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Oh? Let's see what's become of mainstay units of the old Necron 'dex:
1) Monoliths: not something I'd ever take - but it's a matter of taste. I've seem plenty of them played and they do quite well still.
2) Immortals: (sure they have new models, but it's not as if the old ones are less useful; gauss immies are just as good as their tesla counterparts): these see play a LOT now. I know several folk who had 20 or even 30 of those under the old dex - they have 20-30 immies still seeing play now. Competitively.
3) Warriors: still quite good, still used quite a lot.
4) Wraiths (sure new models but the old ones are valid; whip coils aren't hard to DIY): good, competitive unit.
5) Scarabs: these guys got good, no doubt about that.
6) Spyders: used plenty. again, new model available but the old one works fine!
7) Pariahs: ...okay meh. warscythe lychguard can be fun but... meh. still, that's just one unit (and they convert to crypteks just fine with some bits from the lychguard/praetorian kit if you're so inclined!)
8) Destroyers: ...this is actually the only unit that got the 'fex treatment this codex. one. fethin. unit. just one.

all in all someone with an existing army bought a couple of transports and suddenly had a tournament-competitive army to play with.

How was that a bad update? Really. Hey, I got stung by the 'Nid upgrade so I know updates can be bad but Necrons are a good example of an update which was great for pretty much anyone playing a Necron army (aside from destroyerwing, and arguably even those aren't half as bad as, say, oh over half of the 'nid dex ) - as were for example GK and SW - in all those examples you *could* get a whole new army of shiney new toys - but the old toys worked just fine, just as well.
If codex: Tau goes along the lines of those, you'll get some new shinyness you could always just ignore, but you'll get decent rules for existing models as well

 Bolognesus wrote:
Oh? Let's see what's become of mainstay units of the old Necron 'dex:
1) Monoliths: not something I'd ever take - but it's a matter of taste. I've seem plenty of them played and they do quite well still.
2) Immortals: (sure they have new models, but it's not as if the old ones are less useful; gauss immies are just as good as their tesla counterparts): these see play a LOT now. I know several folk who had 20 or even 30 of those under the old dex - they have 20-30 immies still seeing play now. Competitively.
3) Warriors: still quite good, still used quite a lot.
4) Wraiths (sure new models but the old ones are valid; whip coils aren't hard to DIY): good, competitive unit.
5) Scarabs: these guys got good, no doubt about that.
6) Spyders: used plenty. again, new model available but the old one works fine!
7) Pariahs: ...okay meh. warscythe lychguard can be fun but... meh. still, that's just one unit (and they convert to crypteks just fine with some bits from the lychguard/praetorian kit if you're so inclined!)
8) Destroyers: ...this is actually the only unit that got the 'fex treatment this codex. one. fethin. unit. just one.

all in all someone with an existing army bought a couple of transports and suddenly had a tournament-competitive army to play with.

How was that a bad update? Really. Hey, I got stung by the 'Nid upgrade so I know updates can be bad but Necrons are a good example of an update which was great for pretty much anyone playing a Necron army (aside from destroyerwing, and arguably even those aren't half as bad as, say, oh over half of the 'nid dex ) - as were for example GK and SW - in all those examples you *could* get a whole new army of shiney new toys - but the old toys worked just fine, just as well.
If codex: Tau goes along the lines of those, you'll get some new shinyness you could always just ignore, but you'll get decent rules for existing models as well

I totally agree with all of this!

P.S. i like your sig

Normally I’d say something like “Get ready for the pendulum to swing” and for all the effective Tau units to suddenly become useless and vice versa... but how many effective Tau units are there? Can you really nerf an army that doesn’t function as intended?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Normally I’d say something like “Get ready for the pendulum to swing” and for all the effective Tau units to suddenly become useless and vice versa... but how many effective Tau units are there? Can you really nerf an army that doesn’t function as intended?

I expect they'll do their best!

 Bolognesus wrote:
Oh? Let's see what's become of mainstay units of the old Necron 'dex:
1) Monoliths: not something I'd ever take - but it's a matter of taste. I've seem plenty of them played and they do quite well still.
2) Immortals: (sure they have new models, but it's not as if the old ones are less useful; gauss immies are just as good as their tesla counterparts): these see play a LOT now. I know several folk who had 20 or even 30 of those under the old dex - they have 20-30 immies still seeing play now. Competitively.
3) Warriors: still quite good, still used quite a lot.
4) Wraiths (sure new models but the old ones are valid; whip coils aren't hard to DIY): good, competitive unit.
5) Scarabs: these guys got good, no doubt about that.
6) Spyders: used plenty. again, new model available but the old one works fine!
7) Pariahs: ...okay meh. warscythe lychguard can be fun but... meh. still, that's just one unit (and they convert to crypteks just fine with some bits from the lychguard/praetorian kit if you're so inclined!)
8) Destroyers: ...this is actually the only unit that got the 'fex treatment this codex. one. fethin. unit. just one.

all in all someone with an existing army bought a couple of transports and suddenly had a tournament-competitive army to play with.

How was that a bad update? Really. Hey, I got stung by the 'Nid upgrade so I know updates can be bad but Necrons are a good example of an update which was great for pretty much anyone playing a Necron army (aside from destroyerwing, and arguably even those aren't half as bad as, say, oh over half of the 'nid dex ) - as were for example GK and SW - in all those examples you *could* get a whole new army of shiney new toys - but the old toys worked just fine, just as well.
If codex: Tau goes along the lines of those, you'll get some new shinyness you could always just ignore, but you'll get decent rules for existing models as well

1.) Monoliths got totally nerfed. Lost Lance/Melta Immunity. Lost Deep Strike protection. Weapon Strength Reduced. All weapons minus door can now be destroyed.
2.)Both Immortals and Warriors got nerfed in their ability to res only on a 5+ now without an orb. Orb tax makes them way more expensive than original Immortals. Now with 1 less toughness, and rapid fire Gauss Blasters versus the far superior original Assault 2 S5 AP4 gun. Yes Tesla is awesome but really, the original Immortals were removed from the game and the models became 3rd edition warriors slightly better and 1 point cheaper.
3.)Warriors quite good? In what game are you playing. They are only fielded because they are a cheap troop choice and 6th gave them the ability to glance vehicles to death, but since hardly anyone takes decent vehicles anymore the point is moot. The codex gives us 2 troops options, and that is the only reason you see warriors as they are a cheap troop and unlock NightScythes. Warriors Res on a 5+ instead of 4+ and lost an Armour point. They got 5 points cheaper but the Res. Orb tax doesn't make up for the point decrease.
4.) Canoptek Wraiths are not event the same unit they were in 3rd. They kept the 3+ Inv. save and rending weapons but other than that they were totally remade and lost the ability to resurrect. They are now one of the best units in the entire game as they grew in size from max 3 models to 6 but that is all GW needed to change was increasing the unit size.
5.) Scarabs were awesome now they pretty much suck. They were faster in 3rd edition through 5th. 6th edition pretty much nerfed them and made flamers so much better that scarabs die quick and pointless deaths on the 40k battlefields these days. Plus no one takes the units that Scarabs are able to devour in seconds unless they happen to be transports loaded with flamer troops that again, kill them quickly.
6.) Spyders changed very little, but did get nerfed in their ability to be purchased in squads of 3 and placed separately and did not have to maintain coherency.
7.) Lychguard are not Pariahs. At best you can wysiwyg proxie them as Warscythe Lychguard. that is where their similarity ends. Pariahs had built in S5 AP4 assault 2 guns, Warscythes that ignored all saves(even Inv. saves), were fearless, caused Psykers to flee and could reduce their iniative to 1 in CC and they reduced all opposing models leadership to 7 within 12" of the unit. GW deleted these from the game because they sold poorly. But they only needed a little tweaking and a plastic kit and Pariahs would have been amazing if included in the new codex. They suffered from not being able to use the Veil or monolith's teleportation and couldn't ressurect. If that was fixed they would be an amazing unit far superior to Lychguard.
8.) Destroyers got totally nerfed though the ability to combine Heavies with Regulars is a plus.


The point I was making was that Destroyers, Monoliths, warriors, and Lords were amazing and GW didn't need to sell more models of them so they Nerfed them. The few Tau players left have plenty of Hammerheads, Stealth suits, Firewarriors, Kroot and Broadsides so I don't expect them to make any of those must have units in the new book. New unit entries will be amazing so that you buy the new models and ignore your old non-essential units. Broadsides may still be amazing though they will probably get a new kit and options that aren't present on your existing models, making your old ones obsolete and force you to purchase new kits. GW's business model positions players to purchase new kits with new codexes. I totally understand it and acutally support the model, you just have to expect your favorite units from the current book to get eclipsed to a certain degree by new models and units.

Actually I would say destroyers are quite powerful. But it really depends on the meta.

Against meqs, yes.
Against TEQs and vehicles...you'll need heavies.

Against hoards...nope, useless.

 NecronLord3 wrote:
The point I was making was that Destroyers, Monoliths, warriors, and Lords were amazing and GW didn't need to sell more models of them so they Nerfed them. The few Tau players left have plenty of Hammerheads, Stealth suits, Firewarriors, Kroot and Broadsides so I don't expect them to make any of those must have units in the new book. New unit entries will be amazing so that you buy the new models and ignore your old non-essential units. Broadsides may still be amazing though they will probably get a new kit and options that aren't present on your existing models, making your old ones obsolete and force you to purchase new kits. GW's business model positions players to purchase new kits with new codexes. I totally understand it and acutally support the model, you just have to expect your favorite units from the current book to get eclipsed to a certain degree by new models and units.

If they found a way so that Kroot are even worst than theyre right now, its not goin to change much, i doubt anyone actually gets them to the table since they can do little more than stay on a forest and shoot anything comes close enough, they cant charge anymore thanks to overwatch, so its not a needed unit anymore, Firewarriors are insanely better with the new rules for shooting, so unless the new FW kit brings a whole lot of heavy weaponry for them, i dont see the need to buy a new one, and i will not be a surprise that they dont get a new kit with new things, it will probably just become a Firewarrior/Pathfinder kit with the Rail Rifles that the Firewarrior unit cant take, and even if they make it possible, Pulse Rifle are easily convertible to Rail Rifles.

Stealth Suits are probable getting new options, like when they changed from XV15 to XV25, and i will not be bothered with this, since i will still use my XV15 for the model with Pulse Cannon, the XV25 for the Fusion, and the new one for the shiny weapon they bring to the team. Broadsides are hard to take down, since they pack up the best weapon on the Codex with a TL, HH are on the line to pack up a multikit with Rail/Ionhead and the Skyray with some luck.

Anyway, just as was already told a few post above, its hard to make a useless unit more useless(Stealth, Vespid, Kroot), if they bring a new Troop unit for Tau it will be good on everyway, since we have just 1 option thanks to the Assault nerf on 6th. While good ones are going to still be good becouse they are so into the Codex with their best options that i cant see a way to change it unless GW says now that the Railgun its a 9S2AP weapon : /

 NecronLord3 wrote:

 Bolognesus wrote:
Oh? Let's see what's become of mainstay units of the old Necron 'dex:
1) Monoliths: not something I'd ever take - but it's a matter of taste. I've seem plenty of them played and they do quite well still.
2) Immortals: (sure they have new models, but it's not as if the old ones are less useful; gauss immies are just as good as their tesla counterparts): these see play a LOT now. I know several folk who had 20 or even 30 of those under the old dex - they have 20-30 immies still seeing play now. Competitively.
3) Warriors: still quite good, still used quite a lot.
4) Wraiths (sure new models but the old ones are valid; whip coils aren't hard to DIY): good, competitive unit.
5) Scarabs: these guys got good, no doubt about that.
6) Spyders: used plenty. again, new model available but the old one works fine!
7) Pariahs: ...okay meh. warscythe lychguard can be fun but... meh. still, that's just one unit (and they convert to crypteks just fine with some bits from the lychguard/praetorian kit if you're so inclined!)
8) Destroyers: ...this is actually the only unit that got the 'fex treatment this codex. one. fethin. unit. just one.

all in all someone with an existing army bought a couple of transports and suddenly had a tournament-competitive army to play with.

How was that a bad update? Really. Hey, I got stung by the 'Nid upgrade so I know updates can be bad but Necrons are a good example of an update which was great for pretty much anyone playing a Necron army (aside from destroyerwing, and arguably even those aren't half as bad as, say, oh over half of the 'nid dex ) - as were for example GK and SW - in all those examples you *could* get a whole new army of shiney new toys - but the old toys worked just fine, just as well.
If codex: Tau goes along the lines of those, you'll get some new shinyness you could always just ignore, but you'll get decent rules for existing models as well

1.) Monoliths got totally nerfed. Lost Lance/Melta Immunity. Lost Deep Strike protection. Weapon Strength Reduced. All weapons minus door can now be destroyed.
2.)Both Immortals and Warriors got nerfed in their ability to res only on a 5+ now without an orb. Orb tax makes them way more expensive than original Immortals. Now with 1 less toughness, and rapid fire Gauss Blasters versus the far superior original Assault 2 S5 AP4 gun. Yes Tesla is awesome but really, the original Immortals were removed from the game and the models became 3rd edition warriors slightly better and 1 point cheaper.
3.)Warriors quite good? In what game are you playing. They are only fielded because they are a cheap troop choice and 6th gave them the ability to glance vehicles to death, but since hardly anyone takes decent vehicles anymore the point is moot. The codex gives us 2 troops options, and that is the only reason you see warriors as they are a cheap troop and unlock NightScythes. Warriors Res on a 5+ instead of 4+ and lost an Armour point. They got 5 points cheaper but the Res. Orb tax doesn't make up for the point decrease.
4.) Canoptek Wraiths are not event the same unit they were in 3rd. They kept the 3+ Inv. save and rending weapons but other than that they were totally remade and lost the ability to resurrect. They are now one of the best units in the entire game as they grew in size from max 3 models to 6 but that is all GW needed to change was increasing the unit size.
5.) Scarabs were awesome now they pretty much suck. They were faster in 3rd edition through 5th. 6th edition pretty much nerfed them and made flamers so much better that scarabs die quick and pointless deaths on the 40k battlefields these days. Plus no one takes the units that Scarabs are able to devour in seconds unless they happen to be transports loaded with flamer troops that again, kill them quickly.
6.) Spyders changed very little, but did get nerfed in their ability to be purchased in squads of 3 and placed separately and did not have to maintain coherency.
7.) Lychguard are not Pariahs. At best you can wysiwyg proxie them as Warscythe Lychguard. that is where their similarity ends. Pariahs had built in S5 AP4 assault 2 guns, Warscythes that ignored all saves(even Inv. saves), were fearless, caused Psykers to flee and could reduce their iniative to 1 in CC and they reduced all opposing models leadership to 7 within 12" of the unit. GW deleted these from the game because they sold poorly. But they only needed a little tweaking and a plastic kit and Pariahs would have been amazing if included in the new codex. They suffered from not being able to use the Veil or monolith's teleportation and couldn't ressurect. If that was fixed they would be an amazing unit far superior to Lychguard.
8.) Destroyers got totally nerfed though the ability to combine Heavies with Regulars is a plus.


The point I was making was that Destroyers, Monoliths, warriors, and Lords were amazing and GW didn't need to sell more models of them so they Nerfed them. The few Tau players left have plenty of Hammerheads, Stealth suits, Firewarriors, Kroot and Broadsides so I don't expect them to make any of those must have units in the new book. New unit entries will be amazing so that you buy the new models and ignore your old non-essential units. Broadsides may still be amazing though they will probably get a new kit and options that aren't present on your existing models, making your old ones obsolete and force you to purchase new kits. GW's business model positions players to purchase new kits with new codexes. I totally understand it and acutally support the model, you just have to expect your favorite units from the current book to get eclipsed to a certain degree by new models and units.

Poppycock.
warriors and immortals not only lost *some* stuff but they got a helluvalot cheaper, too. per point they're way more effective now: no, that resorb tax works out at less than 3 pts per model on a 20 model unit and that lord has more uses than just that res orb!), have you even *tried* using ghost arks (I don't, myself but I've seen it combined with large blob units to great effect) with your warriors? obviously not, from your statements.
I don't think I said pariahs=lychguard; I just said that's what they'd Counts-As for. If you'd have cared to read even halfway closely you'll see I mentioned them as a disappointment, with destroyers the only nerf.
Monoliths not good? I see you haven't played either with or against them, obviously. they work *just* fine. Differently, yes. Which is good, last codex they were just annoying. Not even that good, just a *(&*()^ to take out.
if you can't make scarabs work you suck at the psychological warfare aspect of the game; they present a disproportionate threat for the points they cost, and dealing with them takes time. No, if your opponent manages to get his flamer troops right up to them before they inflict some harm either he expended significant resources not doing anything more useful, or you're just incompetent
Wraiths might not resurrect but they're even better for the points than they were so again, tiny, tiny violin

Basically, the old codex **sucked** as for fun-to-play either with OR against.
...so yeah, playstyles changed. For the better, mostly, but yeah you have to adapt. once you do that though, **all** those units, except for destroyers and to a lesser degree your old pariahs, make for useful, effective and potentially tier 1 competitive choices. *maybe* not scarabs, but everything else? Hell yeah.

And about those warriors: I like tough troops better, as well so I play immortals too but I can see loads of uses for those warriors and as soon as my first 2K pts list is done, those 40 warriors I still have lying around which I painted as an, I believe, 12 or 13 year old kid when they first came out will hit the brake fluid right quick - I've seen them used to great effect; it just takes a *little* more tactical thinking than just "advance all, and fire at anything that looks squishy" which was all the previous codex *could* do.

 NecronLord3 wrote:
Right because broadsides are fast and mobile.

Not in the tiny microcosm that is the actual 40K game, but thankfully we have a game world that expands a bit beyond 6 turns in a 4 ft. by 6 ft. block. And outside those 6 turns broadsides can be transported by Mantas. Hell, if they are modular enough they may even be able to be transported by Orcas. Meanwhile that giant robot would not be able to be transported by anything. Tau have no way in their currently existing background to move such units from battlefields to battlefields.

Honestly, thinking beyond the tiny scope of a very poorly-designed game is half of the fun of the Tau. I fully expect GW to throw the logistics design Forgeworld has done for the Tau under a bus, but it's a shame nonetheless.

 JOHIRA wrote:

 NecronLord3 wrote:
Right because broadsides are fast and mobile.

Not in the tiny microcosm that is the actual 40K game, but thankfully we have a game world that expands a bit beyond 6 turns in a 4 ft. by 6 ft. block. And outside those 6 turns broadsides can be transported by Mantas. Hell, if they are modular enough they may even be able to be transported by Orcas. Meanwhile that giant robot would not be able to be transported by anything. Tau have no way in their currently existing background to move such units from battlefields to battlefields.

Honestly, thinking beyond the tiny scope of a very poorly-designed game is half of the fun of the Tau. I fully expect GW to throw the logistics design Forgeworld has done for the Tau under a bus, but it's a shame nonetheless.

That's because 40k is the game "Where there is only war"... Not the game "Where there is only war- And taxi services!"
Background on how they transport units between planets isn't as "Cool" As the background for the units themselves. So they dont bother.

 JOHIRA wrote:

 NecronLord3 wrote:
Right because broadsides are fast and mobile.

Not in the tiny microcosm that is the actual 40K game, but thankfully we have a game world that expands a bit beyond 6 turns in a 4 ft. by 6 ft. block. And outside those 6 turns broadsides can be transported by Mantas. Hell, if they are modular enough they may even be able to be transported by Orcas. Meanwhile that giant robot would not be able to be transported by anything. Tau have no way in their currently existing background to move such units from battlefields to battlefields.

Honestly, thinking beyond the tiny scope of a very poorly-designed game is half of the fun of the Tau. I fully expect GW to throw the logistics design Forgeworld has done for the Tau under a bus, but it's a shame nonetheless.

Who says that the giant robot suggested by Hastings would be exactly like that conversion?

Seriously. It's waaaay too early to begin doomsaying that there is going to be a butchering.
Hastings' comment suggests that it's the concept you should be looking at.
A huge, feck-all battlesuit (or even potentially an evolution of the Tau's current drone tech!) heavily armed and armored.
It's not a Titan, it's not even a Knight.
It's about the size of a Dreadknight, which isn't too bad. Especially when you consider that a Manta could be modified to be dedicated carriers for something of that nature, much like how we have a Thunderhawk Gunship and its Transport variant.

 JOHIRA wrote:

 NecronLord3 wrote:
Right because broadsides are fast and mobile.

Not in the tiny microcosm that is the actual 40K game, but thankfully we have a game world that expands a bit beyond 6 turns in a 4 ft. by 6 ft. block. And outside those 6 turns broadsides can be transported by Mantas. Hell, if they are modular enough they may even be able to be transported by Orcas. Meanwhile that giant robot would not be able to be transported by anything. Tau have no way in their currently existing background to move such units from battlefields to battlefields.

Honestly, thinking beyond the tiny scope of a very poorly-designed game is half of the fun of the Tau. I fully expect GW to throw the logistics design Forgeworld has done for the Tau under a bus, but it's a shame nonetheless.

Maybe they have an Orca variant just for transporting the big robot? Maybe a plane we haven't seen.

Seriously, this is one of the most internally contradicting arguments I've seen in a long time. On one hand, you advise to not be confined by the 40k table in your imagination. At the other hand, you're confining yourself to thinking Tau military logistics only in those few hack-jobs that Forge World spun from the line? If you want to think outside the box, think outside the box.

as Zweischneid said there are any number of ways a giant battlesuit could be delivered to a battlefield, special Orca, modified bay on a manta, dropped from low orbit with a thruster pack, assembled from 5 smaller battlesuits and have a big silly sword

Its not the logistics of it that do not appeal to my tau sensibilities..I just dont like giant robot suits ..XV-9 is where I drew the line, but who knows maybe this won't be so bad, it may be even a very mobile broadside suit, with JSJ..now that could be a nightmare .

I hate waiting on all this stuff though..so when I get resettled after dec 12..will have to start back up my P & M blog to feed the modeling craving .

I wouldn't expect it to be mobile at all, but I would expect it to be the Tau's equivalent of a Baneblade.

Lots of armor, lots of weaponry and designed as a linebreaker.

Maybe the giant robot will morph into a truck *ahem* hammerhead, and then it can fold into the back of a manta, then roll... sorry, fly... out and do battle.

I really hope they dont start throwing Veritechs in there....

We dont need jetfighters that transform into battlesuits X_X

 Kanluwen wrote:
I wouldn't expect it to be mobile at all, but I would expect it to be the Tau's equivalent of a Baneblade.

Lots of armor, lots of weaponry and designed as a linebreaker.

Which, as I was getting at before, is the antithesis of everything we've been told about how the Tau conduct warfare.

 JOHIRA wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:
I wouldn't expect it to be mobile at all, but I would expect it to be the Tau's equivalent of a Baneblade.

Lots of armor, lots of weaponry and designed as a linebreaker.

Which, as I was getting at before, is the antithesis of everything we've been told about how the Tau conduct warfare.

What we've been told about how the Tau conduct warfare is that it is very mobile and that the Tau are very adaptable, adjusting to circumstances as necessary. It's why we have the Tau Tiger Shark AX-1-0, which was a Tau response to encountering Titans on Taros and other battlefields.

The Tau are all about exploiting weaknesses and operational synergy. They are also not above having units act as bait to lure in the enemy to tear to shreds with massed pulse rifle fire.

Nothing about the Tau way of warfare precludes something like this being "evolved" to deal with enemies which cannot be dealt with in straight up tactical maneuvers.

Say something like a certain race which has been pestering the Tau, and are known to come at you in great hordes of gribbly chitinous death?

 Just Dave wrote:

 Kroothawk wrote:

75hastings69 wrote:Anybody who might be interested in what tau models (or at least one of them) you can really expect next year might want to type "Fil Dunn tau" into a google image search

verydarkshadow wrote:This is what I found ...
Why am I not surprised?

shaso_iceborn wrote:Basically according to my sources it's pretty much a Dreadknight sized suit with dual (note not twin linked) rail cannons and SMS with a rule for something I will call "hail-fire" in that it shoots massive barrage of weapondry if not moving in the movement phase.

75hastings69 wrote:Just to clear things up there IS something very similar to that image coming for tau.

Always been a huge fan of Fil Dunn's model there. Very District 9-esque too IMHO.

If Tau get that, like Fil Dunn modelled it, that'd be cool (if it's more Fil Dunn than Dreadknight). It'd also fit the trend of big new toys with Codices these days (IMHO); such as the Dreadknight, Helldrake etc.

Might want to check this out...not 100% Tau, but it is 100% Fil Dunn:

http://www.filbot.co.uk/

 Micky wrote:
I really hope they dont start throwing Veritechs in there....

We dont need jetfighters that transform into battlesuits X_X

I'm pretty sure EVERYTHING needs jetfighters that transform into robots.

Including sitcoms The New Girl and Modern Family.

 Soo'Vah'Cha wrote:
as Zweischneid said there are any number of ways a giant battlesuit could be delivered to a battlefield, special Orca, modified bay on a manta, dropped from low orbit with a thruster pack, assembled from 5 smaller battlesuits and have a big silly sword

Its not the logistics of it that do not appeal to my tau sensibilities..I just dont like giant robot suits ..XV-9 is where I drew the line, but who knows maybe this won't be so bad, it may be even a very mobile broadside suit, with JSJ..now that could be a nightmare .

I hate waiting on all this stuff though..so when I get resettled after dec 12..will have to start back up my P & M blog to feed the modeling craving .

I really Hope there is a flower that can deliver Battlesuits into well, battle.

 Kanluwen wrote:
Say something like a certain race which has been pestering the Tau, and are known to come at you in great hordes of gribbly chitinous death?

Then if I were them, the last weapon I would deploy to fight great hordes of gribbly chitinous death would be a slow, lumbering, difficult-to-transport ground-based super-heavy that can be easily overwhelmed by massed infantry.

There is nothing a giant robot can do that other vehicles can't do better. Aside from looking like a humanoid, which is something that can be a concern to Imperials, Chaos, Orcs, and Eldar but really should not be part of the Tau design. Small mobile infantry suits- makes perfect sense. Giant robots that serve no purpose other than looking cool? Leave that to the gue'la and their silly superstitions.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:

 Soo'Vah'Cha wrote:
as Zweischneid said there are any number of ways a giant battlesuit could be delivered to a battlefield, special Orca, modified bay on a manta, dropped from low orbit with a thruster pack, assembled from 5 smaller battlesuits and have a big silly sword

Its not the logistics of it that do not appeal to my tau sensibilities..I just dont like giant robot suits ..XV-9 is where I drew the line, but who knows maybe this won't be so bad, it may be even a very mobile broadside suit, with JSJ..now that could be a nightmare .

I hate waiting on all this stuff though..so when I get resettled after dec 12..will have to start back up my P & M blog to feed the modeling craving .

I really Hope there is a flower that can deliver Battlesuits into well, battle.

...Part of me now wants that to not be an autocorrect malfunction

No it is not at all, I spent most of the day studying, so I'm tired.

75hastings69 wrote:Just to clear things up there IS something very similar to that image coming for tau.

Hell I need a kroot merc and a fire warriors boxes to start journey for the greater good next year.

 Bolognesus wrote:






Poppycock.
warriors and immortals not only lost *some* stuff but they got a helluvalot cheaper, too. per point they're way more effective now: no, that resorb tax works out at less than 3 pts per model on a 20 model unit and that lord has more uses than just that res orb!), have you even *tried* using ghost arks (I don't, myself but I've seen it combined with large blob units to great effect) with your warriors? obviously not, from your statements.
I don't think I said pariahs=lychguard; I just said that's what they'd Counts-As for. If you'd have cared to read even halfway closely you'll see I mentioned them as a disappointment, with destroyers the only nerf.
Monoliths not good? I see you haven't played either with or against them, obviously. they work *just* fine. Differently, yes. Which is good, last codex they were just annoying. Not even that good, just a *(&*()^ to take out.
if you can't make scarabs work you suck at the psychological warfare aspect of the game; they present a disproportionate threat for the points they cost, and dealing with them takes time. No, if your opponent manages to get his flamer troops right up to them before they inflict some harm either he expended significant resources not doing anything more useful, or you're just incompetent
Wraiths might not resurrect but they're even better for the points than they were so again, tiny, tiny violin

Basically, the old codex **sucked** as for fun-to-play either with OR against.
...so yeah, playstyles changed. For the better, mostly, but yeah you have to adapt. once you do that though, **all** those units, except for destroyers and to a lesser degree your old pariahs, make for useful, effective and potentially tier 1 competitive choices. *maybe* not scarabs, but everything else? Hell yeah.

And about those warriors: I like tough troops better, as well so I play immortals too but I can see loads of uses for those warriors and as soon as my first 2K pts list is done, those 40 warriors I still have lying around which I painted as an, I believe, 12 or 13 year old kid when they first came out will hit the brake fluid right quick - I've seen them used to great effect; it just takes a *little* more tactical thinking than just "advance all, and fire at anything that looks squishy" which was all the previous codex *could* do.

wow. I guess I don't know what I'm talking about only after successfully playing Necrons for the last 12+ years. Or I do and mostly what you've said is crap. Scarabs a psychological threat against what the non existent plethora of vehicles or the flyers they can't hit? Are warriors useful? Yes to be cheap and sit on an objective. 20 blob squad warriors with an ark. The ark just gets blown up then opponents kill the warriors. God forbid an opponent gets close to warriors and they are swept faster than anything else in the game. The cost of 1 res orb Per warrior in a 20 man squad is 7.75 with no other options because you at least have to purchase an overlord for th RC then attach the lord with orb to the squad. That cost vastly increases as you arm both models with useful equipment and you can slightly of set the cost do the Overlord as you spread it across more lords in more squads but in the end it cost about as much as they did in 3rd edition and you get a weaker Armour save.

Sniper drones, Vespids and Space Pope were three of the four new units in the 4th edition codex and they were all rubbish. Well, Sniper Drones weren't too bad but they competed with better units for the heavy support slots. The other new unit, the Piranha, wasn't awesome but it competed with other fairly crappy units for the Fast Attack slots.

 NecronLord3 wrote:

 Bolognesus wrote:






Poppycock.
warriors and immortals not only lost *some* stuff but they got a helluvalot cheaper, too. per point they're way more effective now: no, that resorb tax works out at less than 3 pts per model on a 20 model unit and that lord has more uses than just that res orb!), have you even *tried* using ghost arks (I don't, myself but I've seen it combined with large blob units to great effect) with your warriors? obviously not, from your statements.
I don't think I said pariahs=lychguard; I just said that's what they'd Counts-As for. If you'd have cared to read even halfway closely you'll see I mentioned them as a disappointment, with destroyers the only nerf.
Monoliths not good? I see you haven't played either with or against them, obviously. they work *just* fine. Differently, yes. Which is good, last codex they were just annoying. Not even that good, just a *(&*()^ to take out.
if you can't make scarabs work you suck at the psychological warfare aspect of the game; they present a disproportionate threat for the points they cost, and dealing with them takes time. No, if your opponent manages to get his flamer troops right up to them before they inflict some harm either he expended significant resources not doing anything more useful, or you're just incompetent
Wraiths might not resurrect but they're even better for the points than they were so again, tiny, tiny violin

Basically, the old codex **sucked** as for fun-to-play either with OR against.
...so yeah, playstyles changed. For the better, mostly, but yeah you have to adapt. once you do that though, **all** those units, except for destroyers and to a lesser degree your old pariahs, make for useful, effective and potentially tier 1 competitive choices. *maybe* not scarabs, but everything else? Hell yeah.

And about those warriors: I like tough troops better, as well so I play immortals too but I can see loads of uses for those warriors and as soon as my first 2K pts list is done, those 40 warriors I still have lying around which I painted as an, I believe, 12 or 13 year old kid when they first came out will hit the brake fluid right quick - I've seen them used to great effect; it just takes a *little* more tactical thinking than just "advance all, and fire at anything that looks squishy" which was all the previous codex *could* do.

wow. I guess I don't know what I'm talking about only after successfully playing Necrons for the last 12+ years. Or I do and mostly what you've said is crap. Scarabs a psychological threat against what the non existent plethora of vehicles or the flyers they can't hit? Are warriors useful? Yes to be cheap and sit on an objective. 20 blob squad warriors with an ark. The ark just gets blown up then opponents kill the warriors. God forbid an opponent gets close to warriors and they are swept faster than anything else in the game. The cost of 1 res orb Per warrior in a 20 man squad is 7.75 with no other options because you at least have to purchase an overlord for th RC then attach the lord with orb to the squad. That cost vastly increases as you arm both models with useful equipment and you can slightly of set the cost do the Overlord as you spread it across more lords in more squads but in the end it cost about as much as they did in 3rd edition and you get a weaker Armour save.

So since the new codex got released all your overlords do is unlock royal courts, you do not utilize terrain to any effect and finally, you refuse to acknowledge the existence of vehicles with other types than "flyer"?
I now understand why you have a hard time winning - sheesh...

Wasn't there a rumor about 9 months ago that had different HQ's 'unlocking' certain troop options? Wouldn't something this size and firepower be an awesome HQ for a crisis suit troop based army

 Bolognesus wrote:

 NecronLord3 wrote:

 Bolognesus wrote:






Poppycock.
warriors and immortals not only lost *some* stuff but they got a helluvalot cheaper, too. per point they're way more effective now: no, that resorb tax works out at less than 3 pts per model on a 20 model unit and that lord has more uses than just that res orb!), have you even *tried* using ghost arks (I don't, myself but I've seen it combined with large blob units to great effect) with your warriors? obviously not, from your statements.
I don't think I said pariahs=lychguard; I just said that's what they'd Counts-As for. If you'd have cared to read even halfway closely you'll see I mentioned them as a disappointment, with destroyers the only nerf.
Monoliths not good? I see you haven't played either with or against them, obviously. they work *just* fine. Differently, yes. Which is good, last codex they were just annoying. Not even that good, just a *(&*()^ to take out.
if you can't make scarabs work you suck at the psychological warfare aspect of the game; they present a disproportionate threat for the points they cost, and dealing with them takes time. No, if your opponent manages to get his flamer troops right up to them before they inflict some harm either he expended significant resources not doing anything more useful, or you're just incompetent
Wraiths might not resurrect but they're even better for the points than they were so again, tiny, tiny violin

Basically, the old codex **sucked** as for fun-to-play either with OR against.
...so yeah, playstyles changed. For the better, mostly, but yeah you have to adapt. once you do that though, **all** those units, except for destroyers and to a lesser degree your old pariahs, make for useful, effective and potentially tier 1 competitive choices. *maybe* not scarabs, but everything else? Hell yeah.

And about those warriors: I like tough troops better, as well so I play immortals too but I can see loads of uses for those warriors and as soon as my first 2K pts list is done, those 40 warriors I still have lying around which I painted as an, I believe, 12 or 13 year old kid when they first came out will hit the brake fluid right quick - I've seen them used to great effect; it just takes a *little* more tactical thinking than just "advance all, and fire at anything that looks squishy" which was all the previous codex *could* do.

wow. I guess I don't know what I'm talking about only after successfully playing Necrons for the last 12+ years. Or I do and mostly what you've said is crap. Scarabs a psychological threat against what the non existent plethora of vehicles or the flyers they can't hit? Are warriors useful? Yes to be cheap and sit on an objective. 20 blob squad warriors with an ark. The ark just gets blown up then opponents kill the warriors. God forbid an opponent gets close to warriors and they are swept faster than anything else in the game. The cost of 1 res orb Per warrior in a 20 man squad is 7.75 with no other options because you at least have to purchase an overlord for th RC then attach the lord with orb to the squad. That cost vastly increases as you arm both models with useful equipment and you can slightly of set the cost do the Overlord as you spread it across more lords in more squads but in the end it cost about as much as they did in 3rd edition and you get a weaker Armour save.

So since the new codex got released all your overlords do is unlock royal courts, you do not utilize terrain to any effect and finally, you refuse to acknowledge the existence of vehicles with other types than "flyer"?
I now understand why you have a hard time winning - sheesh...

No I have no trouble winning. I have a great record and one of the more feared non-cron air Necron lists out there. I do it witout relying on the obsolete nerfed units from the 3rd edition codex. Your assessment of the effectiveness of Necron units is just very off.