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Out of curiosity who are in what tiers for armies in 6th? and who is the best in tier 1?

Technically, there is only one 6e codex, so I guess that would make it 1st tier...

*grabs popcorn and waits for inevitable flaming*

This is very general but IMHO, these are what I believe the most competitive armies are.
Tier I
Imperial Guard, Necrons, Space Wolves
Tier II
Grey Knights, Dark Eldar, Blood Angels, Daemons
Tier III
Orks, Space Marines, Eldar, Sisters of Battle
Tier IV
Tau, Tyranids
Tier V
DA BT

To be honest, i'd upgrade Tau a bit, to at least 3rd tier. The rules changes have made them very compeditive.

Tyranids would at least be Teir 3 in that list. They got significantly better in 6th.

Imperial guard has one OP unit. A single good unit does not a tier 1 codex make.

I'd say that the strongest three (in no particular order) are GK, BA, and necron, and the weakest three (likewise) are Sisters, Eldar and Tau, with everyone else kind of floating in the middle.

Tier 1
Necrons, GK, SW
Tier 2
IG, BA, DE,
Tier 3
Orks, Daemons, Space Marines, Tyranids.
Tier 4
Eldar, Tau, SoB, DA, BT

 Ailaros wrote:
Imperial guard has one OP unit. A single good unit does not a tier 1 codex make.

I'd say that the strongest three (in no particular order) are GK, BA, and necron, and the weakest three (likewise) are Sisters, Eldar and Tau, with everyone else kind of floating in the middle.

While there's only one truly OP unit in the IG Codex (Vendetta), there's tons of good, solid units.

I'm also genuinely curious; why Blood Angels?

Tier 1
Grey Knights, Space Wolves, Imperial Guard
Tier 2
Necrons, Blood Angels, Dark Eldar, CHaos Space Marines
Tier 3
Orks, Daemons, Space Marines, Tyranids, Eldar
Tier 4
Tau, Sisters of Battle, Dark Angels, Black Templars

 Ailaros wrote:
Imperial guard has one OP unit. A single good unit does not a tier 1 codex make.

I'd say that the strongest three (in no particular order) are GK, BA, and necron, and the weakest three (likewise) are Sisters, Eldar and Tau, with everyone else kind of floating in the middle.

Yeah, but you say that as if there's only one single good unit in the entire codex, and everything else in there is utter gak.

IG is a tier 1 army because the vast majority of the army can put out a ton of firepower, and it's extremely cheap. Most units are relatively fragile, yes, but IG can put piles of infantry or tanks into a single list without sacrificing any firepower.

I would split it up as follows

Tier 1
Grey knights, space wolves, Necrons, and Imperial guard

Tier 2
Blood angels, Dark Eldar

Tier 3
Orcs, space marines, Demons, Eldar

Tier 4
Tau, Tyranids, Sisters of battle,

Tier 5
Dark angels. black templars

No idea where CSM are inder the new codex, but probably tier 2

Depending on particular builds it could easily move an army up or down a tier. There will be particular bad match ups for any army though.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 Ailaros wrote:
Imperial guard has one OP unit. A single good unit does not a tier 1 codex make.

I'd say that the strongest three (in no particular order) are GK, BA, and necron, and the weakest three (likewise) are Sisters, Eldar and Tau, with everyone else kind of floating in the middle.

While there's only one truly OP unit in the IG Codex (Vendetta), there's tons of good, solid units.

I'm also genuinely curious; why Blood Angels?

He's got a vendetta upon them due to the fact that his footguard is a bad matchup vs them.

At least that's what I got from the times he's explained it, or because they are C:SM with more rules, can't remember.

The strongest three that I seem to come up against are: Grey Knights, Necrons and Eldar and the weakest are Orks, BT and Vanilla Marines.
This could be simply due to the people I play but GK and Necrons always seem to be very good no matter what build you play against. Besides the ones mentioned I think each army is pretty much even with good and bad in them, it just depends on how you play them

Ask 100 people, get 100 answers, I'm afraid.

Necrons are Shooty as hell.

Dark Angels are not bottom tier, I will tell you that! I fair fairly well against Gk and Necrons, DW and RW are still competitive. More so in 6th imho.

 kronk wrote:
Ask 100 people, get 100 answers, I'm afraid.

Necrons are Shooty as hell.

Yea, but there will be common lines among all 100,

You can settle by seeing the multiple answers that necrons, grey knights and IG are among the best, if not THE best armies for example.



As for necrons, while shooty as hell-they also have some of the best assualt units in the game as well.

My opinion is:

Tier I
Imperial Guard, Necrons

Tier 2
Grey Knights, Blood Angels, Dark Eldar, Space Wolves, Orks

Tier 3
Space Marines, Sisters of Battle, Tau

Tier 4
Dark Angles, Tyranids, Black Templars

Heres the people who've put all armies in tiers

Nythryl wrote:This is very general but IMHO, these are what I believe the most competitive armies are.
Tier I
Imperial Guard, Necrons, Space Wolves
Tier II
Grey Knights, Dark Eldar, Blood Angels, Daemons
Tier III
Orks, Space Marines, Eldar, Sisters of Battle
Tier IV
Tau, Dark Angels, Tyranids, Black Templars

Sasori wrote:Tier 1
Necrons, GK, SW
Tier 2
IG, BA, DE,
Tier 3
Orks, Daemons, Space Marines, Tyranids.
Tier 4
Eldar, Tau, SoB, DA, BT

Dark Scipio wrote:Tier 1
Grey Knights, Space Wolves, Imperial Guard
Tier 2
Necrons, Blood Angels, Dark Eldar, CHaos Space Marines
Tier 3
Orks, Daemons, Space Marines, Tyranids, Eldar
Tier 4
Tau, Sisters of Battle, Dark Angels, Black Templars

RFHolloway wrote:
Tier 1
Grey knights, space wolves, Necrons, and Imperial guard

Tier 2
Blood angels, Dark Eldar

Tier 3
Orcs, space marines, Demons, Eldar

Tier 4
Tau, Tyranids, Sisters of battle,

Tier 5
Dark angels. black templars

And here is a synthesis

Tier 1
Imperial Guard, Space Wolves, Necrons, Grey Knights

Tier 2
Blood Angels, Dark Eldar

Tier 3
Space Marines, Eldar, Orks

Tier 4
Tau, Tyranids, Sisters of Battle, Black Templars, Dark Angels


Personally I think the Wovles took a serious hit, same for GK. I now routinely take both apart with my shooting Dark Eldar in competetive games, previously it was about 50/50, for this reason I disagree with their T1 placing, but it seems to be the consensus.

Tier 2 Looks about right (except I'd add GK/SW from T1). I'd also add Orks given their performance in recent tournaments.

Tier 3 consensus seems odd to me. Tau got a significant boost this edition and I think they should be here. Not should Eldar deserve it though. Sisters are also better than they are given credit for, but consensus says not good enough for T3.

Tier 4, well 'Nids, Templars and DAngels definetly belong here.

Everyone will agree that currently vendetta and scythe spam are king.

Tier 1: (The meta-knight tier, should be banned from tournaments) Necron/guard flyerspam.

Tier 2: (The generally solid tier) Space wolves, GK, BAngels, Necrons (0-1 scythes), Guard (no vendettas)

Tier 3: (The 'great if you optimize your list' tier. These codeces can compete with tier 2 if they use the current best list) Orks (Shootas/Lootas/Nob bikers), Tau (Suits, allies for counter assault), Dark Eldar (Venoms/Razorwings/Eldar as allies), Tyranids (Flying circus/tervigons), Space marines (Pods).

Tier 4: (The mediocre tier. Includes all the above with suboptimal lists) Sisters (Celestine/Jacobus), Eldar (Eldrad/Fire prisms/Wraithlords), Dark Angels/Black Templars, Daemons, Old CSM.

Tier 5: (The 'you dun goofed' tier) Eldar (banshees), Orks (melée oriented), Tyranids (Carnifexes/genestealers), etc. Etc.

My Turn, left to right in each tier with how I would order them according to power inside that tier. Not including CSM as we don't really know.

Top Tier

Imperial Guard, Necrons, Grey Knights, Space Wolves.

Second Tier

Blood Angels, Dark Eldar, Orks, Chaos Daemons.

Third Tier

Space Marines, Tyranids, Tau, Eldar, Dark Angels.

Bottom Tier

Sisters of Battle, Black Templars.

The ask 100 people get 100 answers is true. There is a very general consensus that the
Strong are
SW, IG, necrons, and grey knights
Middle
C:SM, BA, dark eldar, tau, orks, daemons, CSM
Lower
DA, BT, eldar, tyranids, SoB

 Ailaros wrote:
Imperial guard has one OP unit. A single good unit does not a tier 1 codex make.

I'd say that the strongest three (in no particular order) are GK, BA, and necron, and the weakest three (likewise) are Sisters, Eldar and Tau, with everyone else kind of floating in the middle.

You can keep telling yourself that, but being a top tier Codex has nothing to do with the amount of broken units you have, but rather how your army as a whole takes on all the other armies, and Guard can take on anyone else, most of which they can beat handily.

the_scotsman wrote:
Everyone will agree that currently vendetta and scythe spam are king.

Tier 1: (The meta-knight tier, should be banned from tournaments) Necron/guard flyerspam.

Tier 2: (The generally solid tier) Space wolves, GK, BAngels, Necrons (0-1 scythes), Guard (no vendettas)

Tier 3: (The 'great if you optimize your list' tier. These codeces can compete with tier 2 if they use the current best list) Orks (Shootas/Lootas/Nob bikers), Tau (Suits, allies for counter assault), Dark Eldar (Venoms/Razorwings/Eldar as allies), Tyranids (Flying circus/tervigons), Space marines (Pods).

Tier 4: (The mediocre tier. Includes all the above with suboptimal lists) Sisters (Celestine/Jacobus), Eldar (Eldrad/Fire prisms/Wraithlords), Dark Angels/Black Templars, Daemons, Old CSM.

Tier 5: (The 'you dun goofed' tier) Eldar (banshees), Orks (melée oriented), Tyranids (Carnifexes/genestealers), etc. Etc.

Placing Daemons in the mediocre tier tells me that you're still living in 5th Edition. They have gotten much stronger with 6th and the WD update. I really only have a hard time with DE now, and games against Space Marines (any flavor) are generally mine to lose.

 ZebioLizard2 wrote:

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 Ailaros wrote:
Imperial guard has one OP unit. A single good unit does not a tier 1 codex make.

I'd say that the strongest three (in no particular order) are GK, BA, and necron, and the weakest three (likewise) are Sisters, Eldar and Tau, with everyone else kind of floating in the middle.

While there's only one truly OP unit in the IG Codex (Vendetta), there's tons of good, solid units.

I'm also genuinely curious; why Blood Angels?

He's got a vendetta upon them due to the fact that his footguard is a bad matchup vs them.

At least that's what I got from the times he's explained it, or because they are C:SM with more rules, can't remember.

He's got 'The Sky is Falling Syndrome'. Imperial Guard is definately a top tier army based on their sheer output of fire power, access to the best tanks in the game, and of course the Cruddace Copter...

Look, I'm not saying that IG is BAD. It certainly doesn't belong at the bottom.

What I'm saying is that there is roughly 1 guard list that's at the top, and it revolves around mechanized infantry and 1 overpowered unit. It's why I don't see SW at the top of the heap either. A single army list based around a single OP unit (in this case longfangs) while the rest of the codex languishes isn't a top tier codex.

GK is at the top, for example, because there are several good lists you can run, from draigowing to purifier spam to henchmen lists. On top of that, they have enough good support units that it's not a matter of that one OP unit that everybody has to take and that's it. I've seen dreadknights, but I've also seen razorbacks and stormravens and psyflemen, and, and, and.

A codex is at the top only if it has multiple viable playstyles and several viable support units. It's one where you can actually use most of the codex without wondering if the unit in question is powerful enough, or if adding something to your list is going to weaken it past the point of being competitive.

Likewise, necron clearly fits into this category. An army filled with AV13 transports that ignore cover (except when they're getting cover saves), and have a permanent cover save they bring with them in an army that can turn out the lights to make said cover 3+ on vehicles that are largely 4HP, except for the HQ unit, which has up to 5HP (on an AV13 chassis), that can kill things with its S10 weapon in close combat without disembarking... And you have all of the crazy support units like wraiths and fliers and a railgun that comes in a large blast format, etc. It's hard to come up with necron armylists that are truly awful so long as you practice the most basic of list-building practices.

I likewise put BA up there still. You can do DoA, and you can do razorspam. You can have blood talon dreads assaulting out of fliers. You have psychic, flying dreadnoughts, you have death company and better vanguard vets, and you can have FNP everywhere, and all their vehicles are fast, and you can even do silly things like deepstrike land raiders. Multiple playstyles, lots of good support units.

That's what it takes to be tier 1.

For guard, on the other hand, you now have one properly competitive list, and it starts with mandatory mechvets, and it continues with mandatory vendettas. If you have points left over, you're looking at nerfed russes (no more lumbering behemoth), or nerfed manticores (more likely to hit vehicles, but half as likely to wreck them), or really nerfed hydras (skyfire with no interceptor). Leafblower guard is certainly still strong, and guard in general can certainly handle a lot of stuff, but they don't have the multiple playstyles and multiple great support options that a proper tier 1 army has.

Go back to 5th ed, and I'd certainly say that guard were tier 1, as they had power blob foot hordes and gunline foot hordes, and more support options. A single playstyle with a single mandatory OP unit... that doesn't sound tier 1 anymore.

 Ailaros wrote:
What I'm saying is that there is roughly 1 guard list that's at the top, and it revolves around mechanized infantry and 1 overpowered unit. It's why I don't see SW at the top of the heap either. A single army list based around a single OP unit (in this case longfangs) while the rest of the codex languishes isn't a top tier codex.

I believe the Space Wolves players still haven't recovered from their faint spell about the release of flyers, or how the vanilla marines got one and they didn't. They're still nasty to any army that doesn't have one...

For guard, on the other hand, you now have one properly competitive list, and it starts with mandatory mechvets, and it continues with mandatory vendettas. If you have points left over, you're looking at nerfed russes (no more lumbering behemoth), or nerfed manticores (more likely to hit vehicles, but half as likely to wreck them), or really nerfed hydras (skyfire with no interceptor).

Leman Russ Tanks are now considered Heavy Tanks as indicated by their updated FAQ, so the only real loss is that they can't go above combat speed, which Russes rarely did so there's no real loss. And Manticores got a huge buff (If I read it correctly) where vehicles take the full damage of the blast even if the center isn't on the vehicles hull, which makes it more obnoxious and stupid (Thanks Cruddy Cruddace). The Hydra changes I expected, since I've been playing them since their Imperial Armor days, so no surprise there.

Give it time. Six-seven months in and people should be adjusted to 6th Edition, than evaluate your old lists. I still think foot lists are very viable, except you have to pay attention to where your special models are in the blob so they don't get plinked by woud allocation. That's the ONLY legitimate hiccup horde armies might have. Other than that is speculative heresay...

The Guard Codex is definately top tier, along with Crons, Grey Knights, and maaaaaybe Blood Angels:

Tier One: Guard, Knights, Crons, Blood Angels
Tier Two: Vanilla and Wolf Marines, Dark Eldar, Chaos Demons, Orks
Tier Three: Tyranids, Tau, Sisters, Chaos Marines, Eldar
Tier Four: Black Templars and Dark Angels.

*The only reason I put Chaos Marines as third is that the Dex just released*

The issue with Heavy from Lumbering Behemoth is that LRBT's can no longer fire ordnance turret weapons and blast sponsons, and everything else is fired at snapshot now instead.

 Vaktathi wrote:
The issue with Heavy from Lumbering Behemoth is that LRBT's can no longer fire ordnance turret weapons and blast sponsons, and everything else is fired at snapshot now instead.

Ah. I never really used the blast weapon Russes, so jokes on me I suppose. That sounds terrible for Executioner folks as well. Still, outside of the Executioner + Plasma Sponsons, it doesn't seem that terrible...

 KplKeegan wrote:

 Vaktathi wrote:
The issue with Heavy from Lumbering Behemoth is that LRBT's can no longer fire ordnance turret weapons and blast sponsons, and everything else is fired at snapshot now instead.

Ah. I never really used the blast weapon Russes, so jokes on me I suppose. That sounds terrible for Executioner folks as well. Still, outside of the Executioner + Plasma Sponsons, it doesn't seem that terrible...

The Executioner Plasma Cannon isn't an Ordnance Weapon, though.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 KplKeegan wrote:

 Vaktathi wrote:
The issue with Heavy from Lumbering Behemoth is that LRBT's can no longer fire ordnance turret weapons and blast sponsons, and everything else is fired at snapshot now instead.

Ah. I never really used the blast weapon Russes, so jokes on me I suppose. That sounds terrible for Executioner folks as well. Still, outside of the Executioner + Plasma Sponsons, it doesn't seem that terrible...

The Executioner Plasma Cannon isn't an Ordnance Weapon, though.

Okay, after re-reading the Leman Russ variants and their weapons, I still don't consider losing Lumbering Behemoth a nerf. Only two variants are affected, one of which you would be firing the sponsons until the Ordnance has range (Demolisher). Eh, so now you have a risk/reward added to the Leman Russ Battle Cannon, good. Maybe the other variants will see some sunlight...

SO, without further hijacking, on with the OT.

Can someone explain to me how DA is bottom tier, I honestly do not comprehend this.