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So I was looking at the Vanilla Codex and the thought came to me, why not have these guys sit behind an Aegis line and man the Weapon Emplacement. The Signum gives a BS 5 to whoever is manning the Gun Emplacement the rest can all just do what they do. IS that worth it for 90 points? Basically a 5 man combat squad holding the gun emplacement but with the SIgnum bonus from the Sarg. It also gives you the ability to max out and have 4 marines with heavy weapons hanging out behind cover plus a basic bolter marine around to man the gun and provide meat shields for the other models.

Has anyone tried this and found it effective? And if so what squad configuration did you use?

Doesn't sound awful, but vanilla devastators pay a lot for their guns. And the aegis line doesn't save them from torrent at all. And they are such juicy targets; I really am not a fan of devastators. Maybe if I played Tau every week

I've heard the general thoughts on vanilla SM devastators is that they're overcosted for what they do. They're more expensive than tacticals, and their heavy weapons are overpriced. Comparing them to long-fangs is a bit tough, as long fangs make most other infantry-toting-heavy-weapons squads look inefficient. A better comparison to show you that they're overcosted is to look at Dark Angel Devastators. DA Devs are the same price as DA tacs, and they pay the same price for heavy weapons that DA tacticals pay. You also get a signum. If you're going to run devastators, I'd run them through the Dark Angel Codex, until the vanilla Space Marine Codex gets updated (whenever that happens).

It would be cheaper and more effective to simply use a 5 man scout squad with Telion. BS of 6, 2+ cover save with the cloaks, and Precision shots with the ADL's Cannon. With an extra heavy weapon in the squad (HB or ML) the whole set up comes in at 247pts w/ the quadgun and gives you three meatshields that can pin at 36" and precision shot on a 6.

Otherwise you could try running a 5 man Sternguard behind there with 2 lascannons and 3 meatsheilds w/ special ammo for 255pts w/ the quadgun, though here you're down to BS 4. However, you still have 2 ablative wounds before you start losing Heavy weapons.

Seems a bit better offensively, and gives better survivability to the heavy weapons than a 5 man dev squad that rocks in at 330pts with the ADL (assuming 4 Lascannons). The first wound costs you a weapon (quadgun Sgt or a Lascannon), as there are no real ablative wounds as you want the Quadgun manned for better BS (hell you paid 50pts for it, use it to good effect). Adding in extra bodies for ablative wounds will only drive the price up further.

Hope that helps

so Telion and scouts sound awesome. so what about it this way. A 5 man Dev squad no heavy weapons, costs the same as a normal combat squad but has the signum. less of a target or the same?

< Taken by the void dragon. >

A devastator squad with 3 ML's and a quad gun is 235 points for a bs5 quad gun and 3 rockets a turn. That's pretty cheap for an almost guaranteed 4-S7 hits, and 3s8 shots a turn. And puts out more firepower a turn than with scouts or tacticals.

I hadn't even thought about devs in that roll.

Other than the fact that MLs are garbage.

 Che-Vito wrote:


Save yourself some points, and don't take Telion.
A Scout Sergeant with the Quad Gun will still hit with all of the shots reliably, and still get to use Precision Shot on 6's.

The difference between BS4 TL, and BS6 TL:
Scout Sergeant: 0.9 Precision hits, 3.6 total hits
Telion: 3.98 Precision hits, 3.98 total hits

The question that you'll have to assess with your local meta, is if the extra Precision hits will be worth 50 points.

The main reason I advocate for Telion, is that he brings two things to the table that a regular scout sergeant won't

1) He brings stealth, which in 6th stacks with the cammo cloaks. This means that the scout unit will benefit from a 2+ cover save instead of a 3+ for the cloaks alone

2) All of Telion's shots are precision, all the time, no need for 6's. This makes him double deadly and can guarantee you take out Sgts, special weapons, ect when sniping into a squad with the Quadgun

Martel732 wrote:
Other than the fact that MLs are garbage.

I know we are talking about codex marines here but I use BA devs (5 man squad) with 4 rocket launchers costs only 130 pts, I use two.

< Taken by the void dragon. >

Why would you BS5 a twin-linked Autocannon that already is BS4?

You'd be better off with Telion and 4 Sniper Scouts with cloaks. 137 for Telion, the Snipers, and cloaks.

Then you get an Icarus Lascannon, and have Telion Man it. Since all his shots are precision shots, you get to enjoy sniping characters every turn.

137 + 85 = 222pts. For a Sniper Lascannon.

Jussssst saying.

And, of course, the benefits of having a 4+ cover save and 4 sniper rifles.

< Taken by the void dragon. >

Crazyterran wrote:
Why would you BS5 a twin-linked Autocannon that already is BS4?...

Because BS5 is better than BS4, thats why. If shooting at AV11 which most fliers are if not slightly better I'd rather have the extra point. If using it against MEQ and GEQ then the BS4 is fine but thats not what that gun will be shooting at all the time.

< Taken by the void dragon. >

 Che-Vito wrote:

 dalsiandon wrote:

Crazyterran wrote:
Why would you BS5 a twin-linked Autocannon that already is BS4?...

Because BS5 is better than BS4, thats why. If shooting at AV11 which most fliers are if not slightly better I'd rather have the extra point. If using it against MEQ and GEQ then the BS4 is fine but thats not what that gun will be shooting at all the time.

Even killing 4 Guardsmen a turn, it would take 12 turns to make the points back for a Telion/Quad Gun combo.

If the only thing someone is using the Quad-Gun for is to shoot GEQ during the game then they are using it wrong.

 dalsiandon wrote:

Crazyterran wrote:
Why would you BS5 a twin-linked Autocannon that already is BS4?...

Because BS5 is better than BS4, thats why. If shooting at AV11 which most fliers are if not slightly better I'd rather have the extra point. If using it against MEQ and GEQ then the BS4 is fine but thats not what that gun will be shooting at all the time.

Except, that, with BS4, you are already getting 3.5 hits everytime you shoot the Quadgun. BS5 is unnecessary.

For most cases, I'd rather have the Quad Gun. Most characters are not rolling with 2+ saves, against 3+ and higher, I'd like to have volume of fire.
Mathhammer being what it is, I still seem to play against opponents who roll Invul. saves on characters at pretty solid rates.

An Icarus Lascannon, which can place it's shots (telion), can snipe out special weapons, characters, and if you need to shoot a flyer, has a strong chance of putting damage on an AV12 one. Then, on your next turn, you can shoot things with your 2 shot Sniper Bolter!

I play in a Meta without much flyers, however, so maybe a Quadgun is slightly better at Anti-Air duty. But, the sniper lascannon thing is something i really need to try sometime. >.>

 dalsiandon wrote:

 Che-Vito wrote:

 dalsiandon wrote:

Crazyterran wrote:
Why would you BS5 a twin-linked Autocannon that already is BS4?...

Because BS5 is better than BS4, thats why. If shooting at AV11 which most fliers are if not slightly better I'd rather have the extra point. If using it against MEQ and GEQ then the BS4 is fine but thats not what that gun will be shooting at all the time.

Even killing 4 Guardsmen a turn, it would take 12 turns to make the points back for a Telion/Quad Gun combo.

If the only thing someone is using the Quad-Gun for is to shoot GEQ during the game then they are using it wrong.

This.

I play codex marines with the defense line and quad gun. But I ally imperial guard in to sit behind it. I have a 10 man vet squad with 3 plasma guns and a heavy Bolter or auto cannon and a lord commissar. As an independent character I have The Lord commissar shoot the quad gun at BS 5 and can snipe on a 6. The vet guards are there to sit on an objective since they are scoring and look scary enough to keep assaults away. Also as 2 units they would not have to fire at the same target but can still move close enough when needed to act as extra wounds for The Lord commissar.

< Taken by the void dragon. >

 Che-Vito wrote:

 dalsiandon wrote:

Crazyterran wrote:
Why would you BS5 a twin-linked Autocannon that already is BS4?...

Because BS5 is better than BS4, thats why. If shooting at AV11 which most fliers are if not slightly better I'd rather have the extra point. If using it against MEQ and GEQ then the BS4 is fine but thats not what that gun will be shooting at all the time.

Even killing 4 Guardsmen a turn, it would take 12 turns to make the points back for a Telion/Quad Gun combo.

When playing against IG, the quad gun should be shot against Vendettas, Chimeras, and that damn Bane Wolf. We hates that Bane Wolf, precious!

Well, how about the scouts are Objective scoring Troops, that alone should put them ahead of Sternguard and Dev's.

 dalsiandon wrote:

 Che-Vito wrote:

 dalsiandon wrote:

Crazyterran wrote:
Why would you BS5 a twin-linked Autocannon that already is BS4?...

Because BS5 is better than BS4, thats why. If shooting at AV11 which most fliers are if not slightly better I'd rather have the extra point. If using it against MEQ and GEQ then the BS4 is fine but thats not what that gun will be shooting at all the time.

Even killing 4 Guardsmen a turn, it would take 12 turns to make the points back for a Telion/Quad Gun combo.

If the only thing someone is using the Quad-Gun for is to shoot GEQ during the game then they are using it wrong.

 kronk wrote:


When playing against IG, the quad gun should be shot against Vendettas, Chimeras, and that damn Bane Wolf. We hates that Bane Wolf, precious!

This is what you shoot at with the Quad-Gun. If you can get rid of these then you can shoot all the GEQ you want you've already made it's 50 points back.

 PipeAlley wrote:
Well, how about the scouts are Objective scoring Troops, that alone should put them ahead of Sternguard and Dev's.

The fortifications are not always placed right on top of objectives. And having a non-scoring unit man it can be quite helpful. I know some players love to put the objectives in the middle of the field as a taunt and dare to the opponent to try and seize it. Put the ADL back from the objective and let the enemy come and shoot the shnikies out of them when they do. As for Sterngaurd they are far to good of a shooting unit on their own to have them babysit an emplacement. However Dev squads are normally a stationary unit.

Yeah, I've been putting my 1+ objective(s) closer to the center, if for no other reason to keep peeps away from my Lootas.

Still, you place the Forts first, then the Objectives. If you have Scouts manning the Quad, might as well place the objective close enough for last turn move + run?

 PipeAlley wrote:
Yeah, I've been putting my 1+ objective(s) closer to the center, if for no other reason to keep peeps away from my Lootas.

Still, you place the Forts first, then the Objectives. If you have Scouts manning the Quad, might as well place the objective close enough for last turn move + run?

I run 'nilla Marines, and take Scouts/Telion w/Quadgun in ADL.

This setup, IMO gives the greatest all around benefits.

You get the quad gun with precision shots, anti flyer capability, 2+ cover, sniper rifles (add their own benefits as well) AND it adds another scoring unit to the board.

I stick an objective either in with them or within a turns walking distance for a last minute grab/denial.

It has worked well for my play style.

Has anyone run both the Quad-Gun and the Icarus Lascannon in concert or is that too many points or is the Lascannon just not worth it and its better to spend the 15 points on another Quad-Gun or save the 35 points for other stuff?

Scouts running it, I like that idea a lot. Telion, hum, maybe I could make a custom IF scout and run him with Telions stats.....

 dalsiandon wrote:
Has anyone run both the Quad-Gun and the Icarus Lascannon in concert or is that too many points or is the Lascannon just not worth it and its better to spend the 15 points on another Quad-Gun or save the 35 points for other stuff?

Scouts running it, I like that idea a lot. Telion, hum, maybe I could make a custom IF scout and run him with Telions stats.....

You can't take both an Icarus and a Quad gun unless you are taking 2 fortifications. It says that you may take ANY ONE of the following.

RegalPhantom wrote:

 dalsiandon wrote:
Has anyone run both the Quad-Gun and the Icarus Lascannon in concert or is that too many points or is the Lascannon just not worth it and its better to spend the 15 points on another Quad-Gun or save the 35 points for other stuff?

Scouts running it, I like that idea a lot. Telion, hum, maybe I could make a custom IF scout and run him with Telions stats.....

You can't take both an Icarus and a Quad gun unless you are taking 2 fortifications. It says that you may take ANY ONE of the following.

You are right good sir. And there is really no need to buy to ADL is there?

< Taken by the void dragon. >

You can run dual force org and 2K and each force org can take a fortification, so you could take two aegis lines.

 TheLionOfTheForest wrote:
You can run dual force org and 2K and each force org can take a fortification, so you could take two aegis lines.

Yeah but in a normal game that isn't really necessary is it?