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So Goyf is confirmed for MM2.

As is Etched Champion, Karn Liberated, and Emratoocoolforschool.

Bleh, I don't understand Standard players.

I'm not saying someone should bank on Cards keeping their monetary value, but people who play Standard might as well be shredding money; the cards don't keep value, you can't play with them but for a year, and all it will take is three months for a new deck to surface and wipe yours out of favor.

Blehhhh....

http://www.mythicspoiler.com/dtk/cards/silumgarsscorn.html

The second coming of Counterspell, that's worthless in any format that's not Standard.

Most of the cards don't hold their value. Cryptic Command and Tarmogoyf were in standard once Y'know. Still kicking myself I never got hold of a playset of Goyf.


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But I doubt any of the cards are really going to ever go for much from this set. Still holding out hope for something really pushed though.

Howard A Treesong wrote:There's few creatures so powerful that they can't be removed in EDH, least of all by black which has various boardwipe. Blue and red can steal them, white has even more boardwipe. Big creatures are a liability afaibst blue and red, token swarms are harder to deal with.

I play a red/blue deck, blue/green counters using Vorel of the Hull Clade (which makes creatures huge and abuses +1/+1 counters) and a colourless deck with Karn. That's my fun deck as it struggles competitively having almost no sorceries.

Blue has plenty of ways to deal with tokens and big creatures, it's called bounce and bounce sweepers.

Tidespout Tyrant is pretty popular, Cyclonic Rift, Vapor Snag, Repulse, Undo, there's a whole host of things. Nothing hurts more than making your opponent waste more time and mana casting their creatures TWICE!, and then countering them on the second time, lol.

Still though, on the original topic, if everyone agreed to it, just don't play the guy or don't let him in your games, tell him exactly why no one wants to play with him.

I have a question about the interaction between Wild Research, Thunderous Wrath, and the beginning of my turn.


Could I activate Wild Research to find Thunderous Wrath and cast it for its miracle cost after my lands untap but before I get to draw my card for the turn?

I'd also like to know why, either way.


EDIT: Follow-up question. If I had no cards in hand at the beginning of my turn would that prevent me from casting the card I got for miracle?

Since Wild Research doesn't draw the card, you can never use the miracle cost from it.

Miracle doesn't care how many cards are in your hand, only if it's the first card you draw. So if you gitaxian probe during your upkeep, and draw thunderous wrath, reveal it and play it.


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Went to a prerelease today. 4th out of 20. Picked Kolaghan, and ended up G/R. My packs had Atarka, and a bunch of green cards, my seeded pack what the red off megamorph, and the last card was Silumgar.

Gitaxian probe is a sorcery, can't cast it during upkeep.

Thanks for the information.

 PlaguelordHobbyServices wrote:
Gitaxian probe is a sorcery, can't cast it during upkeep.

Any instant blue cantrip then.

I play a black and green deck built for explosive growth. I use a couple field sweepers then use the fact a token summon and grave summon to gain the advantage. Got liliana and master of the feast. So on the draw phase during your upkeep they draw a card but liliana puts that card in the graveyard. (Guarenttee for her +1 when opponent has no hand)

Planeswalker abilities can only be used during your turn, not theirs, so using Liliana to deny your opponent their draw step doesn't work. Sorry.

I know I will be the jerk at the table, but i currently have a r/g land destruction edh deck under construction, and was curious on what might be a better commander than Radha? I like Radha mainly since she is a cheap costing commander, (and the fact that i already have her), that she can produce mana, and tap for green mana. But i was also curous if there was any other r/g generals out there that i may not have come across yet that may be better. Also, maybe some funny combos, etc, if any,

thanks!
i can toss up a list of stuff i currently have in mind forit, since its not an official list yet!

Bran Dawri wrote:
Planeswalker abilities can only be used during your turn, not theirs, so using Liliana to deny your opponent their draw step doesn't work. Sorry.

Master of the feast has them draw a card during your own upkeep. Which means if havent yet that turn you may force them to discard.

 orkkiller21 wrote:
I know I will be the jerk at the table, but i currently have a r/g land destruction edh deck under construction, and was curious on what might be a better commander than Radha? I like Radha mainly since she is a cheap costing commander, (and the fact that i already have her), that she can produce mana, and tap for green mana. But i was also curous if there was any other r/g generals out there that i may not have come across yet that may be better. Also, maybe some funny combos, etc, if any,

If you wanna splash blue, Riku of Two Reflections can let you double down on the land destruction spells. Maybe also Intet the Dreamer (also RUG colored) for some "free" spells.

 orkkiller21 wrote:
I know I will be the jerk at the table, but i currently have a r/g land destruction edh deck under construction, and was curious on what might be a better commander than Radha? I like Radha mainly since she is a cheap costing commander, (and the fact that i already have her), that she can produce mana, and tap for green mana. But i was also curous if there was any other r/g generals out there that i may not have come across yet that may be better. Also, maybe some funny combos, etc, if any,

thanks!
i can toss up a list of stuff i currently have in mind forit, since its not an official list yet!

You want to play Stax. It is a beautiful play style that does it all: Creature removal, Land Destruction, Board Lockdown.

Shroud, Hexproof, Indestructible? Stax doesn't care, Stax claims all. All hail the power of the Sacrifice.

Here's a good primer for the archtype.

Goblin welder + smokestack comes to mind (it's the original foundation of the the Stax deck mentioned above.

Other goodies to include:
Winter Orb
Jokulhaups
Meekstone
Orcish Lumberjack (if you're going to blow up all lands anyway sacrificing one to do it three turns earlier shouldn't be a problem)
Stone Rain & equivalents (there are abunch of red and green ones)
Wasteland (kinda pricey)
Strip Mine (not so pricey, but strictly better)
Both of the above + Crucible of Worlds.
Sphere of resistance effects
Terravore


Echoing Ruin + Mycosynth Lattice kills all lands of the same name (note that if you target a normal forest while you only have snowcovered ones yours won't be affected but everyone else's will).

Null rod + Mycosynth Lattice (Warning: this turns off all mana that is not generated as a triggered effect or from Elvish/Simian spirit guides FOREVER.)

Sundering Titan + Goblin welder is particularly evil

Titania's Song + Mycosynth Lattice. Kills all lands already in play and new ones as they hit play as a state-based effect (so fast they cannot even be tapped for mana in response, although a Lotus Cobra will still give you a mana), while giving you a 4/4 and a 6/6 beatstick plus whatever other artifacts you have in play.
Obviously, various artifacts that generate R, G, or both types of mana (Mirrodin's Talismans, Mirage's Diamonds, Gruul talismans/guidlstone/keyrunes/whatever.
Myr Landshaper does the same thing to lands with Titania's Song in play, except it only targets one land at a time.

Nature's Revolt (or similar) + Earthquake (or similar) for 2.


If you go for Mayael or some other R/G/W legend and include white you also get access to:
Armageddon + equivalents
Balance + Zuran Orb
Limited Resources
Thalia
Sphere of Law
Nature's Revolt + Humilty does much the same a Lattice + Null Rod except it doesn't shut off artifact mana.
Knight of the Reliquary

What did smoke stacks do again? its been a while.

i still have 4 gob welders

 ChildrenoftheCorns wrote:

Bran Dawri wrote:
Planeswalker abilities can only be used during your turn, not theirs, so using Liliana to deny your opponent their draw step doesn't work. Sorry.

Master of the feast has them draw a card during your own upkeep. Which means if havent yet that turn you may force them to discard.

No, because Planeswalker abilities can still only be used as a sorcery, which means during your main phase when you have priority and the stack is empty. Even if some other spell or effect lets you temporarily use sorceries when you can use instants, a planeswalker activation is not a sorcery and is not affected by that effect.

Sorry, I should have been more specific.

Bran Dawri wrote:

 ChildrenoftheCorns wrote:

Bran Dawri wrote:
Planeswalker abilities can only be used during your turn, not theirs, so using Liliana to deny your opponent their draw step doesn't work. Sorry.

Master of the feast has them draw a card during your own upkeep. Which means if havent yet that turn you may force them to discard.

No, because Planeswalker abilities can still only be used as a sorcery, which means during your main phase when you have priority and the stack is empty. Even if some other spell or effect lets you temporarily use sorceries when you can use instants, a planeswalker activation is not a sorcery and is not affected by that effect.

Sorry, I should have been more specific.

Right, but the combo he is working with is feeding his opponent a card during his own upkeep with Master of the Feast. Provided its not an instant his opponent has mana for, Liliana's discard will kick in during either of his main phases.

 Desubot wrote:
What did smoke stacks do again? its been a while.

i still have 4 gob welders

It looks at your board state and goes: "No, you can't have those things."

 Scrabb wrote:

Bran Dawri wrote:

 ChildrenoftheCorns wrote:

Bran Dawri wrote:
Planeswalker abilities can only be used during your turn, not theirs, so using Liliana to deny your opponent their draw step doesn't work. Sorry.

Master of the feast has them draw a card during your own upkeep. Which means if havent yet that turn you may force them to discard.

No, because Planeswalker abilities can still only be used as a sorcery, which means during your main phase when you have priority and the stack is empty. Even if some other spell or effect lets you temporarily use sorceries when you can use instants, a planeswalker activation is not a sorcery and is not affected by that effect.

Sorry, I should have been more specific.

Right, but the combo he is working with is feeding his opponent a card during his own upkeep with Master of the Feast. Provided its not an instant his opponent has mana for, Liliana's discard will kick in during either of his main phases.

Got it now . I don't see how I missed that one. Cute trick.

Hey folks, another edh deck I am currently almost finished with is my mono-blue Talrand deck, BUT, the hitch is that it only has 4-5 creatures in the entire deck, (since its mostly spells, etc), and I have 3 of the creatures, but i am wondering what might be a fun but obnoxious card to add in for the deck, i was thinking of maybe an aetherling, or echo mage, but i am not yet sure, since there is always something around the corner that would be fun to toss in, any ideas?

What creatures have you already got? What spells?
What is the deck trying to do?

 RivenSkull wrote:

 Desubot wrote:
What did smoke stacks do again? its been a while.

i still have 4 gob welders

It looks at your board state and goes: "No, you can't have those things."

Oh boy

i feel bad for all those lands :/

 Desubot wrote:

 RivenSkull wrote:

 Desubot wrote:
What did smoke stacks do again? its been a while.

i still have 4 gob welders

It looks at your board state and goes: "No, you can't have those things."

Spoiler:

Oh boy

i feel bad for all those lands :/

Despite me liking this kind of stuff being the smug bastard I am, it is more of a delay mechanic because at some point you can/have to sacrifice Smokestack itself.

 Wilytank wrote:

 Desubot wrote:

 RivenSkull wrote:

 Desubot wrote:
What did smoke stacks do again? its been a while.

i still have 4 gob welders

It looks at your board state and goes: "No, you can't have those things."

Spoiler:

Oh boy

i feel bad for all those lands :/

Despite me liking this kind of stuff being the smug bastard I am, it is more of a delay mechanic because at some point you can/have to sacrifice Smokestack itself.

Well the big thing is you use it in conjunction with tokens or other beautiful cards like Martyr's Bonds to wipe their field of lands and with your deck built to withstand losing lands, and you being able to control the pace with Smokestack, you usually end up with 2-3 lands to their none. Deny them resources and you get to really dick them over.

All 4 of my EDH decks are Stax decks. I love the archtype.

Speaking of silly i just heard about this 3 card blind, that looks like a hella brain twister

 RivenSkull wrote:

 Wilytank wrote:

 Desubot wrote:

 RivenSkull wrote:

 Desubot wrote:
What did smoke stacks do again? its been a while.

i still have 4 gob welders

It looks at your board state and goes: "No, you can't have those things."

Spoiler:

Oh boy

i feel bad for all those lands :/

Despite me liking this kind of stuff being the smug bastard I am, it is more of a delay mechanic because at some point you can/have to sacrifice Smokestack itself.

Well the big thing is you use it in conjunction with tokens or other beautiful cards like Martyr's Bonds to wipe their field of lands and with your deck built to withstand losing lands, and you being able to control the pace with Smokestack, you usually end up with 2-3 lands to their none. Deny them resources and you get to really dick them over.

All 4 of my EDH decks are Stax decks. I love the archtype.

That primer you shared inspired me to turn my Rakdos annoyance/discard edh deck into a full-blown stax deck, especially when my existing commander (Malfegor) actually runs pretty well with it. I already have Smoke Stack itself from FTV Annihilation.

 Wilytank wrote:

That primer you shared inspired me to turn my Rakdos annoyance/discard edh deck into a full-blown stax deck, especially when my existing commander (Malfegor) actually runs pretty well with it. I already have Smoke Stack itself from FTV Annihilation.

Well it depends on what you want to do with the deck. There are a number of ways that a Stax deck can be built depending on what you want to target. You can target only creatures, have it be tap lockdown, or full on land destruction. It's very easy to make a deck that can have creature targeting only Stax abilities, as splashing Gravepact or Dictate of Erebos can wreck havoc. But if you want to go land destruction you'll need to go much more with a full Stax type, otherwise plopping down Smokestacks just turns into "I play this card and I guess it will do something. Maybe."

Malfegor might be a poor choice for a general though. Unless you are discarding a ton of creatures and have lots of graveyard return, I wouldn't think that repeatedly discarding your hand would be as effective. If you want to keep with the discard aspect of the deck, a fantastic general is Nekusar, the Mindrazer. Adding in the blue gives you access to a number of great blue lock down enchantments that can keep your opponents from playing anything as they keep drawing and discarding cards. Also, he works wonders with cards like Words of Waste.