Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Why does most of the stuff GW puts out lately have to look like rediculously over the top children's toys.

I would have been interested in the Dragon Ogres, but they just look awkward. The heads are smallish and the stiff legs & arms don't look good at all. They appear to be moving like the 7 foot 2 white guy who wants to play basketball but really isn't athletic at all. As if a trainee sculptor ruined a great potential. And why does that Lord's head look like he has Down Syndrome?

Throgg does look good Imo, but he is FC probably, so no thanks.

Maybe finally the Marauder resculpts then........ oh wait we didn't get any, but only new unnecessary blinged out nonsense again instead.

Last hope goes out to the Forsaken once better pictures show up... (they have some potential as cultists/zombies/mutants/etc).

Whatever though, the best thing about this release will probably be the laugh we get at the new equally over the top prices GW pulled out of their backsides.

 TBD wrote:
Why does most of the stuff GW puts out lately have to look like rediculously over the top children's toys.

I would have been interested in the Dragon Ogres, but they just look awkward. The heads are smallish and the stiff legs & arms don't look good at all. They appear to be moving like the 7 foot 2 white guy who wants to play basketball but really isn't athletic at all. As if a trainee sculptor ruined a great potential. And why does that Lord's head look like he has Down Syndrome?

Throgg does look good Imo, but he is FC probably, so no thanks.

Maybe finally the Marauder resculpts then........ oh wait we didn't get any, but only new unnecessary blinged out nonsense again instead.

Last hope goes out to the Forsaken once better pictures show up...

Whatever though, the best thing about this release will probably be the laugh we get at the new equally over the top prices GW pulled out of their backsides.

Straight from Rick Priestly himself:
"Bryan always said that if the studio ever had to mix with the manufacturing and sales part of the business it would destroy the studio. And I have to say – he wasn’t wrong there! The modern studio isn’t a studio in the same way; it isn’t a collection of artists and creatives sharing ideas and driving each other on. It’s become the promotions department of a toy company – things move on!"

Full interview: http://realmofchaos80s.blogspot.ca/2013/01/rick-priestley-interview-from-realms-of.html

Yeah that hits the nail on the head. Unfortunately it is true.

Reminds me of the Underworld movies, for example. I really love the first one, and the second and third one were alright, but the last one got ruined completely by the absolutely horrible cgi. GW is going down that same road.

My only gripe is on the big beasties, why is their right arm so small, I am scratching my head on how the slaughterbeast must attack, unless it can stand on its legs, the right arm is far too short to strike with and the left arm cannot attack if the right arm cannot support the body on the floor.

The reason I don't like the dragon ogres is the front legs are Huge, rather than looking more like raptors. Also, it was really easy to make decent dragon ogres before. See the following conversion, just black orcs and cold ones...



So, that's why I don't like the new ones...

That thing with the tentacles, whatever it is, looks like it would mesh very well with the 40k Maulerfiend.

These all look awesome! I know what I want for my birthday

Well everyone is entitled to opinions, but GW released far worse stuff in 2012... War Shrine, Coven Throne, Storm Talon, Dinobots etc

For me, this is one occasion where they aren't guilty of churning out toys. That tentacle beastie is just insane.

I love Throgg and the Dragon Ogres. I'll be all over them.

I can't say that any of these minis "wow" me. The dragon ogres aren't bad, but I prefer the old ones.

It is nice to see a new army book. I have a shelf full of both Chaos and Undead, from when I played back in 5th edition. My brother-in-law got me the new core rulebook for a Christmas/birthday present. I was going to default to picking up the vampire count book, as it irks me to buy an out of date codex. Now I'll have to figure out which one of my armies is viable in this day and age, and go forth the destroy the world.

VORTEX BEAST. Good grob damn

Will be buying him and the armybook ... though now I find myself at an impasse, as I can't afford those + the skorne mammoth that hits right around then as well

Also: extremely thrilled that we finally finally finally have plastic chaos chariots. That old metal monster needed to leave long ago. Note that if they're finecast I'mma gonna have to get my hate ray powered up

Also: here's hoping the drogres are still on 50x50 bases, I'd hate to have to rebase my counts as dudes. Same goes for RTides and all those brave folks who converted their own

- Salvage

 TBD wrote:
Why does most of the stuff GW puts out lately have to look like rediculously over the top children's toys.

This.


The large monsters, in fact all the recent large monsters, have a very strong WoW aesthetic about them. They do look like toys. It's like they're straining the last of the horror aspects from WHFB in favour of oversizing and making the model as 'loud' as possible.

I do like the single reptilian steed for the chariot and the dragon ogres seem solid (RiTides, dragon ogres have traditionally been quadruped and it was only the Shaggoth that deviated from that).

Also, I think we all need to understand that it seems no redesigns for existing models when they can release new models for new units and 'encourage' all army owners to buy them. There is a reduced profit if they redesign marauders as lots who already own the existing ones will simply keep their old models. So, this is a maximizing of profit from the company.

I will be looking to kitbash my own 'giant monsters' or pick up a more horrific and eldritch looking creature from another range to replace these 'giant he-man toys'. I'm off to reread Slaves to Darkness...


I'd love to know just what is going through their minds regarding Fantasy, it looks from the outside like they're forcing it to appeal to young children, which, given how much I loved it for it's utter darkness in comparison with so many fantasy settings, is just a bloody shame.

 RiTides wrote:
The reason I don't like the dragon ogres is the front legs are Huge, rather than looking more like raptors.

I have to admit a bit of interest as to why Dragon Ogres equate to raptors in your mind, RiTides. Care to share? I'm genuinely curious, not trying to put you on the spot or anything here.
To my mind, they've always seemed more like they would be rather bulky abominations which deserve both the name "dragon" and "ogre".

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

 TBD wrote:
Why does most of the stuff GW puts out lately have to look like rediculously over the top children's toys.

This.

The large monsters, in fact all the recent large monsters, have a very strong WoW aesthetic about them. They do look like toys. It's like they're straining the last of the horror aspects from WHFB in favour of oversizing and making the model as 'loud' as possible.

I have to wonder if it might be due to the fact that they've started doing primarily digital design work for the bigger things. I seem to recall this line of discussion being a really hot topic when the Ogre Kingdoms book came out regarding the Mammoths.

 Kanluwen wrote:

I have to wonder if it might be due to the fact that they've started doing primarily digital design work for the bigger things. I seem to recall this line of discussion being a really hot topic when the Ogre Kingdoms book came out regarding the Mammoths.

That would make a lot of sense, there's something weirdly artificial and symmetrical about the fur or horns or other things that should be irregular and asymmetrical. This makes it feel, to me, mass produced and cheap, like a child's toy, rather than a sculpt.

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

I have to wonder if it might be due to the fact that they've started doing primarily digital design work for the bigger things. I seem to recall this line of discussion being a really hot topic when the Ogre Kingdoms book came out regarding the Mammoths.

That would make a lot of sense, there's something weirdly artificial and symmetrical about the fur or horns or other things that should be irregular and asymmetrical. This makes it feel, to me, mass produced and cheap, like a child's toy, rather than a sculpt.

To me, a lot of it is coming down to the color choices.

It might sound silly, but a good example of this is again the mammoth. The Stonehorn they painted is vastly more cartoony to my eye than the Thundertusk.

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
I'd love to know just what is going through their minds regarding Fantasy, it looks from the outside like they're forcing it to appeal to young children, which, given how much I loved it for it's utter darkness in comparison with so many fantasy settings, is just a bloody shame.

My kneejerk reaction was to stick up for the rules system itself and say that Fantasy is much more adult oriented (i.e. complex and tactically deep) when compared to 40k, with its loose unit coherency, open LoS, roll-as-many-dice-as-possible-to-secure-victory mechanic ... but you know, I don't believe that anymore. The Yahtzeehammer component of Fantasy is far too hard to ignore, especially when combined with the Deathstarhammer approach to list building that the VP arrangement promotes, and let's face it, a general laxity in the rules of play (premeasure I'm looking at you). Fantasy has a lot of small rules to keep in mind for sure, but compared to the newest 40k? I feel like it pales in comparison to the raw minutiae in that BRB

But you were talking aesthetics MGS, particularly when it comes to the dark powers, so back on topic. For me, GeeDub lost my faith when they removed the Diaz daemonettes, with their glorious preponderance of breasts, and replaced them with the hideous one-breasted plastics. Slaanesh has never recovered - I know you've your own share of angst when it comes to representing that deity in particular (are the newest seekers and the chariot thing really it for the last several years???) Part of my joy over the vortex beast is that the tentacles scream Chaos to me in a way that the Dub hasn't been doing a lot of recently. As in, disconnected from existing IP (Tzeentch = horrors, flamers, screamers; Khorne = bloodletters, juggers, angry dudes, etc).

The rest of my joy over the big beastie is that I unabashedly love me some big monsters

- Salvage

So I show up late to the thread and almost all the pics have been deleted. Anyone able to rehost them?

 Aerethan wrote:
So I show up late to the thread and almost all the pics have been deleted. Anyone able to rehost them?

Fixed them all for you, Aerethan. Let's see how long those last.

Also, now everyone is changing their tune on dates. lol

via anonymous on Faeit212 wrote:
Nothing was wrong with the dates I provided, I guess I just wasn't clear.
Febuary WD is daemons, march WD is flyers.
At least, in so far as the white dwarf released in feb, etc.
The white dwarf released in december had DAngels for instance.

It's back to back releases with a heavier focus on 40k for the next year to two years to get all the army books up to date. Then expect new units in white dwarf releases and army updates to spot fill anything that needs a boost here or there. Then it will be a primary focus on expansions and supplements as opposed to just a revolving door of codexes.

6th edition is here to stay.

 Boss Salvage wrote:

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
I'd love to know just what is going through their minds regarding Fantasy, it looks from the outside like they're forcing it to appeal to young children, which, given how much I loved it for it's utter darkness in comparison with so many fantasy settings, is just a bloody shame.

My kneejerk reaction was to stick up for the rules system itself and say that Fantasy is much more adult oriented (i.e. complex and tactically deep) when compared to 40k, with its loose unit coherency, open LoS, roll-as-many-dice-as-possible-to-secure-victory mechanic ... but you know, I don't believe that anymore. The Yahtzeehammer component of Fantasy is far too hard to ignore, especially when combined with the Deathstarhammer approach to list building that the VP arrangement promotes, and let's face it, a general laxity in the rules of play (premeasure I'm looking at you). Fantasy has a lot of small rules to keep in mind for sure, but compared to the newest 40k? I feel like it pales in comparison to the raw minutiae in that BRB

I think WHFB has ever been above 40k in terms of rules complexity and considered the more adult of the two and I enjoyed it as such for many years as, for me, the unforgiving movement of whole units and thinking several steps ahead in that regard, led to a loftier game. The divergence has indeed happened with the last edition of 40k which has rolled back the playstyle to a strange 2.5 edition. The last edition of Fantasy just seems very very badly constructed for one reason, it's clear that the marketing ploy was for massive units and huge monsters, for pure cash profit, yet monsters are utterly vulnerable to warmachines and magic, the magic also very directly threatens the large 'eggs in one basket' units they want you to build. Premeasure existed long ago and it's coming back is a seasonal thing I think, part of the old is new is old lazy cycling I see on occasion in the newer rulesets. If the newest edition of 40k has got you back to the game though, I'm happy to hear it and insist you head over to Fortress Stompa for a game or two!

 Boss Salvage wrote:

But you were talking aesthetics MGS, particularly when it comes to the dark powers, so back on topic. For me, GeeDub lost my faith when they removed the Diaz daemonettes, with their glorious preponderance of breasts, and replaced them with the hideous one-breasted plastics. Slaanesh has never recovered - I know you've your own share of angst when it comes to representing that deity in particular (are the newest seekers and the chariot thing really it for the last several years???) Part of my joy over the vortex beast is that the tentacles scream Chaos to me in a way that the Dub hasn't been doing a lot of recently. As in, disconnected from existing IP (Tzeentch = horrors, flamers, screamers; Khorne = bloodletters, juggers, angry dudes, etc).
The rest of my joy over the big beastie is that I unabashedly love me some big monsters
- Salvage

Slaanesh is, I think, something that the guys in suits really wish would just vanish from both settings due to it's subject matter not being suitable for little kiddies. Personally I think sHe's my favourite god, partially for that reason alone and mostly because I find it the most interesting of the gods, being a fan of cenobites and paradise lost. I think the only GW models that effectively convey it are some of the very old Jes G champions, like the two headed elf, bald snake and the one carrying the book, and the forgeworld keeper of secrets. I don't think the prior daemonettes were better based on a breast count but rather because they were a much better sculpt than the plastics, they have more movement and sharper details.

I do like the tentacles on the front of that big monster, just the rest of it, ie if you want one of each of those monsters it's basically a giant headswap... and the body is fairly gimpy to me.

The Slaughterbrute came really close to being cool. The mismatched (and too many) arms throws it off. I like the head though, minus the tongue.

And the dragon Ogres are pretty sexy. Might grab some of those at a discount somewhere.

 Kanluwen wrote:
I have to admit a bit of interest as to why Dragon Ogres equate to raptors in your mind, RiTides. Care to share? I'm genuinely curious, not trying to put you on the spot or anything here.
To my mind, they've always seemed more like they would be rather bulky abominations which deserve both the name "dragon" and "ogre".

They can be bulky abominations without having 4 sets of legs that are nearly the same size . Look at the excellent Dragon Ogre Shaggoth model! It's got T-rex front arms. This is how I envisioned dragon ogres to be, too, hence my converting them from cold one bodies (that I learned from someone on Dakka ) to keep the Shaggoth look.

I'm also not a fan of Throgg at all. Glad I got out before they put out those models...

(not that I'm not planning to get back into fantasy, with chaos dwarfs likely, from a variety of sources... but I just find these releases to be lackluster and cartoony is all)

 RiTides wrote:
I'm also not a fan of Throgg at all. Glad I got out before they put out those models...

But but but he's got a cape! Actually most kaos d00ds seem to have capes



- Salvage

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

 Boss Salvage wrote:

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:
I'd love to know just what is going through their minds regarding Fantasy, it looks from the outside like they're forcing it to appeal to young children, which, given how much I loved it for it's utter darkness in comparison with so many fantasy settings, is just a bloody shame.

My kneejerk reaction was to stick up for the rules system itself and say that Fantasy is much more adult oriented (i.e. complex and tactically deep) when compared to 40k, with its loose unit coherency, open LoS, roll-as-many-dice-as-possible-to-secure-victory mechanic ... but you know, I don't believe that anymore. The Yahtzeehammer component of Fantasy is far too hard to ignore, especially when combined with the Deathstarhammer approach to list building that the VP arrangement promotes, and let's face it, a general laxity in the rules of play (premeasure I'm looking at you). Fantasy has a lot of small rules to keep in mind for sure, but compared to the newest 40k? I feel like it pales in comparison to the raw minutiae in that BRB

I think WHFB has ever been above 40k in terms of rules complexity and considered the more adult of the two and I enjoyed it as such for many years as, for me, the unforgiving movement of whole units and thinking several steps ahead in that regard, led to a loftier game. The divergence has indeed happened with the last edition of 40k which has rolled back the playstyle to a strange 2.5 edition. The last edition of Fantasy just seems very very badly constructed for one reason, it's clear that the marketing ploy was for massive units and huge monsters, for pure cash profit, yet monsters are utterly vulnerable to warmachines and magic, the magic also very directly threatens the large 'eggs in one basket' units they want you to build. Premeasure existed long ago and it's coming back is a seasonal thing I think, part of the old is new is old lazy cycling I see on occasion in the newer rulesets. If the newest edition of 40k has got you back to the game though, I'm happy to hear it and insist you head over to Fortress Stompa for a game or two!

 Boss Salvage wrote:

But you were talking aesthetics MGS, particularly when it comes to the dark powers, so back on topic. For me, GeeDub lost my faith when they removed the Diaz daemonettes, with their glorious preponderance of breasts, and replaced them with the hideous one-breasted plastics. Slaanesh has never recovered - I know you've your own share of angst when it comes to representing that deity in particular (are the newest seekers and the chariot thing really it for the last several years???) Part of my joy over the vortex beast is that the tentacles scream Chaos to me in a way that the Dub hasn't been doing a lot of recently. As in, disconnected from existing IP (Tzeentch = horrors, flamers, screamers; Khorne = bloodletters, juggers, angry dudes, etc).
The rest of my joy over the big beastie is that I unabashedly love me some big monsters
- Salvage

Slaanesh is, I think, something that the guys in suits really wish would just vanish from both settings due to it's subject matter not being suitable for little kiddies. Personally I think sHe's my favourite god, partially for that reason alone and mostly because I find it the most interesting of the gods, being a fan of cenobites and paradise lost. I think the only GW models that effectively convey it are some of the very old Jes G champions, like the two headed elf, bald snake and the one carrying the book, and the forgeworld keeper of secrets. I don't think the prior daemonettes were better based on a breast count but rather because they were a much better sculpt than the plastics, they have more movement and sharper details.

I do like the tentacles on the front of that big monster, just the rest of it, ie if you want one of each of those monsters it's basically a giant headswap... and the body is fairly gimpy to me.

You're problem is the same as mine: we're too old! I may be wrong, but I bet you grew up in the late 80s/early 90s and as a result, you're used to a certain 'type' of Chaos.
The images and ethos of Chaos we grew up with was the Michael Moorcock inspiration, and if you've ever read what Rick Priestly has to say about it, you'll know what I mean. There was a certain intellectualism that was reflected in the Chaos designs back then. Bear in mind that the GW design team back then would have tapped into this.
These days, much of what made chaos, chaos has been lost. It's all about big monsters and big profits. There's never that ideological thing with chaos these days. There is no shades of grey, they're just pure evil. Does that make sense?

Boss_Salvage wrote:But but but he's got a cape! Actually most kaos d00ds seem to have capes

Yes, that would be part of the reason why I don't like him

But thanks for the pic

I'm actually a pretty big fan of those 2 lords.

And the tentacle doombeast of course.

That "magic swirly thing" I believe is Vilitch... which is why, as I said, I find the special characters to be lackluster compared to their artwork.

 Buttlerthepug wrote:
That "magic swirly thing" I believe is Vilitch... which is why, as I said, I find the special characters to be lackluster compared to their artwork.

Pretty sure this is Vilitch:

I guess he looks the part: caster thing (staff) + fighty buff armored guy

- Salvage

It being a vortex beast, I imagine the magic swirly thing is probably a vortex. Just sayin'...

He does look the part, I love the whispering wizard part of that model but feel the overall model looks 'flat' and that the metal shoulder spike is ridiculous.

I suppose I'm hoping against reason that he's plastic...

Vilitch is Finecast. You can tell from the new release scan.