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 Wraithlordmechanic wrote:
I always wondered about hellions. They always seemed to fill the category of "cool looking but lackluster".

I didn't realize that Russes weren't considered cool anymore. I guess my Executioner is a fanboy unit now because I love that thing.

Standard battle tank got nerfed with 6th ed, where as the other variants got buffed. If it fires its main cannon its other weapons 'have' to be snapshot (as per the rules) however all of the other variants can move 6 and fire 'everything' because they do not use ordinance weapons (yeah, a plasma tank with plasma cannons, 5 small blasts, gets more at ballistic shots than a normal standard russ, go figure).

Flayed ones.
BURN THE HERETIC!!!!!! WHAT HE SAYS IS HERESY!!!!
But really, they're wonderful (I mean on the table, not those god-aweful models). That and I've just had better luck with than other close combat units, for example my wraiths charged into a unit of TAU of all things and wiffed their rolls, actually losing combat (it was a sad sad day...) but my flayed ones have one of the highest kill counters of all my necrons

Talos pain engines aren't terrible, but compared to flyers and ravagers there isn't much room for them. Still, I love running triple talos lists. The model is so cool, one of my top three models of all.

Viper Jetbikes.

You simply can't run a saim-hann list without them, but they are av10, open topped, 2 hull points... :(

 wolfmerc wrote:
5 chosen all with lightning claws and MoK, 25 ap3 attacks on the charge. these guys beat out bezerkers when it comes to how much crap they can give people. They are so worth it, but god awful expensive. i love them!

Why. Just take Terminators and your actually a bit better off.

Talonair wrote:
My favorite non-competitive unit I own is my ten man Vanguard squad. All jump packs, two PW/SS vets, two PW/PP vets, one Power Fist, one TH, two twin Lightning Claw vets, and a vet with a PW. One game I sent them after a Daemon Prince with a Jump Chaplain and a Jump libby (after Heroic Intervention obviously). The Daemon prince did not know what had hit him

You can't use Heroic Intervention if you attach any ICs.

 spycer wrote:

Talonair wrote:
My favorite non-competitive unit I own is my ten man Vanguard squad. All jump packs, two PW/SS vets, two PW/PP vets, one Power Fist, one TH, two twin Lightning Claw vets, and a vet with a PW. One game I sent them after a Daemon Prince with a Jump Chaplain and a Jump libby (after Heroic Intervention obviously). The Daemon prince did not know what had hit him

You can't use Heroic Intervention if you attach any ICs.

read more closely. he already pointed that out

 varl wrote:

 spycer wrote:

Talonair wrote:
My favorite non-competitive unit I own is my ten man Vanguard squad. All jump packs, two PW/SS vets, two PW/PP vets, one Power Fist, one TH, two twin Lightning Claw vets, and a vet with a PW. One game I sent them after a Daemon Prince with a Jump Chaplain and a Jump libby (after Heroic Intervention obviously). The Daemon prince did not know what had hit him

You can't use Heroic Intervention if you attach any ICs.

read more closely. he already pointed that out

Read more closely, he dropped them WITH the ICs and DID Heroic Intervention, which is not allowed.

 spycer wrote:

 varl wrote:

 spycer wrote:

Talonair wrote:
My favorite non-competitive unit I own is my ten man Vanguard squad. All jump packs, two PW/SS vets, two PW/PP vets, one Power Fist, one TH, two twin Lightning Claw vets, and a vet with a PW. One game I sent them after a Daemon Prince with a Jump Chaplain and a Jump libby (after Heroic Intervention obviously). The Daemon prince did not know what had hit him

You can't use Heroic Intervention if you attach any ICs.

read more closely. he already pointed that out

Read more closely, he dropped them WITH the ICs and DID Heroic Intervention, which is not allowed.

Read more closely. He said they joined them after Heroic Intervention.

I'm not going to put words in Talonair's mouth, but my reading was they deep struck, heroically intervened and then were joined by the ICs to spank the demon prince in a subsequent turn. otherwise, why would he bother to point out "after heroic invervention obviously"?

Fair enough, I see how you read that, and it could be meant that way. I read WITH to mean Deepstruck with, not joined after.

Which still seems pointless. If you deepstrike them and DO use Heroic Intervention, then the ICs cannot be part of that squad. If they join the squad on a subsequent turn, for a second assault, fine.
If they join the same combat that was Heroic Intervention'd into, the Vets squad doesn't get the bonus from the Chaplain and the ICs fight separate from the Vets, as they are not in the same squad, just the same combat.

Heroic Intervention (SM p 62) says they cannot use the ability if there is an IC attached. Attached at all, not just during DS placement. If they DS on to the board, and then any IC joins them, they are not allowed to assault that turn, RAW.

Squads of Kanz seem to suck, But I still use them, EN MASSE

 spycer wrote:
Fair enough, I see how you read that, and it could be meant that way. I read WITH to mean Deepstruck with, not joined after.

Which still seems pointless. If you deepstrike them and DO use Heroic Intervention, then the ICs cannot be part of that squad. If they join the squad on a subsequent turn, for a second assault, fine.
If they join the same combat that was Heroic Intervention'd into, the Vets squad doesn't get the bonus from the Chaplain and the ICs fight separate from the Vets, as they are not in the same squad, just the same combat.

Heroic Intervention (SM p 62) says they cannot use the ability if there is an IC attached. Attached at all, not just during DS placement. If they DS on to the board, and then any IC joins them, they are not allowed to assault that turn, RAW.

What I do is deep strike the Vanguards separately to the Chaplain and Libby. The Vanguards maul a unit close to them, and join up with the ICs next turn, and THEN they go maul more difficult targets (ie, Daemon Princes and the like)

What I do is deep strike the Vanguards separately to the Chaplain and Libby. The Vanguards maul a unit close to them, and join up with the ICs next turn, and THEN they go maul more difficult targets (ie, Daemon Princes and the like)

Gotcha. That is a totally valid tactic, I just misunderstood. So you have HI turn to eat a small squad, and then IC turn to eat DP/HQ/Deathstar. Not at the same time.

 dreamakuma wrote:
Squads of Kanz seem to suck, But I still use them, EN MASSE

I played my first game with my new Ork force, and I'd only really got my Dread mob ready. Apparently Grotzookas do disgusting things to Necrons after a few direct hits.That, and the last surviving Nob of my Trukk mob punched a Monolith so hard it exploded.

My Deff Dread never makes it into combat, but that just lets the Kanz run amok instead.

My Orks are Blood Axe themed, so I think I'll be getting some Kommandos even with their slightly pants rules (and significantly more pants points cost)

 spycer wrote:
Fair enough, I see how you read that, and it could be meant that way. I read WITH to mean Deepstruck with, not joined after.

Which still seems pointless. If you deepstrike them and DO use Heroic Intervention, then the ICs cannot be part of that squad. If they join the squad on a subsequent turn, for a second assault, fine.
If they join the same combat that was Heroic Intervention'd into, the Vets squad doesn't get the bonus from the Chaplain and the ICs fight separate from the Vets, as they are not in the same squad, just the same combat.

Heroic Intervention (SM p 62) says they cannot use the ability if there is an IC attached. Attached at all, not just during DS placement. If they DS on to the board, and then any IC joins them, they are not allowed to assault that turn, RAW.

You do realise this is a thread about being non-competitive right?

I'm sure he does, but it's more than fair for spycer to point out things that seem like they might have been played wrong. I'd certainly want to know I was fielding something illegally before I found out table-side

edit: and back on topic, I really have a burning desire to run a unit of vanguard vets. they're absurdly expensive, but damned if they don't embody everything that assault marines should be! here's hoping the next SM codex balances things out a bit. I mean, c'mon... we have to buy our damn jump packs?! so uncool :p

 varl wrote:
I'm sure he does, but it's more than fair for spycer to point out things that seem like they might have been played wrong. I'd certainly want to know I was fielding something illegally before I found out table-side

edit: and back on topic, I really have a burning desire to run a unit of vanguard vets. they're absurdly expensive, but damned if they don't embody everything that assault marines should be! here's hoping the next SM codex balances things out a bit. I mean, c'mon... we have to buy our damn jump packs?! so uncool :p

O I had no issue with the rules question, just the comment about a better way to use them in a thread about being non-competitive just seemed out of place.

I still do field my Vanguard from time to time, because I got given a Finecast box of them as a present (really good moulds as well) adn I just love the models.

Well, my Eldar army usually includes a large Seer Council on foot led by a Fortuneseer and a PL. The PL like Fuegan walks in front and is there to soak up wounds.
This unit can be successful if used correctly.

I used to run a unit of grot commandos, 10 gretchin and a slaver with a tankbustabomb and a chopper... They once took out a crimson fists dredd and in another game 2 thousand sons chosen termies, one through shooting and another in combat!

I still field my 5 man assault squad with a PP on one marine, rather than on the Sgt. Mostly they die horribly, but sometimes they spring from behind something and contest an objective, or crash into a weakened squad and finish them off. Not "worth it" at all, but they were my first squad I ever owned, so I usually take them.

my attilan rough riders, penal troopers, and hellhounds all get feilded...

mainly cause of rule of cool... seriously, attilan rough riders are awesome looking!

everyone tells me they are non competitive, but they do pretty good actually, I usually make their points back at least...

even had an 80pt penal trooper squad roll the +1 A and rending in CC and take out squads of obliterators, more often then not they act as an 80 pt unit with scout+ outflank that gets to and holds objectives well.

Stingwigs are the "so called" uncompetitive unit Ive used for a long time.

Possessed. The models are awesome and people underestimate them. Once they finally make it into combat, they're pretty devastating. And if you make your own out of generic CSM models it's a lot of fun. I need to get the new daemon codex so I can try out the combos, as well as giving warp talons a shot. I REALLY want warp talons and I even bought a box, but I turned them into raptors instead. I play against a lot of swarms and I think the talons could do some pretty funny stuff.

@Munga

I agree with you on possessed. Even though they are abit random, they can be awesome in close combat. If you give them MOT or a rhino then they might last long enough to get close combat.

 Eldarslayer26 wrote:
@Munga

I agree with you on possessed. Even though they are abit random, they can be awesome in close combat. If you give them MOT or a rhino then they might last long enough to get close combat.

I footslog them with MoS and fnp. What they hit stays hit.