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Alpha strike is a real problem that can end a game turn one.

Alternate activation isn't a new concept I really don't get why gw does not adopt it.

They prefer IGUGO for their game?

pm713 wrote:
They prefer IGUGO for their game?

No, GW prefers an Action/Reaction system
but over time with the "Fantasy and 40k must be different but similar" stuff got wired and 40k became more "fantasy in space" and they wre never able to adopted the preferred system for a shooting heavy modern SciFi game

That is why we have now an Action/Reaction, IGoUGo and alternate activation mix without a concept as some parts are just left overs from the past and others are ideas from other games that were added for the sake of change
a more streamlined version that focus on one type of game and stick to it through all releases would be a huge improvement

 deathwinguk wrote:
RT (1987)
2nd edition (1993)
3rd edition (1998)
4th edition (2004)
5th edition (2008)
6th edition (2012)
7th edition (2014)
8th edition (2017)

I played RT, and now I'm buying into 8th edition. It seems like the time between editions has halved over the years. Slimming down the core rules is good for the gameplay and for the ability to update it without releasing a new edition, but GW needs to find a sensible way to make updates without FAQ bloat.

So a new edition of AoS has just been announced, 3 years after the last edition. Given that's also the previous WH40K time between editions it's probably a good estimate for the future. So perhaps 9th edition in 2020?

 deathwinguk wrote:

 deathwinguk wrote:
RT (1987)
2nd edition (1993)
3rd edition (1998)
4th edition (2004)
5th edition (2008)
6th edition (2012)
7th edition (2014)
8th edition (2017)

I played RT, and now I'm buying into 8th edition. It seems like the time between editions has halved over the years. Slimming down the core rules is good for the gameplay and for the ability to update it without releasing a new edition, but GW needs to find a sensible way to make updates without FAQ bloat.

So a new edition of AoS has just been announced, 3 years after the last edition. Given that's also the previous WH40K time between editions it's probably a good estimate for the future. So perhaps 9th edition in 2020?

I am pretty sure GW wont give up on editions, its not like an RPG, it really can get to the point where enough FAQ and changes can make it completely new

What we might see is that new editions are more a clean up of FAQ and previous rule adjustments with a little bit of new stuff changed - as opposed to the historical edition changes where the adjustments are far more widespread.

Heck even if GW changed very little people would still buy into it just to have lal the rules updated in a single book instead of spread through FAQ, Errata, Rulebook, annual handbook etc...

 Overread wrote:
What we might see is that new editions are more a clean up of FAQ and previous rule adjustments with a little bit of new stuff changed - as opposed to the historical edition changes where the adjustments are far more widespread.

Heck even if GW changed very little people would still buy into it just to have lal the rules updated in a single book instead of spread through FAQ, Errata, Rulebook, annual handbook etc...

I would

 Overread wrote:
What we might see is that new editions are more a clean up of FAQ and previous rule adjustments with a little bit of new stuff changed - as opposed to the historical edition changes where the adjustments are far more widespread.

Heck even if GW changed very little people would still buy into it just to have lal the rules updated in a single book instead of spread through FAQ, Errata, Rulebook, annual handbook etc...

Yeah it really is more convenient, I hate FAQ, I dont have a cellphone or a printer, so I personally vastly prefer having hardcopy.

There was a rumor going around that the devs were bored out of their minds with 40k after the push for 8th. If they have any say in the matter, I would think that they would reluctant to start that meatgrinder up again.

Especially after the grief they get from all sides no matter what they do.

Jim they'll always get kickback however right now the 8th edition changes have brought so much additional income to GW that they beat everything else in London in the stock market. Even if the designers wanted to go back to the old style I doubt they'd be allowed to - the new approach is not just shown to be profitable but super-profitable. If anything I'd expect them to build on the strength of 8th edition. It makes not only good balance; good game but also good financial sense.

It's basically win-win for the vast majority of people

So, with the announcement of Codex: Space Wolves and Codex: Orks, how many more codexes are there to come? And how long after the final codex would people expect to be able to play 8th edition before it's retired?

Xeno wise there's only Genestealer Cults to come

Imperial wise we know Sisters of Battle are next year. After that it really depends how GW wants to take the rest of the Imperial line. The Assassins and Sisters of Silence both have no codex; so GW can either make them into full armies (or at least support armies).

 Overread wrote:
Xeno wise there's only Genestealer Cults to come

Imperial wise we know Sisters of Battle are next year. After that it really depends how GW wants to take the rest of the Imperial line. The Assassins and Sisters of Silence both have no codex; so GW can either make them into full armies (or at least support armies).

Sisters of silence are not getting a codex they are getting a "codex" in Imperial Armour Talons of the Emperor by the end of the year.

 Overread wrote:
Xeno wise there's only Genestealer Cults to come

I'm sure that the Ynnari will get something even if it's not a full codex.

There are also rumors of a new human faction.
We know for sure some Rogue Trader minis are coming with one of the Kill Team box set (but might be in a while), so maybe there will be a larger release.

 krodarklorr wrote:

Stux wrote:
My hunch is that 8th will be around for a while. I think they're trying out the living rules thing.

We may well get an 8.1 and so on, where they rerelease the rulebook and Codexes with updates and errata. But I don't expect a full reboot for several years.

I hope this is the case. Because I'm a big fan of 8th.

You should put out more battle reports. I enjoyed watching them.

Danny slag wrote:
I kinda wish they'd go to 9th and scrap the turns for alternating activations. As long as each army moves in entirety before the other army 40k will always boil down to mass fire alpha strikes. It's nearly impossible to balance or have deep tactics when turns are so lopsided.

The answer to the Alpha Strike is more LOS blocking terrain + proper deployment.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Stormonu wrote:
You know what will happen, right? New Sisters models & codex in May 2019 - then new edition that July, in which the Sisters are squatted.

Does seem to be the way of it, doesn't it?

You see the Christmas decorations go up, and you know Thanksgiving isn't far off.

You see a Sisters Codex, you know a new edition of the rules is maybe two months away.

phydaux wrote:

Danny slag wrote:
I kinda wish they'd go to 9th and scrap the turns for alternating activations. As long as each army moves in entirety before the other army 40k will always boil down to mass fire alpha strikes. It's nearly impossible to balance or have deep tactics when turns are so lopsided.

The answer to the Alpha Strike is more LOS blocking terrain + proper deployment.

Cheap troop screens are also an important part of the solution.

What if any army doesn't have any cheap troops? My basic line troops cost 40+pts without any heavy weapons added.

Karol wrote:
What if any army doesn't have any cheap troops? My basic line troops cost 40+pts without any heavy weapons added.

Imperial guard allies for your custodes

How is LOS Blocking terrain an answer to Alpha Strike?

On a related note, and I am in fact being serious, have we reached peak levels of "MORE TERRAIN!" and everyone is just using it as a joke to troll or do people really believe that adding more terrain will fix the game?

"Khorne Berserkers are OP and broken!" ADD MORE TERRAIN!
"Flyrants are ruining the game!" ADD MORE TERRAIN!
"There's too much terrain on the board to play anymore!" ADD MORE TERRAIN!!!!!!!!!

SemperMortis wrote:
How is LOS Blocking terrain an answer to Alpha Strike?

On a related note, and I am in fact being serious, have we reached peak levels of "MORE TERRAIN!" and everyone is just using it as a joke to troll or do people really believe that adding more terrain will fix the game?

"Khorne Berserkers are OP and broken!" ADD MORE TERRAIN!
"Flyrants are ruining the game!" ADD MORE TERRAIN!
"There's too much terrain on the board to play anymore!" ADD MORE TERRAIN!!!!!!!!!

my roommate uses khorne berserkers, they aint so bad. I mean their attacks and rules around them are super silly, but they are easy enough to kill.

 Overread wrote:
Xeno wise there's only Genestealer Cults to come

Imperial wise we know Sisters of Battle are next year. After that it really depends how GW wants to take the rest of the Imperial line. The Assassins and Sisters of Silence both have no codex; so GW can either make them into full armies (or at least support armies).

If Sisters get anything more than a 3 page article in the 2018 Chapter Approved I will be astonished.

Or more like the 2019 Chapter Approved, right on time for the 2020 drop of 9th Ed.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

SemperMortis wrote:
How is LOS Blocking terrain an answer to Alpha Strike?

On a related note, and I am in fact being serious, have we reached peak levels of "MORE TERRAIN!" and everyone is just using it as a joke to troll or do people really believe that adding more terrain will fix the game?

"Khorne Berserkers are OP and broken!" ADD MORE TERRAIN!
"Flyrants are ruining the game!" ADD MORE TERRAIN!
"There's too much terrain on the board to play anymore!" ADD MORE TERRAIN!!!!!!!!!

Terrain allows you to set up so you are behind LOS-blocking features so you can't be shot at if your gunline opponent gets first go. It also allows you to advance on objectives and not get shot at, or if you are shot at then it is only by a small portion of his army and not the whole gunline.

LOS blocking terrain negates some of the bad rules in this edition, so it is an answer to be used without having house rules
the same is for lowering point per battle and play 1000 instead of 2000 points.

1k points on a standard size table with lot of LOS blocking terrain is a complete different game

phydaux wrote:

If Sisters get anything more than a 3 page article in the 2018 Chapter Approved I will be astonished.

Or more like the 2019 Chapter Approved, right on time for the 2020 drop of 9th Ed.

Beta codex rules in 2018, codex in 2019 as per GW.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

SemperMortis wrote:
How is LOS Blocking terrain an answer to Alpha Strike?

On a related note, and I am in fact being serious, have we reached peak levels of "MORE TERRAIN!" and everyone is just using it as a joke to troll or do people really believe that adding more terrain will fix the game?

"Khorne Berserkers are OP and broken!" ADD MORE TERRAIN!
"Flyrants are ruining the game!" ADD MORE TERRAIN!
"There's too much terrain on the board to play anymore!" ADD MORE TERRAIN!!!!!!!!!

Allows you to protect key units from being blown.

Oh and does protect from assault units as well in a way adding more distance they need to cover. Makes it easier to funnel berserkers from key units.

But sure play on empty billiard table and see how it goes

Too much terrain and the armies with "ignore LOS" weapons are laughing at you, and shooting you from somewhere it will take ages to get to (and they can bubblewrap all the approaches out to 12" with about 10 men)

Mark.

I really wish GW would go back and do some new kits for some of the older lines. I'd love to see some new plastic Imperial Guard troops. Steel Legion, Mordians, etc. Would be awesome.

I can see 8th edition sticking around in one form or another, however, we are rapidly approaching a point where books will need to be reprinted as "8.1" books with updated rules. We are at the point where quite a few of the rules to play the game in the core rulebook are false now, and each Codex is barely worth the material it is printed on since so many units have had points/rules changes, or desperately need point changes.

8th has some great ideas, and is a decent foundation to build off of, it just needs some cleaning up at this point to have decent longevity.

9th won't come out anytime soon. Chapter Approved is like the DLC method, so GW will milk that

 deathwinguk wrote:

So a new edition of AoS has just been announced, 3 years after the last edition. Given that's also the previous WH40K time between editions it's probably a good estimate for the future. So perhaps 9th edition in 2020?

This is the most relevant information we can assess. GW being a public company will be driven by a relentless need for profit. While the majority of revenue comes from models their rules revenue is probably significant. Did AoS need a reboot?