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This is the coolest plasma gun I have ever seen. Gib 3 for Mechanicus pls.

I'm interested to see what other squad types they have. I can only guess an assault version and a devastator version.

Good models for SM's so completely unnecessary

 Bobthehero wrote:
Good models for SM's so completely unnecessary

And I think that sums it up perfectly.

Not sure what these guys are supposed to be. seems like a useless cross between terminators and tacticals. the AP on the bolters is nice if the regular marine boltguns don't have AP, but if they also are AP-1 it seems rather pointless to have these guys, too. Appreciate the new kits though. Might grab some to build a Command Squad or something, unless the rules are actually interesting in some way


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Pancakey wrote:
Think this will be a big problem in 8th?

You'll most likely need only one per squad as it's probably not going to be allowed to have different models wounded, similar to how AoS does it.

Pancakey wrote:
Think this will be a big problem in 8th?

No.

Because if the shooting is like AoS, you have to remove Wounds from already Wounded models before moving on to place for another.

Marmatag wrote:Is anyone else stepping back and appreciating how weak a TAC squad is now?

"And they shall know no fear..." and that's really, really good, considering if they did know fear, they'd be crapping their pants as their bullets bounce off Imperial Guardsman's paper armor.

It took 10,000 years to effectively make a marine with 1 extra wound, and a boltgun that is still weaker than 7th edition boltgun. lol..

How is bolter worse? It's the equivalent of 30" S4 AP4 now?

Again, if a Tactical Squad is weaker, that probably means cheaper. Also, how is a Tactical Squad weak now? The only thing we know they've lost is one point of Leadership, and now don't just ignore 5+/6+ armour. If anything, with armour, at least Space Marines will get saves against weapons that once were AP 3 and lower. The only thing where they're weaker is against AP4 equivalents.

nekooni wrote:Not sure what these guys are supposed to be. seems like a useless cross between terminators and tacticals. the AP on the bolters is nice if the regular marine boltguns don't have AP, but if they also are AP-1 it seems rather pointless to have these guys, too. Appreciate the new kits though. Might grab some to build a Command Squad or something, unless the rules are actually interesting in some way

Regular bolters don't seem to be AP-1. These guys are just like normal, except have a better bolter and an extra attack and wound.

 Marmatag wrote:
It took 10,000 years to effectively make a marine with 1 extra wound, and a boltgun that is still weaker than 7th edition boltgun. lol..

This bolt rifle is better than a 7th edition bolt gun. Maybe not against Guardsmen specifically, but against most things.

The save modifier system replacing the AP system meant AP5 guns of old basically had to turn in to 0 modifier otherwise we'd have the same problem we had in 2nd edition where armour wasn't worth a whole lot.

2 questions 1 how can new marines have dreadnoughts already there new and haven't had time to get badly injured.
2ndly how will the dreadnought be better as the marine inside is a husk and his better speed etc is irrelevant

 Verviedi wrote:


This is the coolest plasma gun I have ever seen. Gib 3 for Mechanicus pls.

The more I see the numarines the more I wish they just replaced the existing marine instead of making the terrible story of them being gullimarines.

Ok few big things came from that chart.

1) A 5 man unit is 1pp more than normal marines. They stay at 5 man and can not take special weapons. 2w was a shock. So no combat squads.

2) Granades are be model now and a normal shooting attack from looks of it. 6" range

3) frag is d6 S3 D1

4) krak is S6 ap-1 D3

5) shooting definitely happens in CC now and does not add to attacks for having it as a second cc weapon.

Lot to think over.

Edit: fat fingered the S on crack

 Gloomfang wrote:
Ok few big things came from that chart.

1) A 5 man unit is 1pp more than normal marines. They stay at 5 man and can not take special weapons. 2w was a shock. So no combat squads.

2) Granades are be model now and a normal shooting attack from looks of it. 6" range

3) frag is d6 S3 D1

4) krak is S4 ap-1 D3

5) shooting definitely happens in CC now and does not add to attacks for having it as a second cc weapon.

Lot to think over.

There's probably the upgrade section missing, so I wouldn't take 1) for granted

 Gloomfang wrote:
Ok few big things came from that chart.

1) A 5 man unit is 1pp more than normal marines. They stay at 5 man and can not take special weapons. 2w was a shock. So no combat squads.

2) Granades are be model now and a normal shooting attack from looks of it. 6" range

3) frag is d6 S3 D1

4) krak is S4 ap-1 D3

5) shooting definitely happens in CC now and does not add to attacks for having it as a second cc weapon.

Lot to think over.

#2 seems like a leap. We don't know how the grenade rule reads. It could read just like it does now "one model in a unit may use a grenade for their shooting attack." At d6 shots, it actually seems pretty likely.

Nope. It was spelled out no specal or heavy weapons. Also the cost to increase unit size was shown on the Rubric datasheet so we know where it goes.

Edit: possible with grenades, but that could caused all sorts of issues last edition. Also can't do that with the new split fire rules.

 BlaxicanX wrote:
"B-but that's just a conversion!"

"I know a Centurion head when I see one!"

"Y-you can see the green stuff on it!"

Has there ever been a time in this hobby where skeptics were more thoroughly blown the feth out?

Yes, they said the exact same things about the leaked Tau images that had the new crisis suits interspersed throughout the background shots.

Along with a healthy dose of 'Tau are already getting two new big suits, no way they'd update crisis suits and fire warriors too'.

Bear in mind that they weren't going off of a blurry picture of an unpainted single model either, they were arguing the crisis suits were, at most, extensive conversions that were being included in official splash images for... reasons.

Marxist artist wrote:
2 questions 1 how can new marines have dreadnoughts already there new and haven't had time to get badly injured.
2ndly how will the dreadnought be better as the marine inside is a husk and his better speed etc is irrelevant

Both very valid questions with answers that are likely to boil down to, "because $".

On the one hand, at least they're releasing some pretty awesome new models.

On the other hand, Space Marines are the last faction that needs awesome new models, let alone ones that represent Super-Superhuman marines.

So, basically space marine nobz. With no upgrades.

icn1982 wrote:
Ok, just seen the new Dataslate for the Primaris Marines. What I am going to say - I think the Primaris Marines Datasheet bodes well for 8th Edition. These are new models, but they haven't had a bunch of special rules bundled onto them, they haven't been given a huge points discount and they aren't a MUST BUY unit.

If you are looking for a solid line unit, these are your guys. But if not, you have plenty of other units to pick from.

I inferred the opposite. I think they lack a bunch of special rules because these are the line Marines of the future. Space Marines are getting slowly scaled to be a small elite army, instead of an elite horde army like they could be. This whole thing looks a lot like the 'Hollywood Marine" article in White Dwarf a ways back...

So, I have to ask....


Do people that do True scale marines now have to take these guys and cut out a few millimeters here and there in order to make their normal tactical marines. That way, their models match..

 Gloomfang wrote:
Ok few big things came from that chart.

1) A 5 man unit is 1pp more than normal marines. They stay at 5 man and can not take special weapons. 2w was a shock. So no combat squads.

I'm guessing this are cut down stats, I expect to see special weapons.

2) Granades are be model now and a normal shooting attack from looks of it. 6" range

Well, we know they're a shooting attack, we don't know what that entails yet. They have the type "grenade" so "grenade" might have some separate rules we don't know about.

5) shooting definitely happens in CC now and does not add to attacks for having it as a second cc weapon.

Where are you getting that from?

Youn wrote:
So, I have to ask....


Do people that do True scale marines now have to take these guys and cut out a few millimeters here and there in order to make their normal tactical marines. That way, their models match..

Best thing I have read today! Exalted!

Of course they can take special weapons. The picture literally has them modeled with 2 plasma guns.

If you can have 4 specials per 5 that's going to be nuts.

The reality of a real military is that the "special weapons" in this setting would become standard issue due to how poorly boltguns perform in practice. Especially for an "elite" fighting force. If getting shot off the table trivially by Tau means "elite".

So the profile, weapon options aside, is basically what marines should have been all along. With the scale their models should have been from the start too.
And they're going to update the scale of the rest of line. Awesome.
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Now could we make their marketing drivel and the fluff go away?
"Marines aren't redundant", yea sure... you keep telling yourself that. They're not, for now, simply because the rest of the line hasn't been updated yet.
This totally doesn't mean that marines are going to get initial rules never to be touched again.

The whole fluff thing is just....*eye roll*. They could have just as easily given the new marines for a new edition the numarine profile and then sell them as a tactical squad, what with their tacticus *sigh* armour.
But nooo, that wouldn't have made the same amount of sales as Wardian marines.

Martel732 wrote:
The reality of a real military is that the "special weapons" in this setting would become standard issue due to how poorly boltguns perform in practice. Especially for an "elite" fighting force. If getting shot off the table trivially by Tau means "elite".

On record: Lore and gameplay are different.

Okay. For why they cannot have special weapons.

"That said, like the Legions of the Great Crusade, they don’t have options for heavy or assault weapons within the squad, so there are still situations where a Tactical Squad will be better suited – bringing lascannons, flamers or other specialist weapons with them for greater tactical flexibility."

And for shooting in CC and pistol not giving another attack

"Though not melee specialists, the Intercessor’s two attacks makes them pretty handy in a fight. In close combat, they can also use their bolt pistols to fire point-blank into enemy units in the shooting phase. "

 Marmatag wrote:


Well the good news is, it's pretty easy to say "All my space marines counts as intscissors squads."

Yeah, but you can never move them more than 6" a turn, because you should never run with intscissors.

 Sgt_Smudge wrote:

Martel732 wrote:
The reality of a real military is that the "special weapons" in this setting would become standard issue due to how poorly boltguns perform in practice. Especially for an "elite" fighting force. If getting shot off the table trivially by Tau means "elite".

On record: Lore and gameplay are different.

I mean standard issue in the game. What's standard issue in the lore has no bearing because of the performance disparity. The boltgun, by rights, should disappear from the table top force because of its lack of efficacy.

In terms of models I like them. Unlike the SIGMARINES, the absurd Centurions or other jazz we've gotten recently, these things actually look decent. Proportions are (mostly) there (I still think they got way too much leg day) so unlike the Centurion or Dreadknight it isn't horrible to look at.

However the whole concept weirds me out. It runs into the same problem as Centurions in that it's trying to fill a niche that's unnecessary (I'm assuming these guys will be somewhere in between a Terminator and a Marine in terms of durability and firepower). Not to mention the just-released Custodes could have filled the same role in the army if it was really that needed. Lore-wise, it's a total ass pull. And finally from a collector's perspective, it runs into all sorts of little niggles as they will look out of place in my own marine armies, but are similar enough that I don't feel justified starting a new collection just for them.

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
In terms of models I like them. Unlike the SIGMARINES, the absurd Centurions or other jazz we've gotten recently, these things actually look decent. Proportions are (mostly) there (I still think they got way too much leg day) so unlike the Centurion or Dreadknight it isn't horrible to look at.

However the whole concept weirds me out. It runs into the same problem as Centurions in that it's trying to fill a niche that's unnecessary (I'm assuming these guys will be somewhere in between a Terminator and a Marine in terms of durability and firepower). Not to mention the just-released Custodes could have filled the same role in the army if it was really that needed. Lore-wise, it's a total ass pull. And finally from a collector's perspective, it runs into all sorts of little niggles as they will look out of place in my own marine armies, but are similar enough that I don't feel justified starting a new collection just for them.

This is why I think they are just slowly redoing the scale of the marine armies, may take a few years but eventually I feel this will be the norm for marines size