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Da krimson barun wrote:
"YOU GIT!IZ GORGUTZ EAD UNTER AND YOU FINK IZ GOFF MUZIC!?COME ER SO I CAN PUT YOU ON ME POINTY STIK!SKULLZ FOR DA POINTY STIK!"

No, Gorguts is deff metul.

This is goff music:

Da krimson barun wrote:
"YOU GIT!IZ GORGUTZ EAD UNTER AND YOU FINK IZ GOFF MUZIC!?COME ER SO I CAN PUT YOU ON ME POINTY STIK!SKULLZ FOR DA POINTY STIK!"

BLUD FUH DA RED PAINT, 'EADZ FUH DA BOSSPOLE!

Can't waite to see some new ork stuff come out! Way over due!

Nidsnik Boreork wrote:

Da krimson barun wrote:
"YOU GIT!IZ GORGUTZ EAD UNTER AND YOU FINK IZ GOFF MUZIC!?COME ER SO I CAN PUT YOU ON ME POINTY STIK!SKULLZ FOR DA POINTY STIK!"

BLUD FUH DA RED PAINT, 'EADZ FUH DA BOSSPOLE!

Hrm, Khornate Ork? Interesting...
I better add this to the Orkonomicon. *Scribble-scribble...*

 Lord Gatlas wrote:

Nidsnik Boreork wrote:

Da krimson barun wrote:
"YOU GIT!IZ GORGUTZ EAD UNTER AND YOU FINK IZ GOFF MUZIC!?COME ER SO I CAN PUT YOU ON ME POINTY STIK!SKULLZ FOR DA POINTY STIK!"

BLUD FUH DA RED PAINT, 'EADZ FUH DA BOSSPOLE!

Hrm, Khornate Ork? Interesting...
I better add this to the Orkonomicon. *Scribble-scribble...*

"DONT FERGET DA STORMBOYZ O CORN!WAAAGH KILL HUMIES!!

Lifta droppa mounted on a battlewagon

Lifta droppa is a FW gun...and it got nerfed to hell and back anyway.

Also, dropping ork boyz to 5pts would be nice but not really needed. Theyre not as powerful as they were when first introduced because the other armies got cheaper, but theyre still good. Its every "special boy" that needs a price cut big time. Tankbustas would be fine if they had tank/monster hunter, lootas obviously are fine where they are, but stormboyz kommandoz and burnas need a cut bad lol or same cost but 4+ armor for free, because right now they cost way more than an 'ard boy.

I think Ork flash gitz should have an assload of options. different weapons, combi-gear, squigs, random grots! No 2 models in any army should be the same.

Ive always thought it would be fun too field a mob of mad boyz. They could have similar stat line to boyz but shepaer and have no sluggs just choppas and some special rule rule that makes them do really weird stuff

I would LOVE feral orks as a supplement! Does anyone remember those lovelies from chapter approved?

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Lifta droppa is a FW gun...and it got nerfed to hell and back anyway.

Lol its still a fun gun and it has been fun since epic 40k and final liberation on windows 95. Just because its forge world now does not mean it's excluded as something i'd like to see in the new dex. nerf or not.

A gun that does absolutely nothing four out of six times and very little for the rest of the time is not fun.

Forgeworld literally nerfed the fun out of the lifta-droppa.

Lol so buff it

I don't understand the debate over the Lifta Droppa. It's a great concept. Yes, the rules are bad right now... isn't that all the more reason for them to be rewritten for the new Dex?

 Lord Gatlas wrote:
I think Ork flash gitz should have an assload of options. different weapons, combi-gear, squigs, random grots! No 2 models in any army should be the same.

This this this this this!!!!!!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Quientin wrote:

 Vineheart01 wrote:
Lifta droppa is a FW gun...and it got nerfed to hell and back anyway.

Lol its still a fun gun and it has been fun since epic 40k and final liberation on windows 95. Just because its forge world now does not mean it's excluded as something i'd like to see in the new dex. nerf or not.

Personally i have not used the lifta droppa. But i would have loved to, tell me, What was it like?

 Ugin, the Owl King wrote:
I don't understand the debate over the Lifta Droppa. It's a great concept. Yes, the rules are bad right now... isn't that all the more reason for them to be rewritten for the new Dex?

Generally speaking, Games workshop doesn't cannibalize stuff from Forge world, as it'd be eating into it's own profits.

Making Ork Boyz cheaper wouldn't help - because they still wouldn't be good. Simple points adjustments won't make them more viable; Ork players can already max out the Troops slots in most games if they wanted. What is needed is some way to ensure that they can do their intended job - i.e. overwhelm the enemy in melee by strength of numbers.

 Charles Rampant wrote:
Making Ork Boyz cheaper wouldn't help - because they still wouldn't be good. Simple points adjustments won't make them more viable; Ork players can already max out the Troops slots in most games if they wanted. What is needed is some way to ensure that they can do their intended job - i.e. overwhelm the enemy in melee by strength of numbers.

Sorry in advance, because this might sound like an ad hominem attack directed at you; it's not meant to be.

In my experience, people who think that Ork boyz aren't good either don't play Orks themselves (and don't have to face good Ork players frequently), or do play Orks and are just inferior players. I say this as an extremely experienced Ork player (17 years); boyz have been better and they have been worse than they are now, but they have never been bad. We can enter into a debate about their relative strengths and weaknesses, and you'd be right to list a whole lot of problems with the ladz.

I think the problem with Orks is that the boyz are not supported. If boyz had a dedicated transport with AVs between the Trukk and the BW (that could still hold 20 orks), they'd be much more effective. Or even if boyz could just straight-up take BWs, and BWs were 80 points. If their Looted Wagons were legitimate battle tanks even nearly as good as a Russ, they'd be much better off. If Flash Gitz were cheaper and reasonably reliable, so there was another shooty alternative to Lootaz, that'd also be nice. The problem is that boyz are good, but Orks are rapidly approaching becoming a one-trick pony. They need decent support, so opponents are distracted from just killing boyz and winning games.

That being said, I think the new cover rules pretty much necessitate a 6+ FnP for all Orks, across the board.

I have only been playing Ork for a few months, but I agree with Ugin.

There doesn't seem to be a problem with the number of boyz I can take at any point level I have played at.

But some better transport options would be most welcome. I find that I just don't have good transport options for my boyz.

As for those options I am not sure, I haven't been playing long enough to feel confident enough to offer a detailed opinion.

Would love to see some revamped Flash Gitz, they are to cool to be as worthless as they are now.

Also, I think Flash Gitz should stay in HS, but have access to a BW as DT. Why?

The Elites slot is already crowded, and has the best shooty unit in the Dex. If you want to go all the way shooty, then you should be able to take a few Flash Gitz without sacrificing Lootaz.

Also, pretty much every single unit should have access to BWs as a DT. That would almost single-handedly fix Orks difficulty as a contender in high points games. BWs are NOT AN EFFECTIVE BATTLE TANK, so they shouldn't cost 90 points, and/or they shouldn't take up a HS slot. If the Killkannon were effective and actually worth taking, then it should obviously remain unavailable on DT BWs. I could even see the same argument being made about Deffrollas (which will probably be nerfed, and so it won't matter)/

Flash Gitz and Lootas should be swapped. Lootas in HS, Gitz in Elite. Why? Because Lootas are almost the definition of Heavy Support! They carry the only Boy-portable Heavy weapon in the Codex, fer cryin out loud!

Or, if you want to take Gitz in HS, then allow them to buy upgrades that stack multiple times. I'd pay 25 points per model to upgrade the strength of its gun to Str 10, even on a 24" range gun.

 Ugin, the Owl King wrote:

 Charles Rampant wrote:
Making Ork Boyz cheaper wouldn't help - because they still wouldn't be good. Simple points adjustments won't make them more viable; Ork players can already max out the Troops slots in most games if they wanted. What is needed is some way to ensure that they can do their intended job - i.e. overwhelm the enemy in melee by strength of numbers.

Sorry in advance, because this might sound like an ad hominem attack directed at you; it's not meant to be.

In my experience, people who think that Ork boyz aren't good either don't play Orks themselves (and don't have to face good Ork players frequently), or do play Orks and are just inferior players. I say this as an extremely experienced Ork player (17 years); boyz have been better and they have been worse than they are now, but they have never been bad. We can enter into a debate about their relative strengths and weaknesses, and you'd be right to list a whole lot of problems with the ladz.

I think the problem with Orks is that the boyz are not supported. If boyz had a dedicated transport with AVs between the Trukk and the BW (that could still hold 20 orks), they'd be much more effective. Or even if boyz could just straight-up take BWs, and BWs were 80 points. If their Looted Wagons were legitimate battle tanks even nearly as good as a Russ, they'd be much better off. If Flash Gitz were cheaper and reasonably reliable, so there was another shooty alternative to Lootaz, that'd also be nice. The problem is that boyz are good, but Orks are rapidly approaching becoming a one-trick pony. They need decent support, so opponents are distracted from just killing boyz and winning games.

That being said, I think the new cover rules pretty much necessitate a 6+ FnP for all Orks, across the board.

Had to quote this for truth. Perfect analysis of the current ork problem.

However, I'd still like to see a point drop for ork boyz, simply to make it easier to bring more toys. The "boyz before toyz" mantra mostly stems from boyz being cheap while everything else isn't. I also don't think that the 90 points on a battlewagon is a problem. It's still a large assault transport with AV14/12/10, that's something no one else gets. The deff rolla is just the icing on the cake. If boyz (and more importantly, their nobz) drop in points, a unit of battlewagon boyz would also drop in total, pretty much resulting in the same thing you suggest.

Anvildude wrote:
Flash Gitz and Lootas should be swapped. Lootas in HS, Gitz in Elite. Why? Because Lootas are almost the definition of Heavy Support! They carry the only Boy-portable Heavy weapon in the Codex, fer cryin out loud!

No, they shouldn't be. Heavy support is for heavy stuff, like deff dreads, battlewagons, big gunz and whatnot. Boyz with special weapons do not belong there, nor do shooty nobz. Lootaz are just a medium strength medium range unit compared to the rest of the game, more like stern guard, fire dragons or purifiers than devastators, havocs or dark reapers.

Just because we don't get any good shooting, doesn't mean that the single decent gun we get is atomatically our equivalent of a leman russ, a predator or a fire prism. At least to me, lootaz aren't even remotely "heavy". If lootaz actually had a gun that would be on par with missile launchers or lascannons, that would be "heavy".

Are Lootas not the equivalent of a Devestator squad? Dark reapers (though those might be elite? don't know Pansy Force Org)? Obliteraters? There's plenty of precedent for a 'medium' shooty unit in Heavy Support.

People keep saying lootas should be in heavy because theyre basically orky devastator and they provide cover fire, which heavy normally does if it isnt being used for durable things.

People dont realize though that if you swap them, you break the codex. Wagon lists are jack squat without loota support, and if theyre the same FOC slot you cant have both anymore.

I would love a BW as a dedicated transport. I was going to mention it actually and im glad someone else brought it up. Boyz could probably use a points reduction and/or a 6+FNP. Given the way that new codexs points are going on basic troops, I wouldnt be surprised to see a points reduction.

i'd be fine taking BW as heavy like usual for my boyz but i'd love Ramshackle on that thing lol.

S4 on 20 models is usually 1/3 of the models dead when its just a tshirt save. S3 on the other hand, you might cause 4-5 wounds instead of nearly double that. Every time my BW blows up i lose 8-10 orks. That makes them as pointless as Trukk boyz, and about the same numbers after a trukk exploded too.

EmperorsChosen wrote:
Would love to see some revamped Flash Gitz, they are to cool to be as worthless as they are now.

This should be reason enough for writers to make worthwhile units. Let this be your motivation: Cool = Good.

Big Mek Dattrukk wrote:
Bring back the 3rd Ed version of Waaagh. Instead of getting Fleet, they do a "size check" (leadership test against current mob size) and get +1 attack and Double initiative if passed. Ghazkull instead allows all units to auto pass.

Give the truly dedicated shooting units (lootas, Flash gits) +1 BS and -1 WS to compensate (they spend so much time shooting they forgot how to krump good and proppa)

Make Mega armor and option for nobz, rather than a different unit.

bring back Nazdreg, and give him the special rule that he can allow d3 units to deepstrike. (his Telly Portas)

Add Bad Doks to the list of HQs, allowing units to take Painboyz at 15points instead of nobs.

Give Big choppa's an AP value.

bring back the Dakka Dread. (can replace its CCWs to make the guns TL)

Give the Kans something to make them a little more durable.

Give tank bustas some form of ranged Melta. (even if it only has the stat line of a melta pistol)

That would be godly.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I am not only looking for a new codex but 7 supplement books for the 6 klans and 1 for freebooters!
like evilsunz can strap turbo boostas onto your vehcles bikes as troops and so on
snakebits can be immune to all poison attacks and squiggoths for pete's sake!
goffs a variety of krump ugrades and cqan give your trukk a bigger crew compartment
badmoons cna give you flashy and snazzy gunz
blood axes can have camo armour and have BS3 because they learnt how to shoot
deffskullz can loot all vehicles and have their stats!
then there are freebooters they have beeter snazzgunz and some other freebooter stuff like kannonz carried but an orkboy!

All Orks loot vehicles. Deffskullz and Blood Axes just do it best. I don't mean to be pedantic, but Looted Wagon rules shouldn't apply to Deffskullz only. My fear is that the consensus has shifted such that a lot of players think of Looted Wagons as a Deffskull thing. Seriously, one time I posted a picture of a Blood Axe detachment with two Looted Russes, and I got multiple responses back to the effect that my detachment looked more like a Deffskullz force. This in spite of extensive kammo.

This would be tragic if it spread. I love my Blood Axes, and I can't imagine playing them without Looted Wagons. I've stood by this unit despite how bad it is (hey, it's still a fairly cheap pie plate, and it can make up its points in Beakies with some small luck and KFF/cover). But using Imperial technology (including tanks) is as much a part of traditional Blood Axe fluff as looting the battlefield is a part of Deffskull fluff. I would hate it if the Blood Axe equivalent of Chapter Tactics (which we will hopefully finally get) doesn't include Looted Wagons (especially Imperial ones), or if only Deffskullz get good rules for looting.