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Nice, also, temporary Twilight Kin list! Thank you!

Looks very promising so far. No TLoS is epic.

Too many magic items, however, for my taste, I'd cut them in half or more. I prefer simple games. The less you gotta explain or look up the better!

In general: three thumbs up for being so transparent. Amazing work.

Less magic items might be problematic for listbuilding though, since you cant just add command or single models. If youve got anywhere from 5 to ~ 60 points left over, youd have a lot of trouble finding something to fill the list out.

Besides, if balanced well, more options are always better for a game's longevity than fewer. Plus, in a game where we bring in so many models from... other games or lines, magic items help retain the flavor of many favorite models when importing them into KoW. :-)

 Tyr13 wrote:
Less magic items might be problematic for listbuilding though, since you cant just add command or single models. If youve got anywhere from 5 to ~ 60 points left over, youd have a lot of trouble finding something to fill the list out.

There is that - especially since they've busily been cutting out the options for smaller units across the board as they're so terrified of "spam-lists".

I heard this rumor that with 2nd edition, there might be more army lists available, and there might even be one that is made up of humanoids with rather 'rat-like' appearances. Is this accurate?

Also - any idea when these 2nd ed rules will be released?

Thanks!

Shipping in July for backers.

 Azazelx wrote:

 Tyr13 wrote:
Less magic items might be problematic for listbuilding though, since you cant just add command or single models. If youve got anywhere from 5 to ~ 60 points left over, youd have a lot of trouble finding something to fill the list out.

There is that - especially since they've busily been cutting out the options for smaller units across the board as they're so terrified of "spam-lists".

Spam and scenic basing to the point of adding a height stat

Mort wrote:
I heard this rumor that with 2nd edition, there might be more army lists available, and there might even be one that is made up of humanoids with rather 'rat-like' appearances. Is this accurate?

Also - any idea when these 2nd ed rules will be released?

Thanks!

The 2nd rules are locked in now. The army lists in our spreadsheet are final (barring typos and anything broken which crops up) and we're waiting on Mantic for a final PDF to release.

That rumour is very accurate ;-) I would hope we can start public beta of those lists before the end of July, if not much sooner.

privateer4hire wrote:

 Azazelx wrote:

 Tyr13 wrote:
Less magic items might be problematic for listbuilding though, since you cant just add command or single models. If youve got anywhere from 5 to ~ 60 points left over, youd have a lot of trouble finding something to fill the list out.

There is that - especially since they've busily been cutting out the options for smaller units across the board as they're so terrified of "spam-lists".

Spam and scenic basing to the point of adding a height stat

The height stat is from the loss of TLOS, brings it more in line with how most other small model scale, large battle games handle it. The games basically a 6mm game blown up to 28mm anyway so..

TLOS was a bad thing in such a conversion and proxy-friendly game specifically designed around "elements" of troops. The Height stat is a much needed fix.

For what it is worth, the person in my group that had the bases that most needed to have a 'height stat' was also the person that first used it in our group - long before 2nd edition had a Kickstarter. (His dwarf rangers are climbing a mountain, and planting their banner at the top.... The unit is almost six inches high, and looks great. He did not try to pass the unit off as being that tall in game. they do not bring their mountain with them....)

The Auld Grump

I play in friendly games and TLOS still sucked. We all use huge amounts of different manufacturer's miniatures and the height difference between them can be up to a centimeter, which can be the difference between being able to see a horse-mounted wizard or not. The Height stat is a nice abstraction that will make the few instances of "hmm can I see that dude" go away. I'm all for it.

Exactly what Doug said. We ended up house-ruling a kind of height stat anyway, so having it properly embedded in the rules is so much better.