about the softness of the detail is that you can get away with painting the entire head green and it'll look okay. Nothing of those stupid bits of cloth for me


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 judgedoug wrote:
It doesn't have a unit quantity next to it. I'm guessing it's some sort of character/war engine/necromancer/etc that's big and tough enough to have his own $20 box.


it would be cool if they put out something fancy just to go with those Z-corps. However, what would that be? $20 is Iron Ancestor level pricing if I'm not mistaken - that's a big kit to invest in for something which is very much a sideline bonus mini...

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/01/01 20:14:07


 
   
Made in us
Haughty Harad Serpent Rider





Richmond, VA

All this goblin talk has inspired me to finish assembling my KS goblins today. I'm going to be painting the army using the 24-hour-army challenge... spray prime brown, drybrush tan lightly on clothes and heavily on spear/bows, paint skin and anything metal (swords, spear heads, shield etc) then dip!

"...and special thanks to Judgedoug!" - Alessio Cavatore "Now you've gone too far Doug! ... Too far... " - Rick Priestley "I've decided that I'd rather not have you as a member of TMP." - Editor, The Miniatures Page "I'd rather put my testicles through a mangle than spend any time gaming with you." - Richard, TooFatLardies "We need a Doug Craig in every store." - Warlord Games "Thank you for being here, Judge Doug!" - Adam Troke 
   
Made in nl
Zealous Knight






the Netherlands

I've gone for something a bit more bold: Prime yellow (yes. yellow. and brightly ), paint metals metallic (duh) and bows off-white, wash everything except skin sepia twice, wash skin green two or three times.
Your method sounds good too, though. I might have to test a model like that as well - see how it works
   
Made in us
Haughty Harad Serpent Rider





Richmond, VA

Yellow... interesting!
I'm thinking of actually using the citadel foundation yellow/orange color for their skin. Who sez gobbos need to have green skin?

"...and special thanks to Judgedoug!" - Alessio Cavatore "Now you've gone too far Doug! ... Too far... " - Rick Priestley "I've decided that I'd rather not have you as a member of TMP." - Editor, The Miniatures Page "I'd rather put my testicles through a mangle than spend any time gaming with you." - Richard, TooFatLardies "We need a Doug Craig in every store." - Warlord Games "Thank you for being here, Judge Doug!" - Adam Troke 
   
Made in nl
Zealous Knight






the Netherlands

ohh no, you misunderstand!
Painting bright yellow, then applying a wash or three of, say, biel-tan green is actually the fastest way to get good looking *green*skins
   
Made in us
Haughty Harad Serpent Rider





Richmond, VA

Oh, no, I got ya, but you saying prime yellow/wash green is what was 'interesting', which the yellow part of it is what reminded me of what I might do.

"...and special thanks to Judgedoug!" - Alessio Cavatore "Now you've gone too far Doug! ... Too far... " - Rick Priestley "I've decided that I'd rather not have you as a member of TMP." - Editor, The Miniatures Page "I'd rather put my testicles through a mangle than spend any time gaming with you." - Richard, TooFatLardies "We need a Doug Craig in every store." - Warlord Games "Thank you for being here, Judge Doug!" - Adam Troke 
   
Made in nl
Zealous Knight






the Netherlands

Ah, good. Tho yellow gobbos could be fun too

It's really nice, the yellow gives a really warm and bright feel to the green. Best you're going to get whilst speedpainting
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






Anyone have pics of the plastic gobbos? I keep hearing that they are horrible,but haven't seen any yet.
   
Made in us
Haughty Harad Serpent Rider





Richmond, VA

I've also heard they were horrible, but I have 200 of them or whatever. They're not great, but they're not bad either. Details are a little soft.

Here's a Mantic thread that shows the sprue (and the metal bits to make 'em spearmen)
http://forum.manticblog.com/showthread.php?1629-Goblin-Sharpsticks-Unboxed

"...and special thanks to Judgedoug!" - Alessio Cavatore "Now you've gone too far Doug! ... Too far... " - Rick Priestley "I've decided that I'd rather not have you as a member of TMP." - Editor, The Miniatures Page "I'd rather put my testicles through a mangle than spend any time gaming with you." - Richard, TooFatLardies "We need a Doug Craig in every store." - Warlord Games "Thank you for being here, Judge Doug!" - Adam Troke 
   
Made in nl
Zealous Knight






the Netherlands

TBH I have decent ones and horrible ones - it's not exactly consistent. Sometimes even varies within a sprue...
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Dankhold Troggoth






Shadeglass Maze

Improving their gobbos is a good idea, since the current are so lackluster and other companies (RBG) are about to put out their own fantastic ones!
   
Made in us
Haughty Harad Serpent Rider





Richmond, VA

The level of detail reminds me of the old citadel Warhammer Regiments box set of plastics that came with orcs, goblins, dwarves, dark elves, wood elves, and skaven, all static pose but with two different heads and weapons. (I loved that box set, my first Orc army was full of those figs)

"...and special thanks to Judgedoug!" - Alessio Cavatore "Now you've gone too far Doug! ... Too far... " - Rick Priestley "I've decided that I'd rather not have you as a member of TMP." - Editor, The Miniatures Page "I'd rather put my testicles through a mangle than spend any time gaming with you." - Richard, TooFatLardies "We need a Doug Craig in every store." - Warlord Games "Thank you for being here, Judge Doug!" - Adam Troke 
   
Made in jp
[DCM]
Incorporating Wet-Blending





Japan

 judgedoug wrote:
I've also heard they were horrible, but I have 200 of them or whatever. They're not great, but they're not bad either. Details are a little soft.


I found them a little disappointing individually, but ranked up in a block of 20, they'll look fine on the tabletop. Add some nice character models and they'll be perfectly servicable army.

Now showing obstacles for Dreadball and a preview of Things To Come!

Painting Total as of 4/1/2021: 24 plus an iron golem and five spider nests and all the obstacles for Dreadball Xtreme

Painting Total as of 12/26/2020: 185 plus two mechs and the Throne of Bone




 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Dankhold Troggoth






Shadeglass Maze

If the best that can be said about a model / group of models is that they look fine in a block of 20 / are "serviceable"... well, those are not models that I want.

I think that'd be the same for most people, unless at a steep discount to fill out an army with on the cheap. But if they're at all similar in price to better gobbos, it'd be no contest to go with the alternative.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/01/04 01:18:59


 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut





 RiTides wrote:
If the best that can be said about a model / group of models is that they look fine in a block of 20 / are "serviceable"... well, those are not models that I want.

I think that'd be the same for most people, unless at a steep discount to fill out an army with on the cheap. But if they're at all similar in price to better gobbos, it'd be no contest to go with the alternative.



Fortunately Mantic stuff is a a steep discount, averaging less than a dollar a dude if you go for the larger sets. Even the small sets of plastic rarely run more than $1.50 a dude.

CHAOS! PANIC! DISORDER!
My job here is done. 
   
Made in gb
Incorporating Wet-Blending




UK

You can buy 40 goblins for $25 off the Mantic store currently.

Also, to put everyone's minds at ease - Mantic are aware of the problems with the goblin sprue, aren't happy about it themselves and won't be releasing any more hard plastic until they're certain the issue is fixed. This isn't going to be a permanent thing, they do want to move back to hard plastic in a big way, but resin plastic is going to be the status quo for a little while longer until they can find a way to make that happen.

They waited until a full 6 months after the goblin sprue was released to announce that Celestian Men-at-arms and a generic horse sprue would be made in hard plastic and released in June this year.

So, there's good odds that they've used that time to find a new supplier that is capable of understanding that the minis are not simply disposable children's toys and that a shoddy detail-less sprue will not be "good enough".

That's the problem with getting stuff done in China, most of the manufacturers there are geared towards "low quality, pile 'em high, cheapest price possible" production because that's what most Western clients want, to sell the cheapest-to-manufacture, worst product they can get away with for the highest price they can, thus maximizing dividend yield for their shareholders.

If you need high quality, they're not so good. It took Wargames Factory three years to figure out that the wargames market is more like the scale models market than the "kiddies toy" market. Now that they've come to that understanding, they are producing sprues which are massively superior in quality to anything that GW has ever produced. (double-slide core tooling for as many undercuts as you want, coloured plastic casting, tolerances so precise that working hydraulics and posable ball joints can be used, almost *zero* mould lines).

If Mantic stick with the goblin manufacturer for their future sprues in the hopes that they'll improve, they'll have an extemely uphill struggle to convince them that high quality is required.

There's also the small matter that the people who made that sprue don't actually know what they're doing.. someone on the Mantic forum who works in plastic injection noted that the vents/gates/ whatever were all really horribly placed and it looked like an amateur job by someone without any training.

I hope one of the goals with the Warpath KS is to move plastic manufacturing in-house, like Reaper did with theirs.

There's a lot of people in the UK with the skills to do this sort of thing, but there just aren't any jobs going for them after the economy tanked and Airfix etc. went bust and others in the plastics industry fired a load of staff.

As long as Mantic can get hold of the equipment, it should be dead easy to find the staff to use it. You can even get away with a single person who really knows their stuff if most of your sculpts are digital (helps to hugely reduce the cost of hard plastic tooling by automating the bulk of the milling with modern CNC tech, rather than the laborious and tedious pantograph method that Renedra use).

Even GW switched to digital sculpting 5 years ago, so you know you're really in the stone age if you're unwilling to make use of it. Dreamforge have already produced more hard plastic in 2 months than Mantic have in 3 1/2 years, at 1/5th of the manufacturing cost (It costs $60k to tool a 5-man sprue from Renedra, using "ye olde dinosaur pantograph and 3-up" methods, and $8k for WGF to tool the exact same sprue, using digital sculpts as the base).

This message was edited 12 times. Last update was at 2013/01/04 20:30:37


 
   
Made in us
[DCM]
Dankhold Troggoth






Shadeglass Maze

If they know they're low quality and are unhappy with them, I don't know if they should really be selling them. Not everyone reads forums/reviews (most don't) and might not assume discount = poor product, but just excess stock or the like.
   
Made in gb
Incorporating Wet-Blending




UK

Some more Men-At-Arms concept art, this time with the posing of the bodies that will appear on the sprue:



Latest rumblings from Mantic are that the staff are all really happy with how the Celestian range is looking.

We also know that they're the last models to be sculpted, so there's good odds that the sculpting phase of the KoW KS is nearly complete, with a move to get everything tooled over the next couple of months.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/01/29 12:03:16


 
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Battlefield Tourist





On an Express Elevator to Hell!!

Those look interesting! Any word yet on who is doing the sculpting for them?

ScarletSquig, really like your idea of trying to get plastic manufacturing done in the UK - and like you say there should be the staff with the engineering prowess. GW are able to produce plastics in the UK and still make massive profit from it (someone did a break-down of the costs recently on another part of the forum - not as much as you would think comes from the production costs). So, the potential would remain for them to release a box set, but without the hyper-inflated prices presented by GW (or at least, I hope! )

Epic 30K&40K! A new players guide, contributors welcome https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/751316.page
Small but perfectly formed! A Great Crusade Epic 6mm project: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/694411.page
 
   
Made in ca
Master Sergeant





 Pacific wrote:
Those look interesting! Any word yet on who is doing the sculpting for them?

ScarletSquig, really like your idea of trying to get plastic manufacturing done in the UK - and like you say there should be the staff with the engineering prowess. GW are able to produce plastics in the UK and still make massive profit from it (someone did a break-down of the costs recently on another part of the forum - not as much as you would think comes from the production costs). So, the potential would remain for them to release a box set, but without the hyper-inflated prices presented by GW (or at least, I hope! )


Not just GW, most of the plastic historicals out there were tooled by Renedra.
   
Made in gb
Been Around the Block




London

 scarletsquig wrote:
Some more Men-At-Arms concept art, this time with the posing of the bodies that will appear on the sprue:



Latest rumblings from Mantic are that the staff are all really happy with how the Celestian range is looking.

We also know that they're the last models to be sculpted, so there's good odds that the sculpting phase of the KoW KS is nearly complete, with a move to get everything tooled over the next couple of months.


Nice! I thought they were going to be corporation with the goggles taken off
   
Made in nl
Zealous Knight






the Netherlands

Well, if those arms are going to be supplied with open hands as the undead were and poses one and five are going to be produced as shown, I guess it won't take long before we see diorama's of "the dancing basileans".
Not a bad thing, there's plenty of dynamic poses going to be possible with that stuff. I just hope and pray they found a better manufacturer than they used for the goblins. These concepts really deserve a decent final product!

And it seems Mantic will be one of the very few to deliver a major KS project entirely on time now.
It seems to be overlooked by cynics a bit, but that alone is a good indication of how well they've got their stuff together - hardly any major project gets delivered on time and KoW isn't exactly the least complicated of them all.
   
Made in us
Haughty Harad Serpent Rider





Richmond, VA

Well there's the heady rumors of Warlord Games buying their own plastic injection machines; so Mantic could contract through them instead of Renedra?

"...and special thanks to Judgedoug!" - Alessio Cavatore "Now you've gone too far Doug! ... Too far... " - Rick Priestley "I've decided that I'd rather not have you as a member of TMP." - Editor, The Miniatures Page "I'd rather put my testicles through a mangle than spend any time gaming with you." - Richard, TooFatLardies "We need a Doug Craig in every store." - Warlord Games "Thank you for being here, Judge Doug!" - Adam Troke 
   
Made in nl
Zealous Knight






the Netherlands

There being talk of WG buying their own machines, though, means they'll be quite a few months off from having them operational (these things tend *not* to be available off the shelf!) let alone getting into the business of running them for others.
Nah, I don't think that'd be workable in time even for the WP KS...
   
 
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