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ZergSmasher wrote: That's a cool analysis! Looks like maybe Veterans should be in every list, at least with plasma. I wonder how they'll fare in the anti-infantry calculations?
I would like to point out that I asked about this idea months ago and promptly got shot down that they were too expensive! Oh, irony.
To be honest, their damage per point is really good as per the analysis, but with just 1 wound their survivability per point is probably not so great. Hence why people (including myself probably) said they were too expensive. One way to mitigate that and make sure they get to shoot would be to let them ride in a Stormraven or something, perhaps.
I was thinking of putting two veteran squads with plasma and chain swords in a crusader together with Ezekiel and start wrecking stuff.
2018/05/29 09:11:57
Subject: Dark Angels Tactics 2018 - LVO lists on pg. 16, Adepticon lists pg. 24
zedsdead wrote:And this here is the rub. I am finding that S7 hellblasters are a bit overkill in so many instances. i find my HBs shooting at T4-6 stuff so much more often. Im still on the fence but i am finding the Assault HBs version a bit more versitile. I almost never get outranged and im getting 2 shots out of them. With Azzy they are great. Sure the RFHBs are awsome but by then im in such close range im getting shot or charged. Its still a tough one but im liking my Assault HBs more and more.
Well, Assault Hellblasters aren't that bad vs T8 3+ (22,50 PPD; 7.76 damage inflicted) and if they're working for you, kudos to that!
Shrapnelbait wrote:
ZergSmasher wrote: That's a cool analysis! Looks like maybe Veterans should be in every list, at least with plasma. I wonder how they'll fare in the anti-infantry calculations?
I would like to point out that I asked about this idea months ago and promptly got shot down that they were too expensive! Oh, irony.
As ZergSmasher said: they're very effective for their points, but they're flimsy. They need a transport do to their job, while Hellblasters have a bit more survivability and Devastators can plink away from a safe distance.
Played in a 40 player "Supreme Commander" tournament at 1,250 points. You had to have a Named Character and you could not bring Lords of War or Super Heavies. I took Sammael on Corvex, a Talonmaster, an RW Champion, six RW Black Knights, an RW Bike Squad with two Meltas and a Multi-Melta Attack Bike, a Darkshourd, two Scout Squads and a Tactical Squad. The missions all had bonus points for your Warlord doing stuff.
Game 1 vs Custodes: He had Trajan, a Shield Captain on a Bike, a Bike squad and three normal squads. The Darkshroud helped me weather his Meltamissiles. I then used my mobility to focus on his jetbikes. The Meltas on the RW Bikes combined with massed Black Knight supercharging WfTDA Plasma wiped the Custodes bikes. After that I could use my mobility and firewpower to erase a squad a turn. By Turn 5 Trajan was limping along alone and Sammael went in for the mercy kill (and tabling). Result - Dark Angles win.
Game 2 vs Blood Angels. He had Mephiston, a variety of BA units and a Leviathan Dreadnought. The objective was simply to kill the enemy Warlord. Half of the Black Knights died to rolling 1s on supercharge on the first turn and the Leviathan made its invul saves. My plan was distract him with movement until Sammael was within striking range of Mephiston. The plan worked and I pulled off the surprise aerial assault, but I did a bad job of managing my CPs and did not have enough for Honour the Chapter or Only in Death Does Duty End when I made my surprise solo assault. Mephiston was left with two wounds after my strikes and Sammael went down. At least it was dramatic! Dark Angels loss.
Game 3 vs Blood Angels. This was for Kill Points. He had The Sanguinor, a 15 man Deathcompany, a Las Pred and three tactical squads in Rhinos. His Death Company went after my screening scouts, after which I whittled him down to nothing in two turns of massed shooting while the other Tac Squad and Scouts bought time. There was lots of LoS blocking terrain which, combined with my Darkshround, neutralized his Las Predator. When the game ended on Turn 5 he was down to a Rhino and a Tac Squad. Dark Angels Win.
Game 4 vs Harlequins. The Harley codex had come out the night before so this was a journey of discovery! He had Bikes and Harleys on Vypers. We were fighting for Table Quarters and this one turned into a revolving door as my Bikes smashed his left wing while two of his Harley squads on Vypers rolled up my own left wing. Even with his -1 to hit and 4++ saves, though, my own Darkshroud and Jink evened that out. Massed RW firepower with the Talonmaster and Sammael buffing was too much for his Harleys. Dark Angels Win.
We closed with boss battles - I drew Gazkull. I could have simply flew around him and shot him but that seemed lame so I charged in to a glorious death!
I was happy with the list, bearing in mind that the format means that the lessons may not be universally applicable. The big RW Knight squad was great, although the rubber band of probability hurt me on Game 2 - I am a gambler with Plasma and it can hurt! I was constantly supercharging with WFTDA and they certainly made their mark on the enemy. The RW Bikes with Melta were also quite useful. I realized in the final game that I had been forgetting to apply the Talonmaster's ability to allow RW units to ignore the +1 Cover Saves when they were within 6". This would have helped in Game 2 and 3. The Talonmaster was still amazing. The RW Champion with The Eye of the Unseen was a nasty surprise to some folks. I am not saying he is a open tourney must-have, but he was a late addition to my list that worked out. Sammael on Corvex was fun and characterful. If I had managed CPs better in Game 2 I could have gone 4-0 instead of 3-1. Lesson learned!
As an aside, tourneys with low points values can be a nice change of pace. The top finishers were Tyranids with the Swarmlord, Chaos with Abaddon and the Blood Angel I faced in round 2.
All you have to do is fire three rounds a minute, and stand
I'd like to try something that isn't just the usual Azrael + Hellblasters and Devastators gunline. I know there has been some measure of success with more mobile DA lists before, and I've been wanting to get my Ravenwing on the table again, so this seemed like a good opportunity. I'm curious how some of you, my fellow Dark Angels fans, feel about it? Is there something I should tweak? Should I just stick to Azrael and those Hellblasters?
My armies (re-counted and updated on 11/1/23, including modeled wargear options):
Dark Angels: ~15000 Astra Militarum: ~1200 | Adeptus Custodes: ~1900 | Imperial Knights: ~2000 | Sisters of Battle: ~3500 | Leagues of Votann: ~1200 | Tyranids: ~2600 | Stormcast Eternals: ~5000
Check out my P&M Blogs: ZergSmasher's P&M Blog | Imperial Knights blog | Board Games blog | Total models painted in 2023: 40 | Total models painted in 2024: 12 | Current main painting project: Dark Angels
Mr_Rose wrote: Who doesn’t love crazy mutant squawk-puppies? Eh? Nobody, that’s who.
2018/06/04 09:42:24
Subject: Dark Angels Tactics 2018 - LVO lists on pg. 16, Adepticon lists pg. 24
Seems like it could go alright. I always think having two options for WotDA is a good call. Little tweaks I'd make would be to swap the snipers for bolters (personally haven't got much mileage out of snipers) and get a fourth heavy weapon in the devastator unit with the extra points. I'd also ditch the GL on the RWBK to maximize WotDA use. Big fan of the scout bikes. Unless you're trying to minimize drops, 2x3 might be worth considering over 1x6 but idk
I dig it, should do well. Consider paying a CP for the -1 to hit relic for your jump pack master for extra fun with that 3++. I concur with dropping the sniper rifles and switching out the Ravenwing grenade launcher.
The grenade launcher is only there because that's the model I have, but honestly I doubt anyone will have a problem with it being a slight breach of WYSIWYG. I had also thought about the stratagem for it, but I'm not sure it's worth losing a plasma talon. I had originally planned for the snipers to harass enemy characters and at least force them to keep their heads down (so to speak), but I think it's true that one unit will not accomplish much on its own. Probably better to have the fourth heavy weapon (either 2nd ML or 3rd LC) in the dev squad.
My armies (re-counted and updated on 11/1/23, including modeled wargear options):
Dark Angels: ~15000 Astra Militarum: ~1200 | Adeptus Custodes: ~1900 | Imperial Knights: ~2000 | Sisters of Battle: ~3500 | Leagues of Votann: ~1200 | Tyranids: ~2600 | Stormcast Eternals: ~5000
Check out my P&M Blogs: ZergSmasher's P&M Blog | Imperial Knights blog | Board Games blog | Total models painted in 2023: 40 | Total models painted in 2024: 12 | Current main painting project: Dark Angels
Mr_Rose wrote: Who doesn’t love crazy mutant squawk-puppies? Eh? Nobody, that’s who.
Sammael on speeder
2 talonmaster one has heavenfall blade
1x8 black knights
2x3 bikes one unit is flamer, other is grav
3x5 scouts
3 dark talons
1 darkshroud.
New to the forum, but stumbled upon this thread and very happy to see people discussing running lots of ravenwing! I'm just getting back into the game after not playing for over 15 years. I've been using a similar list like the one above, but keep feeling like the knights end up getting targeted quickly/dying and then the "bubble" sort of crumbles.
I still have lots to learn, but could anyone give some advice on how best to maneuver a list like the one above? Obviously it depends on the type of mission and board layout, but generally speaking. My commander skills certainly need a lot of work but any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Sammael on speeder
2 talonmaster one has heavenfall blade
1x8 black knights
2x3 bikes one unit is flamer, other is grav
3x5 scouts
3 dark talons
1 darkshroud.
New to the forum, but stumbled upon this thread and very happy to see people discussing running lots of ravenwing! I'm just getting back into the game after not playing for over 15 years. I've been using a similar list like the one above, but keep feeling like the knights end up getting targeted quickly/dying and then the "bubble" sort of crumbles.
I still have lots to learn, but could anyone give some advice on how best to maneuver a list like the one above? Obviously it depends on the type of mission and board layout, but generally speaking. My commander skills certainly need a lot of work but any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Welcome to the Rock!
I find that deciding who Jinks and gets to use Speed of the Raven is a critical decision. A lot will depend on the target array - if I don't need to supercharge the Plasma Talons then they can Advance and fire without worry allowing an RW Bike Squad to use Speed of the Raven to advance, fire and get that 4++ as well. My Ravenwing tend to run as a bit of a blob with at least two big units within 6" of Sammael, the Talonmaster and the Darkshroud. Use mobility to hit one part of the enemy hard (preferably one of the enemy wings/flanks) and then roll him up. Driving into the centre of the enemy position is usually inviting disaster.
A Ravenwing list on an open table without much LOS blocking terrain is praying for 1st turn or else the RW Black Knights will indeed die quickly. Try to deploy the RW Black Knights out of sight otherwise they get targeted if you lose the roll-off. Once I am moving, though, I find that a Darkshroud and Jink make the Black Knights pretty resilient. Just avoid the temptation to charge into CC with them unless its really favourable/desperate.
All you have to do is fire three rounds a minute, and stand
I'd like to try something that isn't just the usual Azrael + Hellblasters and Devastators gunline. I know there has been some measure of success with more mobile DA lists before, and I've been wanting to get my Ravenwing on the table again, so this seemed like a good opportunity. I'm curious how some of you, my fellow Dark Angels fans, feel about it? Is there something I should tweak? Should I just stick to Azrael and those Hellblasters?
I often use a lot more ravenwing and keep Azrael near a dread and maybe 5 hellblasters. I find ten of them just too boring.
Sammael on speeder
2 talonmaster one has heavenfall blade
1x8 black knights
2x3 bikes one unit is flamer, other is grav
3x5 scouts
3 dark talons
1 darkshroud.
New to the forum, but stumbled upon this thread and very happy to see people discussing running lots of ravenwing! I'm just getting back into the game after not playing for over 15 years. I've been using a similar list like the one above, but keep feeling like the knights end up getting targeted quickly/dying and then the "bubble" sort of crumbles.
I still have lots to learn, but could anyone give some advice on how best to maneuver a list like the one above? Obviously it depends on the type of mission and board layout, but generally speaking. My commander skills certainly need a lot of work but any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Welcome to the Rock!
I find that deciding who Jinks and gets to use Speed of the Raven is a critical decision. A lot will depend on the target array - if I don't need to supercharge the Plasma Talons then they can Advance and fire without worry allowing an RW Bike Squad to use Speed of the Raven to advance, fire and get that 4++ as well. My Ravenwing tend to run as a bit of a blob with at least two big units within 6" of Sammael, the Talonmaster and the Darkshroud. Use mobility to hit one part of the enemy hard (preferably one of the enemy wings/flanks) and then roll him up. Driving into the centre of the enemy position is usually inviting disaster.
A Ravenwing list on an open table without much LOS blocking terrain is praying for 1st turn or else the RW Black Knights will indeed die quickly. Try to deploy the RW Black Knights out of sight otherwise they get targeted if you lose the roll-off. Once I am moving, though, I find that a Darkshroud and Jink make the Black Knights pretty resilient. Just avoid the temptation to charge into CC with them unless its really favourable/desperate.
Thanks for the advice! Twice i've attempted to run my BK heavy blob more or less straight into some heavy stuff assuming I could do a lot of damage with the plasma and then charge and finish up in CC. Yeah that clearly doesn't work very well (in most cases anyway).
Should I be using bikers in front of the BK's as a screen for moving up the field -- this is assuming I already have a dark shroud as well. In general i'm guessing I should try to keep all of my bikes in a bubble rather than attempt to spread out on the board?
Also curious how you feel about leaving something heavy in the backfield -- predator, venerable dread -- something with lascannons and some more anti-tank to harass from afar while the dark talons get up close.
At 1,500 points you can fit a big RW Black Knight Squad, a decent-sized Ravenwing Bike Squadron, Sammael, the Talonmaster and a Darkshroud plus some supporting units (Scouts, Devastators etc).
I find its useful to run the Rawenwing units as a cohesive blob to benefit from the various aura and provide mutual support at the decisive point. If you need to secure multiple objectives you can try to use your mobility late in the game to split up and secure after defeating the main enemy as a concentrated force. That's one of the big advantages of Ravenwing over normal Dark Angels - exploit their mobility and firepower! The normal Ravenwing Bikes are not so much a screen (although I have sacrificed them a few times to save the Black Knights), but rather extra dakka to help destroy the enemy at your chosen point.
Even with the Beta Deepstrike/Reserve rules I still use Scout squads to create a DS-free zone in the midfield. This can pay off on Turn 2 as I find the Ravenwing Bikes like to engage from midfield. I usually use the full 18" of range for the Black Knights to limit retaliation - there is no real benefit to closing the range and you can always use your mobility the next turn to displace.
At 1,500 points I can include some long-ranged firepower in the form of a Devastator Squad with Lascannon. Black Knights can deal with most enemy tanks, but the range limit of 18" can be exploited by your opponent if he screens his tanks properly. Having something with real range in your force can certainly help.
One thing I can't get to work is normal Ravenwing Landspeeder. While the Talonmaster and Sammael on Sableclaw are great, the rank and file Landspeeders have struggled to find a place in my lists. I tried to make them work out of nostalgia, but they are pretty much just display models for now.
All you have to do is fire three rounds a minute, and stand
2018/06/05 23:38:31
Subject: Dark Angels Tactics 2018 - LVO lists on pg. 16, Adepticon lists pg. 24
Against my better judgement and after some.unsuccessful test, I tried a Land Speeder with the double heavy flamer... and it works!!!!
It synergies very well with the fast movement, have a decent AP (with a Talonmaster around and unit hidden around) and in general was a pleasant surprise.
I can't condone a place where abusers and abused are threated the same: it's destined to doom, so there is no reason to participate in it.
TangoTwoBravo wrote: At 1,500 points you can fit a big RW Black Knight Squad, a decent-sized Ravenwing Bike Squadron, Sammael, the Talonmaster and a Darkshroud plus some supporting units (Scouts, Devastators etc).
I find its useful to run the Rawenwing units as a cohesive blob to benefit from the various aura and provide mutual support at the decisive point. If you need to secure multiple objectives you can try to use your mobility late in the game to split up and secure after defeating the main enemy as a concentrated force. That's one of the big advantages of Ravenwing over normal Dark Angels - exploit their mobility and firepower! The normal Ravenwing Bikes are not so much a screen (although I have sacrificed them a few times to save the Black Knights), but rather extra dakka to help destroy the enemy at your chosen point.
Even with the Beta Deepstrike/Reserve rules I still use Scout squads to create a DS-free zone in the midfield. This can pay off on Turn 2 as I find the Ravenwing Bikes like to engage from midfield. I usually use the full 18" of range for the Black Knights to limit retaliation - there is no real benefit to closing the range and you can always use your mobility the next turn to displace.
At 1,500 points I can include some long-ranged firepower in the form of a Devastator Squad with Lascannon. Black Knights can deal with most enemy tanks, but the range limit of 18" can be exploited by your opponent if he screens his tanks properly. Having something with real range in your force can certainly help.
One thing I can't get to work is normal Ravenwing Landspeeder. While the Talonmaster and Sammael on Sableclaw are great, the rank and file Landspeeders have struggled to find a place in my lists. I tried to make them work out of nostalgia, but they are pretty much just display models for now.
Excellent advice thank you! I think I need to be more aware of my distance from the enemy to maximize the plasma talons but also to stay out of charge range if possible. That should help me stay mobile (and hopefully more 'alive').
Question for you guys, looking at a Battalion and an Outrider detachment. I have Sammy on a sableclaw and a talonmaster for the Battalion, but need another HQ choice for the outrider. How does a librarian on a bike sound? Better options? I was thinking of using Aversion to help give another -1 to hit for enemy unit in 24" which would also help with the dark shroud as well. Either mind wipe or smite for the other psychic ability.
Also have some points left over, does anyone run a Ravenwing Apothecary? I figured it's extra plasma talons and can keep some of my black knights alive longer.
Though a librarian biker + ravenwing apothecary is about 221pts. I at least need 1 HQ for the second detachment, just not sure what's best. Rest of the list looks like:
Sammael Sableclaw
Talonmaster
Scouts (4 + heavy bolter)
Scouts (4 + heavy bolter)
Scouts (4 + heavy bolter)
Ravenwing Apothecary
Ravenwing Dark Shroud
Librarian on a bike
Ravenwing bike squad (2 bikes + sarge, flamer + meltagun)
Ravenwing bike squad (2 bikes + sarge, flamer + meltagun)
Ravenwing Black knights (9)
Dark Talon (x2)
2018/06/06 18:52:07
Subject: Dark Angels Tactics 2018 - LVO lists on pg. 16, Adepticon lists pg. 24
Another option rather than librarian on bike is techmarine on bike. Its cheaper and you can heal Sammy and Talon master with him. He can also heal a dark shroud or even a dark talon if you move just right.
I have run a Librarian on a Bike out of the Index to support my RW at 1500 points. Psychic defence against Smite etc is important for your valuable bikes, and as you note Aversion can be really effective.
I also run an Apothecary from time to time. When he brings a Black Knight or two back he's a star. Sometimes he just eats CPs from me re-rolling to get a 3+.
A good suggestion from Swillsswil on a Techmarine on a Bike, especially if Sammael is running on Sableclaw!
All you have to do is fire three rounds a minute, and stand
2018/06/07 03:12:04
Subject: Dark Angels Tactics 2018 - LVO lists on pg. 16, Adepticon lists pg. 24
Personally, I'd be inclined to ditch both the apothecary and lib and fill that HQ slot with a second Talonmaster. I'm not sold on the apothecary but if you go that route I think the Techmarine is a good call
So we were going to have a tournament earlier today, but hardly anyone showed up. We ended up just playing a few pickup games instead using the ITC missions. I ran my Dark Angels with 2 detachments: a Battalion with Sammael in Sableclaw, a Talonmaster (with Heavenfall Blade), 3 Scout Squads, a Devastator Squad (2 Lascannons, 2 Missile Launchers), and a Dark Talon, along with an Outrider with a Master with Jump Pack, Thunder Hammer, and Storm Shield, a 6-man Inceptor Squad with Plasma, a Darkshroud, a 6-man Scout Bike squad, and a 6-man Black Knights squad with a grenade launcher. The first game I played was vs. pure Drukhari. I ended up winning only because the game was going long and we ended it early (both of us were learning our armies and units, so we were equally guilty of slow play). If it had gone on, I probably would not have won, as I was running out of material. The Inceptors did really well, as did the Dark Talon. That Agents of Vect strat is really annoying, as it prevented me from firing after falling back in one instance. I did make good use of Hellfire Shells and Flakk Missile though, along with WotDA of course. In my second game of the day, I faced one of the top players in the ITC and he was running a pure Tsons list. The only way I ended up accomplishing anything in that game was because he failed two important charges on turn 1 (Magnus and some Tzaangors that used the Dark Matter Crystal), allowing my Plasma Inceptors to drop in and erase Magnus (3 Inceptors blew themselves up thanks to -1 to hit). I rolled really hot with their numbers of shots, though, or Magnus would not have died. I also wiped the Tzaangors. Ultimately the list just could not cope with the number of Smites he was throwing out, since Tsons ignore the penalty to Smite apparently (didn't know that), and I conceded on turn 3 with just 7 of my models on the board.
My feelings about the units I used:
Sammael: He's good, but only with Ravenwing, who aren't that hot overall. Sableclaw is better than Corvex for sure.
Talonmaster: Really fun, but expensive. Probably works better with a gunline so he won't have to move as often, as that screws up his shooting.
Scouts: I mean, they are your troop tax, so you gotta take them if you want a decent supply of CP. The infiltrate is cool, although it didn't really help in either of my two games today. I might swap one unit for some Intercessors instead.
Devastators: They are solid, and provide some heavy firepower to supplement your plasma guys. The Cherub + Flakk or Hellfire is legit. 2d3 mortal wounds for 1 CP? Yes please!
Dark Talon: Another solid performer. Absolutely shreds hordes, and works very well against mooks with invul saves (like Tzaangors) thanks to the stasis bomb. The short range on the rift cannon sucks, but the speed of the plane helps negate that little problem.
Master on Jump Pack: He didn't really get a chance to shine in either game, so the jury is still out on the loadout. Rerolling 1's on the Inceptors is clutch, though.
Inceptors with Plasma: Very solid unit. They put out so many wounds with WotDA. They are expensive and not that tough to kill, though, so don't expect them to get much more than 1 turn of shooting in.
Darkshroud: Must take unit. It will get focused hard though, so don't expect it to win you the game and be prepared to lose that protection quickly. It will take some of the heat off your squishier units though.
Scout Bikes: Again, jury's still out as they never got a real chance, but in the first game they got to squeeze off a nice 40-shot volley (6 Twin Bolters + 6 Shotguns + Storm Bolter on Sarge, all under 12"). I feel like they are very good for their points, and if they survive something charging them, they can use that cheeky stratagem as they fall back.
Black Knights: Nowhere near good enough for their points. Yes, the Plasma Inceptors are more expensive with the same durability, but they get a lot more shots at least plus they can hide in reserves. They really need a points drop to be worth taking. Mortal wounds from psychic powers/C'tan abilities just wreck them fast.
Overall I think I need to just stick to the Azrael gunline for competitive play. It's boring as hell to run, but at least it sort of works. I should save the Ravenwing stuff for casual play, as it is at least interesting and fun to run a fast-moving list like that.
My armies (re-counted and updated on 11/1/23, including modeled wargear options):
Dark Angels: ~15000 Astra Militarum: ~1200 | Adeptus Custodes: ~1900 | Imperial Knights: ~2000 | Sisters of Battle: ~3500 | Leagues of Votann: ~1200 | Tyranids: ~2600 | Stormcast Eternals: ~5000
Check out my P&M Blogs: ZergSmasher's P&M Blog | Imperial Knights blog | Board Games blog | Total models painted in 2023: 40 | Total models painted in 2024: 12 | Current main painting project: Dark Angels
Mr_Rose wrote: Who doesn’t love crazy mutant squawk-puppies? Eh? Nobody, that’s who.
2018/06/11 15:34:41
Subject: Dark Angels Tactics 2018 - LVO lists on pg. 16, Adepticon lists pg. 24
I've seen a few lists that take one dev blob with 4 heavies in it. Consider spending a few points to do 2 dev squads with 2 heavies each. This gets you an extra signum and an extra cherub. I personally use 1 LC+1ML and 1 LC+1 HB. This allows you to double fire flakk and hellfire turn 1. That could be 4d3 mortals on something like magnus. You also end up with 2 meat shields in each squad before you loose more valuable models.
Imperial Knights seem to be all the craze atm. I was wondering if anyone had good ideas on how to add knight elements to a dark angels army as a supporting element.
Been running different variations of azrael and hellblasters or ravenwing and I am struggling to think of an effective combination.
2018/06/14 13:12:32
Subject: Dark Angels Tactics 2018 - LVO lists on pg. 16, Adepticon lists pg. 24
While I may not *need* them, I already have a plan for a small knight force seconded to my dark angels. The armigers will be painted in ravenwing livery. The questoris class in greenwing. And the dominus class in deathwing.
2018/06/14 17:01:59
Subject: Dark Angels Tactics 2018 - LVO lists on pg. 16, Adepticon lists pg. 24
1. Super-heavy Auxiliary Detachment
2. Imperial Knight Gallant
3. Give it <Questor Mechanicus> allegiance (better Stratagems, I'd say)
4. Make it a Freeblade
a. Quality: Peerless Warrior
b. Burdens: Exiled in Shame and Obsessed with Vengeance
5. Spend 1CP on the Stratagem to make it a Character and give it the +1A Warlord Trait
6. Give it the 5++ in melee relic
7. Give extra weapons at will
Now you have a 12" moving, WS 2+ T8 24W 6A with tremendous power. You have a 50% chance to get +1 WS (which means it'll still fight at WS2+ for 2 brackets instead of 1) and 33% chance of getting +2" move.
It's simply more efficient than any other melee unit at our disposal vs T5+. I have yet to calculate vs T4-, though.
I was actually thinking about making a Superheavy detachment with 2 Armiger Helverins, 2 Armiger Warglaives, and a Knight Gallant, along with Azrael and friends (Hellblasters and stuff). I have a feeling that mixing DA and Knights will really be taking Knights and adding DA to supplement it, rather than the other way around, at least if you want more than 1 Knight. I do kind of like the Freeblade idea above though.
My armies (re-counted and updated on 11/1/23, including modeled wargear options):
Dark Angels: ~15000 Astra Militarum: ~1200 | Adeptus Custodes: ~1900 | Imperial Knights: ~2000 | Sisters of Battle: ~3500 | Leagues of Votann: ~1200 | Tyranids: ~2600 | Stormcast Eternals: ~5000
Check out my P&M Blogs: ZergSmasher's P&M Blog | Imperial Knights blog | Board Games blog | Total models painted in 2023: 40 | Total models painted in 2024: 12 | Current main painting project: Dark Angels
Mr_Rose wrote: Who doesn’t love crazy mutant squawk-puppies? Eh? Nobody, that’s who.
2018/06/15 00:55:01
Subject: Dark Angels Tactics 2018 - LVO lists on pg. 16, Adepticon lists pg. 24
Knights need allies with bodies, and so pair much better with Guard and AdMech than other Imperials. Best Dark Angels can offer is probably piles of scouts. A smash jump master is good too, but Blood Angels do this better.
How about this idea: 3 Dark Talons, and 1400 points worth of Knight stuff. Could probably get 3 full size Knights in there. The Talons could deal with hordes that could bog Knights down and overwhelm their relatively low numbers of shots, and the Knights could deal with the heavy stuff. You would only have 7 CP to work with though, and that hurts since Knights need quite a few for their best stratagems.
My armies (re-counted and updated on 11/1/23, including modeled wargear options):
Dark Angels: ~15000 Astra Militarum: ~1200 | Adeptus Custodes: ~1900 | Imperial Knights: ~2000 | Sisters of Battle: ~3500 | Leagues of Votann: ~1200 | Tyranids: ~2600 | Stormcast Eternals: ~5000
Check out my P&M Blogs: ZergSmasher's P&M Blog | Imperial Knights blog | Board Games blog | Total models painted in 2023: 40 | Total models painted in 2024: 12 | Current main painting project: Dark Angels
Mr_Rose wrote: Who doesn’t love crazy mutant squawk-puppies? Eh? Nobody, that’s who.
2018/06/16 01:37:11
Subject: Dark Angels Tactics 2018 - LVO lists on pg. 16, Adepticon lists pg. 24
Vector Strike wrote: 1. Super-heavy Auxiliary Detachment
2. Imperial Knight Gallant
3. Give it <Questor Mechanicus> allegiance (better Stratagems, I'd say)
4. Make it a Freeblade
a. Quality: Peerless Warrior
b. Burdens: Exiled in Shame and Obsessed with Vengeance
5. Spend 1CP on the Stratagem to make it a Character and give it the +1A Warlord Trait
6. Give it the 5++ in melee relic
7. Give extra weapons at will
Now you have a 12" moving, WS 2+ T8 24W 6A with tremendous power. You have a 50% chance to get +1 WS (which means it'll still fight at WS2+ for 2 brackets instead of 1) and 33% chance of getting +2" move.
It's simply more efficient than any other melee unit at our disposal vs T5+. I have yet to calculate vs T4-, though.
add in 30 hellblasters, Azzy, 3 scout squads a LT with HF blade and an ancient and you have a pretty formidable force
2018/06/16 09:29:44
Subject: Dark Angels Tactics 2018 - LVO lists on pg. 16, Adepticon lists pg. 24
Honestly don't think we'd really benefit all that much from a knight. A Gallant could combat our relatively week melee options but the Gallant itself need melee support like Dragoons or something imo.
If you do go that route I think the best loadout is probably Terryn (for the strat) with either Ion Bulwark or Landstrider WLT and either the Paragon Gauntlet (if there's something you want to Death Grip) or the Armour of Sainted Ion.
Imo our best option is probably a Hawkshroud Valiant though, with Ion Bulwark and Traitor's Pyre for the overwatch threat. Our Az bubble already wanted to be at around the same range for rapid fire and to put the aggressors to work
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/06/16 09:31:58
To take Terryn or any other House Tradition, you'll need an entire 3-Questor/Dominus Super-heavy Detachment. By that time you're already playing an IK list, not DA...
Vector Strike wrote: To take Terryn or any other House Tradition, you'll need an entire 3-Questor/Dominus Super-heavy Detachment. By that time you're already playing an IK list, not DA...
What about supporting a Knight list with a bunch of Ravenwing? I had come up with a list with 3 Questoris Knights (Gallant, Crusader, Warden), along with Sammael, a Talonmaster, a Scout Bike unit, 3 Scout Squads, and some regular Ravenwing bikes. I think mobility is good to support the Knights and just cover the board. Obviously we want a warlord with Brilliant Strategist to hopefully recycle a couple of CP. I won't be able to try it out real soon as I don't have my other 2 Knights yet, but it seems like it could be okay.
My armies (re-counted and updated on 11/1/23, including modeled wargear options):
Dark Angels: ~15000 Astra Militarum: ~1200 | Adeptus Custodes: ~1900 | Imperial Knights: ~2000 | Sisters of Battle: ~3500 | Leagues of Votann: ~1200 | Tyranids: ~2600 | Stormcast Eternals: ~5000
Check out my P&M Blogs: ZergSmasher's P&M Blog | Imperial Knights blog | Board Games blog | Total models painted in 2023: 40 | Total models painted in 2024: 12 | Current main painting project: Dark Angels
Mr_Rose wrote: Who doesn’t love crazy mutant squawk-puppies? Eh? Nobody, that’s who.
/ BMG: Mr. Freeze, Deathstroke / Battletech: SR, OWA / HGB: Caprice / Malifaux: Arcanists, Guild, Outcasts / MCP: Mutants / SAGA: Ordensstaat / SW Legion & X-Wing: CIS / WWX: Union
~15000 Astra Militarum: 
~1200 | Adeptus Custodes: 
~1900 | Imperial Knights: 
~2000 | Sisters of Battle: 
~3500 | Leagues of Votann: 
~1200 | Tyranids: 
~2600 | Stormcast Eternals: 
