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I guess the benefit of kill team and being relatively elite, we can tailor our force with plenty of space in the Roster. Like, Gauss Blasters don't gain a huge amount over Flayers against GEQs right? So your Immortals are paying an extra 4 points p/m for +1 save and - 1AP. At 3 immortals you can be 4 warriors...

Against MEQs though, the S5 has a much bigger difference. You can math hammer it out if you want, but something I might experiment with.

I'm gonna try running x6 Immortals with Gauss later this week. I'll report back once its done.

 iGuy91 wrote:
I'm gonna try running x6 Immortals with Gauss later this week. I'll report back once its done.

Hopefully you're able to get a few games in with them, so you'll have better data to work off of (to rule out fluke occurrences) and determine how well they perform..

I played my first game yesterday, and it was... pretty much a disaster. Granted, we were playing very "rules-light" just to get a feel for the game, and I know we did a few a things wrong, but I'm struggling to see how I can make my team more viable.

I feel like I don't have the same tactical flexibility that other factions have. We have a bunch of S4, 1 damage weapons. Aside from Flayed Ones, which didn't perform great for me, we're absolutely lost once we get locked in melee. And compared to something like the Tyranid Warriors, our shooting really isn't that strong, either. Assault 3 24" feels way stronger than Rapid Fire 1 24".

I'll run Deathmarks next time to see how they fare, but I'm a little disheartened. How's everyone else doing?

We don't perform well in melee. Stay away from it! And if you are going against T3, then maybe deathmarks long range can help. I've typically used Immortals, for their extra strength (not useful vs T3), and only had two flayed ones to distract / pull combatants. Everyone else shoots.

Played 2 games last night with this list:

2 x Deathmarks (Sniper and Comms)
2x Flayed Ones (one combat)
3x Immortals

First Game against Death Watch - Lost (only just)

He had 5 models, two of which were melee guys (one thunder hammer, one maul and shield). I managed to kill only two of his models both of which were done by my combat flayed one (he kept two of his models close together and i charged them both from out of sight so got in and managed to kill them with the amount of wounds i was getting). It was a control point based game and it basically came down to the last fight phase of the game where my flayed one was in combat with his last non melee vet but I didn't kill him and he managed to kill me back (meaning he kept the near by control point and that won him the game due to him killing 2 more of my models (both had 1 control point)!). Was a fun game of kiting his melee guys so they only ended up killing one of my flayed ones with them.

Second game against Death Guard - Won (only just)

Was against 5 plague marines and 2 poxwalkers. His guy with a plague flail was his Vet and he used the CP to advance before the first turn right in front of me. I got initialive in the first turn and charged him with my combat flayed one and managed to kill him in the first round of combat (The CP to increase my strength by 1 in the fight phase was amazing here)! The only other kill I managed was with my other flayed one on his pox walkers. He had a marine with a big axe (sorry don't know the name but was basically a thunder hammer) in combat with my flayed one but he took 3 turns to kill him due to getting high damage rolls and always getting a 6 on one of the injury rolls (RP to the rescue). My shooting and his shooting ended up killing no one. He survived primarily due to making 6 5+ armour saves in a row on the same marine I was focus firing on a control point. I survived shooting due to him having bad hit rolling dice (he could save but never hit with weapons). The game ended with us both on 1 control point but I had killed more models.

MVP in both games was the combat specialist Flayed One. Deathmarks didn't kill anyone or inflict any flesh wounds but my opponents did have to work around them so affected the game that way. Against marines the immortals should have been great with the -2 AP but my opponents just kept making 5+ armour saves (the only 1 that got through ended up being a flesh wound in the first game). I am going to continue with this list and see how it fairs against other armies before coming up with any conclusions but I was impressed so far against opponents I thought would steam roll me. Best advice (that i forgot in first game till the end) PLAY TO THE OBJECTIVES.

hvg3akaek wrote:
We don't perform well in melee. Stay away from it! And if you are going against T3, then maybe deathmarks long range can help. I've typically used Immortals, for their extra strength (not useful vs T3), and only had two flayed ones to distract / pull combatants. Everyone else shoots.

Agreed, STR5 is a little over-blown against T3. But I think the 3+ save is important too, which cannot be discounted.

It just me though, or does RP still kind of suck?

 iGuy91 wrote:

It just me though, or does RP still kind of suck?

It's reasonable against high damage weapons, although you don't see many of those.

It may not be as good as Disgustingly Resilient, but it's infinitely better than it is in 40k.

It is very feast or famine. Against the first Wound you take while in cover, it takes you from a 1/3 chance of death to 1/6. That's huge. But some games it'll do... literally nothing.

 iGuy91 wrote:
It just me though, or does RP still kind of suck?

 DarknessEternal wrote:
It may not be as good as Disgustingly Resilient, but it's infinitely better than it is in 40k.

I prefer the 40k version, but clearly that won't work in this setting. I find the idea of 'getting back up after defeated' as much more fitting than 'not going down in the first place'. And yeah, it's really hard to trigger. 1 in 6 per guy, and it stops working once you are removed. And then, since most of the time your opponent is rolling, if that six comes up, they reroll it.

I've had a mini or two been 'healed' of their flesh wounds, but more often than not, I can go through a game without a single mini being triggered.


Now, if it was instead the same roll that everyone else had, and then I'd just lay my model down, and each turn roll a d6, and stand them back up on a 5+, I think that would work better and be more fitting to how the necrons feel. Maybe only a 6+ if the team is broken? I don't know, but I'm not feeling that it's overly useful.

hvg3akaek wrote:

 iGuy91 wrote:
It just me though, or does RP still kind of suck?

 DarknessEternal wrote:
It may not be as good as Disgustingly Resilient, but it's infinitely better than it is in 40k.

I prefer the 40k version, but clearly that won't work in this setting. I find the idea of 'getting back up after defeated' as much more fitting than 'not going down in the first place'. And yeah, it's really hard to trigger. 1 in 6 per guy, and it stops working once you are removed. And then, since most of the time your opponent is rolling, if that six comes up, they reroll it.

I've had a mini or two been 'healed' of their flesh wounds, but more often than not, I can go through a game without a single mini being triggered.

Now, if it was instead the same roll that everyone else had, and then I'd just lay my model down, and each turn roll a d6, and stand them back up on a 5+, I think that would work better and be more fitting to how the necrons feel. Maybe only a 6+ if the team is broken? I don't know, but I'm not feeling that it's overly useful.

I would much prefer something like that. Nothing like being cut down by Hormogaunts in CC and having a 1/6 chance to stand back up, but then getting blown apart by a heavy venom cannon and going all T-1000.

And there are so many 1 damage weapons that it really feels like we're working in reverse from how we should.

Wow, I totally missed the part where the attacker rolls the injury roll most of the time, despite their great pains to point it out. That does make RP even worse. I played my first Necron game yesterday, 5 Immortals and 2 FO against some Nyds in Search and Rescue. Overall I did better than I had expected, but he managed to swarm the objective on the last turn with a good initiative roll. I'll have to try proxying in some Pariahs as DM in my next game to see if they do any better (been on a bit of a 40k hiatus).

~Trueborn

Played against Primaris last night, and they are just so much better. Typically cheaper, longer range weapons, better weapon options, more HP, more attacks, and ignoring first flesh wound was much more beneficial than a slightly stronger gun that was -2AP instead of -1AP, and a "reanimation" that triggered exactly 1 time...and he used a CP to reroll it. Definitely felt overpriced as he cut through more and more of my guys...


Also, harlies really messed up my shooting

I was gonna say, honestly, my best games so far have been against primaris/space marines. My hardest was against death guard, and was realllllly annoying.

But I agree. RP is irritatingly bad.

Played the "destroy facility" mission last night, taking an unusua team of 2 deathmark (leader + comms) and 7 flayed ones (combat + zealot). Why? because I went up against GSC before, and with their 13 bodies, was overwhelmed by numbers. This time, with bodies a little more even, I managed to destroy two pieces of the facility, and snatch a victory.

Had some terrible rolling (about 80% of my roles were below 3), but managed to hold fast enough to keep my main guys alive on two of the three turns, so it's a win all around. Wouldn't take that team normally, but thought it would be interesting to test it out (It did make the shooting phase very boring!)

Huh...thats a kind of neat way of running them. I imagine that would work vs. nids as well.

It might, but nids bring lots of melee attacks and some shooting; GSC worked because there were three genestealers (who were still nasty), but a whole lot of guys with guns who I could tie up in melee. The melee troops vs ranged troops was what really helped in that case.

I think RP compares pretty well to DR actually, especially with 2+ damage weapons, it's just DG combine it with 3+ saves on everyone and (the real kicker) toughness 5. You get wounds through more rarely, so those DR procs sting more. Really you need plasma (and ideally overcharged) to take those guys down. Possibly as a meta call you might do well in a tournament if people are teched to take on DR or Primaris... But, ofc, you can just choose not to use overcharge.

I've found the real trouble Necrons have is just a weak offense. Maybe we are tough, but our choice of weapons is uninspiring to say the least. Flayed Ones seem like they'd be good in combat, but they have no AP and no base Str boost... they're basically as good as an Ork with a Choppa for twice the points (sure, harder to take out). Sure, they're amazing in combat... compared to an Immortal, but they just get cut apart by ACTUAL combat specialists.

I don't even know what they do to fix it, because Necrons in 40k also have a crippling lack of options. The one option we do have, Tesla vs Gauss, the right option like 80% of the time is Gauss anyway. Wraiths would be great units as they have multidamage, cool special abilities, and some equipment options, but they're going to blow your point budget right away.

I've picked up a Scion team just to have some fun building a list, as all I get to do with my Necrons is fiddle with the number of each troop.

I would have liked to see a lychguard, even if it was expensive. But considering how other "really expensive" units have had drops in prices for KT, I could see them getting a slight dip - maybe 25 points each? That makes them as expensive as a Lictor, and honestly, not as good. (slower, less WS, no ranged, weaker, less wounds, less attacks...it's only their gear, save, and RP that could make them worthwhile).

hey, since they let harlies and reivers have their pseudo-flight, and Tau stealthsuits have actual flight, it could be nice to see some praetorians in (or even just one?). With no dynasties, they aren't as poor a choice as in 40k, so that would be a nice way of getting something different into our KT.

I need to get a few more games in but I can't shake the feeling that Necrons are a bit weak. It's a combination of lots of little things: high points cost, no weapon/upgrade options, almost no melee choice, no heavy / multi-damage weapons and RP mostly sucking due to the low probability & opponent just re-rolling it.
Any one or two of those you could live with, but all added up means I'm not loving playing them. Time to look for a second faction to play, at very least to mix things up

Although Ive won my (only) two games vs. Admech (a lot of mistakes on both sides) I clearly had luck on my side like:
plasma selfdestroy even after reroll, charges that didnt make it,
somehow saved all 3+ sv in meele, killed infiltrators with Deathmarks in meele, all in all some really hot dice on my side and not so hot on my opponents side.

I too think that necrons are low tier. We lack basically everything.
We have NOT enough bodies to play and hold the obj.
NO multidmg weapons
NO mobility
Not strong enough shooting (only 1shot, 2 if in 12“ but then we get assaulted)
RUBISH in melee
NO options
slightly ocercosted (GW overestimated our tankyness again or is still doing it)

The only thing going for us is RP which gets rerolled anyway.

Just funny how they managed to make Necrons terrible in 40k AND Kill Team. Really shows the objectivity and love for this faction . As if we have to suffer because of 7th ed.

I've gotten to the point where the only things I even try to kill are the guys with the highest Ld.

I'll let the high damage guns pound me into the dirt, I can't compete on that front.

All I can do is be the last to break.

So, in campaign play: should the necrons' "reanimation protocol" effect the post-game casualty roll (the one made for any model with a flesh wound, but who is still on the field). Normally, 1-3 is "recovered", and 4-6 is "out of action"; should that reflect our RP during the game?

(note - I realise that, by the rules, it doesn't; rather, I'm asking *should* it - would that be appropriate, is it something that should be changed?)

To your point, probably should yeah.

That being said, Necrons are in a really rough spot for KT....Immortals are really over-priced I feel, but Warriors are too squishy...

Kinda sad ‚cause my local store started a KT campaign which is fun but by just looking at the other lists I just dont want to bring Necrons.

Every time it feels like an uphill battle even against „fluffy“ soft lists its just boring, plus one round of shooting on 5s with only 1 shot isnt really fun either...
Necrons are just a boring KT as of now...period.

EDIT: What I mean with boring is that Necrons dont feel like a specialized KT...Its just a deathmark rerolling ones or an Immortal „Leader“...

So I feel like the Commanders expansion is really good news for Necrons. With the addition of an Overlord to the team we can now run a warscythe to rip through the models that were previously our most troubling opponents.

I wonder what else we'll get. With "40+" commanders, we should be seeing ~2 or 3 each...could we get a cryptek, or a lord? Three different commanders for different styles of play?

hvg3akaek wrote:
I wonder what else we'll get. With "40+" commanders, we should be seeing ~2 or 3 each...could we get a cryptek, or a lord? Three different commanders for different styles of play?

How about a Lychguard? Wouldn't mind sword & board with INV saves. And right now Flayed Ones are inadequate for CC counterpunching.

I think we can be pretty sure we'll get a Cryptek commander. A Lord or Destroyer Lord or much less likely due to not having plastic models, and obviously a Command Barge is out of the question.

On a more general topic, I've switched to a team of all Flayed Ones and I've gone undefeated since then after having 1 game with gun guys.

You very much have to play the game as a game though and lawyer out the wins. Flayed Ones are just tough enough that they can do that while still sort of being a horde.

I don't usually kill more than 1-2 enemies per mission, but that's not what Necrons do.