I am Alpharius - Alpha Legion Tactica 8th Edition

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**Blueguy203**

So in hopes to keeping this thread alive as i am a new Alpharius lord and am looking to play an Alpha Legion list competitively. I am looking for some C & C about my list and any revisions my fellow lords would like to offer:

Spoiler:

**Cephalobeard**

All of the horrors invalidate this as a valid AL detachment and you no longer receive legion traits. Needs to all be Alpha Legion CSM or it isn't battleforged.

**Blueguy203**

Cephalobeard wrote:
All of the horrors invalidate this as a valid AL detachment and you no longer receive legion traits. Needs to all be Alpha Legion CSM or it isn't battleforged.

Yes, thank you for making me aware of that, i did a quick edit and swapped out the horrors for cultist. I would appreciate any further C & C.

thanks

**Mr. Funktastic**

Thinking about starting Alpha Legion as a second army, I'd appreciate any critiques!

Spoiler:

The idea is that the Rhino full of Berzerkers with the Dark Apostle and Exalted Champion drive up the board, get Warptimed by the Daemon Prince following in tow and popping smoke when needed. Heldrake goes for a turn 1 flame and charge to tie up as many backline ranged units as possible. Noise Marines go around squatting on an objective. Terminators and Terminator Sorcerer deep strike and pull the old semi reliable Prescience + Warptime + Endless Cacophony + Overcharge Plasma strategy with Delightful Agonies to give the Terminators some more survivability. Also deep striking Obliterators nearby to provide backup fire support. Is this a good strategy or am I being too reliant on psyker powers going off? Do I have too few models for a viable army? I'd like to run a Battalion at 1500 pts for the extra CP since we're such a CP hungry army, but I'm not too keen on using Cultists for Troops despite being the cheap option and I don't know what the consensus is on CSM as reliable Troop choices despite their -1 to hit from the Legion trait. Are Chaos Marines any good and would they really shine in this list?

**orkswubwub**

I thought that the CSM detachment had to share the same legion?

If your army is Battle-forge, all INFANTRY, BIKERS and HELBRUTE units in Chaos Space Marine Detachments gain a Legion Trait, so long as every unit in the Detachment is from the same Legion.

This would seem to indicate you could mix and match Legions/Deamons as long as each detachment was legion specific. So no deamons in a CSM Detachment, although a battle forged army can include deamon detachments. So looking above the horrors don't seem to be the problem, just the chaos spawn? Also battalion detachment requires 2 hqs not one.

**Blueguy203**

orkswubwub wrote:
I thought that the CSM detachment had to share the same legion?

If your army is Battle-forge, all INFANTRY, BIKERS and HELBRUTE units in Chaos Space Marine Detachments gain a Legion Trait, so long as every unit in the Detachment is from the same Legion.

This would seem to indicate you could mix and match Legions/Deamons as long as each detachment was legion specific. So no deamons in a CSM Detachment, although a battle forged army can include deamon detachments. So looking above the horrors don't seem to be the problem, just the chaos spawn? Also battalion detachment requires 2 hqs not one.

Actually Cep is right in this case because the horrors do not share the keywords "heretic Astartes" and "Legion" they would interfere with the detachment being battleforge. Spawns however share those keywords and therefore are an exception.

**orkswubwub**

It seemed he was trying to run a battalion detachment of deamons separate from the brigade detachment of heretic astartes? I guess I misunderstood but my point was that it should be possible to have a battleforged army with a heretic astartes legion detachment and a completely non-heretic astartes deamon detachment. As long as the heretic astartes legion detachment is all the same legion - they would get legion trait.

In the same way it would be possible to run 3 patrol detachments all from separate legions - each patrol would get legion trait as long as all members were from heretic astartes and from the same legion (within each corresponding detachment)

**Slayer-Fan123**

So I had posted this in the regular Chaos Marine Tactica and got no replies, and figured I'd share here the Brigade I made.
I went 4-2 at Locals which is nothing but hey better than some I guess.

HQ:
x1 Biker Lord
. Combi-Bolter, Blade of the Hydra
x1 Dark Apostle
. The Black Mace or regular Maul depending if I think I need the Command Point later, Bolt Pistol
x1 Arkos The Faithless

Troops:
6 x10 Cultists
. All Autoguns

Elites:
x6 Chosen
. 5 Plasma Guns, Combi-Flamer
. Rhino w/ 2 Combi-Bolters
x6 Chosen
. 5 Plasma Guns, Combi-Flamer
. Rhino w/ 2 Combi-Bolters
x6 Berserker Marines
. 5 Chainaxes, 3 Chainswords, 2 Plasma Pistols, Champ w/ Plasma Pistol and Power Fist, Banner
x6 Berserker Marines
. 5 Chainaxes, 3 Chainswords, 2 Plasma Pistols, Champ w/ Plasma Pistol and Power Fist, Banner

Fast Attack
x3 1 Spawn

Heavy Support
x3 Obliterators
x3 Obliterators
x1 Maulerfiend
. Magna Cutters

Plan should make sense from the get-go. Infiltrate the Berserker Marines and Apostle (or hide him in one of the Rhinos), Rhinos will rush up with my Chosen, Cultists can be infiltrated as a screen or hold home objectives, Maulerfiend makes itself look threatening and to be a "SHOOT ME FOR FIRST BLOOD" target (in fact, I don't expect it to make any points back at all), and Obliterators strike when and where necessary. Spawn just sit there and eat up points or hold an objective; I don't particularly care. However, I feel I still lack offensive power. Is it worth so many Command Points if I still lack Chosen or other offensive power in my list? Would it be worth just going with a couple of Vanguard detachments or a Vanguard detachment with a regular Battalion to get less command points but more Chosen and killing power?

**Cephalobeard**

Instead of a Brigade, move to two Battalions. Cut some of the units you don't need, like Spawn, this allows you to use a Daemon Prince instead of a Biker Lord. Give him claws, wings and the Slaanesh elixir. If you don't use the chosen, you could fit in more Zerkers and then infiltrate larger blobs of Zerkers. Make one of the Obliterators Slaanesh so you can double tap.

Slightly less CP, much more punch.

**Slayer-Fan123**

Cephalobeard wrote:
Instead of a Brigade, move to two Battalions. Cut some of the units you don't need, like Spawn, this allows you to use a Daemon Prince instead of a Biker Lord. Give him claws, wings and the Slaanesh elixir. If you don't use the chosen, you could fit in more Zerkers and then infiltrate larger blobs of Zerkers. Make one of the Obliterators Slaanesh so you can double tap.

Slightly less CP, much more punch.

Two Battalions is the same number of Cultists though, which basically means I'm paying for the Spawn (90 points), for that extra 5 CP.

Would moving to a Vanguard + Battalion work just as well? I'd lose 2 CP in exchange of needing less Cultists and gaining more of those delicious elite slots.

**Cephalobeard**

Sure. Would work fine.

**orchewer**

Quick question to throw onto this thread:

What would be the best icon to put on a maxed out unit of Chaos Possessed deploying via the "Forward Operatives" Stratagem for Alpha Legion? My analysis is below ...

Icon of Wrath - The re-roll on charge seems nice, but since I'm already deploying up in the enemy's face, is it really necessary?

Icon of Flame - I'm not sure how useful it would be to rely on a D6 to cause mortal wounds on a 6+, but it seems like a neat little gimmick

Icon of Despair - Seems like a good, general ability, and has the potential to be much more useful considering I'm, again, deploying right against my opponent's face

Icon of Excess - Very situational, but could be excellent depending on a player's meta

Icon of Vengeance - Another all round general bump, useful if I ever need to start taking morale tests.

**Captyn_Bob**

Honestly I wouldn't base it on icons..

Khorne - very good stratagem for applying overkill

Nurgle- stacks with epidemus/skabiethrax

Tzeentch - Stacks with the Changling (-2 sounds very good)

Slaanesh - has tits. Wait..

**fishwaffle2232**

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Plan should make sense from the get-go. Infiltrate the Berserker Marines and Apostle (or hide him in one of the Rhinos), Rhinos will rush up with my Chosen, Cultists can be infiltrated as a screen or hold home objectives, Maulerfiend makes itself look threatening and to be a "SHOOT ME FOR FIRST BLOOD" target (in fact, I don't expect it to make any points back at all), and Obliterators strike when and where necessary. Spawn just sit there and eat up points or hold an objective; I don't particularly care. However, I feel I still lack offensive power. Is it worth so many Command Points if I still lack Chosen or other offensive power in my list? Would it be worth just going with a couple of Vanguard detachments or a Vanguard detachment with a regular Battalion to get less command points but more Chosen and killing power?

You can only infiltrate one unit with the forward operatives stratagem. Not only this but HQ can't 'join' units anymore. This means that you can't infiltrate your dark apostle with your unit of beserkers.

What you could do, to deploy your beserkers up close with support from HQ, is use a drop pod. You could drop your HQ and maybe one of your chosen units right near your forward operative deployed beserkers for support and buffs. You may have trouble delivering them where you want if your opponent is exoecting this though, because if they are smart they will bubble wrap key targets.

My current strat is to use forward operatives and drop pods to strategically deploy plasma cultists in cover or on objectives. Sorcerers with jetpacks can be dropped in where they are needed. Being able to drop a blob of 40 cultists on and objective with forward operatives is also nice. At -1 to hit and with the option of redeploying them at full strength on a table edge, using the stratagem, this unit can cause a lot of hassle for your opponent.

**Slayer-Fan123**

fishwaffle2232 wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Plan should make sense from the get-go. Infiltrate the Berserker Marines and Apostle (or hide him in one of the Rhinos), Rhinos will rush up with my Chosen, Cultists can be infiltrated as a screen or hold home objectives, Maulerfiend makes itself look threatening and to be a "SHOOT ME FOR FIRST BLOOD" target (in fact, I don't expect it to make any points back at all), and Obliterators strike when and where necessary. Spawn just sit there and eat up points or hold an objective; I don't particularly care. However, I feel I still lack offensive power. Is it worth so many Command Points if I still lack Chosen or other offensive power in my list? Would it be worth just going with a couple of Vanguard detachments or a Vanguard detachment with a regular Battalion to get less command points but more Chosen and killing power?

You can only infiltrate one unit with the forward operatives stratagem. Not only this but HQ can't 'join' units anymore. This means that you can't infiltrate your dark apostle with your unit of beserkers.

What you could do, to deploy your beserkers up close with support from HQ, is use a drop pod. You could drop your HQ and maybe one of your chosen units right near your forward operative deployed beserkers for support and buffs. You may have trouble delivering them where you want if your opponent is exoecting this though, because if they are smart they will bubble wrap key targets.

My current strat is to use forward operatives and drop pods to strategically deploy plasma cultists in cover or on objectives. Sorcerers with jetpacks can be dropped in where they are needed. Being able to drop a blob of 40 cultists on and objective with forward operatives is also nice. At -1 to hit and with the option of redeploying them at full strength on a table edge, using the stratagem, this unit can cause a lot of hassle for your opponent.

The list is 12 CP total (well 13 with Arkos). I can spend it if I want to.

**lessthanjeff**

fishwaffle2232 wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

Plan should make sense from the get-go. Infiltrate the Berserker Marines and Apostle (or hide him in one of the Rhinos), Rhinos will rush up with my Chosen, Cultists can be infiltrated as a screen or hold home objectives, Maulerfiend makes itself look threatening and to be a "SHOOT ME FOR FIRST BLOOD" target (in fact, I don't expect it to make any points back at all), and Obliterators strike when and where necessary. Spawn just sit there and eat up points or hold an objective; I don't particularly care. However, I feel I still lack offensive power. Is it worth so many Command Points if I still lack Chosen or other offensive power in my list? Would it be worth just going with a couple of Vanguard detachments or a Vanguard detachment with a regular Battalion to get less command points but more Chosen and killing power?

You can only infiltrate one unit with the forward operatives stratagem. Not only this but HQ can't 'join' units anymore. This means that you can't infiltrate your dark apostle with your unit of beserkers.

What you could do, to deploy your beserkers up close with support from HQ, is use a drop pod. You could drop your HQ and maybe one of your chosen units right near your forward operative deployed beserkers for support and buffs. You may have trouble delivering them where you want if your opponent is exoecting this though, because if they are smart they will bubble wrap key targets.

My current strat is to use forward operatives and drop pods to strategically deploy plasma cultists in cover or on objectives. Sorcerers with jetpacks can be dropped in where they are needed. Being able to drop a blob of 40 cultists on and objective with forward operatives is also nice. At -1 to hit and with the option of redeploying them at full strength on a table edge, using the stratagem, this unit can cause a lot of hassle for your opponent.

If you're basing that on the claim that a strategem can only be used once per phase, the BRB states that strategems used before the game begins are an exception so you can infiltrate multiple units.

**fishwaffle2232**

My mistake I forgot about the rule which allows you to use a stratagem more than once if it used before the battle starts. This has made me rethink my own list now haha.
I think your list looks really good. I guess it depends on what you are versing but I think it has a good amount of fire power. I definitely think a daemonprince with wings is a must take in most lists and would do well in yours. Its a highly mobile psyker and aura buffer, and is extremely deadly in CC especially with an elixir and diabolic strength or warptime.

Have you considered running 2 10man cultist squads and a big blob of them? In my last two games they were fantastic bubble wraps, screens and objective holders. Put them in cover near an apostle and/or lord and they can do some real work for not much investment.

**ZergSmasher**

I'm curious as to whether Arkos the Faithless is a competitive choice for an AL list. The +1 Command Point is nice, as is the -1 to hit that stacks with our legion trait, but I'm just not sure if Arkos is worth his points. Reason I ask is because I could build my own custom version of him and I have pretty much decided to play my CSM competitively as Alpha Legion.

**Simaka**

Returning AL player here (haven't played since 5e!)

What is the viability of running a list with heavy use of Hellbrutes for alpha legion? I love the models and the distinction from our loyalist counterparts, trying to pick the legion which works best for them.

Also, what are people's thoughts on vehicle use for AL in general. For heavy support, are havocs considered the best because of the -1 to hit, or do preds / defilers have their place even with us?

**Tidfortad**

I have ran las/ML brutes, as well as havocs with a mix of HBs and MLs as a back-line to great effect. If you go into a game knowing that you will face lots of armor, feel free to switch MLs for las. While the oblits delete key units along with forward deployed units, you can have a solid -1 to hit back-line protected by cultists that dish out some serious damage.

Concerning other vehicles, preds are more durable than both havocs and hellbrutes, and come at a lower cost than brutes in terms of dakka. But I feel that the fact that brutes don't degrade while also getting the -1 to hit might out-weigh that. I have not tested preds in my AL lists yet though, so who knows.

**Opeth**

Hey all. New to the forum. Had a question about the alpha legion warlord trait. When a alpha legion warlord is slain we can elect another alpha legion character to be our warlord. Does he also get the previous warlords war gear ? Or does he just get whatever he is equipped with at the start of the game. Example: I have 5 chaos lords with chain swords I have given my warlord blade of the hydra when he is slain does the next chaos lord chosen get blade of the hydra. Cheers

**ZergSmasher**

Opeth wrote:
Hey all. New to the forum. Had a question about the alpha legion warlord trait. When a alpha legion warlord is slain we can elect another alpha legion character to be our warlord. Does he also get the previous warlords war gear ? Or does he just get whatever he is equipped with at the start of the game. Example: I have 5 chaos lords with chain swords I have given my warlord blade of the hydra when he is slain does the next chaos lord chosen get blade of the hydra. Cheers

I don't think wargear transfers, only the trait (and you roll a new one in addition to gaining I am Alpharius).

**orchewer**

I just finished a game with my Alpha Legion army and I wanted to reiterate to all my fellow Alpha Legion players out there ...

Use. The. Forward. Operatives. Stratagem.

First turn, I used that stratagem and brought 20 Possessed Marines onto my opponent's door step. They then proceeded to slaughter an entire squad of 16 Iron Warrior Marines. Huge distraction that allowed the rest of my army to pick up the Relic and hurry back to my lines untouched. It is an amazing stratagem.

**Slayer-Fan123**

ZergSmasher wrote:
I'm curious as to whether Arkos the Faithless is a competitive choice for an AL list. The +1 Command Point is nice, as is the -1 to hit that stacks with our legion trait, but I'm just not sure if Arkos is worth his points. Reason I ask is because I could build my own custom version of him and I have pretty much decided to play my CSM competitively as Alpha Legion.

Look at what he provides first. For less than 130 points:
1. He can infiltrate by himself, so mobility is a non-issue.
2. He provides a different kind of buff compared to the usual rerolls of 1 on stuff, making him less redundant depending on the field and list.
3. He gives an extra command point, which is great because the army can be starved for them. He's gonna be your warlord anyway because he makes good bait to kill or charge into suicide situations and you don't have to worry about Slay The Warlord.
4. He's obnoxious to shoot which is kinda funny.

He's not mandatory but an Alpha Legion list should definitely consider him every time. He's a good price and a good character.

**Blueguy203**

So i have a question about using a pred in an AL army, since we can infiltrate with our infantry who can bring in high strength weapons, would it make to still equip the pred with lascannons or look at pred autocannons for more shots and consistent damage? Compared to the Havocs, the pred with autocannon is cheaper and would have more wounds for survivability. thoughts?

**Slayer-Fan123**

Blueguy203 wrote:
So i have a question about using a pred in an AL army, since we can infiltrate with our infantry who can bring in high strength weapons, would it make to still equip the pred with lascannons or look at pred autocannons for more shots and consistent damage? Compared to the Havocs, the pred with autocannon is cheaper and would have more wounds for survivability. thoughts?

The Autocannon isn't that bad mathematically against larger targets and provides more shots when you have to target infantry. The AutoLas is a pretty good TAC as far as I'm concerned.

**Blueguy203**

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Blueguy203 wrote:
So i have a question about using a pred in an AL army, since we can infiltrate with our infantry who can bring in high strength weapons, would it make to still equip the pred with lascannons or look at pred autocannons for more shots and consistent damage? Compared to the Havocs, the pred with autocannon is cheaper and would have more wounds for survivability. thoughts?

The Autocannon isn't that bad mathematically against larger targets and provides more shots when you have to target infantry. The AutoLas is a pretty good TAC as far as I'm concerned.

Yeah, originally I was looking at Havocs to infiltrate them with with better positioning but then i was looking at the hellforge predator and the options that thing comes with make it more attractive IMO.

**Rivener**

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

The list is 12 CP total (well 13 with Arkos). I can spend it if I want to.

12 CP? I am only counting 9 for the brigade, 10 if Akros is your warlord. What am I missing?

**Blueguy203**

Rivener wrote:
Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

The list is 12 CP total (well 13 with Arkos). I can spend it if I want to.

12 CP? I am only counting 9 for the brigade, 10 if Akros is your warlord. What am I missing?

You are forgetting the 3 free ones you get for starting off.

**Rivener**

Holy crap. I totally missed that in the rule book! I have been gimping myself!