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 CommisarBruno wrote:

 TheCaptain wrote:

 CommisarBruno wrote:
Don't be such an elitist

Funny. I think I'll keep on being an elitist, actually.

Cute of you to talk down to me, though

talk down to you? no, im talking to you. if you think you're above me you must be some sort of megalomaniac, but what's pathetic is you're trying to be a badass on the internet

Don't take someone so seriously when they have "TFG" right in their avatar.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
and
"WARNING: This post may include the following: Arrogance, sarcasm, abrasiveness, hyperbole, english, differing opinions, concurrent opinions, words, grammar, pictures, and intelligence. Read at your own risk. "

in the signature.

what are people comparing this hobby to if they think its expensive??

i work part time, in retail, for the minimum wage and i pick up a box every month or 2 and am only missing a total of 3 codex/army books (plan to get 2 of those next week )

it is at the end of the day a hobby........

how much money do guys throw out on say......... football (uniforms, boots, training, tickets etc..... all needing to be constantly updated)

we all get the "new army" bug now and then and yes the average price of an army has jumped up quite a bit (my "theoryhammer" armies used to cost about £200, now they cost £350-£450) but once we have our army, it is not a hardship to maintain it......surely???

personally, i dont like finecast. not because of any quality issues (as such...) but because i think it is too fragile... my ogre firebelly looked awesome when i built him but after just 15 minutes in my case his hammer was banana shaped (compared to the metal models i occasionally find at the bottom of boxes, chipped to hell but still in one piece

mrspadge wrote:
what are people comparing this hobby to if they think its expensive??

Erm, I'm gonna go with OTHER WARGAMES. That is the only thing it should be compared to as its like for like. GW is ridiculously overpriced compared to all the other games out there, mainly in part due to the startup costs for what is required for a "normal" game (so 1500/1750pt 40k and 2000pts WHFB), not even factoring in things like army books and the rulebook itself (which if you don't play SM or CSM, sucks to be you. Looks like you've gotta buy a £50 slab of a rulebook)*

When you can immediately get into a game like Warmahordes for £30-£35 with a single battlebox you can see how much GW are bleeding people in this hobby.







*Note, I'm not including getting the mini rulebook off of eBay or a bits site, as this example is meant to be a person starting up that would more than likely not know about these things.

I think the big issue is trying to attract new players. Ever try justifying why one special character will cost $25 for one model?

We all accept the cost because we are in the hobby. Some find it harder to justify expanding their army(armies) because cost to get a good sized force can be relatively high. That and things GW does to "promote" sales. Such as Making flyers expensive to purchase in an enviornment that has little skyfire. How do you deal with enemy fliers? Buy more fliers!

I'm on the midground right now. I don't think it's too absurd, though it bothers me that GW has a terrible mentality behind their business. The fact that they have terrible release schedules, manufacturing times, and a relatively small staff really show their dedication to stagnating when they should try to expand as a company.

It's always bothered me when people say "Oh, GW is too small to increase release schedule times or produce less expensive minatures."
Bull crap.
Companies are supposed to invest profits back into the company to expand, hire new writers, build more factories, and so on and so forth. It bothers me that the money I put into the game isn't going to make it a better game, it's going into bad business ventures or into someone's wallet.

 angel of ecstasy wrote:

 TheCaptain wrote:
Prices should be higher. I'm not a fan of poor people doing something that I do.

But that's just my opinion.

I'm totally with you, man. Only I'm poor as hell. And I think prices should be lower.

I am poor as hell, too. But I don't complain online that I can't afford a Ferrari.

 CommisarBruno wrote:

 TheCaptain wrote:

 CommisarBruno wrote:
Don't be such an elitist

Funny. I think I'll keep on being an elitist, actually.

Cute of you to talk down to me, though

talk down to you? no, im talking to you. if you think you're above me you must be some sort of megalomaniac, but what's pathetic is you're trying to be a badass on the internet

My elitism strikes you as badass?

Why thank you

Would you complain under a Ferrari forum in a thread dedicated to how expensive Ferraris are to the common man?

Would you complain about the complaining when the threads topic is dedicated to complaining?

 Savageconvoy wrote:
Would you complain under a Ferrari forum in a thread dedicated to how expensive Ferraris are to the common man?

I don't think the matter would be that the complaints are misplaced in a thread about overpriced ferraris, but that the thread itself is ridiculous.

Which this one is.

Raise prices, GW. 40k should be a game for the rich man.

 TheCaptain wrote:

 Savageconvoy wrote:
Would you complain under a Ferrari forum in a thread dedicated to how expensive Ferraris are to the common man?

I don't think the matter would be that the complaints are misplaced in a thread about overpriced ferraris, but that the thread itself is ridiculous.

Which this one is.

Raise prices, GW. 40k should be a game for the rich man.

Edited by AgeofEgos

I agree prices are a bit too much especially when you have to pay twice as much compared to other countries since I am in NZ even when you convert it. Sadly I still play and collect warhammer 40k even though it bankrupts me, why can't they at least have a sale with a reasonable discount every so often or just drop some prices. Fincast is pretty average really not that great though you would think making it in plastic or whatever it is instead of metal would be cheaper

i think the captain is just trying to see how many people he can piss off ! rather than having anything worth while to say .

 TheCaptain wrote:

 Savageconvoy wrote:

 TheCaptain wrote:

 Savageconvoy wrote:
Would you complain under a Ferrari forum in a thread dedicated to how expensive Ferraris are to the common man?

I don't think the matter would be that the complaints are misplaced in a thread about overpriced ferraris, but that the thread itself is ridiculous.

Which this one is.

Raise prices, GW. 40k should be a game for the rich man.

I'm sorry but I can't take anything you say seriously. It's an honest discussion and it's a major factor in the process of collection. It's as absurd as a thread discussing painting/assembling tips, personal favorite units, or any other real discussion.

But please, discuss your "elitist" neckbeard standards.

I mean, dismiss my input as elitist and neckbeard because it disagrees with you.

That's cool too.

I'm sorry, but I'll have to have my butler reply to you since I have such a difficult time speaking commoner.
Warhammer40K is a hobby that people collect in between tea parties and yacht racing. Collection, acquiring, accummulating, and other wise obtaining requires a significant amount of capital. About the same price for a battleforce as I'd pay my migrant gardners to maintain my many estates on my private islands.

Whether or not you "agree" with the issue at hand is not an issue. It is a legitimate discussion. You have offered nothing to this discussion other than "Laugh out loud. People of a lower social status than myself shouldn't enjoy what I do." which has no real substance and then commented that the topic is ridiculous even though it's a valid discussion.

You just sound so unrefined. I mean are you even a noble, good sir.

Now excuse me, I have a Limosine fitting I must attend.

 gumball wrote:
i think the captain is just trying to see how many people he can piss off ! rather than having anything worth while to say .

Not to mention this is the 7000th thread on this issue...

Yes we know its expensive. With the economy the way it is, it would be nice if a lot of little luxuries like wargaming would get cheaper. But they won't. We either deal with it or we move on.

 gumball wrote:
i think the captain is just trying to see how many people he can piss off ! rather than having anything worth while to say .

Be careful. I just got a mod warning for saying something not entirely polite.

 Savageconvoy wrote:

 TheCaptain wrote:

 Savageconvoy wrote:

 TheCaptain wrote:

 Savageconvoy wrote:
Would you complain under a Ferrari forum in a thread dedicated to how expensive Ferraris are to the common man?

I don't think the matter would be that the complaints are misplaced in a thread about overpriced ferraris, but that the thread itself is ridiculous.

Which this one is.

Raise prices, GW. 40k should be a game for the rich man.

I'm sorry but I can't take anything you say seriously. It's an honest discussion and it's a major factor in the process of collection. It's as absurd as a thread discussing painting/assembling tips, personal favorite units, or any other real discussion.

But please, discuss your "elitist" neckbeard standards.

I mean, dismiss my input as elitist and neckbeard because it disagrees with you.

That's cool too.

I'm sorry, but I'll have to have my butler reply to you since I have such a difficult time speaking commoner.
Warhammer40K is a hobby that people collect in between tea parties and yacht racing. Collection, acquiring, accummulating, and other wise obtaining requires a significant amount of capital. About the same price for a battleforce as I'd pay my migrant gardners to maintain my many estates on my private islands.

Super rude pandering?

Whether or not you "agree" with the issue at hand is not an issue. It is a legitimate discussion. You have offered nothing to this discussion other than "Laugh out loud. People of a lower social status than myself shouldn't enjoy what I do."

Never said LoL

Now excuse me, I have a Limosine fitting I must attend
It's limousine .

I'm sorry if my opinion ruffled your feathers, but attacking it seems ridiculous. Is your opinion the only one valid and certifiably true?

(The answer is no.)


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 gumball wrote:
i think the captain is just trying to see how many people he can piss off ! rather than having anything worth while to say .

No like, I'm from NYC. I legitimately am sick of poor people in the hobby.

And poor people whining about how it is too expensive, and begging for ways around it.


Consider it akin to a sport, or even another hobby.

If you can't afford Hockey skates, you can't play Hockey. If you can't afford a kite, you can't take up Kite flying.

40k is expensive. That's just the facts.

But, you know, SPOILER ALERT

This opinion is super controversial because it's not all-inclusive and disney.

So everyone get your torch and pitchfork ready, because I'm about to get witchhunted for stating my opinion.

40k is expensive to those who don't know how to barter or simply don't know any better.

I need to write a guide one of these days on how to go about getting set up.

The biggest problem is your "opinion" is a very poorly formed idea that "poor" people can't enjoy this as a hobby. We are discussing why it's expensive and how it shouldn't be based on other wargames.

Your opinion has very little weight because you offer nothing of substance to back it up. You add nothing to the conversation and is rather insulting to people who are trying to enjoy a game they are finding harder to justify as an expense. And yet you're playing the victim.

No matter how much money someone has is irrelevent though. Why throw a significantly larger sum of capitol towards a game when the competitors are offering a similar product for a more agreeable price? Get involved in the discussion and stop trying to defend a childish "opinion" and sense of superiority. Explain why you don't mind paying more for the exact same product. In fact,

I'll post my entire army up on ebay for 125% market value if you're so interested in paying more for the same thing.

 TheCaptain wrote:

 Savageconvoy wrote:

 TheCaptain wrote:

 Savageconvoy wrote:

 TheCaptain wrote:

 Savageconvoy wrote:
Would you complain under a Ferrari forum in a thread dedicated to how expensive Ferraris are to the common man?

I don't think the matter would be that the complaints are misplaced in a thread about overpriced ferraris, but that the thread itself is ridiculous.

Which this one is.

Raise prices, GW. 40k should be a game for the rich man.

I'm sorry but I can't take anything you say seriously. It's an honest discussion and it's a major factor in the process of collection. It's as absurd as a thread discussing painting/assembling tips, personal favorite units, or any other real discussion.


But please, discuss your "elitist" neckbeard standards.

I mean, dismiss my input as elitist and neckbeard because it disagrees with you.

That's cool too.

I'm sorry, but I'll have to have my butler reply to you since I have such a difficult time speaking commoner.
Warhammer40K is a hobby that people collect in between tea parties and yacht racing. Collection, acquiring, accummulating, and other wise obtaining requires a significant amount of capital. About the same price for a battleforce as I'd pay my migrant gardners to maintain my many estates on my private islands.

Super rude pandering?

Whether or not you "agree" with the issue at hand is not an issue. It is a legitimate discussion. You have offered nothing to this discussion other than "Laugh out loud. People of a lower social status than myself shouldn't enjoy what I do."

Never said LoL

Now excuse me, I have a Limosine fitting I must attend
It's limousine .

I'm sorry if my opinion ruffled your feathers, but attacking it seems ridiculous. Is your opinion the only one valid and certifiably true?

(The answer is no.)


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 gumball wrote:
i think the captain is just trying to see how many people he can piss off ! rather than having anything worth while to say .

No like, I'm from NYC. I legitimately am sick of poor people in the hobby.

And poor people whining about how it is too expensive, and begging for ways around it.


Consider it akin to a sport, or even another hobby.

If you can't afford Hockey skates, you can't play Hockey. If you can't afford a kite, you can't take up Kite flying.

40k is expensive. That's just the facts.

But, you know, SPOILER ALERT

This opinion is super controversial because it's not all-inclusive and disney.

So everyone get your torch and pitchfork ready, because I'm about to get witchhunted for stating my opinion.

I don't think it has anything to do with your opinion. It's how you act bud. If your going to bad mouth people or act all high and mighty then the pitchforks are deserved.

 Savageconvoy wrote:
Why throw a significantly larger sum of capitol towards a game when the competitors are offering a similar product for a more agreeable price?

Because you might not like the models.

Aesthetics are a very personal thing. You either like a model, or you don't. Someone else may adore a model, it's a technically superior sculpt, but you just prefer the alternative that is technically inferior. Money isn't always the deciding factor with what models to buy.

A good example that always comes up is the Mantic Undead. In particular, their zombies. People claim they're better than the GW zombies. Personally, I find them very average. While the sculpt is better, it's not hard to be better than the GW zombie sculpt. GW zombies have that schlock horror style however, which I find gives them some charm. Mantics are technically superior sculpts, but are extremely generically boring to me and neither really fit with the rest of the updated Vampire Counts line. Basically, they're both pretty bad for different reasons. I do, however, go with the GW zombies for two reasons - I keep getting them in pack deals, and I do like the schlock horror look they have.

If it were just money, I'd be going with the Mantic zombies. 3-4 times the amount for the price GW asks. But the utter generic blandness keeps me away from them. I'm holding out hope someone like Avatars of War decide to do some characterful Fantasy zombie sculpts. Until then, I'll just keep using the GW zombies I keep getting in pack deals.

 wowsmash wrote:


I don't think it has anything to do with your opinion. It's how you act bud. If your going to bad mouth people or act all high and mighty then the pitchforks are deserved.

Please, 'bud', direct me to where I badmouthed anyone.

I've been called troll, elitist, and neckbeard, and not only have I abstained from verbal retaliation, but all I did was voice and stand behind my initial opinion.

But, as you've shown: Let the Unpopular-opinion-WitchHunt Begin.

This is not directed to any one user.

Please consider how your post may be viewed by others when posting. Casual statements via text can seem much harsher than a user may intend and this thread is starting to generate alerts. Thanks for your consideration.

 TheCaptain wrote:


Please, 'bud', direct me to where I badmouthed anyone.

I've been called troll, elitist, and neckbeard, and not only have I abstained from verbal retaliation, but all I did was voice and stand behind my initial opinion.

But, as you've shown: Let the Unpopular-opinion-WitchHunt Begin.

1.)Stop playing the victim card.

2.) you haven't defended your position. You just stated that poor people shouldn't play the game and they should raise prices to ensure less people play.

3.) Sorry if you took offense, but neck beard wasn't directed at you. What I meant to say was your elitist aming standards. I'm not calling you gaming, so don't get that confused.

4.) State a reason why prices should increase. Nobody suggests purchasing a game they can't afford. Nobody says they choose war gaming over eating, they simply say they purchase less for the same disposable income.

5.) you said the topic was ridiculous, and gave no justification for it. Why is this thread ridiculous for commenting on a legitimate concern for the game?

 Savageconvoy wrote:

 TheCaptain wrote:


Please, 'bud', direct me to where I badmouthed anyone.

I've been called troll, elitist, and neckbeard, and not only have I abstained from verbal retaliation, but all I did was voice and stand behind my initial opinion.

But, as you've shown: Let the Unpopular-opinion-WitchHunt Begin.

1.)Stop playing the victim card.

2.) you haven't defended your position. You just stated that poor people shouldn't play the game and they should raise prices to ensure less people play.

3.) Sorry if you took offense, but neck beard wasn't directed at you. What I meant to say was your elitist aming standards. I'm not calling you gaming, so don't get that confused.

4.) State a reason why prices should increase. Nobody suggests purchasing a game they can't afford. Nobody says they choose war gaming over eating, they simply say they purchase less for the same disposable income.

5.) you said the topic was ridiculous, and gave no justification for it. Why is this thread ridiculous for commenting on a legitimate concern for the game?

1. Um. Don't tell me what to do?

2. I didn't read a rule where I had to. I can have an opinion without source material.

3. Keep talking down to me. Looks great with mods watching the thread.

4. I already did. I said prices should go up to keep poor people out of LGS's. That was my initial reason, written in my first post. If it's not good enough of a reason, that was never any concern to me.

5. Again, I'm entitled to my own opinion without offering extensive, or any justification. This is the internet, not a presidential debate.

Your aggressive persecution of my opinion is getting ridiculous, and frankly, despite how absurd what I've said may seem, your constant attacking of it is just as absurd.

Edit: Added some color.

 TheCaptain wrote:


1. Um. Don't tell me what to do?

2. I didn't read a rule where I had to. I can have an opinion without source material.

3. Keep talking down to me. Looks great with mods watching the thread.

4. I already did. I said prices should go up to keep poor people out of LGS's. That was my initial reason, written in my first post. If it's not good enough of a reason, that was never any concern to me.

5. Again, I'm entitled to my own opinion without offering extensive, or any justification. This is the internet, not a presidential debate.

Your aggressive persecution of my opinion is getting ridiculous, and frankly, despite how absurd what I've said may seem, your constant attacking of it is just as absurd.

Edit: Added some color.

Seriously?
1.) You have an objectionable opinion. People disagree with you. You are not a victim.
2.) then you are not involved in a discussion, just stating the same point.
3.) I'm not saying anything mean.
4.) Why shouldn't "poor" people be allowed in a store if they are making purchases and playing? Who is poor to you?
5.) Your opinion is very elitist and somewhat offensive. You don't just spout off something like that without expecting people to have issue, and I think you know that.

And all you do is keep saying that my points are absurd. If you don't want to take part in the discussion then you don't have to respond. You've made your comment, poor people shouldn't be allowed to play the game and everyone should pay more to make this happen. Done. You are adding nothing else or expanding on this, so there is no reason for you to stay involved in the discussion.

I thought 'don't feed the trolls' was internet common sense by now.

 Savageconvoy wrote:

And all you do is keep saying that my points are absurd. If you don't want to take part in the discussion then you don't have to respond. You've made your comment, poor people shouldn't be allowed to play the game and everyone should pay more to make this happen. Done. You are adding nothing else or expanding on this, so there is no reason for you to stay involved in the discussion.

Your sense of entitlement and illusion of command is staggering.

I'm staggered.

To answer your questions/statements:

1. Disagreeing and attacking are different.

2. I've been discussing. You've just attacked my attempts at the matter.

3. "Sorry if you took offense, but neckbeard wasn't directed at you... etc, etc, etc', "your gaming standards, I'm not calling you gaming, so don't get that confused"

Pretty blatant mockery. Don't fake ignorance on that one; you thought it up.

4. I never said this. If someone can come into a store, play with a full army, or make purchases, then power to them. But when people do neither because of the price, the hobby is hurt. When people go third party because GW is too expensive, the hobby is hurt. When people ignore this problem, the hobby is hurt.

There is no definitive "poor". Only "Too poor for X" If you're too poor for 40k, then you're too poor for 40k. I'm not a fan of having people too poor for 40k trying to third-party their way into the hobby that most pay full price for.

That is unfair.

5. Telling someone their opinion is anything is like, ridiculously condescending.

Again, unless I see a [Mod] tag by your name, I don't see you kicking people out of discussions.

Good luck though, Modhood is a cool aspiration.

-The Captain

Oh, and no offense intended.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 -Loki- wrote:
I thought 'don't feed the trolls' was internet common sense by now.

Calling someone a troll for expressing a viable, conscious, intentional opinion is flaming as defined by Dakka's rules of conduct.

Edit: It's sad, I had hoped the populace could handle bipartisan discussion with varied opinions and feelings, but it seems all this thread begs for is agreement with the singular, hailed opinion to rule them all.

For shame.

 -Loki- wrote:
I thought 'don't feed the trolls' was internet common sense by now.

This. Just by reading the first post, then the next one that confirmed legitimacy, you could easily tell where the conversation was heading. Better off just dropping the conversation at this point.

40k is a terribly expensive hobby to buy into, especially if you want a top-notch highly competitive list.

I'd love to buy new stuff. I love most of the new models and flyers. However Weddings are expensive, and so are honeymoons, and poopskittles so is saving for a down payment on a home. Maybe in another year I'll toss some Cash GW's way on stuff other than glue/paint/basing/etc supplies

 -Loki- wrote:
I thought 'don't feed the trolls' was internet common sense by now.

^ Drop it man, Captain ain't gonna jump off his derp bucket anytime soon.

jdjamesdean@mail.com wrote:
40k is a terribly expensive hobby to buy into, especially if you want a top-notch highly competitive list.

I'd love to buy new stuff. I love most of the new models and flyers. However Weddings are expensive, and so are honeymoons, and poopskittles so is saving for a down payment on a home. Maybe in another year I'll toss some Cash GW's way on stuff other than glue/paint/basing/etc supplies

So what you're saying is real life expenses are getting in the way of hobbies. If you're paying for a wedding and a honeymoon, you shouldn't be throwing any money into hobbies.