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At this point, I'd really like to see "The List", please!

A BA friend went up against fate crusher.

The first time, he lost to it. The second time - it met Blender dread.

AV13 on a dread with the ability to keep rolling till everything is dead?
Cheese.

Note:Cheese is subject to change and one mans cheese is another mans milk.

As far as exploits, not uber power but

Lelith throwing "ignores armor saves" plasma grenades.

what if she misses you say? Her BS is crazy high for some reason. The crazy b!tch and bullseye grenades over her shoulder at a moving target while blindfolded.

 Ravenous D wrote:
If you charged a full 10 man paladin squad with your 8 bloodcrushers, and lets assume you magically took zero casualties from shooting despite their slow speed, and lets also assume fateweaver didnt take 4 master crafted psycannons, and numerous S5 bolter shots to the face that you managed to charge paladins that were standing in the open otherwise you're I1, and lets assume there is zero halbreds after all that you get what? 32 attacks on the charge, 16 hits, 14 wounds. 2 will be ignored by the stave, lets say 6 are ignored from swords and I'll give it to you the rest go in and that Draigo didnt make it in combat. Thats 6 wounds spread out over 10 2 wound models. Paladins hammerhand up back with draigos, along with the banner and counter attack you're looking at 40 attacks, 20 hits, 14 wounds, after rerolls from fateweaver (who magically is still within 6") you're still looking at 7 wounds + daemon bane. Next round you lose your strength and attack bonus, and you have to deal with Draigo in the mix.

1) Your only going to get one round before your assaulted. That means you get one round to shoot.
2) A STR 5 storm bolter has a 1/27 (2/3 * 1/2 * 1/9) chance of wounding a bloodcrusher. The 'hail of bullets' are not likely to do any damage to fatecrusher.
3) Fatecrusher also brings skulltaker on a jugg. Sometimes there will be 2 heralds, (though often your also facing the masque instead of a 2nd khorne herald)
4) You assault with fatey on the same turn you assault with the crushers. You challange draigo with fatey. Draigo will kill fatey in about 6 rounds of combat given average rolls. Fatey will spawn draigo in about the same amount of time. Before that happens though, Skulltaker will jump in the challange.
5) Skulltaker has a 35/36 chance of saving from any force weapon. Simply put, you take every hit from the paladin squad onto skulltaker who tanks em like a champ.
6) Skulltaker rends on a 4+ and inflicts instant death. Hes your carrying force to kill the paladins. You can expect to kill ~2 paladins a round on the turn you dont charge, and 3 on the turn you do. I illustrate the mathhammer below.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/listByUser/90/1943.page

So what will happen is fatecrusher will assault the paladin squad and wipe out the 10 paladins in 5 combat rounds. By then fatey will be dead, taken out of the assault by skulltaker, or spawned draigo. In every case though, its a grind-fest in the middle of the board for most of the game.
Paladins are actually a really bad matchup against fatecrusher. There are excellent matchups that give fatecrusher a hard time (triple helldrakes *cough* *cough*) but paladins are not it.

There were no Challenges in 5th Edition...

 labmouse42 wrote:

 Ravenous D wrote:
If you charged a full 10 man paladin squad with your 8 bloodcrushers, and lets assume you magically took zero casualties from shooting despite their slow speed, and lets also assume fateweaver didnt take 4 master crafted psycannons, and numerous S5 bolter shots to the face that you managed to charge paladins that were standing in the open otherwise you're I1, and lets assume there is zero halbreds after all that you get what? 32 attacks on the charge, 16 hits, 14 wounds. 2 will be ignored by the stave, lets say 6 are ignored from swords and I'll give it to you the rest go in and that Draigo didnt make it in combat. Thats 6 wounds spread out over 10 2 wound models. Paladins hammerhand up back with draigos, along with the banner and counter attack you're looking at 40 attacks, 20 hits, 14 wounds, after rerolls from fateweaver (who magically is still within 6") you're still looking at 7 wounds + daemon bane. Next round you lose your strength and attack bonus, and you have to deal with Draigo in the mix.

1) Your only going to get one round before your assaulted. That means you get one round to shoot.
2) A STR 5 storm bolter has a 1/27 (2/3 * 1/2 * 1/9) chance of wounding a bloodcrusher. The 'hail of bullets' are not likely to do any damage to fatecrusher.
3) Fatecrusher also brings skulltaker on a jugg. Sometimes there will be 2 heralds, (though often your also facing the masque instead of a 2nd khorne herald)
4) You assault with fatey on the same turn you assault with the crushers. You challange draigo with fatey. Draigo will kill fatey in about 6 rounds of combat given average rolls. Fatey will spawn draigo in about the same amount of time. Before that happens though, Skulltaker will jump in the challange.
5) Skulltaker has a 35/36 chance of saving from any force weapon. Simply put, you take every hit from the paladin squad onto skulltaker who tanks em like a champ.
6) Skulltaker rends on a 4+ and inflicts instant death. Hes your carrying force to kill the paladins. You can expect to kill ~2 paladins a round on the turn you dont charge, and 3 on the turn you do. I illustrate the mathhammer below.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/listByUser/90/1943.page

So what will happen is fatecrusher will assault the paladin squad and wipe out the 10 paladins in 5 combat rounds. By then fatey will be dead, taken out of the assault by skulltaker, or spawned draigo. In every case though, its a grind-fest in the middle of the board for most of the game.
Paladins are actually a really bad matchup against fatecrusher. There are excellent matchups that give fatecrusher a hard time (triple helldrakes *cough* *cough*) but paladins are not it.

Except that a certain Troll has said their list contained 3x 8 strong Bloodcrushers + Fatey + Bloodthirster, so there's no Skulltaker rescues or Pavane shinanagains to help ensure assaults happen on your terms.
A "good" Fatecrusher list is still brutal. But as you point out, it includes the right pair of named Heralds to help bring it all together.

However, in 5th, a "good" Draigowing list was not just Draigo + Pallies + Psyflemen, but rather a solid core centered around those 3 options, but including support units in the form of say Henchmen, basic Strikes, a Vindicare (because he was filthy-good anti-tank) and/or Interceptors.
You had your main Deathstar unit that most opponents would focus on, but you still had fringe helpers for numbers plus maybe a Solodin or two to help cap rear objectives.

Firstborn wrote:


You sir, are an armchair general. I eat guys like you for lunch.

A ben franklin says you haven't dealt with either of these 2 lists you are theory hammering over your keyboard. I have played them in the trenches, many times, where the rubber meats the road.

That's the difference between you and me.

Your arguments also fall flat. Bubble wrap is ineffective against a skilled Vulkan drop pod player, and a large footprint would be the least of your worries if you faced my Fatecrusher daemons.
Not to mention all 3x 8 Bloodcrushers, the Blood Thirster, and Fateweaver almost always show up turn 1. Because they are 50% of my 2k list. You need to re-read how daemonic assault works.

Real talk;

You're like, ridiculously aggressive for posting on an internet forum.

You're having no problem sniping at people with petty insults, but when it comes to actual list-questions, you completely ignore them.

That's not really contributing.

Experiment 626 wrote:
Except that a certain Troll has said their list contained 3x 8 strong Bloodcrushers + Fatey + Bloodthirster, so there's no Skulltaker rescues or Pavane shinanagains to help ensure assaults happen on your terms.
A "good" Fatecrusher list is still brutal. But as you point out, it includes the right pair of named Heralds to help bring it all together.

Yea, I'm not sure what worked for that person. I was illustrating what works for me in this eidtion.

Experiment 626 wrote:
However, in 5th, a "good" Draigowing list was not just Draigo + Pallies + Psyflemen, but rather a solid core centered around those 3 options, but including support units in the form of say Henchmen, basic Strikes, a Vindicare (because he was filthy-good anti-tank) and/or Interceptors.
You had your main Deathstar unit that most opponents would focus on, but you still had fringe helpers for numbers plus maybe a Solodin or two to help cap rear objectives.

And those support units have become virtually less effective while daemons support units (screamers/flamers) got significantly better.

Personally I'm surpised more people don't bring fatecrusher today.

 labmouse42 wrote:

Experiment 626 wrote:
Except that a certain Troll has said their list contained 3x 8 strong Bloodcrushers + Fatey + Bloodthirster, so there's no Skulltaker rescues or Pavane shinanagains to help ensure assaults happen on your terms.
A "good" Fatecrusher list is still brutal. But as you point out, it includes the right pair of named Heralds to help bring it all together.

Yea, I'm not sure what worked for that person. I was illustrating what works for me in this eidtion.

Experiment 626 wrote:
However, in 5th, a "good" Draigowing list was not just Draigo + Pallies + Psyflemen, but rather a solid core centered around those 3 options, but including support units in the form of say Henchmen, basic Strikes, a Vindicare (because he was filthy-good anti-tank) and/or Interceptors.
You had your main Deathstar unit that most opponents would focus on, but you still had fringe helpers for numbers plus maybe a Solodin or two to help cap rear objectives.

And those support units have become virtually less effective while daemons support units (screamers/flamers) got significantly better.

Personally I'm surpised more people don't bring fatecrusher today.

Nosfey baby, let's meet up on vassal and settle this as men. Okay? I am not going to continue debating with you. It is a pointless exercise, I might as well have a discussion with my FW Greater Daemons.

You don't need Skulltaker or other heralds to destroy Paladins with Fatecrusher in 5th. HQ's are Bloodthirster with blessing\might & Fateweaver. The rest of you whiners crying "post your Fatecrusher list", nah not
going to do it. You can search Dakka yourself, you don't get to tell me what to do. I guess your mother never taught you how to say please.

And Fatecrusher is dead in 6th as a TAC list, mainly because hellblades have dropped to AP3. Meganobz, Paladins, and big blocks of Terminators will wreck them.

Bloodcrushers are still good, but there is no reason to take them with Screamers around, unless you just want to play with the cool models. I have 28 Bloodcrushers fully painted to a high standard, with custom made Heralds & a
Skulltaker on juggernaught. You can imagine my sorrow when 6th edition rolled around.... My sense is, one or more of the 6th edition designers had Fatecrusher shoved up his a$$ one too many times, and decided to take action.
I am expecting them to get a power axe option in the next book, however.

Again, more bluster and chest thumping. It is *really* dull.

This also isnt "debate" - we have asked questions and looked for evidnce, you have made assertions with no backup.

You said "put up or shut up" yet refuse to post any actual proof of what you are saying - absolutely nothing.

 rabid1903 wrote:
Just always was a bad feeling when I see that the only thing left on my half of the table is his army haha!

Doesn't matter army you play or what army you are facing this just sucks.

Skriker

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Again, more bluster and chest thumping. It is *really* dull.

This also isnt "debate" - we have asked questions and looked for evidnce, you have made assertions with no backup.

You said "put up or shut up" yet refuse to post any actual proof of what you are saying - absolutely nothing.

Am I missing something?

Did he ever post The List?

And if not... why not?

He hasn't. He claims he doesn't need to because Dakka can be searched for it.

Alpharius wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Again, more bluster and chest thumping. It is *really* dull.

This also isnt "debate" - we have asked questions and looked for evidnce, you have made assertions with no backup.

You said "put up or shut up" yet refuse to post any actual proof of what you are saying - absolutely nothing.

Am I missing something?

Did he ever post The List?

And if not... why not?

Apparently we have to duel him for it?

Firstborn wrote:
Nosfey baby, let's meet up on vassal and settle this as men. Okay?

This is so funny, I can't even begin.

Firstborn wrote:
And Fatecrusher is dead in 6th as a TAC list, mainly because hellblades have dropped to AP3. Meganobz, Paladins, and big blocks of Terminators will wreck them..

I suggest trying it again. Its actually just fine against those. I've tried it a number of times. I even illustrated a mathhammer example for you.

The best part is the fatecrusher clocks in at 800 and change points, meaning you still have plenty of points for flamers and screamers.
What it provides is a beatstick to use that can threaten multiple units at once.

Firstborn wrote:
The rest of you whiners crying "post your Fatecrusher list", nah not going to do it. You can search Dakka yourself, you don't get to tell me what to do. I guess your mother never taught you how to say please.

Right, I searched through all of your Dakka posts. No Fatecrusher list anywhere, although there was quite a bit of posts where you failed at basic decency. I guess your mother never taught you how to behave in a civil conversation, because you're getting more and more rude by the minute.


Your reading comprehension also leaves something to be desired.

 Alpharius wrote:
At this point, I'd really like to see "The List", please!

Firstborn wrote:
I am not going to continue debating with you. It is a pointless exercise, I might as well have a discussion with my FW Greater Daemons.

As a spectator in this thread tangent I have to say that this line made me laugh out loud!

Skriker

In case anyone is curious, this is how I run a fatecrusher in 6th. As I said, try it out. Its suprisingly effective.

1750 points
Fateweaver
Skulltaker on Jugg
Masque

8 Bloodcrushers w/instrument
9 flamers
9 flamers

10 plague bearers
10 plague bearers

4 screamers.

When increasing the point values, increase your numbers of screamers. At 1850, take 8 screamers. At 2000 take 14 screamers, etc...
This army is designed to table people. Its weak on troops because its goal is to either contest every one you have or just remove you from the table.
I use flamers over screams due to personal preference. Both are extremely effective. The flamers mix well with the masque as you can use her ability to group things up for the flame.

The problem with this list is the same problem with any daemon lists. You will win games, but often will lose tourneys. That's because one out of 6 games you don't get your perferred wave, and half your crap winds up deep striking excally where it should not be.

This list also has a few bad matchups. As I mentioned, triple helldrakes are a problem. You might kill everything else on the table, but those 3 helldrakes will cause big issues.

Ok, I haven't played 6th yet, so all the cheese I can bring to the party is pretty old. Old, but no less stinky...

2nd Ed, IG army... Back in the day, instead of cover saves we had penalties to hit targets in cover. Partial cover was a -1 to your roll, while Full cover was a -2. This meant BS3 models would only hit models in full cover on a 6.

The IG lascannon heavy weapon had a armor plate on the front that gave every model directly behind it full cover (despite the plate being *smaller* than the plate on the heavy bolter). No other IG weapon granted cover. Heavy weapon squads counted as basic troops under the older army building rules, so you could take an army consisting of 1 HQ squad and many++ lascannon teams.

Think about that: an IG army where EVERYONE is in full cover. I've seen it. Thirty-seven lascannons (1HQ +18 squads) that your MEQ are only hitting on a 5+. Oh, and the IG player spent the points to give every squad the ability to re-roll missed shots, so his BS3 is ends up feeling more like a BS4.

That was not a fun game.

 Alpharius wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Again, more bluster and chest thumping. It is *really* dull.

This also isnt "debate" - we have asked questions and looked for evidnce, you have made assertions with no backup.

You said "put up or shut up" yet refuse to post any actual proof of what you are saying - absolutely nothing.

Am I missing something?

Did he ever post The List?

And if not... why not?

No

Because he seems to think Fatecrusher was a be all end all list.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 labmouse42 wrote:
In case anyone is curious, this is how I run a fatecrusher in 6th. As I said, try it out. Its suprisingly effective.

1750 points
Fateweaver
Skulltaker on Jugg
Masque

8 Bloodcrushers w/instrument
9 flamers
9 flamers

10 plague bearers
10 plague bearers

4 screamers.

When increasing the point values, increase your numbers of screamers. At 1850, take 8 screamers. At 2000 take 14 screamers, etc...
This army is designed to table people. Its weak on troops because its goal is to either contest every one you have or just remove you from the table.
I use flamers over screams due to personal preference. Both are extremely effective. The flamers mix well with the masque as you can use her ability to group things up for the flame.

The problem with this list is the same problem with any daemon lists. You will win games, but often will lose tourneys. That's because one out of 6 games you don't get your perferred wave, and half your crap winds up deep striking excally where it should not be.

This list also has a few bad matchups. As I mentioned, triple helldrakes are a problem. You might kill everything else on the table, but those 3 helldrakes will cause big issues.

So essentially its a table cheese list where if you lose one of your deadly units (flamer or crushers) your army effectiveness is greatly diminished but still effective.

Cool.

Btw Firstborn if you had just posted a list like this it would have been a lot easier.

 labmouse42 wrote:

 Ravenous D wrote:
If you charged a full 10 man paladin squad with your 8 bloodcrushers, and lets assume you magically took zero casualties from shooting despite their slow speed, and lets also assume fateweaver didnt take 4 master crafted psycannons, and numerous S5 bolter shots to the face that you managed to charge paladins that were standing in the open otherwise you're I1, and lets assume there is zero halbreds after all that you get what? 32 attacks on the charge, 16 hits, 14 wounds. 2 will be ignored by the stave, lets say 6 are ignored from swords and I'll give it to you the rest go in and that Draigo didnt make it in combat. Thats 6 wounds spread out over 10 2 wound models. Paladins hammerhand up back with draigos, along with the banner and counter attack you're looking at 40 attacks, 20 hits, 14 wounds, after rerolls from fateweaver (who magically is still within 6") you're still looking at 7 wounds + daemon bane. Next round you lose your strength and attack bonus, and you have to deal with Draigo in the mix.

1) Your only going to get one round before your assaulted. That means you get one round to shoot.
2) A STR 5 storm bolter has a 1/27 (2/3 * 1/2 * 1/9) chance of wounding a bloodcrusher. The 'hail of bullets' are not likely to do any damage to fatecrusher.
3) Fatecrusher also brings skulltaker on a jugg. Sometimes there will be 2 heralds, (though often your also facing the masque instead of a 2nd khorne herald)
4) You assault with fatey on the same turn you assault with the crushers. You challange draigo with fatey. Draigo will kill fatey in about 6 rounds of combat given average rolls. Fatey will spawn draigo in about the same amount of time. Before that happens though, Skulltaker will jump in the challange.
5) Skulltaker has a 35/36 chance of saving from any force weapon. Simply put, you take every hit from the paladin squad onto skulltaker who tanks em like a champ.
6) Skulltaker rends on a 4+ and inflicts instant death. Hes your carrying force to kill the paladins. You can expect to kill ~2 paladins a round on the turn you dont charge, and 3 on the turn you do. I illustrate the mathhammer below.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/listByUser/90/1943.page

So what will happen is fatecrusher will assault the paladin squad and wipe out the 10 paladins in 5 combat rounds. By then fatey will be dead, taken out of the assault by skulltaker, or spawned draigo. In every case though, its a grind-fest in the middle of the board for most of the game.
Paladins are actually a really bad matchup against fatecrusher. There are excellent matchups that give fatecrusher a hard time (triple helldrakes *cough* *cough*) but paladins are not it.

1 and 2) Shoot fateweaver, if the massive foot print of 8 juggers in front of me so is he, and I have a lot more then 4 mc psycannons and 6 storm bolters
3) Dark Excommunication, best 5pts spent ever, renders daemons useless,
4) Was talking 5th, I sold this army waaaaaay before 6th.

Here's the army I was toting and never lost to daemons with in 5th:

Draigo
libby - sword, might of titan, shrouding, hammerhand, dark excomunication

Vindicare assassin

10 Paladins
4 Mc psycannons, banner, apoth, 2 hammers, stave, 4 swords, 4 halbreds, various master crafting to make each guy individual

1 paladin - hammer

1 paladin - hammer

Storm raven.

Psyfleman dread

Idea was to let daemons go first then drop the paladins in cover and take out whatever I liked, nothing could touch the raven, and I'd hold back the 1 man squads as long as possible (somestimes throwing one in the raven so it is scoring). Fatecrusher was never a problem, First born seems to think some how those massive 60mm bases wont impede him in the slightest into getting a full charge, and you cant be everywhere with fateweaver.

 Ravenous D wrote:
Here's the army I was toting and never lost to daemons with in 5th:

Draigo
libby - sword, might of titan, shrouding, hammerhand, dark excomunication

Vindicare assassin

10 Paladins
4 Mc psycannons, banner, apoth, 2 hammers, stave, 4 swords, 4 halbreds, various master crafting to make each guy individual

1 paladin - hammer

1 paladin - hammer

Storm raven.

Psyfleman dread

Idea was to let daemons go first then drop the paladins in cover and take out whatever I liked, nothing could touch the raven, and I'd hold back the 1 man squads as long as possible (somestimes throwing one in the raven so it is scoring). Fatecrusher was never a problem, First born seems to think some how those massive 60mm bases wont impede him in the slightest into getting a full charge, and you cant be everywhere with fateweaver.

Isn't it funny the difference one edition makes? That paladin list that dominated late 5th edition is moderate (at best) during 6th. I would take the fatecrusher daemon list I posted against it any day of the week, and twice on Sunday.

A few changes really hurt it.
* Draigo becoming AP3
* Flyers starting off the board turn 1.
* Only being able to score 1 objective with a troop choice.
* Would allocation meaning that you can't do would allocation magic across en entire paladin squad.

And of course, daemons got flamers/scremaers which are excellent.

 Ravenous D wrote:

 labmouse42 wrote:

 Ravenous D wrote:
If you charged a full 10 man paladin squad with your 8 bloodcrushers, and lets assume you magically took zero casualties from shooting despite their slow speed, and lets also assume fateweaver didnt take 4 master crafted psycannons, and numerous S5 bolter shots to the face that you managed to charge paladins that were standing in the open otherwise you're I1, and lets assume there is zero halbreds after all that you get what? 32 attacks on the charge, 16 hits, 14 wounds. 2 will be ignored by the stave, lets say 6 are ignored from swords and I'll give it to you the rest go in and that Draigo didnt make it in combat. Thats 6 wounds spread out over 10 2 wound models. Paladins hammerhand up back with draigos, along with the banner and counter attack you're looking at 40 attacks, 20 hits, 14 wounds, after rerolls from fateweaver (who magically is still within 6") you're still looking at 7 wounds + daemon bane. Next round you lose your strength and attack bonus, and you have to deal with Draigo in the mix.

1) Your only going to get one round before your assaulted. That means you get one round to shoot.
2) A STR 5 storm bolter has a 1/27 (2/3 * 1/2 * 1/9) chance of wounding a bloodcrusher. The 'hail of bullets' are not likely to do any damage to fatecrusher.
3) Fatecrusher also brings skulltaker on a jugg. Sometimes there will be 2 heralds, (though often your also facing the masque instead of a 2nd khorne herald)
4) You assault with fatey on the same turn you assault with the crushers. You challange draigo with fatey. Draigo will kill fatey in about 6 rounds of combat given average rolls. Fatey will spawn draigo in about the same amount of time. Before that happens though, Skulltaker will jump in the challange.
5) Skulltaker has a 35/36 chance of saving from any force weapon. Simply put, you take every hit from the paladin squad onto skulltaker who tanks em like a champ.
6) Skulltaker rends on a 4+ and inflicts instant death. Hes your carrying force to kill the paladins. You can expect to kill ~2 paladins a round on the turn you dont charge, and 3 on the turn you do. I illustrate the mathhammer below.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/listByUser/90/1943.page

So what will happen is fatecrusher will assault the paladin squad and wipe out the 10 paladins in 5 combat rounds. By then fatey will be dead, taken out of the assault by skulltaker, or spawned draigo. In every case though, its a grind-fest in the middle of the board for most of the game.
Paladins are actually a really bad matchup against fatecrusher. There are excellent matchups that give fatecrusher a hard time (triple helldrakes *cough* *cough*) but paladins are not it.

1 and 2) Shoot fateweaver, if the massive foot print of 8 juggers in front of me so is he, and I have a lot more then 4 mc psycannons and 6 storm bolters
3) Dark Excommunication, best 5pts spent ever, renders daemons useless,
4) Was talking 5th, I sold this army waaaaaay before 6th.

Here's the army I was toting and never lost to daemons with in 5th:

Draigo
libby - sword, might of titan, shrouding, hammerhand, dark excomunication

Vindicare assassin

10 Paladins
4 Mc psycannons, banner, apoth, 2 hammers, stave, 4 swords, 4 halbreds, various master crafting to make each guy individual

1 paladin - hammer

1 paladin - hammer

Storm raven.

Psyfleman dread

Idea was to let daemons go first then drop the paladins in cover and take out whatever I liked, nothing could touch the raven, and I'd hold back the 1 man squads as long as possible (somestimes throwing one in the raven so it is scoring). Fatecrusher was never a problem, First born seems to think some how those massive 60mm bases wont impede him in the slightest into getting a full charge, and you cant be everywhere with fateweaver.

A friend of mine played Draigo Wing in 5th, and I used to beat him so bad with Fatecrusher that he started tailoring by taking dark excommunication on his librarian.
It didn't matter, it turned off the power swords off on 1 squad of crushers but it is not enough. The only way that shuts down the army is if you also spammed 3x Dreadknights

Firstborn seems like a really good 40k player.

Firstborn wrote:


Nosfey baby, let's meet up on vassal and settle this as men. Okay? I am not going to continue debating with you. It is a pointless exercise, I might as well have a discussion with my FW Greater Daemons.

Firstborn, you are a gem

So, if you beat Nos, it means you really did table everyone you've played... but if you don't you didn't?! The logic here is that winning a Vassal duel gives you credibility?

List please (I post my record, and I post my lists... I give all house rules we use, and I back up my record if asked... if you want to tout your 40k proweness, back it up with facts and support).

 Lobukia wrote:

Firstborn wrote:


Nosfey baby, let's meet up on vassal and settle this as men. Okay? I am not going to continue debating with you. It is a pointless exercise, I might as well have a discussion with my FW Greater Daemons.

Firstborn, you are a gem

So, if you beat Nos, it means you really did table everyone you've played... but if you don't you didn't?! The logic here is that winning a Vassal duel gives you credibility?

List please (I post my record, and I post my lists... I give all house rules we use, and I back up my record if asked... if you want to tout your 40k proweness, back it up with facts and support).

I play so often, I don't even know what my win loss record is. But, not trying to tout my prowess. I just understand the GK\Daemon matchup really well. I guess you could call it my 40k specialty.

And, when playing with friends, I don't care if I win or loose. For example, I played a game last night and took a fluffy list because my friend was new and I didn't want him to get discouraged. Matter of
fact, I think I am going to let him beat up on me for a while. The last thing the game needs are people getting discouraged and quitting. It is hard enough to get new players into the game.

Firstborn wrote:

 Lobukia wrote:

Firstborn wrote:


Nosfey baby, let's meet up on vassal and settle this as men. Okay? I am not going to continue debating with you. It is a pointless exercise, I might as well have a discussion with my FW Greater Daemons.

Firstborn, you are a gem

So, if you beat Nos, it means you really did table everyone you've played... but if you don't you didn't?! The logic here is that winning a Vassal duel gives you credibility?

List please (I post my record, and I post my lists... I give all house rules we use, and I back up my record if asked... if you want to tout your 40k proweness, back it up with facts and support).

I play so often, I don't even know what my win loss record is. But, not trying to tout my prowess. I just understand the GK\Daemon matchup really well. I guess you could call it my 40k specialty.

And, when playing with friends, I don't care if I win or loose. For example, I played a game last night and took a fluffy list because my friend was new and I didn't want him to get discouraged. Matter of
fact, I think I am going to let him beat up on me for a while. The last thing the game needs are people getting discouraged and quitting. It is hard enough to get new players into the game.

If you posted more like this, instead of how you had been earlier in the thread, I have no doubt people would have responded to you in a significantly different manner.

 Sasori wrote:

Firstborn wrote:

 Lobukia wrote:

Firstborn wrote:


Nosfey baby, let's meet up on vassal and settle this as men. Okay? I am not going to continue debating with you. It is a pointless exercise, I might as well have a discussion with my FW Greater Daemons.

Firstborn, you are a gem

So, if you beat Nos, it means you really did table everyone you've played... but if you don't you didn't?! The logic here is that winning a Vassal duel gives you credibility?

List please (I post my record, and I post my lists... I give all house rules we use, and I back up my record if asked... if you want to tout your 40k proweness, back it up with facts and support).

I play so often, I don't even know what my win loss record is. But, not trying to tout my prowess. I just understand the GK\Daemon matchup really well. I guess you could call it my 40k specialty.

And, when playing with friends, I don't care if I win or loose. For example, I played a game last night and took a fluffy list because my friend was new and I didn't want him to get discouraged. Matter of
fact, I think I am going to let him beat up on me for a while. The last thing the game needs are people getting discouraged and quitting. It is hard enough to get new players into the game.

If you posted more like this, instead of how you had been earlier in the thread, I have no doubt people would have responded to you in a significantly different manner.

Well, you have to take the internet with a grain of salt. Sometimes posts\comments look really faked up, but they weren't meant that way.....
With that being said, I shouldn't have said girly boy & armchair general. My appologies.

Firstborn wrote:

 Sasori wrote:

Firstborn wrote:

 Lobukia wrote:

Firstborn wrote:


Nosfey baby, let's meet up on vassal and settle this as men. Okay? I am not going to continue debating with you. It is a pointless exercise, I might as well have a discussion with my FW Greater Daemons.

Firstborn, you are a gem

So, if you beat Nos, it means you really did table everyone you've played... but if you don't you didn't?! The logic here is that winning a Vassal duel gives you credibility?

List please (I post my record, and I post my lists... I give all house rules we use, and I back up my record if asked... if you want to tout your 40k proweness, back it up with facts and support).

I play so often, I don't even know what my win loss record is. But, not trying to tout my prowess. I just understand the GK\Daemon matchup really well. I guess you could call it my 40k specialty.

And, when playing with friends, I don't care if I win or loose. For example, I played a game last night and took a fluffy list because my friend was new and I didn't want him to get discouraged. Matter of
fact, I think I am going to let him beat up on me for a while. The last thing the game needs are people getting discouraged and quitting. It is hard enough to get new players into the game.

If you posted more like this, instead of how you had been earlier in the thread, I have no doubt people would have responded to you in a significantly different manner.

Well, you have to take the internet with a grain of salt. Sometimes posts\comments look really faked up, but they weren't meant that way.....
With that being said, I shouldn't have said girly boy & armchair general. My appologies.

Wait, what is this? A person on the internet apologizing and turning out to be a decent person after all? No way!

Maybe it's a Jekyll Hyde thing? I like the afternoon Tanith fan. Firstborn is dead, long live Firstborn!