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Wether they do it now or later really dosnt matter. Personally I think it will be next. I believe GW have states they won't be killing any other codexs. Marines are the name of the game from GW stand point. I honestly don't understand why you guys have to start this argument every time DA is brought up. I don't try and down play other people's armies when they might be getting updated. Especially since GW seems to take 5 to 10 years to get back around to it. Just because your preferred army isn't next doesn't mean you have to rain on other peoples parades.

The WD SoB codex might not have too much in the way of options but it does work. Quite well, in fact - I'm still about even vs our resident Necron player.

DA hands down. The only thing that is worth it in the book is the deathwing army. Anything else besides termies, dreads, and landraiders in that list is over prices and not as good as codex marines. The SOB WD dex is not that bad and can be kind of beastly in the right hands and allies makes them even better.

Personally, I'm not sure if any codices are worse than others, but I am hating all the tonnes of new special rules and weapons that inflict instant death without using the instant death rule in the new books

There doesn't seem to be much point to Eternal Warrior anymore unless I'm missing something...

...Though Tyranids are probably the worst right now.

 HeatWave wrote:
Personally, I'm not sure if any codices are worse than others, but I am hating all the tonnes of new special rules and weapons that inflict instant death without using the instant death rule in the new books

There doesn't seem to be much point to Eternal Warrior anymore unless I'm missing something...

...Though Tyranids are probably the worst right now.

Umm... I'm not sure what you are playing, but I've encountered very little which bypasses EW. EW works against any source of instant death, including wounds from weapons with a strength equal to twice the model's toughness and force weapons. Only things that directly remove models can get around it, and the only example I can think of is the Tesseract Labyrinth for Necrons, and even that is rarely taken and is not very reliable. EW is still incredibly valuable so I'm pretty sure you are missing a ton of information.

GK's, almost as filthy as 'crons.

 Lobukia wrote:

 Flashman wrote:
Went for Black Templars. One too many "Fantasy in Space" archetype for me. Plus I find it untidy that a minor chapter gets it's own Codex. If we have to have individual books for Space Marine chapters, let's restrict it to the big 4 please.

This, and it looks like GW agrees. Very possible BT get rolled into the SM codex (as should BA and DA, IMO)

There has never been a single statement or rumor from the GW camp stating theyre getting rolled. That opinion stems from guesswork after their limited representation in the 6th Rulebook. The only actual BT rumors Ive seen can be found on Bolter and Chainsword in the BT Rumor Thread, and these are from BT fans who attend GW events to bug the game designers and have sent in numerous emails to their customer service department. These all state that GW is continuing to support BT and they are getting a new codex, but unfortunately there is no timeframe involved. This coupled with the BT-flavored models on the leaked release list keep me more than confident in our independence, and amazed that people consider fan-made speculation to be actual "rumors".


So....love us or hate us...were going to be around for a long time, with our own codex, and youre gullible if you dont think so.

 HeatWave wrote:
Personally, I'm not sure if any codices are worse than others, but I am hating all the tonnes of new special rules and weapons that inflict instant death without using the instant death rule in the new books

There doesn't seem to be much point to Eternal Warrior anymore unless I'm missing something...

...Though Tyranids are probably the worst right now.

Well, as a Daemon player who relies heavily on EW being the bee's knees to keep my gribblies going, I have to say that there's barely *any* abilities out there that can insta-gibb my dudes...

Outside of GK's who simply steamroll Daemons with absolutely no effort, the only abilities/wargear off the top of my head are;
- Jaws of the World Wolf (SW's)
- Tessarect Labrynth, Monolith portal, 1 specific C'tan power ('Crons)
- Dark Eldar have one or two single use items that can 'remove from play' a model
- Shokk Attack Gun rolling boxcars (Orks)
- Gift of Chaos/Boon of Mutation ability (CSM's & Daemons)

So yeah, EW is proof against pretty much anything outside of a bare handful of abilities that outside of Jaws, are either stupidly short ranged and/or 'one use only'

Only one I don't like is the Sisters of Battle (White Dwarf update thing).

I like the Sisters of Battle, Witch Hunters etc, I just don't feel it's enough to even be regarded as a codex anymore, which is a damn shame because if anybody they have a decent merit to be a single codex.

That whole little WD update just felt like a way to lessen peoples anger than actually caring about the sob line.

Can SOB work? Sure, in the same way Nids, Eldar, or Tau can work. Which is to say one specific build spamming the same handful of units that crumples up and dies when it runs into Space Wolves. I miss being able to play SOB as a HtH army and the ability to take Repentia in 20 girl units. Not to mention Canonesses suddenly losing the ability to take Jump packs after a decade and a half (and three of the four models) sporting them. Cruddace beat the flavor out of that army like he has every book he has ever touched.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
PS- The WD thing was because they were tired of answering questions about the allies thing and the shared models with different profiles between them and the new GK book.

I had to vote Sisters of Battle, since it isn't even a real codex. Pretty sad considering it is such a unique range of models. Certainly more interesting than a variety of different colored space marines.

Experiment 626 wrote:

Well, as a Daemon player who relies heavily on EW being the bee's knees to keep my gribblies going, I have to say that there's barely *any* abilities out there that can insta-gibb my dudes...

Outside of GK's who simply steamroll Daemons with absolutely no effort, the only abilities/wargear off the top of my head are;
- Jaws of the World Wolf (SW's)
- Tessarect Labrynth, Monolith portal, 1 specific C'tan power ('Crons)
- Dark Eldar have one or two single use items that can 'remove from play' a model
- Shokk Attack Gun rolling boxcars (Orks)
- Gift of Chaos/Boon of Mutation ability (CSM's & Daemons)

So yeah, EW is proof against pretty much anything outside of a bare handful of abilities that outside of Jaws, are either stupidly short ranged and/or 'one use only'

RegalPhantom wrote:

 HeatWave wrote:
Personally, I'm not sure if any codices are worse than others, but I am hating all the tonnes of new special rules and weapons that inflict instant death without using the instant death rule in the new books

There doesn't seem to be much point to Eternal Warrior anymore unless I'm missing something...

...Though Tyranids are probably the worst right now.

Umm... I'm not sure what you are playing, but I've encountered very little which bypasses EW. EW works against any source of instant death, including wounds from weapons with a strength equal to twice the model's toughness and force weapons. Only things that directly remove models can get around it, and the only example I can think of is the Tesseract Labyrinth for Necrons, and even that is rarely taken and is not very reliable. EW is still incredibly valuable so I'm pretty sure you are missing a ton of information.

Huh, well maybe I've just been very unlucky in games I take my comment back though!

 d3m01iti0n wrote:
These all state that GW is continuing to support BT and they are getting a new codex, but unfortunately there is no timeframe involved. This coupled with the BT-flavored models on the leaked release list keep me more than confident in our independence, and amazed that people consider fan-made speculation to be actual "rumors".

Besides, what could be easier for GW than yet another Marine Codex? You can sell the same models again, and again, and again, just by adding a few flavor bits to make it the Chapter you want. Lower production costs since you produce a lot and don't need to sculpt it all anew for the Codex! And people will still buy it for the same price!

Spetulhu wrote:

 d3m01iti0n wrote:
These all state that GW is continuing to support BT and they are getting a new codex, but unfortunately there is no timeframe involved. This coupled with the BT-flavored models on the leaked release list keep me more than confident in our independence, and amazed that people consider fan-made speculation to be actual "rumors".

Besides, what could be easier for GW than yet another Marine Codex? You can sell the same models again, and again, and again, just by adding a few flavor bits to make it the Chapter you want. Lower production costs since you produce a lot and don't need to sculpt it all anew for the Codex! And people will still buy it for the same price!

Seems like a business model with no drawbacks to me.

 d3m01iti0n wrote:

Spetulhu wrote:

 d3m01iti0n wrote:
These all state that GW is continuing to support BT and they are getting a new codex, but unfortunately there is no timeframe involved. This coupled with the BT-flavored models on the leaked release list keep me more than confident in our independence, and amazed that people consider fan-made speculation to be actual "rumors".

Besides, what could be easier for GW than yet another Marine Codex? You can sell the same models again, and again, and again, just by adding a few flavor bits to make it the Chapter you want. Lower production costs since you produce a lot and don't need to sculpt it all anew for the Codex! And people will still buy it for the same price!

Seems like a business model with no drawbacks to me.

I never agree with you d3m01iti0n how is this happening!

Here are the facts Marines are one of the common starter armies. They do use the same base models. But then use sell a ton of upgrade sprues and chapter specific bits to make them fluffy and fitting.

I actually broke down the 9 main chapters into 4 codex based on their fluff tactical deployment (the you just add in (death company are for blood angels only for example)

Standard deployment: Ultramarines, Salamanders
Fast Strike: White scars, Blood Angels, Raven guard
I have no idea how to describe this but there doctorine is kinda similar: Iron Hands, Space Wolves
Elite Gunlines: Imperial Fists, Dark Angels

Tell me where you could fit Black Templars in there maybe with the wolves and hands yeah but they really don't fit there either. So in short leave it.

 captain collius wrote:

 d3m01iti0n wrote:

Spetulhu wrote:

 d3m01iti0n wrote:
These all state that GW is continuing to support BT and they are getting a new codex, but unfortunately there is no timeframe involved. This coupled with the BT-flavored models on the leaked release list keep me more than confident in our independence, and amazed that people consider fan-made speculation to be actual "rumors".

Besides, what could be easier for GW than yet another Marine Codex? You can sell the same models again, and again, and again, just by adding a few flavor bits to make it the Chapter you want. Lower production costs since you produce a lot and don't need to sculpt it all anew for the Codex! And people will still buy it for the same price!

Seems like a business model with no drawbacks to me.

I never agree with you d3m01iti0n how is this happening!

Here are the facts Marines are one of the common starter armies. They do use the same base models. But then use sell a ton of upgrade sprues and chapter specific bits to make them fluffy and fitting.

I actually broke down the 9 main chapters into 4 codex based on their fluff tactical deployment (the you just add in (death company are for blood angels only for example)

Standard deployment: Ultramarines, Salamanders
Fast Strike: White scars, Blood Angels, Raven guard
I have no idea how to describe this but there doctorine is kinda similar: Iron Hands, Space Wolves
Elite Gunlines: Imperial Fists, Dark Angels

Tell me where you could fit Black Templars in there maybe with the wolves and hands yeah but they really don't fit there either. So in short leave it.

They dont fit anywhere, thats the point. They are an old school throwback to the days of the Great Crusade. They establish fortresses on multiple planets and recruit from each, effectively multiplying their numbers. They ignore the Codex Astartes. There command structure is, lets face it, nearly non-existant. Theyre more a less a horde with veterans running things. They only take orders from the Emperor, and seeing as how he's not saying anything lately, theyre are still on the "Purge the galaxy of xenos bitches" tip. They are more or less a bunch of raging over-zealous donkey-caves that look down on other chapters as lazy mary sues who dont get gak done.

You dont agree with me? Im deep frying truth nuggets here, breaded in crisp facts. Thats how their fluff is written. There is no official statement or rumor from GW concerning a codex roll; only confirmation of a new codex in the far future. Selling a shitton of Marines with different upgrade sprues IS a lucrative tactic. You might not like BT but Im not saying anything that is inaccurate.

I was supporting you. try and read what it actually says dude. my point was they are seperate even if they shouldn't have originally been seperated

 captain collius wrote:
I was supporting you. try and read what it actually says dude. my point was they are seperate even if they shouldn't have originally been seperated

LOL sorry with Righteous Zeal I sometimes run at the wrong targets..........

I fail to see how anyone can think Tyranids is the worst codex right now, don't get me wrong it maybe isn't as strong as it should be at this point in time but it is by far not the worst.

Black Templars, SoB's and even DA (I'm a DA player and I admit our codex sucks, still play it though) are worse off than the nids.

 d3m01iti0n wrote:

 captain collius wrote:
I was supporting you. try and read what it actually says dude. my point was they are seperate even if they shouldn't have originally been seperated

LOL sorry with Righteous Zeal I sometimes run at the wrong targets..........

No problem

Now back to the truth the worst codex is the Nids they make no sense in the fluff, and the codex is pretty bad

Id like to see a Nid update as there is a decent army on Craigslist Ive been eyeballing. No idea if theyre bad or not as I have no idea how theyre played.

I will tell you that Orkz being forced to Loota spam seems ridiculous for a CC army. Would like to see that addressed so I can dust mine off.

Tau and Sisters, my 2 armies! I play to lose

SoB right now is the worst codex; it came in installments and is almost impossible to acquire now that the original print run is done on it.

Of all the codices in 40K right now, the one that least deserves to exist is the Space Wolves Codex.
I'm actually a little bit into Norse mythology, but I just feel that the "Viking" marines violate that in the most horrible way. They have the most ugly model range of all GW miniatures, and their fluff is completely rediculous because they are trying too hard.
The naming policy is so silly, that it makes the entire army look completely unserious while still trying the best to be "awesome" at the same time.
I wanted to start an elite close combat army, and a friend gifted me the SW battleforce, but I just coulden't get myself to assemble a single miniature, so recently decided to sell it, after hiding it in my closet for two years. After SW, GK is close second, because they were simply changed to "silver" "bad ass" marines, instead of a mysterious branch of the inquisistion. Fluff means a lot to me, so the codices that are written badly gets the most hate from me. It doesn't help either if people are chosing it because it is OP.

The sisters could use an update.

Makumba wrote:how do sob deal with necron or IG flyer lists ?

Lots of ways. My favourite is Melta Dominions. Four to five twin-linked meltaguns can make a mess of pretty much anything, even rolling 6s to hit. There's also the Avenger Strike Fighter, which is pretty nice, especially with its ability to target two enemy fliers at a time, one of which can be behind it[/]. Plus, a Canoness on an Aegis Defence Line will mincemeat a flier a turn with twin-linked BS5 double autocannons.

Phazael wrote:If we are talking no allies or fortifications, then its SOB hands down. Hello army with a bunch of overpriced T3 assault models with squad caps of ten, poor saves, and no access to assault vehicles. This backed by a core of infantry priced in the neighborhood of space marine that falls short on every stat with no access to AP2 or armor killing weapons on their squad leaders. And lets not forget the non scaling faith mechanic....

They do get better than Nids the moment they can take an ally or man an emplaced gun, however.

Eitherway, when it comes to crappy codexes, no one can touch the master robin Crudface.

You seem to have forgotten that Battle Sisters can take twin plasma pistols on their sister superior, or a combi-melta, or a power axe (yes, that DID get FAQ'd). You're also overlooking meltaguns in squads with preferred enemy. Meltabombs on Sister Superior as well, Don't forget we hit walkers on weapon skill with melta bombs now. We're also 3 points cheaper than a Marine, model for model, while being identical on the offence.

Repentia are insanely fragile for their price, but considering that they slaughter tanks and walkers, you just have to treat them like a real woman: with a little care and attention, and make sure you know what they like. Besides, they're hardly our main units. Dominions, Seraphim, Retributors and Exorcists are all excellent, while Battle Sister squads and Penitent Engines have their place.

Sure, I'd like the option to drop frag and krak grenades and only pay 10/11 points/model, but I can live with what I've got... and anyone who says the fluff has been ripped apart needs to go buy a copy of Codex: Grey Knights. The only thing that's disappointing about the "new" Sisters fluff is that Silvana's body just vanished, instead of being replaced with a silver skeleton. Everything else has been a return to the good-old-days, when the Sisterhood was a proud force in its own right, serving the Ecclesiarchy and the Ecclesiarchy alone without any of this "Ordo Hereticus" :cuss:.

So no, the SoB codex, what there is of it, isn't the worst.

The worst is the vanilla Space Marine codex. Not enough information on any [i]one chapter except the Ultramarines, it tries to be too many armies at once, and to do so it mostly stole Dark Angels equipment and tactics!

Tyrant's Legion!

I want to like it so much, because it's characterful etc., and is generally something I really like, but there are so many drawbacks w/o any real compensation (cheaper, etc.) that I can't get myself to field it. Every time I try, I find myself trying to salvage something terrible...

I would have to say Sisters of Battles. as an atheist I personally find the fanatism of the IoM rather annoying but with the IG it is sort of understandable. They have Commissars who say "Believe or die" and SM are less worship, than say, high respect. But Sisters just go on and on and on and deny their God-given rights (no pun intended) to happiness or pleasure.

And also, female space marines. No.

 SoloFalcon1138 wrote:
Tau. It was invented simply to bring the annoying, Pocky-fueled anime/mechanfans into the game.

No. Just... no.

As for the whole Space Marines Codex(es) thing... well, how about two books? You have Codex: Space Marines and Non-Codex: Space Marines! One for codex-adherent, and one for non-codex-adherent. That way, all the variations/flavours of Marines out there that are different more on the fluff side than the tabletop one, and therefore don't really deserve a full book, still get the attention they do deserve.

I feel that some are using a pragmatic point about how some of the game mechanics are poorly presented to take pot-shots at armies that provide a wealth of diversity and flavour to the setting, attacking their existence in the game wholesale, and not just their codexes. This is extreme, to say the least.

Tau, its just lackluster and old aged. The fish heads are in serious need of an update and some Matt Ward magic.