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Made in us
Auspicious Aspiring Champion of Chaos






 Geifer wrote:
I bought the queen and will use her in my Chaos army. My local store seems to be participating in the campaign, so hey, maybe I'll even get to use her with all this portent stuff. No idea if she actually does anything for Blades of Khorne one way or another, but the model is too pretty to pass up.

 EnTyme wrote:
Why not? IMO, they add a layer of strategy and can help to mitigate a string of bad rolls. It's one thing I've been hoping to see added to AoS for a while now. Personally, I'm glad to see them.


I can think of a couple of reasons:

1. No idea how the portents are handled, but stratagems depend on how your army is built which is in no way balanced across armies. As a result, some armies simply get more use out of them than others. That can't be desirable.

2. Stratagems are typically front loaded to improve or enable an alpha strike. They don't so much turn around situations or games as prevent games from happening at all.

3. Stratagems are used much more in the list building stage than the game itself. Instead of improving the game by using a tactical option that is wise at the time, and thus using the entire breadth of option available, lists are built around a handful of options, and thus those are the options employed because the decision which tactical choice is the wisest has long been made when the game is played.

I think Age of Sigmar is better off sticking with (carefully distributed) command abilities than adopting stratagems. Stratagems are the formations of 8th ed: you get something for free, but your opponent gets so much more for free that you aren't even playing the same game anymore.

Disclaimer: Anecdotal evidence is anecdotal.


You should probably read the portents before you comment on them.

2000 Khorne Bloodbound (Skullfiend Tribe- Aqshy)
1000 Tzeentch Arcanites (Pyrofane Cult - Hysh) in progress
2000 Slaves to Darkness (Ravagers)
 
   
Made in us
Enigmatic Chaos Sorcerer




Tampa, FL

I just don't like stratagems in general. They add a strong unbalanced element. Although I do like the way MP handled it better than how 40k handles them. I especially liked how the matched play version gives you static prophecy points, you can't "game" the system to get more.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/02/13 18:08:06


- Wayne
Formerly WayneTheGame 
   
Made in de
Huge Bone Giant






 EnTyme wrote:
 Geifer wrote:
I bought the queen and will use her in my Chaos army. My local store seems to be participating in the campaign, so hey, maybe I'll even get to use her with all this portent stuff. No idea if she actually does anything for Blades of Khorne one way or another, but the model is too pretty to pass up.

 EnTyme wrote:
Why not? IMO, they add a layer of strategy and can help to mitigate a string of bad rolls. It's one thing I've been hoping to see added to AoS for a while now. Personally, I'm glad to see them.


I can think of a couple of reasons:

1. No idea how the portents are handled, but stratagems depend on how your army is built which is in no way balanced across armies. As a result, some armies simply get more use out of them than others. That can't be desirable.

2. Stratagems are typically front loaded to improve or enable an alpha strike. They don't so much turn around situations or games as prevent games from happening at all.

3. Stratagems are used much more in the list building stage than the game itself. Instead of improving the game by using a tactical option that is wise at the time, and thus using the entire breadth of option available, lists are built around a handful of options, and thus those are the options employed because the decision which tactical choice is the wisest has long been made when the game is played.

I think Age of Sigmar is better off sticking with (carefully distributed) command abilities than adopting stratagems. Stratagems are the formations of 8th ed: you get something for free, but your opponent gets so much more for free that you aren't even playing the same game anymore.

Disclaimer: Anecdotal evidence is anecdotal.


You should probably read the portents before you comment on them.


Good thing I commented on stratagems and not portents then, isn't it?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/02/13 18:24:40


Nehekhara lives! Sort of!
Why is the rum always gone? 
   
Made in us
Auspicious Aspiring Champion of Chaos






I definitely agree that they were handled better in AoS than 40k. I think the gap will be better in 40k once every faction has a codex, though. Hopefully, this is another case of GW using AoS to "beta test" 40k rules, and CP will be standardized in the next version of CA.

2000 Khorne Bloodbound (Skullfiend Tribe- Aqshy)
1000 Tzeentch Arcanites (Pyrofane Cult - Hysh) in progress
2000 Slaves to Darkness (Ravagers)
 
   
Made in us
Enigmatic Chaos Sorcerer




Tampa, FL

I think it needs to be. But that's neither here nor there. I sadly feel, as I said originally, like most of the malign portents things will be ignored in matched play.

- Wayne
Formerly WayneTheGame 
   
Made in us
Irked Necron Immortal




So played a game yesterday using Malign Portents. Made the game quite interesting and threw some unexpected things at us.

First thing I noticed was that I had a distict advantage when genereating points because I played DoT. I had 6 Wizards on the table vs his 2. I generated between 7 and 9 points a turn. I think the most he generated was 6. Neither of us had a Harbinger (he had Nagash soo....).

I haven't really read the different Portents but they seem to work around a kind of theme. In my case I had rolled the Balemoon which liked to do things on the Opponents turn and mess with units during battleshock. His Portent had some interesting effects, like -6 to shooting range or letting a unit Fly for a turn.

We both found them to not be game breaking while adding some fun elements into the game
   
Made in us
Auspicious Aspiring Champion of Chaos






One good thing is that the Matched Play scenarios give a fixed number of Prophecy Points, so you won't run into the 40k issue of one side having 30 CP while the other has 6.

2000 Khorne Bloodbound (Skullfiend Tribe- Aqshy)
1000 Tzeentch Arcanites (Pyrofane Cult - Hysh) in progress
2000 Slaves to Darkness (Ravagers)
 
   
Made in us
Clousseau




I spent some time up at my store over the weekend talking about the Malign Portents thing I was running Apr - May. We have about 12 interested to play, but of the 12 I'm the only one that has the Malign Portents book. No one was interested in picking that up or in using the rules.

The rules will be in effect for the campaign but will largely not be used by the bulk of the players unless I am there because there is no incentive for them to buy the book since it won't be used in typical matched play.
   
Made in gb
Master Engineer with a Brace of Pistols






 EnTyme wrote:
One good thing is that the Matched Play scenarios give a fixed number of Prophecy Points, so you won't run into the 40k issue of one side having 30 CP while the other has 6.


Good. I was hoping that would be the case. What is it, like 3 for Vanguard, 6 for battlehost and 9 for warhost?

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/02/19 20:10:12


 
   
Made in us
Pious Palatine




 Future War Cultist wrote:
 EnTyme wrote:
One good thing is that the Matched Play scenarios give a fixed number of Prophecy Points, so you won't run into the 40k issue of one side having 30 CP while the other has 6.


Good. I was hoping that would be the case. What is it, like 3 for Vanguard, 6 for battlehost and 9 for warhost?


It's 12 for battlehost. Also, fun fact, while you don't get an Extra D6 in matched play or the extra 3 for taking a harbinger, you DO get +1 for every priest or wizard still. Meaning a Tzeentch changehost has enough prophecy points to use EVERY stratagem at MAX power in whatever group of 6 they so choose.

These are far, far worse and far far less balanced than they are at 40k.


 
   
Made in us
Irked Necron Immortal




To be specific its 3 points for every 500 with an additional 1 for every wizard or priest. Harbingers do not generate points, but if both players have a Harbinger in their collection and NOT in their roster they can field 1 for free. However, if the (free) Harbinger is either a Darkoath Warqueen or the Cave Shaman they can generate 3 additional points. Yeah I don't get it either.

You can get points for playing in Shyish or having a Hero garrisoning a Warscryer Citadel but that's not going to happen even in Open/Narrative play 99% of the time
   
Made in gb
Fresh-Faced New User




we have a campaign just started, one of the requirements was that everyone had to have the book, which solved much problems and with games at only 1000pts, the abilities and games I found much more fun. playing the narrative games with matched play points meant at most people had 6 points per tunr.
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




How is the Malign Portents painting competition going in your areas?

In my local GW and about 30 people signed up for month one, with only about 6 completing the task. (Understandable really, painting a starter box in a month is a big ask.) Month two only 2 of us painted a Harbinger. (I guess the price tag put people off.) Now month three, which should be ending Saturday 31st, the shop is putting on a Forgebane mega battle!

It's as if they completely forgot, or don't care. Did I just waste my time painting all that stuff? :(
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




If they're still sending in the result then I don't think it's wasted time. Every vote helps as they say.
   
Made in ro
Fresh-Faced New User




Who are the authors of the stories from malign portents?
   
Made in us
Clousseau




Members of the studio.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Well Tuesday will be the last short story for the Portents as the new edition dawns. Sad to see such amazing shorts come to an end but there's always more amazing lore on the horizon.

At least the Hammerhal Herald will give a slight fix for fluff content as new books and the rpg are released.

Fingers crossed that next year sees such an amazing event with equally glorious trailers as the Soul War concludes, Slaanesh makes literal hell break loose and the mortal realms keep thr Age of Hope alive.
   
Made in gb
Master Engineer with a Brace of Pistols






This book is still worth getting isn’t it? For the fluff? I want to know what the hell the Necroquake is for example.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Oh indeed and for it's other contents as well.

As for the Necroquake, one thing I know about it is that when it struck the other realms it caused Shyish magic to tear great canyons in the lands that unleashed the malevolent NightHaunt hosts in the realms as the native spirits of criminals and the damned are conscripted for Nagash's campaign.

So the NightHaunt battletome should go more into as well show wraiths native to their own realms.(I hope the lightning geists from Azyrheim get represented)
   
Made in us
Blood Angel Terminator with Lightning Claws





Baal Fortress Monastery

Have they confirmed that the last story comes out this week? I figured they'd stop with the launch of 2.0, but I wasn't sure.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Indeed, devs confirmed Tuesday will be the last story as afterward the new edition lands and the Soul Wars finally kicks off.
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






Necroquake and it's effects are detailed in the core booj and I suspect will be in the last short story as well. Suffice it to say that this is the second time Nagash has tried to kill everything and make it undead, and history repeats itself in poetic fashion.

Spoiler:
Skaven screw it up.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/24 06:53:03


Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page

I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.

I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. 
   
Made in be
Courageous Beastmaster





Spoiler:
Yeah he really needs some good rat security. I mean that's the third time now.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
I also loved the one mention we have of Tyrion and Teclis throughout all this:

"They'll have secured their interests in hysh I'm sure" ,Malerion.

Like the Aelf gods don't give a

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2018/06/24 15:23:39





 
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






Have they ever? The Elf gods of the old world didn't care much beyond their own little sphere either. I actually like how they emphasized that in the End Times fluff by making Malekith still the rightful heir to the phoenix throne--being burned by the fire was a trial that he simply failed. Asuryion didn't give a dam about morality or quality of character; the bloodline was what mattered.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/24 22:18:23


Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page

I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.

I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. 
   
Made in us
Ollanius Pius - Savior of the Emperor






Gathering the Informations.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Have they ever? The Elf gods of the old world didn't care much beyond their own little sphere either. I actually like how they emphasized that in the End Times fluff by making Malekith still the rightful heir to the phoenix throne--being burned by the fire was a trial that he simply failed. Asuryion didn't give a dam about morality or quality of character; the bloodline was what mattered.

Remember that a part of it as well was that his claims that the Flame of Asuryan was tampered with? They were legitimate claims too!

The Elf gods were definitely...interesting. I really want to see what we get out of Kurnous and Lileath now.
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






Lileath was a straight-up bitch imo.

Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page

I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.

I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. 
   
Made in us
Ollanius Pius - Savior of the Emperor






Gathering the Informations.

 NinthMusketeer wrote:
Lileath was a straight-up bitch imo.

Fair, although I do think part of it comes from Morai-Hag getting involved during the whole Naggarythe civil war in the Sundering.

The Elf pantheon seemed to be closer to the Greeks than anything else imo. The gods chose 'sides', had bloodlines associated with them, etc.
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






Hm, I never thought of it that way before but I see what you mean.

Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page

I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.

I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. 
   
Made in us
Blood Angel Terminator with Lightning Claws





Baal Fortress Monastery

NinthMusketeer wrote:Necroquake and it's effects are detailed in the core booj and I suspect will be in the last short story as well. Suffice it to say that this is the second time Nagash has tried to kill everything and make it undead, and history repeats itself in poetic fashion.

Spoiler:
Skaven screw it up.

Is that really how it goes down?

Baron Klatz wrote:Indeed, devs confirmed Tuesday will be the last story as afterward the new edition lands and the Soul Wars finally kicks off.

Darn that's a shame we won't be getting more. I've been enjoying the stories so far.
   
Made in us
Humming Great Unclean One of Nurgle






 Red Comet wrote:
NinthMusketeer wrote:Necroquake and it's effects are detailed in the core booj and I suspect will be in the last short story as well. Suffice it to say that this is the second time Nagash has tried to kill everything and make it undead, and history repeats itself in poetic fashion.

Spoiler:
Skaven screw it up.

Is that really how it goes down?
Spoiler:
Not that they specifically masterminded the whole thing, more of a 'happy accident' involving the untimely trapping of some elite eshin infiltrators expendable slaves.

Road to Renown! It's like classic Path to Glory, but repaired, remastered, expanded! https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/778170.page

I chose an avatar I feel best represents the quality of my post history.

I try to view Warhammer as more of a toolbox with examples than fully complete games. 
   
 
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