Sedition Wars Kickstarter, full of McVey goodness! Sci Fi Boardgame. $951k FINISH!

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**General Seric**

str00dles1 wrote:
AegisGrimm wrote:
I got all my stuff today, and while everything is there and in good condition (aside from heavy flash) I am still not sure if I want to keep my copy. Kinda worried about how little it would go for on Ebay, though. I'd like at least 50% or more of what I originally paid into the Kickstarter, but I'm not sure the demand is there for even that.

As a related note....man, those wave 2 figures are absolutely tiny. Beyond heads, Ridley's arms are about the thickness of the back banner poles Space Marines use to come with.

Not sure how much you pledged, but Biohazard with the wave 2 stuff goes for 130-140. Saw a few sell with bids so I put mine up and ended up going for 155$ but mine was 80% painted.

Note Wave 2 for me was whatever extra stuff I got for free, I didn't spend any extra money on more guys, just the 100 for Biohazzard.

It seems that the Wave 2 stuff is certainly very popular on Ebay, unopened copies of the base game only go for $40-50, but some of the Wave 2 figures go for $20-30 each.

The THI suits also seemed to be going for $15, so those that want to get rid of theirs can make their money back.

EDIT: actually, looking at the current listing, the high prices seem to have ben on only the first few Wave 2 listings on, but the demand seems to have already been satisfied, as the current group is not going for nearly as high (except for a few of the $10 add-on figures).

Wish I had been able to put my wave 2 stuff on when it came 2 weeks ago, I could have close to made my money back...

**zedmeister**

Yeah, homage miniatures are keeping their prices but they are slowly decreasing. The other Wave 2 minis are definitely dropping in price. Gnosis Armour Kara is already going for less than £10 on many auctions

Good for me as I'll wait until the prices are low before I grab my homage miniatures

**Hulksmash**

I'm selling a couple of extra homage characters myself. Just the extras. Didn't bother with the basic set models as I figured they wouldn't get a value back I would consider worth the effort of Ebay.

I'm more annoyed they haven't responded to my messages via kickstarter or email yet about my missing items.

**rigeld2**

Hulksmash wrote:
I'm more annoyed they haven't responded to my messages via kickstarter or email yet about my missing items.

Was about to ask that...

I'm pretty annoyed - I have a friend that loves the Riddick story and I was going to paint up not-Riddick for him... but I have to have the mini first.

**Hulksmash**

Yeah, I'm doing the same with the Serenity crew for a buddy who got me into it. He'll dig it. At least I have those though.....

At this point I'd be happier after seeing the models to just have them shift the difference back into Wrath of Kings, which is one of the options I'm going to give them if they ever get back to me.....

**Forlorn**

AegisGrimm wrote:
Nope, just Biohazard models, Ridley, a THI and an updated rulebook.

Wait. Were we supposed to get an updated rule book? Because I didn't get one in my WAVE 2 order.

**spiralingcadaver**

Forlorn wrote:
AegisGrimm wrote:
Nope, just Biohazard models, Ridley, a THI and an updated rulebook.

Wait. Were we supposed to get an updated rule book? Because I didn't get one in my WAVE 2 order.

Only if you paid for it.

**DaveC**

I thought I would post about the comments if the size/scale of the miniatures. Apologies for not doing this sooner, but the past few weeks have been pretty full-on.

I have to say right off the bat, that I am unhappy with the shrinkage of some of the casts - it is certainly disappointing to me, and I'm sure it is to some of you too. Unfortunately, the ones that are the worst effected are the ones that were the thinnest to start with - the ones with a more chunky design have not suffered in the same way. It seems that the process is not kind to finer designs. I don't think the miniatures are ruined - but they are not quite how I had envisioned them coming out.

I can only apologies, and learn from it.

As for the scale... Well as anybody who has been in the hobby for a while knows - discussions on scale and proportions are likely to open up a huge can of worms and polarise opinions. But here we go...

The first Sedition Wars human miniatures (Vanguard) were mainly sculpted by one person, and when that person was not available to work on the wave two material, I had to give the commissions to other sculptors. The people I am working with on SW now, are of the more realistic school of proportion when it comes to humans - so smaller heads compared to bodies, and generally a little finer. They are the same people who have been working with on the bulk of my LE resin line for the past few years, and the proportions there lead to absolutely no complaint . I had to make a decision about the future of the SW range - and who was going to be sculpting the bulk of it going forward, and I decided the more realistic approach was going to be the one that would lead to the best consistency in the future.

You most likely think I should have had the new sculptors work to a style that matched more closely with the original miniatures - but that wasn't really a workable solution. When you try and get creative people to work in a style they are not comfortable with - the results are never good in the long term, and you end up with more problems with quality and consistency. We tried for a half-way house - and if characters were going to be in units with the older miniatures (like Ramirez), we tried to match more closely.

The other factor here, is the subject matter. Some of the wave two characters are supposed to be closely inspired by 'real' subjects, so to get an accurate representation I thought it best to go down the realism route - that was particularly the case with Hexen and Ridley, and the Calamity crew. I didn't want 'war-games' versions of those characters - with large heads and chunky bodies. That was the decision I took at the time - was that the right choice? Given how they suffered in shrinkage terms, I'm no so sure now - but that was my choice, and I'll have to live with it.

Overall I'm not as happy with Wave 2 as I had hoped to be - but they are by no means terrible, and I think many of the miniatures came out very well.

mike

**Breotan**

So, about this Wave 2 stuff. How do we wait before it's all sent out?

**CptJake**

I think I remember CMON saying it would take 2-3 weeks to get it all sent out once they had the terrain packs. I think that means this coming week would be the final week of sending stuff out so hopefully by the following week we get our stuff.

**DiabolicAl**

DaveC wrote:
I thought I would post about the comments if the size/scale of the miniatures. Apologies for not doing this sooner, but the past few weeks have been pretty full-on.

I have to say right off the bat, that I am unhappy with the shrinkage of some of the casts - it is certainly disappointing to me, and I'm sure it is to some of you too. Unfortunately, the ones that are the worst effected are the ones that were the thinnest to start with - the ones with a more chunky design have not suffered in the same way. It seems that the process is not kind to finer designs. I don't think the miniatures are ruined - but they are not quite how I had envisioned them coming out.

I can only apologies, and learn from it.

As for the scale... Well as anybody who has been in the hobby for a while knows - discussions on scale and proportions are likely to open up a huge can of worms and polarise opinions. But here we go...

The first Sedition Wars human miniatures (Vanguard) were mainly sculpted by one person, and when that person was not available to work on the wave two material, I had to give the commissions to other sculptors. The people I am working with on SW now, are of the more realistic school of proportion when it comes to humans - so smaller heads compared to bodies, and generally a little finer. They are the same people who have been working with on the bulk of my LE resin line for the past few years, and the proportions there lead to absolutely no complaint . I had to make a decision about the future of the SW range - and who was going to be sculpting the bulk of it going forward, and I decided the more realistic approach was going to be the one that would lead to the best consistency in the future.

You most likely think I should have had the new sculptors work to a style that matched more closely with the original miniatures - but that wasn't really a workable solution. When you try and get creative people to work in a style they are not comfortable with - the results are never good in the long term, and you end up with more problems with quality and consistency. We tried for a half-way house - and if characters were going to be in units with the older miniatures (like Ramirez), we tried to match more closely.

The other factor here, is the subject matter. Some of the wave two characters are supposed to be closely inspired by 'real' subjects, so to get an accurate representation I thought it best to go down the realism route - that was particularly the case with Hexen and Ridley, and the Calamity crew. I didn't want 'war-games' versions of those characters - with large heads and chunky bodies. That was the decision I took at the time - was that the right choice? Given how they suffered in shrinkage terms, I'm no so sure now - but that was my choice, and I'll have to live with it.

Overall I'm not as happy with Wave 2 as I had hoped to be - but they are by no means terrible, and I think many of the miniatures came out very well.

mike

Well this is looking like a total cluster from the ground up really isnt it? I really regret bakcing this now, and when i FINALLY get wave 2 (i've had 2 shipping notifications from CMON 4 weeks apart but BOTH say the label is just printed) it's probably going to languish in a box somewhere and ill gaze at it disappointedly from time to time. Those THI suits are a total rip too.

**Alpharius**

Yeah, I'm pretty much done with Sedition Wars and McVey moving forward.

Very, very disappointing.

**CptJake**

DiabolicAl wrote:

Well this is looking like a total cluster from the ground up really isnt it? I really regret bakcing this now, and when i FINALLY get wave 2 (i've had 2 shipping notifications from CMON 4 weeks apart but BOTH say the label is just printed) it's probably going to languish in a box somewhere and ill gaze at it disappointedly from time to time. Those THI suits are a total rip too.

At least you got a shipping notice. I'm still waiting for that.

**Gomez**

Alpharius wrote:
Yeah, I'm pretty much done with Sedition Wars and McVey moving forward.

Very, very disappointing.

I'm not quite at that point yet as I quite like the game, the universe, and most of the minis. But I agree that this thing has been wildly disappointing and has virtually killed SW's future prospects. I just can't see myself working with restic ever again, I loved the original minis and have no interest in seeing the scale shift, and I don't want to give CMON another dollar of mine...

**ThaneCawdor**

CptJake wrote:
DiabolicAl wrote:

Well this is looking like a total cluster from the ground up really isnt it? I really regret bakcing this now, and when i FINALLY get wave 2 (i've had 2 shipping notifications from CMON 4 weeks apart but BOTH say the label is just printed) it's probably going to languish in a box somewhere and ill gaze at it disappointedly from time to time. Those THI suits are a total rip too.

At least you got a shipping notice. I'm still waiting for that.

Could be worse- I received a shipping notice on the 12th.. .showing the Shipping Info Received on the 10th.... and it still hasn't been updated.
So apparently they packaged & labeled my box 10 days ago and still haven't bothered giving it to the postman

**Forlorn**

DaveC wrote:
I thought I would post about the comments if the size/scale of the miniatures. Apologies for not doing this sooner, but the past few weeks have been pretty full-on.

I have to say right off the bat, that I am unhappy with the shrinkage of some of the casts - it is certainly disappointing to me, and I'm sure it is to some of you too. Unfortunately, the ones that are the worst effected are the ones that were the thinnest to start with - the ones with a more chunky design have not suffered in the same way. It seems that the process is not kind to finer designs. I don't think the miniatures are ruined - but they are not quite how I had envisioned them coming out.

I can only apologies, and learn from it.

As for the scale... Well as anybody who has been in the hobby for a while knows - discussions on scale and proportions are likely to open up a huge can of worms and polarise opinions. But here we go...

The first Sedition Wars human miniatures (Vanguard) were mainly sculpted by one person, and when that person was not available to work on the wave two material, I had to give the commissions to other sculptors. The people I am working with on SW now, are of the more realistic school of proportion when it comes to humans - so smaller heads compared to bodies, and generally a little finer. They are the same people who have been working with on the bulk of my LE resin line for the past few years, and the proportions there lead to absolutely no complaint . I had to make a decision about the future of the SW range - and who was going to be sculpting the bulk of it going forward, and I decided the more realistic approach was going to be the one that would lead to the best consistency in the future.

You most likely think I should have had the new sculptors work to a style that matched more closely with the original miniatures - but that wasn't really a workable solution. When you try and get creative people to work in a style they are not comfortable with - the results are never good in the long term, and you end up with more problems with quality and consistency. We tried for a half-way house - and if characters were going to be in units with the older miniatures (like Ramirez), we tried to match more closely.

The other factor here, is the subject matter. Some of the wave two characters are supposed to be closely inspired by 'real' subjects, so to get an accurate representation I thought it best to go down the realism route - that was particularly the case with Hexen and Ridley, and the Calamity crew. I didn't want 'war-games' versions of those characters - with large heads and chunky bodies. That was the decision I took at the time - was that the right choice? Given how they suffered in shrinkage terms, I'm no so sure now - but that was my choice, and I'll have to live with it.

Overall I'm not as happy with Wave 2 as I had hoped to be - but they are by no means terrible, and I think many of the miniatures came out very well.

mike

Nothing like a half ass admission that the figures are of poor quality and are small compared to WAVE 1. Love it. Fool me once shame on you. Fool me twice shame on me. Never again.

**Azazelx**

Alpharius wrote:
Yeah, I'm pretty much done with Sedition Wars and McVey moving forward.

Very, very disappointing.

Yeah. He's got to live with it. So do we. I spent/wasted a lot of money on those pieces of gak that I could have spent on any number of better models. "I'm so sad the expensive figures I sold you are gakky" doesn't really do it for me.

**OrlandotheTechnicoloured**

come on $5 per figure is not that expensive

(THI suits aside)

**IdentifyZero**

OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
come on $5 per figure is not that expensive

(THI suits aside)

You're joking right? We paid $10 an optional figure for the most part. I didn't pay for the strain versions of them, those came as a free bonus.

Let's face it, in any other kickstarter, these bonus figures would have likely been resin given the prices.

Long story short, hope Mike enjoyed his share of that million dollars.. likely the last major sum of money he will ever see in his life now that he's tanked his business to the gaming community.

**spiralingcadaver**

IdentifyZero wrote:
You're joking right? We paid $10 an optional figure for the most part. I didn't pay for the strain versions of them, those came as a free bonus.

That's a pretty nit-picky semantic argument. Yes, they were technically sold as $10 minis that happened to get bonus minis, but they were all sold under the same structure of ultimately being $5/mini because they wanted to make each deal more desirable, and IIRC none were at any risk of not getting the bonus minis.

It's like saying buy1-get1 deals are bad deals because the first one's full price.

A slightly more serious complaint to make would be that the above structure limited your flexibility/the granularity of what you could choose to buy, but even that's not much of an argument: minis most often come in set packs where you can't pick and choose.

There are plenty of real problems with this KS/process, but "I technically was paying $10 for one mini and nothing for another" isn't one of them.

Also, please, cite a KS that has had $5 resin LE minis, other than the anomaly that was Bones. (Or $10 ones and free ones, if you really want to hold on to that weird argument.) Seriously, this isn't a joke or a dig or challenge or anything: I want to be informed on what games did that, because it's kind of impressive and I haven't seen it.

**IdentifyZero**

spiralingcadaver wrote:
IdentifyZero wrote:
You're joking right? We paid $10 an optional figure for the most part. I didn't pay for the strain versions of them, those came as a free bonus.

That's a pretty nit-picky semantic argument. Yes, they were technically sold as $10 minis that happened to get bonus minis, but they were all sold under the same structure of ultimately being $5/mini because they wanted to make each deal more desirable, and IIRC none were at any risk of not getting the bonus minis.

It's like saying buy1-get1 deals are bad deals because the first one's full price.

A slightly more serious complaint to make would be that the above structure limited your flexibility/the granularity of what you could choose to buy, but even that's not much of an argument: minis most often come in set packs where you can't pick and choose.

There are plenty of real problems with this KS/process, but "I technically was paying $10 for one mini and nothing for another" isn't one of them.

Also, please, cite a KS that has had $5 resin LE minis, other than the anomaly that was Bones. (Or $10 ones and free ones, if you really want to hold on to that weird argument.) Seriously, this isn't a joke or a dig or challenge or anything: I want to be informed on what games did that, because it's kind of impressive and I haven't seen it.

Comment removed. Reds8n , the strain versions of the miniatures were FREE unlocks. Purchasing those miniatures had nothing to do with the unlocks. If you want to apply that logic in other places as well, it's not going to do you any good.

Also, you know who was selling $10 resin miniatures.. wait for it.. oh... Studio McVeys Sedition Wars lineup when they came out.

You know who did $15 resin miniatures in a larger scale as add-ons? Kingdom Death.

Please Spiral, stop defending Studio McVey and this project altogether. You're the only one who still seems to be there trying to defend them, or is it you have a hard on for replying to only my posts/ I've seen a lot worse stuff posted since Wave 2 was announced than I ever posted on these topics, the difference is, you only and the fanbois seem to like to appear when I post. Is your problem with what I said or just with me? Seems like your problem is with me because you have a twisted obsession, verging on something that gives you pleasure in trying to defend Sedition Wars from my comments but not others.

(P.S. On the resin miniatures for $10, I can give you about a dozen more manufacturers who sell products of high quality resin sculpts for $10 each. This restic gak isn't worth $1 a miniature, let alone $5 or $10. Give it up Spiral).

**Alpharius**

I don't think there's much good to come from getting down to that level of detailing the problem that many have with this Kickstarter.

It is all rather obvious and sad at this point.

For me, once my Wave 2 stuff comes in, it is all going up on eBay and I hope to get back some of what I put into this thing, and then just move on.

**IdentifyZero**

Alpharius wrote:
I don't think there's much good to come from getting down to that level of detailing the problem that many have with this Kickstarter.

It is all rather obvious and sad at this point.

For me, once my Wave 2 stuff comes in, it is all going up on eBay and I hope to get back some of what I put into this thing, and then just move on.

I'm going to box all mine up and ask Mike McVey if he is willing to buy it back for what I paid. No Joke.

**spiralingcadaver**

Thanks for the assumptions and inferences about what I said, plus some insults and misinformation. It's been fun.

**IdentifyZero**

spiralingcadaver wrote:
Thanks for the assumptions and inferences about what I said, plus some insults and misinformation. It's been fun.

Thanks for attacking everything I post no matter how factual it is.

**AegisGrimm**

I don't think there's much good to come from getting down to that level of detailing the problem that many have with this Kickstarter.

It is all rather obvious and sad at this point.

For me, once my Wave 2 stuff comes in, it is all going up on eBay and I hope to get back some of what I put into this thing, and then just move on.

Same here. I don't really want to take the time required just to prep the base game figures for priming, let alone paint them all after all of this. Much less the extras from the Biohazard level. Other than the clear opticamo Vanguard (which are really cool), I completely regret buying Ridley and a THI suit. The suit is way too small for a 15 dollar figure, and the strain model of Ridley is horrid compared to the artwork.

This single campaign has actually colored me towards other campaigns that are using Restic as their material of choice.

It's unfortunate that backing this campaign was a complete splurge made just before the (relative) chaos of my wedding, as I can think of many other games I could have made better use of spending $150 on. If I could get $100 dollars for it on Ebay, I'd do it right now, and buy more X-Wing ships, or something-or even better, put it towards Deadzone minis to use for 40K.

**Triple9**

I view SW as a cautionary tale. It's definitely taught me to be much more conservative with my pledges as well as with pledge managers. My 250 pledge here has saved me at least 4X that since January.

**sparkywtf**

Triple9 wrote:
I view SW as a cautionary tale. It's definitely taught me to be much more conservative with my pledges as well as with pledge managers. My 250 pledge here has saved me at least 4X that since January.

Very much this.

Also I figure even if it isn't the top quality stuff we all were promised, I am not too upset. I also look at it as a way to expand my skillset with a different material and technique, and as a newer painter, plenty of fodder for the paint brush.

**cincydooley**

IdentifyZero wrote:
, .

(P.S. On the resin miniatures for $10, I can give you about a dozen more manufacturers who sell products of high quality resin sculpts for $10 each. This restic gak isn't worth $1 a miniature, let alone $5 or $10. Give it up Spiral).

I'd actually love to know this.....

**spiralingcadaver**

Yep, agreed that it would be a good resource. I've never seen a $10 resin I've wanted (I find Bones's line which I find generic and not the best sculpts, and GW has some for non-uniques but characters are around $20 +/- $5), which is why I asked hoping for a useful resource, and got the snarky response of SMV's own resins (which are currently around $20... don't know what price they were before years of inflation and fluctuation of exchange rates) and KD's (which are $25+).