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I've been trying to stay off this thread, but I see that's not such a wise decision. Ailaros, by being capable to hurt, I mean just being capable, not better. The EAC can hurt anything except AV14, the PGC can't hurt AV12 and 13. By "being able to hurt", I don't mean "being better against". In this context, just add and subtract-the EAC can hurt more targets-not that it will. As I stated multiple times, I'm not concerned about which tank is better, especially given the difference in cost.
BryilCream, obviously you've never tried the Exterminator before, so do proxy it once and watch as it fires every turn with OK results, but nothing too spectacular, while no one shoots at it thanks to most people having contempt for it as you do. If all you want is a piece of AV14 that you expect to survive, the Exterminator is best. If you expect a lot from your Russ, yeah, go for more specialized versions (I often do, objectively the Exterminator isn't best by any means, and may be 5th in the entire non-FW Russ line in terms of overall efficiency). The whole point of the comparison you mentioned is to illustrate how much the range difference matters, especially if you get short table edge deployment.

I personally have been liking the bolter boat Exterminator. Whilst not doing any one thing fantastically, it holds its own for me as a good take all comers piece of armour.

I dont care that it cant tackle av14, I have melta vets and vendettas for that.

I have had a painted Leman Russ hull equipped with a lascannon for a while now and I have two turrets for it.
The first is the Exterminator and the second is the Vanquisher with Pask.
So far I have only used it with the Exterminator turret, and every time I have used it, I have wished for those HB sponsons to be on. It simply doesn't do a lot of damage against vehicles, nor a lot of damage to infantry either. If I had those extra HB's, it would be decent against GEQ and MC's at least.
The Vanquisher turret has been on the shelf since I got it, because right now that variant is just too expensive to field for what it does. Maybe I should just get a third Leman Russ hull with 3x heavy bolters?

Martel732 wrote:
BA terminators? TH/SS? Again, crack the LR and torrent them to death. Takes a bit longer with FNP, but same thing applies.

Yes and I you can just kill them with lasguns a lot of lasguns.

As I previously mentioned, a 3 HB exterminator is serving me well so far. I definitely recommend at least proxying one.

 Afrodactyl wrote:
As I previously mentioned, a 3 HB exterminator is serving me well so far. I definitely recommend at least proxying one.

Exterminators are funny creatures. They don't do their job by doing a s***load of damage, but by just being cheap and being there, contributing oh so small amounts to the carnage while soaking up fire. While being highly versatile, they tend to pose insufficient psychological threat when fielded alone. Whenever I field one by itself, the opponent tends to ignore it. Remember, if your Russes aren't being shot at, you're wasting points. Artillery is both cheaper and more powerful, it just lacks the same survivability.

 Hedkrakka wrote:
Remember, if your Russes aren't being shot at, you're wasting points. Artillery is both cheaper and more powerful, it just lacks the same survivability.

That's not entirely true. It's a relevant argument for the blast Leman Russes where the artillery tanks give you the same (or better) weapon, but it fails in the cases where there's no artillery tank with an equivalent gun. There's no artillery tank that can duplicate what the Exterminator can do, so you have to judge it on its own merits.

If you want to be technical, an autocannon HWT will mimic an Exterminator turret's firepower. Of course, doing so means you're sacrificing mobility and survivability to a degree that pretty much negates the comparison.

 Hedkrakka wrote:

Exterminators are funny creatures. They don't do their job by doing a s***load of damage, but by just being cheap and being there, contributing oh so small amounts to the carnage while soaking up fire.

I've always been disappointed each time I use an exterminator. My opponent generally ignores it, so it doesn't do that much firepower soaking as you might think. If they do destroy it (think outflanking Hive Tyrant warlord) I tend to just shrug and I'm glad my opponent didn't decide to shoot something else.

I've not tried the punisher, but from the looks of this thread it is the most versatile. I might give it a go, but I just have that horrible thought in the back of my head saying "you could get a vulture for less points."

The trick I have for making it pull its weight is simply being highly aggressive with it; driving it forward and shoving it down your opponents throat to force them to deal with it. Im also using it as my chief tank-shocker because of this.

 Afrodactyl wrote:
The trick I have for making it pull its weight is simply being highly aggressive with it; driving it forward and shoving it down your opponents throat to force them to deal with it. Im also using it as my chief tank-shocker because of this.

How do you tank shock with a heavy vehicle?

I was using it as a bolter-boat, in which case driving it too far forwards is rather pointless, I suppose I could kit it with MM and charge towards an opposing tank. However if I do that, I might as well make it a demolisher.

 Griddlelol wrote:

 Hedkrakka wrote:

Exterminators are funny creatures. They don't do their job by doing a s***load of damage, but by just being cheap and being there, contributing oh so small amounts to the carnage while soaking up fire.

I've always been disappointed each time I use an exterminator. My opponent generally ignores it, so it doesn't do that much firepower soaking as you might think. If they do destroy it (think outflanking Hive Tyrant warlord) I tend to just shrug and I'm glad my opponent didn't decide to shoot something else.

I've not tried the punisher, but from the looks of this thread it is the most versatile. I might give it a go, but I just have that horrible thought in the back of my head saying "you could get a vulture for less points."

If you read my entire post, you'll see it also happens to me. You need to have a lot of them (well, at least two) and/or use them to cover something important to make the enemy shoot at them. "an" Exterminator will always disappoint you, use Exterminators instead.

Punishers are great, but as I said, not versatile. I've tried the hull LC/MM sponson build considered here multiple times and shooting at something as ordinary as a Wave Serpent is painful in itself. 20 shots go to waste and you're stuck with three BS3 single shot weapons. It still excels against infantry and most MC, but that's it. The Punisher is very good at its role, but not versatile. Also, if you have access to FW, definitely use that, it's the same gun on a flyer AFAIK, who wouldn't love that?

Peregrine: The average firepower an Exterminator Autocannon dishes out is equal to three Autocannon teams. Admittedly the Exterminator has a smaller standard deviation, but it should be close enough for comparison purposes.

 Griddlelol wrote:

 Afrodactyl wrote:
The trick I have for making it pull its weight is simply being highly aggressive with it; driving it forward and shoving it down your opponents throat to force them to deal with it. Im also using it as my chief tank-shocker because of this.

How do you tank shock with a heavy vehicle?

I was using it as a bolter-boat, in which case driving it too far forwards is rather pointless, I suppose I could kit it with MM and charge towards an opposing tank. However if I do that, I might as well make it a demolisher.

It only happens rarely, but I occasionally get it off. Its like, one in ten games, but I dont really tank shock with any of my chimeras haha.

Is it a good idea to tank shock?

 Tomten wrote:
Is it a good idea to tank shock?

In what situation?

Besides targeting fliers (which LRs shouldn't. I mean we have Vendettas come on) I just take a ton of demolishers. They never disappoint. With enough on the board you will be able to touch everything with their pie plates of death.

I play an Armored Battlegroup and they are ALWAYS used.

 Tomten wrote:
Is it a good idea to tank shock?

It depends on what you're plowing into. A small group of say, cultists, is a great target if you need it out of the fight.

You can tank shock everything that wont kill you.


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But it all depends if you are close enough.