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Thanos wasn't able to switch off Vision, or Wanda. And both (directly and indirectly, in that exact order) were powered by Infinity Stone stuff. Wanda is probably the closest in nature to Carol). So it seems likely he won't have that control over Carol Danvers. Mind you, he was missing one stone when he confronted Wanda, so that's a variable right there.
Vision is sort of less powered by a stone, and more that he Is the stone, or at least it’s a part of him, and thus the extensive surgery required to separate it and the discussion of how much of him would be left after they were to do so. And with Wanda, Thanos wasn’t just missing A stone, he was missing The stone that she got her powers from, namely the same Mind Stone that was part of Vision. If Carol shows up now, or even Wanda again, now he’s got their power source, so it might be a different story.
Athough depends "when" they fight him - also his gauntet looked pretty damaged?
I AM A MARINE PLAYER
"Unimaginably ancient xenos artefact somewhere on the planet, hive fleet poised above our heads, hidden 'stealer broods making an early start....and now a bloody Chaos cult crawling out of the woodwork just in case we were bored. Welcome to my world, Ciaphas."
Inquisitor Amberley Vail, Ordo Xenos
"I will admit that some Primachs like Russ or Horus could have a chance against an unarmed 12 year old novice but, a full Battle Sister??!! One to one? In close combat? Perhaps three Primarchs fighting together... but just one Primarch?" da001
Stark did say the Mind Stone itself worked much like a brain. The issue of personality could be interesting though. It’s kind of the same question they were worried about with how much of Vision is left if the stone is removed from his head. How of Vision resides in the stone when his head is removed from it? Also Thanos did it, shall we say “less gently” than the Avengers were trying to do it.
The only thing we truly know is Tony is pivotal to the successful outcome somehow.
Booked my ticket this morning (GAWD BLESS PAYDAY, AND ALL WHO SAIL UPON HER).
Going to a fancy cinema, too. Everyman, Canary Wharf. Worth a google, as it’s well lush. And seeing ultimately a big kids film in a wannabe poncy venue appeals to my sense of irony.
Plus their burgers look ace.
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Its gonna be like, 3 weeks or so till I see it, I hate seeing movies in crowded theaters.
Im likely gonna just roll up to the Drive In with my nephews next week and See it.
I'm just going to copypasta what I wrote on another board as I'm not typing this all out again. This movie has tons to unpack and work through, so my review/retelling is kinda stream of consciousness-y.
Either way, everything is a spoiler, so it goes in tags:
Spoiler:
Ok, unpacking this film is tough because there is so much to go through. To start with what a lot of others have said, this is the other side of the Infinity War coin. Where that film was Thanos first and foremost, this film was an Avengers film, specifically the core original six. On that alone it works.
Broadly the film is divided into three specific sections:
1. The fallout from Infinity War.
2. Adventures in Space and Time.
3. The Final Battle.
The fallout from Infinity War is the most dour part, as everyone has lost. It's interesting to see how people develop over this period, with Cap and Natasha unwilling to move on, Tony teaching Nebula to be more of a person (and failing to fix the ship), Clint losing the plot and turning into an anti-crime murder machine, and finally Thor giving into despondence and anguish, falling into a spiral of guilt, shame and self-loathing. And it's all fantastic stuff, and especially as the confrontation with Thanos happens so quickly during that part, and how that confrontation leads to nothing, makes it all the more interesting. Civil War broke the Avengers up, but Thanos disassembled them. And for all its showings in the posters and whatnot, the Hulkbuster suit is on screen for all of 30 seconds, if that, so yeah. Oh and Korg is there, and has clearly prayed to the Emperor of Mankind to rid of him of the influence of Bathos, the 5th God of Chaos, because he doesn't ruin a since scene he's in.
The Adventures in Time and Space section is where we get the most laughs, as it's the one where they get to play with the setting, revisit old time periods, but also have some serious drama. I love them revisiting New York during Loki's Chitarui invasion. This is where we get cameos a'plenty, and there are some amazing ones. Loki showing up again (and escaping with the Tesseract) is a maddening bit that will plague me until they definitively state whether he really will show up again. The balls Marvel has to have Cap go "Hail Hydra" into Agent Sitwell's ear in a sort-of recreation of the incredible elevator scene from Winter Soldier is just great. Robert Redford shows up!!! I did not see that coming at all. Cap fights himself, which was funny. Professor Hulk pretends to be angry, and then has a full conversation with The Ancient One, which was amazing. Revisiting the opening scene of Guardians one, but from Rhodey and Nebula's perspective was great, as was the method Thanos uses to find out what's going on. Plus the stuff in the 70's (70's?) with Howard Stark and Cap seeing Peggy, all amazing. Really the only real self-indulgent part is that they re-use the classic 360 around the Avengers from the first film, but as this is their victory lap I'll let them have it. We also get some fantastic stuff with Thor and Frigga, of all people. I think Frigga has more screentime in this film than in Thor/Thor 2 combined! Sadly no Lady Sif, although Jane Foster is in there with new stuff (but no lines it seems). Love Thor leaving with Mjolnir.
And then... Widow sacrifices herself so that Hawkeye can get the soul stone. I guess we're in for a wave of screeching "Fridging is soggy knees!" articles in the coming weeks, but for the scene itself it's heartbreaking. So is the aftermath with the remaining 5 back at base.
Then comes the final battle, and after Professor Hulk unsnaps the universe I deadset thought that Thanos' ship had killed Scott with that barrage. They survive, naturally, but it does mean that Tony, Cap and Thor have to take on Thanos by themselves. Even without the gauntlet Thanos is no slouch, and he cleans their clocks pretty damn well. Tony is knocked out cold, and Thor very nearly gets his own axe through his chest if not for...
Cap wielding Mjolnir!!!
The audience reaction to this bit was huge, with someone down the front just shouting "YES! YES!" when it happened. Totally worth it for the payoff of 11 years, as Cap engages Thanos 1-on-1, his shield in one arm, Mjolnir in the other. He uppercuts Thanos, he zaps him, he summons lightning. He does all the very Thor things, and it's simply amazing. It doesn't really work though, as, again, Thanos is a fething beast, nearly cuts Cap's shield in half with that double-blade thingy he has, and he doesn't go down.
Then Thanos swears to wipe out all existing life so that no one will know, and my heart skips a beat as I wonder if this is how they'll end the film and somehow justify mutants existing in the MCU. Thankfully no, that never comes to pass, but Thanos does roll out a massive army with everything we've seen him use so far (and some new giant hulking creatures in armour). The Black Order shows up again (I missed what happened to Corvus and Proxima this time, but the ends of Cull and Maw are very clear this time - I'll need more viewings to find them), and they're just advancing on Cap all by himself. It's very Jon Snow vs the entire Bolton army from Game of Thrones, except this time we get another great callback to previous films.
"Hey Cap... on your left!", and slingring portals start opening up everywhere. This is probablyh another indulgent moment, as they show everyone coming back, and more and more characters showing up (Wasp, Valk on a fething pegasus, everyone who dusted on Titan, Wakanda, the Wakanda army - all of them, with air support this time). Everyone who can be there is there. And I mean everyone. They all advance, meet up with Cap, and he finally orders the Avengers to assemble (more big reaction from the crowd, more "YES!" from the dude up the front of the cinema).
The battle is enormous and kinda dark, so it becomes hard to follow. It will require many viewings to get the full scope of all the stuff going on. I basically lose Rhodey, Rocket and Bucky during the fight. And honestly I've forgotten why Scott and Hope are trying to use Juan Punch Man's van (Luis does not show up, sadly). Scott gets some great moves (including squashing Cull), Valk proves why she's one of the Valkyrie, Falcon takes down one of those big things I mentioned before, and then Thanos finds himself up against a very-pissed-off-and-totally-not-holding-back Scarlet Witch. Holy crap does Wanda go to town on Thanos, to the point where she is literally about to tear him apart with her mind. Thanos has to cheat by calling in an orbital (or sub-orbital) bombardment just to escape. Thanos even has his ship fire on his own troops to get an advantage, something that the newly arrived Captain Marvel stops by doing that thing where she just flies through gak because she's basically invincible. The "all the women have each other's back" bit is about as cringe as the film gets (that and the America's Ass joke which is maybe used one too many times), mainly because of the geography of the battle makes it weird for all of them to be there at that point.
We get lots of keepaway from various characters, including a nice fight between Carol and Thanos where she actually gets angry and starts to really block everything he can hit her with (I call her the MCU's unstoppable force, but she may just be the MCU's immovable object as well) until Thanos just blasts her with the power stone. It's not an easy fight for either of them, but it never feels like Carol can just do it one handed, nor does it feel like Thanos is better than everyone. Strange and the students of Kamar-Taj are mostly on damage control, shielding a lot of incoming attacks. Strange himself has to spend a lot of time protecting the armies. Oh and Pepper is there, as Rescue, which is fething amazing. And Quill gets kicked in the balls by pre-Guardians Gamora. And Nebula kills Nebula, which is bizarre. And Spidey activates Instant-Kill mode, and it's amazing!
Eventually, finally, Tony realises that he has to make the sacrifice play, understanding that this is the one chance they have at winning (Strange makes that not so subtle as well). He gets the stones, and Thanos repeats the line he said just before Thor killed him at the start of the film: "I am inevitable". Very Agent Smith.
Tony responds with the best come back he can muster: "I am... Iron Man."
*snap*
Thanos' army begins to dust, and eventually Thanos himself goes. Tony dies, saying goodbye to Rhodey, Peter and finally Pepper. We get a very Return of the King multiple endings thing after that, all 100% earned, where we get even more cameos (Hill, Thunderbolt Ross, Hank Pym, Janet van Dyne, Tachalla's mother, Fury, Aunt May and even the kid from Iron Man 3). Cap passes the mantle onto Sam, which is great, and Cap finally gets to live his life as he chooses (Peggy got a happy ending!).
Overall yeah, this film is immense. I will need to see it again tomorrow just to get a handle on everything. And then see it again on Saturday.
And most surprising cameo has to be Jarvis, as in the Jarvis from Agent Carter. That surprised me more than Robert Redford showing up. That's a deep, deep cut for hardcore MCU fans, and I appreciated it, even if that show never got a third season.
Yeah, so much in this film. I don't think they left me dissatisfied in any way. A wonderful send-off to the MCU as it exists now. Bring on New Avengers.
Worth seeing a few times just so you can experience everything without the surprises coming (sounds weird, but sometimes it's good to go into a film where you know what's coming, so it isn't so relentless) and a few times just so you can work out what's happening in the final battle.
It's not confusing or overstuffed; it's just huge, and it makes the character team-ups in Infinity War look pathetically small in comparison.
H.B.M.C. wrote: I'm just going to copypasta what I wrote on another board as I'm not typing this all out again. This movie has tons to unpack and work through, so my review/retelling is kinda stream of consciousness-y.
Either way, everything is a spoiler, so it goes in tags:
Spoiler:
Ok, unpacking this film is tough because there is so much to go through. To start with what a lot of others have said, this is the other side of the Infinity War coin. Where that film was Thanos first and foremost, this film was an Avengers film, specifically the core original six. On that alone it works.
Broadly the film is divided into three specific sections:
1. The fallout from Infinity War.
2. Adventures in Space and Time.
3. The Final Battle.
The fallout from Infinity War is the most dour part, as everyone has lost. It's interesting to see how people develop over this period, with Cap and Natasha unwilling to move on, Tony teaching Nebula to be more of a person (and failing to fix the ship), Clint losing the plot and turning into an anti-crime murder machine, and finally Thor giving into despondence and anguish, falling into a spiral of guilt, shame and self-loathing. And it's all fantastic stuff, and especially as the confrontation with Thanos happens so quickly during that part, and how that confrontation leads to nothing, makes it all the more interesting. Civil War broke the Avengers up, but Thanos disassembled them. And for all its showings in the posters and whatnot, the Hulkbuster suit is on screen for all of 30 seconds, if that, so yeah. Oh and Korg is there, and has clearly prayed to the Emperor of Mankind to rid of him of the influence of Bathos, the 5th God of Chaos, because he doesn't ruin a since scene he's in.
The Adventures in Time and Space section is where we get the most laughs, as it's the one where they get to play with the setting, revisit old time periods, but also have some serious drama. I love them revisiting New York during Loki's Chitarui invasion. This is where we get cameos a'plenty, and there are some amazing ones. Loki showing up again (and escaping with the Tesseract) is a maddening bit that will plague me until they definitively state whether he really will show up again. The balls Marvel has to have Cap go "Hail Hydra" into Agent Sitwell's ear in a sort-of recreation of the incredible elevator scene from Winter Soldier is just great. Robert Redford shows up!!! I did not see that coming at all. Cap fights himself, which was funny. Professor Hulk pretends to be angry, and then has a full conversation with The Ancient One, which was amazing. Revisiting the opening scene of Guardians one, but from Rhodey and Nebula's perspective was great, as was the method Thanos uses to find out what's going on. Plus the stuff in the 70's (70's?) with Howard Stark and Cap seeing Peggy, all amazing. Really the only real self-indulgent part is that they re-use the classic 360 around the Avengers from the first film, but as this is their victory lap I'll let them have it. We also get some fantastic stuff with Thor and Frigga, of all people. I think Frigga has more screentime in this film than in Thor/Thor 2 combined! Sadly no Lady Sif, although Jane Foster is in there with new stuff (but no lines it seems). Love Thor leaving with Mjolnir.
And then... Widow sacrifices herself so that Hawkeye can get the soul stone. I guess we're in for a wave of screeching "Fridging is soggy knees!" articles in the coming weeks, but for the scene itself it's heartbreaking. So is the aftermath with the remaining 5 back at base.
Then comes the final battle, and after Professor Hulk unsnaps the universe I deadset thought that Thanos' ship had killed Scott with that barrage. They survive, naturally, but it does mean that Tony, Cap and Thor have to take on Thanos by themselves. Even without the gauntlet Thanos is no slouch, and he cleans their clocks pretty damn well. Tony is knocked out cold, and Thor very nearly gets his own axe through his chest if not for...
Cap wielding Mjolnir!!!
The audience reaction to this bit was huge, with someone down the front just shouting "YES! YES!" when it happened. Totally worth it for the payoff of 11 years, as Cap engages Thanos 1-on-1, his shield in one arm, Mjolnir in the other. He uppercuts Thanos, he zaps him, he summons lightning. He does all the very Thor things, and it's simply amazing. It doesn't really work though, as, again, Thanos is a fething beast, nearly cuts Cap's shield in half with that double-blade thingy he has, and he doesn't go down.
Then Thanos swears to wipe out all existing life so that no one will know, and my heart skips a beat as I wonder if this is how they'll end the film and somehow justify mutants existing in the MCU. Thankfully no, that never comes to pass, but Thanos does roll out a massive army with everything we've seen him use so far (and some new giant hulking creatures in armour). The Black Order shows up again (I missed what happened to Corvus and Proxima this time, but the ends of Cull and Maw are very clear this time - I'll need more viewings to find them), and they're just advancing on Cap all by himself. It's very Jon Snow vs the entire Bolton army from Game of Thrones, except this time we get another great callback to previous films.
"Hey Cap... on your left!", and slingring portals start opening up everywhere. This is probablyh another indulgent moment, as they show everyone coming back, and more and more characters showing up (Wasp, Valk on a fething pegasus, everyone who dusted on Titan, Wakanda, the Wakanda army - all of them, with air support this time). Everyone who can be there is there. And I mean everyone. They all advance, meet up with Cap, and he finally orders the Avengers to assemble (more big reaction from the crowd, more "YES!" from the dude up the front of the cinema).
The battle is enormous and kinda dark, so it becomes hard to follow. It will require many viewings to get the full scope of all the stuff going on. I basically lose Rhodey, Rocket and Bucky during the fight. And honestly I've forgotten why Scott and Hope are trying to use Juan Punch Man's van (Luis does not show up, sadly). Scott gets some great moves (including squashing Cull), Valk proves why she's one of the Valkyrie, Falcon takes down one of those big things I mentioned before, and then Thanos finds himself up against a very-pissed-off-and-totally-not-holding-back Scarlet Witch. Holy crap does Wanda go to town on Thanos, to the point where she is literally about to tear him apart with her mind. Thanos has to cheat by calling in an orbital (or sub-orbital) bombardment just to escape. Thanos even has his ship fire on his own troops to get an advantage, something that the newly arrived Captain Marvel stops by doing that thing where she just flies through gak because she's basically invincible. The "all the women have each other's back" bit is about as cringe as the film gets (that and the America's Ass joke which is maybe used one too many times), mainly because of the geography of the battle makes it weird for all of them to be there at that point.
We get lots of keepaway from various characters, including a nice fight between Carol and Thanos where she actually gets angry and starts to really block everything he can hit her with (I call her the MCU's unstoppable force, but she may just be the MCU's immovable object as well) until Thanos just blasts her with the power stone. It's not an easy fight for either of them, but it never feels like Carol can just do it one handed, nor does it feel like Thanos is better than everyone. Strange and the students of Kamar-Taj are mostly on damage control, shielding a lot of incoming attacks. Strange himself has to spend a lot of time protecting the armies. Oh and Pepper is there, as Rescue, which is fething amazing. And Quill gets kicked in the balls by pre-Guardians Gamora. And Nebula kills Nebula, which is bizarre. And Spidey activates Instant-Kill mode, and it's amazing!
Eventually, finally, Tony realises that he has to make the sacrifice play, understanding that this is the one chance they have at winning (Strange makes that not so subtle as well). He gets the stones, and Thanos repeats the line he said just before Thor killed him at the start of the film: "I am inevitable". Very Agent Smith.
Tony responds with the best come back he can muster: "I am... Iron Man."
*snap*
Thanos' army begins to dust, and eventually Thanos himself goes. Tony dies, saying goodbye to Rhodey, Peter and finally Pepper. We get a very Return of the King multiple endings thing after that, all 100% earned, where we get even more cameos (Hill, Thunderbolt Ross, Hank Pym, Janet van Dyne, Tachalla's mother, Fury, Aunt May and even the kid from Iron Man 3). Cap passes the mantle onto Sam, which is great, and Cap finally gets to live his life as he chooses (Peggy got a happy ending!).
Overall yeah, this film is immense. I will need to see it again tomorrow just to get a handle on everything. And then see it again on Saturday.
And most surprising cameo has to be Jarvis, as in the Jarvis from Agent Carter. That surprised me more than Robert Redford showing up. That's a deep, deep cut for hardcore MCU fans, and I appreciated it, even if that show never got a third season.
Yeah, so much in this film. I don't think they left me dissatisfied in any way. A wonderful send-off to the MCU as it exists now. Bring on New Avengers.
Wow... just amazing.
Thanx for the review. I'm super stoked to see all this playout. Sadly have to wait until Saturday afternoon at the earliest (Friday nights are always way too crowded)
Oh and Stan Lee cameo cracked whole hall into laughter.
But gosh 3 hour movies are looooong to sit. Good thing I had been avoiding drinking ahead in time. Especially as in theater here there's 1 men/women toilet and 1 women only toilet.
Couple favourite jokes in spoilers.
Spoiler:
-Thor giving earful for some poor fellow(maybe kid) over online game
-Hulk smashing couple cars and so more for "just for appearances" when they came to New York in past.
-"Your mother never wears anything I get her anyway"
-Thor preferring bloody mary over breakfest
-Thor coming along on promise of booze in ship
-"I can do this, I can do this, I can do this, I can't do this"
-"I'm so from the future"
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2019/04/24 20:20:02
I liked it enough to not feel ripped off. Okay as an action film(bit too over the top for my tastes) but plenty of humour and that Thor was just great. Not something you usually see in super hero films. Though guess he could be divisive as well. Some will like, some won't(noticed he isn't shown much in official trailer that I can see so no more than that about him).
Thought it was great as it paid off not just the last film but the entire history of the MCU. The grand spectacle in the last hour just has to be seen.
In the new defeated Thanos timeline, is Cap responsible for the non-existence of Agent 13?
I couldn't figure out if geriatric Cap appearing at the end broke the rules established in the Banner/Ancient One dialogue?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/04/25 10:15:37
Ex-Mantic Rules Committees: Kings of War, Warpath
"The Emperor is obviously not a dictator, he's a couch." Starbuck: "Why can't we use the starboard launch bays?"
Engineer: "Because it's a gift shop!"
I think they should have made a bigger deal of that fight, TBH, if only to give Okoye a bit more to do at the end.
[EDIT]: Reading over my big rambly post I realise that if someone had posted that a year ago you'd laugh at them for writing the biggest wish fulfilment bit of fan fiction ever. I mean, there are bits I've missed in my description like...
Spoiler:
Black Panther and Spider-Man playing keep away with the Infinity Gauntlet, present-Tony sending Ant-Man to mess with past-Tony's arc reactor to give him a 'minor' cardiac issue, Rhodey and Scott arguing with Hulk over time travel movies, Cap telling cap that he can 'do this all day', Iron Man and Rescue fighting back-to-back blasting away at Thanos' army, Cap ending up with Stormbringer and swapping back with Thor to get Mjolnir
... and many more, and they just sound like I'm making them up. I mean, it's crazy.
Going to see this again tomorrow, then I think I'm seeing it with friends on Saturday, and then I am seeing it with another friend on Sunday.
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2019/04/25 18:44:19
It really is a fantastic pay off for the previous movies. And to be be honest, the three hour duration feels about right. There’s very little we could cut out.
My favourite bit?
Spoiler:
Korg’s line about some kid calling him a dill weed. Probably because I enjoy a good swear, but that really tickled me.
And I now have a Chris Hemsworth body, so there’s that too
Though the portal moment....and the look of ‘umm.....oh’ on Thanos’ face. Seeing all that happen very nearly brought me to tears. It’s just executed so beautifully.
And given the timeywimey? I wonder if they’ve deliberately broken the rules, given the pay off of doing so opens up multiverse potential. And that in turn gives them a range of options when they incorporate the previously owned by Fox stuff.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2019/04/25 18:51:47
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+1 to all the good stuff people have been saying. I was honestly surprised to realise three hours had passed at the end. Go see this, as unspoiled as possible. It's not just a brilliant superhero movie, I think it's one of the only movies in recent years that I'd describe as legitimately epic, like something from the Golden Age.
Spoiler:
One thing I was surprised at was how the snap isn't retconned--yes, the people come back, but the five years have still passed and everyone remembers what happens. So now the population of the world is split by those who suffered through the loss and those who (from their point of view) jumped forwards five years into a very different world. I do wonder if any future movies will follow on this--say, if Peter Parker meets any former classmates who are now five years older than him.
I was also impressed by Thanos' arc, and not just how he signed off in the opening battle, conducting himself like a tragic, misunderstood hero until the end. But after that, the film builds Past Thanos back up as a terrifying villain and near-unstoppable threat--after all, in the changed timeline, he never had the shock of having to make a sacrifice for the Soulstone, and finding out that he's "destined" to win would logically fuel his hubris. But the story also let him keep enough of his gravitas and dignity "(I will wait.") to not have it feel like his character was flattened down into a generic end boss.
"The 75mm gun is firing. The 37mm gun is firing, but is traversed round the wrong way. The Browning is jammed. I am saying "Driver, advance." and the driver, who can't hear me, is reversing. And as I look over the top of the turret and see twelve enemy tanks fifty yards away, someone hands me a cheese sandwich."
The most telling thing for me about this movie are the negative reviews on Rotten Tomatoes.
They’re basically sniffy film ponces being sniffy film ponces. The sort of up themselves buttmunches that inherently don’t like any film that isn’t some poofy art jazz spank.
Their comments don’t even remotely make sense.
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5000pts 
6000pts 
3000pts
