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 Vankraken wrote:


This is the Imperium of Man in the 41st millennium, suspicion and closed mindedness are the status quo and everything done by the Emperor is treated as being divine and holy. For some Mechanicus magos to take one of His creations (the gene seeds for the adeptus astartes) and manipulate it to be "better" is heresy of the highest magnitude. To think some lowly mortal/robot/whatever can make something better than the Emperor himself could make is both insulting to the Emperor, tech heresy, and possibly a plot by Chaos to corrupt the Emperor's work. I would see other chapters accepting the leadership of Gulliman well before accepting this corrupted geneseed into their fold.

Perhaps so, but my point is that acceptance of the Primaris and reverence of Guilliman are not necessarily linked. One can be OK with one while not being OK with another.

And Ad Mech messing with the geneseed is not exactly a new thing. They've always done it. Does 21st (Cursed) Founding ring a bell?

So I hear that the Flesh Tearers refused to have Primaris marines added to their ranks as they do not have the gene flaw and therefore do not know how to carry on with said flaw.

Gabriel Seth didn't like them initially, but they still have them.

Could be though that he only accepted them because...well, a primarch showed up to turn them over to him.

I would imagine the Flesh Tearers treat their primaris marines much like the Dark Angels and keep them at arms' length. The DA view the primaris somewhat suspiciously/resentfully and don't fully integrate them into the chapter's culture.

It's a cop-out for letting players decide whether they want to build armies that are mixed marines or "pure" one way or another, sure, but I'm happy that it sets a lore precedent for these sort of things. Lets everyone play with their toy soldiers how they want.

Well I'm glad the Dark Angels don't trust Primaries. I like the idea of the Ultima Founding chapters having a bit of a hurdle to overcome in that regard. Far better than everyone is just Bros, cuz even if that is the case you know it can't last long.

Also, kind of a funny story. When I bought the medium starter box and was reading about Primaris Marines I got interested and so I googled them at work while on my break. I read the bit about the secret Legions on Mars and I say aloud 'fething heretics!', not noticing the lady standing beside me... That got me a weird look!

Did anyone else have that reaction when they read about the Primaris Marines creation?

 darkcloak wrote:

Did anyone else have that reaction when they read about the Primaris Marines creation?

Yes, the whole lore is a mess. But It helped me to think it basically as a new Cursed Founding, except this time things have gone a bit better (at least thus far.) In my headcanon the Cursed Founding was basically for testing prototype Primaris marines.

I rather like the idea of Primaris Marines, maybe sans the whole 10k old already part, but like you say as something flawed. Or perhaps they struggle in the same way as regular marines? Losing homeworlds or getting stomped in battle and having to rebuild. And we all know some of them are going to fall to chaos sooner or later.

That's when PMs are going to get interesting!

I think it might be a stretch to say the dark angels don't trust the primaris marines, at least anymore than the dark angels distrust everyone that's not already in the inner circle. Some of the primaris have been added to the inner circle, more as matter of necessity than desire (kind of hard to keep secrets from telepaths). The line I think everyone misinterprets is:

Typically such men served in the Deathwing, where they further distinguished themselves, although with the arrival of reinforcements from the Ultima Founding, promotions to Company Master without membership of the Inner Circle is far less rare than of old.

It can take a Dark Angel a hundred years to earn their way into the inner circle if they ever make it at all. In fact the vast majority of dark angels never earn their way in. So I wouldn't read too much into the fact primaris Masters are rarely if ever part of the inner circle, that will probably change as time goes on. As far as the dark angels are concerned the new guys haven't put in their time. Being in the inner circle isn't a privilege, or an honor bestowed like a medal, it's a burden shared between genebrothers with only those that they know can bear it.

I also suspect when we start seeing primaris versions of special characters their stance will have softened. It would be hard to argue against their inclusion in the inner circle when say azrael is one of them.