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It's supposed to have the anti-air role...

I'm not sure about the megabolter, I'd rather keep the TL lascannon for penetration. My issue with any of the other weapons is that you need to roll 5-6 to glance/pen most other flyers, then if someone brings a stormeagle/blight-drones/stormraven to the party it gets even harder to disable them... Specially when you got to spend more points on the megabolter, I can't seem to justify it.

Anybody cares to share their input?

The Megabolter is for a ground attack role. The lascannon for anti-air. Simple as that.

Ally in a Vendetta?

Seriously, the Nephilim jetfighter is terrible. It's only role is anti infantry, which DA have so much of already.

The key to using the Nephilim is to remember the basics of air combat, get behind the enemy and fire until he explodes.

With the mega bolter you're looking at 7 S6 shots and 3 TL S5 shots, that's a pretty good kill chance against AV10/11. With the TLLC you can take on front armor of other flyers, but I really think it's best used to get behind other flyers and drop them or long strafing runs against enemy infantry.

The nice thing about the Blacksword missiles is that they can be fired at other flyers. Check this against the big book and having Skyfire doesn't remove the restrictions from template/blast weapons.

If people will play the Nephilim like an air superiority fighter then I think it will be useful, if you treat it like a flying tank and go straight at the enemy you're going to have a bad time

I'm with you there but I don't have the $$ to get IG stuff. I could ally with SM and get a stormtalon but that means spending points on HQ and troops...
So I'm stuck with the codex options for now.

The Nephilim is fine, reasonably balanced at 180pts.

If you're playing against AV10/11 flyers, the Megabolter isn't too bad, but I think the Lascannon is what most people would want.

If anti-flyer is your primary goal though, having a RIfleman Dread on the board for a mere 125 points might be the better way to go though. You have a ~76% chance to score at least one hit against a flyer with the S7 gun from the Dred.

The Nephilim scores one hit with it's S9 AP2 lascannon 88%, so it's better at taking on the flyers than the dread, but it's vulnerable to other flyers (ironically),.
(Edit, +2 S6 AP4 Missiles)


The other flyer is truly anti-infantry with it's 2 hurricane bolters, terribad rift-cannon, and synergistic stasis bomb.

Always take the LC. STR 6 AP 4 is a joke, and it doesn't have enough volume of fire to be effective against infantry.

Now, if it had a real avenger bolt cannon...

 Peregrine wrote:
Always take the LC. STR 6 AP 4 is a joke, and it doesn't have enough volume of fire to be effective against infantry.

Now, if it had a real avenger bolt cannon...

Pure sweetness!

 phoenix darkus wrote:

 Peregrine wrote:
Always take the LC. STR 6 AP 4 is a joke, and it doesn't have enough volume of fire to be effective against infantry.

Now, if it had a real avenger bolt cannon...

Pure sweetness!

This
And even more so, since getting behind someone (assuming you are both of same skill level and that level is above being bad) is almost impossible unless they are making tge choice to sac their flyer.

These DA fliers are the worst though, about 30-40 points too much to be efficient with their crappy loadouts. At least the Chaos codex got a really good one with that Helldrake!

I'm still waiting on me DA codex, but does the Nephilim have Vector Dancer? If so or not, how does that play into its effectiveness?

The Neph has Unrelenting Hunter and Strafing Run - Hunter lets you make weapon destroyed into immobilized

I really think that you guys aren't giving the Neph the respect it deserves. Yes it's not a flying tank, at best you've got 1 S9 shot. But roll the dice. How many other flyers have air to air missiles? Against AV10/11 you have a good chance to do damage with 7 S6 and 3 TL S5 shots.

If you don't rate it against other flyers it's a great ground attack platform, now your 10 shots/turn hit on 2's and wound well against all but the biggest enemy units.

It doesn't live up to the fluff, but last time I checked by fluff a SM or CSM army should be unbeatable in an even fight

andystache wrote:
The Neph has Unrelenting Hunter and Strafing Run - Hunter lets you make weapon destroyed into immobilized

I really think that you guys aren't giving the Neph the respect it deserves. Yes it's not a flying tank, at best you've got 1 S9 shot. But roll the dice. How many other flyers have air to air missiles? Against AV10/11 you have a good chance to do damage with 7 S6 and 3 TL S5 shots.

If you don't rate it against other flyers it's a great ground attack platform, now your 10 shots/turn hit on 2's and wound well against all but the biggest enemy units.

It doesn't live up to the fluff, but last time I checked by fluff a SM or CSM army should be unbeatable in an even fight

The Main Problem is, with AV11, it's going to get smoked after firing it's weapons, once. It will likely kill any AV 11 flier, It's got a weaker chance against AV12, and then next turn it will be effortlessly destroyed by the enemy flier or a Quadgun. A Quadgun may not even give the Neph a chance to fire it's weapons. While Necrons have a somewhat similar problem with AV11, The Night Scythe is 80 points cheaper, and a Dedicated transport so the loss of 1 isn't near as big a deal.

For 20 points more, look how much more you get out of Stormraven.

Neither DA flier is worth it's points, but the Neph is just way overcosted. If it had been AV12, I would say it would be closer to costing correctly.

I think it's odd that it seems like the AV12 flyers are the only ones with reliable weaponry to take down AV12 fliers while AV11 fliers only stand a chance against AV11 fliers or stuck to ground attack.

As somebody pointed out earlier, they made a flier that's designed to move in fast and deal lots of damage to ground targets in an army filled with bikes and plasma weaponry.

 Savageconvoy wrote:
I think it's odd that it seems like the AV12 flyers are the only ones with reliable weaponry to take down AV12 fliers while AV11 fliers only stand a chance against AV11 fliers or stuck to ground attack.

As somebody pointed out earlier, they made a flier that's designed to move in fast and deal lots of damage to ground targets in an army filled with bikes and plasma weaponry.

Well, I think it's really only the case with the DA fliers. I could be wrong, but I believe the Stormtalon can take some str 7+ weapons, and they are fairly cheap fliers.

The Necrons also don't have a problem, with their Tesla Destructors.

So, that leaves, Orks? The Dakka Jet has a pretty decent chance when it Waaaghs! The Ork flyer is pretty cheap though.

I really want to like the Nephlim, if it was 125 points I would take one for fun. That being said when you own 3 vendettas and a BA stormraven the Nephlim is underwhelming and the stained glass cannon on the other one is meh, the stasis bomb sounds awesome but the platform it's on is not worth the points.

I bought one:p It's awesome looking for sure. I'll try it out, though I am sure I'd rather take land speeders. If a divination Libby is close, those speeders are TL. But man, it looks soo fething kool. I want to figure out is intended with this flyer.