The Dust Tactics (& Dust Warfare) News and Rumors Thread

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**Azazelx**

Are we using hand waving only for the technology of giant walking tank-robots and reanimated corpses but holding the plane models to the actual reliability and accuracy of the technology of the day?

**Evil_Toast**

Of course! After all, This. Is. DAKKADAKKA!

**RogueRegault**

scipio.au wrote:
Are we using hand waving only for the technology of giant walking tank-robots and reanimated corpses but holding the plane models to the actual reliability and accuracy of the technology of the day?

My brother won't even touch the zombies and gorillas with a ten foot pole.

I like the Dust Warfare base game, but this policy of putting out the new units in dribs and drabs is killing it for me. What's the point in spending twenty+ dollars on a book that has only has rules for one or two units?

How much you want to bet Axis and Ally players will be expected to buy Operation Zverograd to get the rules to use the flyers in Operation Icarus?

**em_en_oh_pee**

...or print the free fanmade cards for your units. Done.

And by releasing like this, they can at least playtest to ensure no major bs comes out that invalidates one army or creates flavor-of-the-month armies, etc.

Also, they are at the mercy of Dust Studios, so its not their fault. They do what they can to make the best of the releases. And Hades is a good example of a book you don't need, but has awesome content beyond unit listings - such as a badass campaign! Its fantastic!

**Duncan_Idaho**

You do realise that these are plastic kits and that only one other company can put out plastic kits at a higher rate?

**BrookM**

These aren't multi-part assembly kits however.

**Duncan_Idaho**

Actually quite some of them are such kits. They are put together at the factory or do you think they are carved out of a block of rubber?

The walkers and vehicles are sprue-kits like the stuff GW puts out.

And the minis can be compared to the FW/Finecast line of GW, though quality-wise Finecast is lacking in comparison.

**BrookM**

Judging from the quality of some of the infantry models, wouldn't surprise me if they were carved from tires. And yes, I am aware of the until recently single-pose walkers being kits.

**Duncan_Idaho**

Actually the walkers have quite some working articulation points and when you cut them loose from their base you can even reposition most of them easily.

Also, only a few infantry needs just some heating up with the hair dryer to bend the thin parts into shape.

**spaceelf**

It is no secret that these do not have the detail of metal models. However, I think that it is a great product. More importantly they are positioned in a unique place in the market, between prepainted stuff like Clix and high quality kits like Infinity. The question is will the game appeal to both experienced gamers and new blood?

**Scottywan82**

Duncan_Idaho wrote:
Also, only a few infantry needs just some heating up with the hair dryer to bend the thin parts into shape.

While I'm totally happy with my AT-43 and DUST models, I would say that the solution above is becoming more and more irritating as time wears on. I really wish they would just move to the same sort of plastic as GW, Dreamforge, etc.

No disrespect to the folks who like it, it just grates on me after awhile.

**Duncan_Idaho**

Well, this would mean a steep increase in prices anda lower rate of infantry. Sorry, but business-side ahs to beconsidered or we end up with another dead game.

Also, there are not that many minis that need this treatment.

And be happy that they never switched to Finecast like GW did, then you really could cry Havoc.

**rwwin**

Scottywan82 wrote:
While I'm totally happy with my AT-43 and DUST models, I would say that the solution above is becoming more and more irritating as time wears on. I really wish they would just move to the same sort of plastic as GW, Dreamforge, etc.

No disrespect to the folks who like it, it just grates on me after awhile.

Same here at about 150 dust infantry, It gets to be a pain after a while. I haven't had one box of infantry yet that didn't need at least one figure to be straightened.

Duncan_Idaho wrote:
Well, this would mean a steep increase in prices anda lower rate of infantry. Sorry, but business-side ahs to beconsidered or we end up with another dead game.

Sorry Duncan, you usually sound like you know what you're talking about, but you're going to have to expound on that before I'm going to believe it. There are plenty of companies cranking out dirt cheap hard plastic infantry and dust puts out hard plastic vehicles, so why would switching to a harder material make the cost of infantry go up?

**Duncan_Idaho**

Cause it is different forms being used? Cause its way less different parts for vehicles than for infantry? And some of the dirt cheap companies are already in trouble or already have problems delivering in time. And those that do better don´t get as many different infantry kits out the door as FFG or GW do.

If you are referring to Warlord, that just started and they are quite abig company now in comparison to many others. Guess why Battlefront does not have that many different plastic kits (besides from being a little bit late to the show).

Can you please give me some examples?

The infantry that goes with Dust right now is btw, much quicker to get into production than plastics would.

**rwwin**

Duncan_Idaho wrote:
Cause it is different forms being used? Cause its way less different parts for vehicles than for infantry? And some of the dirt cheap companies are already in trouble or already have problems delivering in time. And those that do better don´t get as many different infantry kits out the door as FFG or GW do.

If you are referring to Warlord, that just started and they are quite abig company now in comparison to many others. Guess why Battlefront does not have that many different plastic kits (besides from being a little bit late to the show).

Can you please give me some examples?

The infantry that goes with Dust right now is btw, much quicker to get into production than plastics would.

And none of that explains why soft plastic figures are cheaper and faster to produce than hard plastic figures. I'm honestly asking you to elaborate to someone not an expert on injection molding why can't produce hard plastic figures and retain the same profit level they have now. Is it the type of plastic, the type of mold, labor?

**Duncan_Idaho**

It´s a different molding process that uses different molds and different casting machines.

The difference between both processes can mean that you have to pay several thousand to tenthousand dollars more just to get the same pieces in hard plastic.

**Azazelx**

rwwin wrote:

Duncan_Idaho wrote:
Well, this would mean a steep increase in prices anda lower rate of infantry. Sorry, but business-side ahs to beconsidered or we end up with another dead game.

Sorry Duncan, you usually sound like you know what you're talking about, but you're going to have to expound on that before I'm going to believe it. There are plenty of companies cranking out dirt cheap hard plastic infantry and dust puts out hard plastic vehicles, so why would switching to a harder material make the cost of infantry go up?

This is the sort of thing I was talking about in the other thread, Duncan.
Also, my plastic AT-43 and Confrontation figures are pretty soft. I think they went under for other reasons...

The main defence of soft plastic over hard that I can think of is that it results in fewer breakages of the figures (weapons, etc) when packed/in transit, as the figures are pre-assembled - which results in fewer returns, etc.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Duncan_Idaho wrote:
It´s a different molding process that uses different molds and different casting machines.

The difference between both processes can mean that you have to pay several thousand to tenthousand dollars more just to get the same pieces in hard plastic.

It depends very much on run numbers of course. Also worth noting that a lot (most?) of Dust figures are essentially "cut and pasted" from a selection of parts, Most Allied troops use the same 5 heads/torsos/legs. Likewise with the Axis and SSU (some head variation in some cases) so a run of Recon Boys and Special Ops Rangers use most of the same parts, as opposed to being a completely distinctive run of models.

**Duncan_Idaho**

Some standard parts are of course interchangeable as those units use standard army issue stuff. But there are always pieces in every unit that are not in the others, so you still need quite a number of different pieces.

Softer plastic also allows for smaller runs than hard plastic does. So even heros can be done in plastic and don´t need to be cast in metal. That was a problem GW had for quite a time.

**BrookM**

Anyway, Operation Icarus can now be found on-line: http://new.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_news.asp?eidn=3872

The rules for the upcoming Dust Tactics expansion Operation “Icarus” are now available on our Dust Tactics support page! The siege of Zverograd continues, and the three factions are all trying to secure this vital military target. The Allies currently possess the most powerful air force on the planet, but the Axis is in control of the airfield in Soviet Zverograd. The helicopters of the SSU and the new Axis jets are beginning to close the gap in control of the skies. In order for the Allies to secure their dominance in the air, they must launch a major offensive to take control of the airfield.

Prepare for an Aerial Assault

The Allies will have to take care as they plan their approach. New rules are introduced for taking some limited cover in the few trees that line the strip, deadly and explosive minefields create an added obstacle to tactics on the ground, and the Axis’ infantry can take shelter from the Allied barrage in quonset huts. These hazards and havens will be vital to the Allied assault and will be just as crucial for any Axis or SSU defense plan.

A large array of new skills are introduced in Operation “Icarus,” offering a whole host of news ways to gain a tactical edge. A good general knows the strengths of the units he commands, so to make the best use of all these new abilities, begin planning now.

More Realism in Your Dogfights

If you hunger for a more realistic representation of airborne combat, new Optional Advanced Flying Rules (pdf, 1.5 MB) are also now available on our Dust Tactics support page. These rules were designed to give the aerial battles of Dust Tactics a greater sense of realism to the use of planes in combat.

Head to our Dust Tactics support page to download the rules (pdf, 4.2 MB) for Operation “Icarus.” and plan for the Allies’ push into Zverograd and take a look at a different way to leverage your power in the air!

Direct download link: http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/ffg_content/dust-tactics/support/DT061_OpIcarus_Rulebook_eng%20low%20res.pdf

**Evil_Toast**

So the tradition of including models only available in campaign boxes continues.

Wonder if those models will ever be boxed separately?

**BrookM**

Panzerprins has been available forever now as a resin model on Dust-models. Lovely model, comes with another head, shipping is a bit steep, but well worth it for such a fine quality resin cast.

Might have to get the set though for the huts. Haven't played Dust in ages thanks to FFG and their crawl of releases, but them huts are a must have for me!

**BrookM**

Speaking of Dust-models, here are some new upcoming releases:

US tank crew set A: http://dust-models.com/products_d.php?sid=58&id=383

US tank crew set B: http://dust-models.com/products_d.php?sid=58&id=384

German tank crew: http://dust-models.com/products_d.php?sid=58&id=382

**em_en_oh_pee**

They are very nice, but too expensive for my tastes.

**Kendo**

Are there any other factions planned. This game is quite tempting, but I bit more choice would be alright. I see one Japanese vehicle on the Dust website, so perhaps that might be an option. What about the actual aliens? Any chance of them coming back for their ship?

**Duncan_Idaho**

Japanese, British, Chinese, and French are already planned as subfactions within their relevant factions. Also the Vrill are planned as the fourth major faction.

**AAN**

Just out of curiosity Duncan, what exactly is your involvement with FFG?
You seem to be always "in the know".

**Duncan_Idaho**

Working in the gaming business as a freelancer, and being well-informed about what is going one helps me earning my money

.

On the other hand, the above info is not new, it has been mentioned on the FFG/Dust Studio websites several times.

**RogueRegault**

scipio.au wrote:
Are we using hand waving only for the technology of giant walking tank-robots and reanimated corpses but holding the plane models to the actual reliability and accuracy of the technology of the day?

It's not the tech, it's the proportions. The walkers have "realistic" proportions. The fliers all have these kind of stubby Fisher Price proportions.

Our brains can handwave legs instead of wheels. They can't handwave too fat to fly.

**Azazelx**

Oh, I was talking about Duncan's defence of the giant engines on the Chibi-P-38 in this exchange:

Duncan_Idaho wrote:
Still, the engine makes sense. Germans where the only ones at that time that were able to build the sleek jet-engines. Angloamerican engines were way more bulkier before they were able to observe german engines.

BrookM wrote:
The Gloster Meteor would love to see you about that.

I'm not fond of any of their planes, quite frankly.

**Floris**

The February issue of Dust Chronicles is now available for free download.

DOWNLOAD THE LATEST ISSUE