Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

 cgage00 wrote:
My two cents here.

I like mwg for the most part some stuff is cool other stuff is well lame. The fact they are shutting down cause games workshop is enforcing a rule that has been in effect in the US for years. Sounds like either A) bad money management poor economy and using gw as a good dramatic way out or B) they had no real shop it was all online which is totally against gw policy( I know I tried). Or there could be another reason but to stop sales on all products screams there is more going on here.

Now with that said the warstore has been selling online(ish) for years. I buy a good amount from them but I always try to buy from my local store for a number of reasons biggest is that it helps the local economy.

Will I stop buying gw product due to their changes? No
Do I think their policy is right? No I think it's odd not sure I fully understand it but I can see their point of not wanting a single guy flooding the market with cheap gw product. It hurts business all over the world.

On this I would take him at face value. Online GW sales were a large part of their business. Now they cannot sell online, and what they can sell locally is being slashed (see his bit on direct order). Welland (where MWG is based) is not a large city, not large enough to support the store they have.

They have LGS close in Niagara falls and St. Catharines, which are bigger cities, so its doubtful people would drive out to MWG, especially since their physical store is not open Sunday or Monday.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Nothing really feels as good as driving other people out of business with your short-sighted and anti-competitive business practices.

*raises glass*

Here’s to another embargo!

I used to rapidly grow tired of your comments about GW but now...

...now all I can do is pour a glass for myself and join your toast.

Oh how the last year has changed things.

 Sean_OBrien wrote:
Or it could just be that the new terms effectively cut the 15% or so off the top of their business which would kill pretty much any store...even if it were running fairly strong in the local economy.

The internet is a great thing for companies who are able to properly leverage it and create a larger market for themselves beyond their local customers. It has allowed a lot of businesses to continue and grow.

The stronger Canadian dollar compared to the US dollar has likely encouraged more of their potential customers to order from a US based supplier like The Warstore. I know more than a few companies (outside of gaming) in Canada who have seen their online sales drop a good bit in the past 5 years largely attributed to exchange rates.

GW's actions are a definite nail in the coffin though for a lot of companies. When you develop a business plan, you assume that certain activities will be part of your business. They built their business with online sales as a large part of it. This isn't unusual at all, and up until these new terms - it was perfectly allowed under the retail trade terms for Canadian businesses (just as it is still allowed for UK/EU businesses).

Assuming that the store has to close down because of mismanagement or that they had no retail presence (the store that is in the background of their videos is bigger than a few B&M only stores that I have been in) is not really a valid leap.

That said, I am pretty sure the new terms violate the Competition Act - so they could probably stick with it if they wanted to fight with GW for a bit.

15% of there total sales are online gw only? That is a good amount. But to shut down is a bit drastic. It's like rage quitting a game. But that is what they want I can't stop them nor do I want to. It's hard to run a business. I think they should look at us based companies that have been selling under this long existing gw policy and take example.

 Surtur wrote:

 Goliath wrote:
In this thread:
"GW is evil for forcing this game store owner to shut down!"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm_syndrome

Read his whole post man! He was making a great point about consumers on here complaining about how evil GW is to the flgs, while the same consumers are plotting how to steal from said store.

GWs new policy is hard to fathom, and it sucks that they are running away great people who support the community. But at the same time there is something to be said about basing your whole business model on the goods from one knowingly fickle manufacturer. It leaves you dependent on their every business decision, and not the master of your own destiny.

 cgage00 wrote:


15% of there total sales are online gw only? That is a good amount. But to shut down is a bit drastic. It's like rage quitting a game. But that is what they want I can't stop them nor do I want to. It's hard to run a business. I think they should look at us based companies that have been selling under this long existing gw policy and take example.

No - I believe he said around 70% were...though I would need to take another listen to be certain.

The 15% comes out of his pile of money after he purchases stock to do things like pay the bills and put food in his belly. If you figure that of the 100% the store makes, 70% of that is GW online, he has a 40% margin on that...

When I was growing up, our family had owned two different stores (hardware and drugstore) and neither of them could have afforded to have 15% taken out of the top of the business - most were running at 5% or less wiggle room each year. That is the nature of retail business. After you pay your suppliers, pay your utilities, pay your employees, pay the government you have enough left over to pay yourself a bit...but very few people get rich running an independent store of any kind.

Regarding a conventional B&M LGS - that might not have been an option. Any number of factors tie you to a given geographic location. Apparently it was a smaller town (according to Mecha_Buddha) and it may not have had a population that could support a LGS on its own - but combined with internet sales they were able to do as much. Considering that GW claims to want to support LGS - cutting off their ability to serve smaller communities just goes to prove the fallacy.

 cgage00 wrote:

 Sean_OBrien wrote:
Or it could just be that the new terms effectively cut the 15% or so off the top of their business which would kill pretty much any store...even if it were running fairly strong in the local economy.

The internet is a great thing for companies who are able to properly leverage it and create a larger market for themselves beyond their local customers. It has allowed a lot of businesses to continue and grow.

The stronger Canadian dollar compared to the US dollar has likely encouraged more of their potential customers to order from a US based supplier like The Warstore. I know more than a few companies (outside of gaming) in Canada who have seen their online sales drop a good bit in the past 5 years largely attributed to exchange rates.

GW's actions are a definite nail in the coffin though for a lot of companies. When you develop a business plan, you assume that certain activities will be part of your business. They built their business with online sales as a large part of it. This isn't unusual at all, and up until these new terms - it was perfectly allowed under the retail trade terms for Canadian businesses (just as it is still allowed for UK/EU businesses).

Assuming that the store has to close down because of mismanagement or that they had no retail presence (the store that is in the background of their videos is bigger than a few B&M only stores that I have been in) is not really a valid leap.

That said, I am pretty sure the new terms violate the Competition Act - so they could probably stick with it if they wanted to fight with GW for a bit.

15% of there total sales are online gw only? That is a good amount. But to shut down is a bit drastic. It's like rage quitting a game. But that is what they want I can't stop them nor do I want to. It's hard to run a business. I think they should look at us based companies that have been selling under this long existing gw policy and take example.

You really have no clue. Getting set back at least 15% is HUGE. And the growth to come back from that will take a long time. From now till June is not a long time. This means all of their fixed costs like employees, bills and rent just became more drastic and all of their projects just became unaffordable luxuries. The US businesses have had a long time to recover and adapt and I'm sure several had problems handling the transition.

dionysus wrote:


GWs new policy is hard to fathom, and it sucks that they are running away great people who support the community. But at the same time there is something to be said about basing your whole business model on the goods from one knowingly fickle manufacturer. It leaves you dependent on their every business decision, and not the master of your own destiny.

In fairness, it isn't their whole business model - just their retail side. They plan on continuing their Vault program, which is independent of GW's trade terms (though I would caution them that GW might go after them for something like Trademark violations...as that is the sort of people GW are).

Two points he made in the video I think deserve some further consideration.

First, in an internet world how do most new customers find out about your company to begin with. Channels and word of mouth are still important. GW seems to think they can become like Amazon, yet even Amazon provides a lot of community interaction (Comments and reviews) on their site. GW's site is nothing but old school 1980's marketing speak which doesn't cut it in the 2010's.

Second, he talks briefly about an internet savvy customer base, which is completely true in today's day and age. Yet GW policy is more reflective of the 80s than the current generation. Since most real-time discussions (on forums and blogs) are better indexed in Google than a retail product splash piece, the majority of searches will pull up NEGATIVE information on GW as a majority. As a new customer, the internet is driving more people away than bringing them in since GW doesn't seem to do ANY internet outreach beyond their site. Also, unlike Amazon products, GW products require at least two people. GW doesn't promote community at all. This is a major structural difference between GW and Amazon customers, and therefore shows why it is folly for them to chase the Amazon structure.

In other words, GWs policies are going to make it harder and harder for them to gain new customers as time goes by while other competitors, being more internet savvy, will eventually overtake them. GW is acting more like Border's did in the face of a new start-up called Amazon. And look where that got Border's...

On their policy changes in general. I think GW is realizing, most likely, a hit in sales as a result of their ludicrous pricing. Instead of fixing that problem, they decide that they should collect all the margin on the products so they can make their profits. The last two years have shown some rather close-minded views, and an amazing amount of hubris, on why their products became as big as they did in the first place. Rather than admit their own decisions are hurting their business, they are basically blaming it on their retailers, and thinking they can do it better. GW would NEVER, and I mean NEVER, have ever been a major player in the North American markets if it wasn't for their independent retailers. Likewise, many of these same retailers will shift to promoting other game systems to survive. So GW will not gain those customers directly, they instead will move to other game systems.

I`m glad Matt said they will still be doing videos, what I`m not sure about is can they only do it with Dark Potential and Warmachine/Hordes because they are not selling GW products no more..

 TechmarineNic wrote:
I`m glad Matt said they will still be doing videos, what I`m not sure about is can they only do it with Dark Potential and Warmachine/Hordes because they are not selling GW products no more..

Well with the store, they did videos on games they sold. From what it sounds like, if the vault and videos now becomes their main focus, they may branch out into games people want to see that they didnt previously sell.

 Sean_OBrien wrote:

dionysus wrote:


GWs new policy is hard to fathom, and it sucks that they are running away great people who support the community. But at the same time there is something to be said about basing your whole business model on the goods from one knowingly fickle manufacturer. It leaves you dependent on their every business decision, and not the master of your own destiny.

In fairness, it isn't their whole business model - just their retail side. They plan on continuing their Vault program, which is independent of GW's trade terms (though I would caution them that GW might go after them for something like Trademark violations...as that is the sort of people GW are).

True, but they are still planning to cater to the community with those videos, and the community is made up mostly of GW hobbyists.

Don't get me wrong Im not saying they fethed up in their business designs, just saying we should wish them luck with their new endeavors while we all learn the "eggs in one basket" lesson that is on display. The smartest move they are making is pulling out before it goes south. Regroup and recommit.

The end of the day, all this anger people have been tossing around isn't due to the inability to get some specific plastic guns for their overpriced plastic army men. Its to do with GW messing with the way people hobby. Someone earlier said it best when they mentioned that the lack of GW community support removes most of the "no 3rd party" rules that used to be an issue when there were actual GW supported tournies going on all the time. So there is no reason not to run to places like Kromlec to grab your plasmas, or maxmini to get some T-Hammers. The people this policy hurts the most are the super competitive power gamers who go to all the cool tournies, because now those folks will have to pay an even higher premium to have just the right list.

There seems to be a huge disconnect between the vision GW has for their game and the way we feel it should be played. Decisions like the ones GW has been making does not hurt the new players that GW is recruiting as kids. It also doesn't hurt the "Beer and pretzel" gamers who people all seem to laugh about every time GW makes the reference (as they can use whatever they want and call it a chimera.) It hurts all the Fluff Nazi, rules lawering, min maxing, power gamers (like myself.)

Which makes me realize it might be time to take a step back, use whatever bits i want, be creative again, kit-bash multiple company's kits together, and just learn how to have fun as a hobby again. As opposed to just buying the little plastic men, building them just like the box shows, equipping them the way the internet told me, then painting them in one of the official color schemes that have been pounded into my head as the "right" way to do it. All so i can win a tourney to get more little plastic men.

Talk to your local tourney organizers and see if the non sponsored events can be less restrictive about GW only.

(sorry for the block of text, END RANT.)

Mecha_buddha wrote:

Well with the store, they did videos on games they sold. From what it sounds like, if the vault and videos now becomes their main focus, they may branch out into games people want to see that they didnt previously sell.

True. But believe that this will ultimately mean more 40K videos, as that is what draws people to internet content.

On my small blog (not anywhere near the caliber of sites like miniwargaming), the most basic post or update on anything 40K will get at least 10 times more traffic than anything else I could ever write about other games. Hell, I wrote an interview with Adam Poots shortly before the Kickstarter launched. It got links from TGN, BoardGameGeek and much else and is probably one of my most visited non-40K posts on my site. I also wrote a short "Codex Dark Angels Review", a month or so after the release and long after most blogs did their reviews. It still beat the Poots-interview within a day or two by search-traffic alone.

Go to sites like BOLS and see how many comments, etc.. they get on a 40K review or tactica article and compare that to the comments they get on a Warmachine tactica article, etc.. .

If you're trying to make a decent income by doing online content only/mostly (e.g. BOLS, future MiniWarGaming), you'll need to do 40K, likely as much as 70% or 80% of your content minimum I'd guess.

 Surtur wrote:

 Goliath wrote:
In this thread:
"GW is evil for forcing this game store owner to shut down!"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm_syndrome

Was I defending GW?
(The answer is no)

I find some of their recent plans pretty annoying, and feel sorry for companies like this that have had to shut down because of them, but the fact that in the same thread where you can find this:

theninjabadger wrote:
This is why everyone hates GW

You can also find people discussing the ease with which you could cancel the subscription before the free trial ended.

Obviously me white-knighting, and not at all me finding the concept of criticising a policy that loses a business money whilst also trying to get stuff for free that you'd normally have to pay for, vaguely hypocritical.

 Goliath wrote:

 Surtur wrote:

 Goliath wrote:
In this thread:
"GW is evil for forcing this game store owner to shut down!"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm_syndrome

Was I defending GW?
(The answer is no)

I find some of their recent plans pretty annoying, and feel sorry for companies like this that have had to shut down because of them, but the fact that in the same thread where you can find this:

theninjabadger wrote:
This is why everyone hates GW

You can also find people discussing the ease with which you could cancel the subscription before the free trial ended.

Obviously me white-knighting, and not at all me finding the concept of criticising a policy that loses a business money whilst also trying to get stuff for free that you'd normally have to pay for, vaguely hypocritical.

1 person in the entire thread advocated this behaviour while condemning GW practices.

Obviously 1 person doing it = everyone in this thread is an hypocrite!

 Yonan wrote:

 Goliath wrote:
"How can we stop this from further damaging our hobby.

ftfy

But they're carrying on with making the videos!
Yes, if the company had gone nuclear and they'd decided to start again with a brand new knitting company then yes, maybe getting the videos for free might be justifiable whilst also complaining about GW, to "preserve the hobby".
But they're not.
They're still (as far as I can tell) going to be making the videos, and making money from them, so you going in and trying to get them for free by fething around with the subscription isn't "stopping this further damaging our hobby" it's removing income they might have gotten from the videos, and removing some of the reason for the videos being made in the first place.

Yes, I'm a fan of GW's models. No, I'm not a fan of their recent policies, but I don't go around criticising them for taking money out of retailers' pockets whilst publicly plotting to do the exact same thing.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

PhantomViper wrote:

 Goliath wrote:

 Surtur wrote:

 Goliath wrote:
In this thread:
"GW is evil for forcing this game store owner to shut down!"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm_syndrome

Was I defending GW?
(The answer is no)

I find some of their recent plans pretty annoying, and feel sorry for companies like this that have had to shut down because of them, but the fact that in the same thread where you can find this:

theninjabadger wrote:
This is why everyone hates GW

You can also find people discussing the ease with which you could cancel the subscription before the free trial ended.

Obviously me white-knighting, and not at all me finding the concept of criticising a policy that loses a business money whilst also trying to get stuff for free that you'd normally have to pay for, vaguely hypocritical.

1 person in the entire thread advocated this behaviour while condemning GW practices.

Obviously 1 person doing it = everyone in this thread is an hypocrite!

Did I say it was everyone in the thread? (The answer is no)

My hope was that people who were doing it might see my post and go "oh, you know what, I am being a bit hypocritical aren't I? I probably should pay for these videos."
But no, for the second time in this thread my posts have been misread or misinterpreted or misrepresented for a cheap shot that doesn't address the fact that this gak happens regularly be it hypocritical condemnations of companies (mainly GW, but there have been others), or complaints about pricing for stuff that really doesn't warrant it. But no "GW/PP/FW/THON sucks! GW/PP/FW/THON rules for the exact same reason that the other one sucks!" Is still considered a valid post, and agreed with by many, which makes me upset at the decline in logic over the past few years since I joined Dakka.

I'll admit, I do it too, but if I realise I've done it I'll just not post rather than posting and hoping people won't notice.

This is madness...no...no..its just GW and its HHHobby.

sadly enough i love the HHHobby but i always pay where i play.

In New England's case its always a LFGS.

Sad about MWG but i really couldnt stand their videos.

I wish them luck with their videos (I watch them a lot), but the new policies contributing largely to them shutting down their store is pretty up. I live near a LGS and am going to continue to contribute by purchasing (and play) through them. I just feel bad that as a store they had to shut down; I mean you can see that Mat was kinda torn up about it.

 TechmarineNic wrote:
I`m glad Matt said they will still be doing videos, what I`m not sure about is can they only do it with Dark Potential and Warmachine/Hordes because they are not selling GW products no more..

They Said they are still going to do Warhammer 40k and Warhammer because they like the games


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Ironwill13791 wrote:
I wish them luck with their videos (I watch them a lot), but the new policies contributing largely to them shutting down their store is pretty up. I live near a LGS and am going to continue to contribute by purchasing (and play) through them. I just feel bad that as a store they had to shut down; I mean you can see that Mat was kinda torn up about it.

It is just there online store that is shutting down.

DeadWingman wrote:

 TechmarineNic wrote:
I`m glad Matt said they will still be doing videos, what I`m not sure about is can they only do it with Dark Potential and Warmachine/Hordes because they are not selling GW products no more..

They Said they are still going to do Warhammer 40k and Warhammer because they like the games


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Ironwill13791 wrote:
I wish them luck with their videos (I watch them a lot), but the new policies contributing largely to them shutting down their store is pretty up. I live near a LGS and am going to continue to contribute by purchasing (and play) through them. I just feel bad that as a store they had to shut down; I mean you can see that Mat was kinda torn up about it.

It is just there online store that is shutting down.

Watch the video, they're also closing down the physical store.

This is bad all around. If for nothing less there is one less physical store to go to and play, discuss, order from, etc.

I never used their promos because they just never saved me any more money than my local stores (even the ones in Europe vs. when I'm stateside).

They had closed the Europe store just as I found out about them.

Neal's store has always been the best option for me. He is a hop-skip and a jump away from the MPS in NY/NJ.

I have now placed two orders with them. My first and my last. The points earned (combined with a 40% off of one line and 30% on 3 GW items) more than made it worth my while to order and then get 95% off of 3 items and mainly just pay the shipping for them and $0.47 was more than I even thought possible.

I will miss these guys. I hope the polices and other factors can change to keep them going.

GW - the Great Weasel of addiction for over 20+ years. They are like Slurm.....

 Eldarain wrote:
Online sales must really be a huge part of their business if this asinine decision by GW is closing both their online as well as physical store.

They were shipping out $5k a month, most of which I assume was to Australians trying to get around the embargo. A lot of Australians are starting DKOK armies because the trade terms for normal GW suck.

The thing is, i can kinda see their point. MWG doesn't add a ton to the hobby, and in fact probably costs GW sales. Most Australian gamers probably would go back to buying GW at their ridiculous prices if they shut them down. So they did.

It always sucks to hear about people losing their jobs in this economy, but they didn't really add anything to the hobby, and in fact were taking things away in Australia.

Bet you there's a ton of retailers in Australia that are happy about this.

--Chris
www.chrisvalera.com

You're assuming the same people buying from MWG at discounted prices would buy at AU prices though from B&M AU retail stores. That may not be true

Well then what counts as "adding something to the hobby"? Personally if we're gonna go there then I want to be one of the first to proclaim that GW themselves don't really add anything to the hobby. If anything, a lot of what they've done in recent years has only hurt it. You could even blame them for stifling creativity to an extent, because every new game that comes out now has to be "compatible" with 40k, it has to match the same "heroic" scale that GW uses and the models have to be on the same style of bases. Any new models or parts that other companies put out have to be designed as obvious 40k proxies matching GW's aesthetic or there's no market for them. Etc.

Anyway, I used to watch MWG's videos a few years ago. Personally their video about Space Hulk's game play helped push me into buying a copy myself back when my store got them, even though I thought $100 was too high a price point for a board game and I was really unhappy about the limited nature of it to begin with (still kinda pissed that GW haven't done another print or made it permanently available). A lot of their tutorials and stuff were kinda basic and I wasn't too interested in the batreps, but it's pretty obvious these guys have a lot of enthusiasm for the hobby and I'm sure other people like having them around. In any case I certainly don't see how they aren't adding to the hobby by generating interest in it by showing people how to play, how to paint, and how to get started in general. One could argue they're doing more work to promote the game than GW is in that regard.

And needless to say I disagree with the rest. You're merely assuming that all of MWG's customers would have bought from GW at full MSRP if they weren't around, and that's not necessarily true. Especially if most of their customers were Australians like you're assuming, if their only option now is to pay unreasonably-high MSRP's or not play, then I imagine a lot of people will probably find another game sold by a company that actually wants their business.

Are we mad because they are going out of business or that we can't get a 20-25% discount on GW products online anymore?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 chris_valera wrote:

 Eldarain wrote:
Online sales must really be a huge part of their business if this asinine decision by GW is closing both their online as well as physical store.

They were shipping out $5k a month, most of which I assume was to Australians trying to get around the embargo. A lot of Australians are starting DKOK armies because the trade terms for normal GW suck.

The thing is, i can kinda see their point. MWG doesn't add a ton to the hobby, and in fact probably costs GW sales. Most Australian gamers probably would go back to buying GW at their ridiculous prices if they shut them down. So they did.

--Chris
www.chrisvalera.com

It's tough to say GW lost a sale, did MWG not buy their products from GW?

Its 5k that MWG sold so if they got it from GW direct GW still made money, but they aren't making as much off the sales. And of they were going to Aussies then its a price disparity between the Canadian, British, and Australian prices.

boyd wrote:
Are we mad because they are going out of business or that we can't get a 20-25% discount on GW products online anymore?

I didn't buy from them, so most likely the former.

Sining wrote:
You're assuming the same people buying from MWG at discounted prices would buy at AU prices though from B&M AU retail stores. That may not be true

It's most definitely not true. And the new policy isn't going to persuade them to... It's just going to move their purchases to Ebay. The new trade terms do nothing more than remove the ability to compete from those stores who choose not to risk selling on Ebay, or whose margins don't allow for the extra fees per sale.

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
The DVD givaway is a 'trial' for which you have to provide a CC/Paypal account, and will roll into a subscription if you don't cancel in time

http://www.miniwargaming.com/freedvds

not something I'm interested in, but if you're on the ball enough to record the content and cancel in time....

(I've no idea how easy it will be to cancel, some 'trials' make it difficult/impossible. I've no evidence that this is the case here, but it is a potential concern)

My solution to that problem would be to get a gift card from your local bank, use that number as the "Credit Card" and when the value of the card expires, BOOM, end of subscription. No need to have a minipanicattack trying to remember the date of expiration for the trial. lol

 Sean_OBrien wrote:
Most retail stores are on tight margins, game stores tend to be even closer to the line between keeping the lights on and closing shop.

For a shop like MWG, they probably made close to 50% of their sales from GW products and probably 90% of those sales through online customers. If you figure that they get 35% of the sales for their revenue...little bit of math, carry the two...the new terms just cut 15% off the top of their business. Since I doubt they have a few hundred people they can lay off or a warehouse or two that they can downsize, then it causes most stores to close down.

I doubt they will be the last either, as a number of other stores will be put in the same position as a result of one clause or another in the new terms.

And this is precisely the kind of behavior that is killing GW's business. I don't know about you, but it's really difficult for me to play a fun game of Warhammer or WH40K at one of GW's brick and mortar stores. I've ALWAYS preferred to play at the local - privately owned and operated - game store. Their tables are better. Their customer service is better. The atmosphere is friendlier and they have more than just GW products. The privately operated FLGS is the engine that drives this hobby and if GW puts them all out of business, no one is going to purchase GW mini's anymore.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

xraytango wrote:
I would say boycott GW, but getting everyone on board with that is the very definition of the word "futile"

I'm not so sure.

GW already has a monopoly on the intellectual property - (We can talk about CHS in another thread) - this latest move is just another attempt to create a monopoly on the distribution of their products. We could easily boycott GW distribution and in fact I have been participating in a de-facto boycott of GW's distribution for almost 10 years.

It's simple - don't buy your stuff from the GW website or a GW brick and mortar store. Buy your models and books from ebay or a FLGS or some online equivalent. As GW imposes more draconian restrictions on their distributers, they'll see their sales shrink. In fact I think they already have. The only way that GW will ever get the share of online distribution they want is to put independent distributors of GW products out of the online business. It's very clear that this is their intention, but that can't happen if you buy your stuff from independent retailers. GW knows that it can't just up and stop selling it's product to those independent retailers because if they did, then no one would even play their games. So we, the consumers, have GW by the short and curlies on this.

Let GW keep it's control of the IP becasue we all love the game and the warhammer universe. That's what they're good at. But don't give them a monopoly on distributing the product.

 Grugknuckle wrote:

 Sean_OBrien wrote:
Most retail stores are on tight margins, game stores tend to be even closer to the line between keeping the lights on and closing shop.

For a shop like MWG, they probably made close to 50% of their sales from GW products and probably 90% of those sales through online customers. If you figure that they get 35% of the sales for their revenue...little bit of math, carry the two...the new terms just cut 15% off the top of their business. Since I doubt they have a few hundred people they can lay off or a warehouse or two that they can downsize, then it causes most stores to close down.

I doubt they will be the last either, as a number of other stores will be put in the same position as a result of one clause or another in the new terms.

And this is precisely the kind of behavior that is killing GW's business. I don't know about you, but it's really difficult for me to play a fun game of Warhammer or WH40K at one of GW's brick and mortar stores. I've ALWAYS preferred to play at the local - privately owned and operated - game store. Their tables are better. Their customer service is better. The atmosphere is friendlier and they have more than just GW products. The privately operated FLGS is the engine that drives this hobby and if GW puts them all out of business, no one is going to purchase GW mini's anymore.

Well soon you wont have to worry, GWs new store format is zero gaming space and they only have room to run demos. Slowly but surely all their stores will look like that, especially if Kirby was truthful when he said he wanted to open 800 new stores in the US this year.