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Monster Rain wrote:If you're breaking laws I think that means your wish to be "left alone" is irrelevant.

Which isn't to say they should have been burned, of course.

Uh... they burned themselves. It was a suicide thing.

I think there's some debate on that point, but I think a dissection of the events of the Waco Seige might be a little off-topic.

The main point was that if you open fire on people trying to serve a warrant, legally obtained based on legitimate concerns that you're breaking several laws, you are not a sympathetic figure in the eyes of most reasonable people.

 Monster Rain wrote:
I think there's some debate on that point, but I think a dissection of the events of the Waco Seige might be a little off-topic.

The main point was that if you open fire on people trying to serve a warrant, legally obtained based on legitimate concerns that you're breaking several laws, you are not a sympathetic figure in the eyes of most reasonable people.

And then when the government kills everyone in the house, the government is not a sympathetic figure in the eyes of the most reasonable people.

 Frazzled wrote:

 Monster Rain wrote:
I think there's some debate on that point, but I think a dissection of the events of the Waco Seige might be a little off-topic.

The main point was that if you open fire on people trying to serve a warrant, legally obtained based on legitimate concerns that you're breaking several laws, you are not a sympathetic figure in the eyes of most reasonable people.

And then when the government kills everyone in the house, the government is not a sympathetic figure in the eyes of the most reasonable people.

Of course most reasonable people would know better than to think of the government in terms like sympathetic or empathetic, and would also not believe such foolishness as the government just going into a burning house and killing everyone for the lulz, or that they even did that.

I do love when you try to pretend to know what a reasonable person would think though. It shows imagination.

 Da Boss wrote:
It's not strange, but it is worth reflecting on. I'm not trying to piss anyone off.

Alot of what happens in the middle east is simply sectarian violence and has been on-going for hundreds or even a thousand plus years.

 Ahtman wrote:
I do love when you try to pretend to know what a reasonable person would think though. It shows imagination.

Thanks! At least someone recognizes the effort it takes for me.

 Frazzled wrote:

 Ahtman wrote:
I do love when you try to pretend to know what a reasonable person would think though. It shows imagination.

Thanks! At least someone recognizes the effort it takes for me.

I just assume that anyone that has made their way to OT would be far enough down the rabbit hole that 'reasonable' would not be an apt description, so I probably should have said "when we try to pretend".

 Frazzled wrote:

And then when the government kills everyone in the house, the government is not a sympathetic figure in the eyes of the most reasonable people.

There is, as I understand it, some controversy surrounding your claim that the government was responsible for starting the fire or that the heads of this order, that condoned Koresh taking several wives aged 12 and 13 up and maintained that the end of the world was upon them, living as they did in a fortress armed to the teeth for a siege, decided to 'go out with a bang'.

Everyone I know was very upset about the children and got the sense that likely there were people who wanted to leave, but that the majority were a hotbed of total lunatics that condoned child abuse 'in the name of god' and that forming yourselves into a small army and fortifying yourselves to fight the government was not very in keeping with anything they could remember reading in the Bible. I was raised Methodist and I have not one jot of sympathy with their apocalyptic nonsense or the wickedness they perpetrated in their fortress, only for those they inflicted their evil ways on, in service to Koresh, a false messiah.

Thankfully some one has bought up this domain before a nutjob did

 Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:
Thankfully some one has bought up this domain before a nutjob did

Genius

 Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:
Thankfully some one has bought up this domain before a nutjob did

I think this is one of those times were we're grateful for small mercies. Alex Jones may be cursing the name of the person who bought it though

 Dreadclaw69 wrote:

 Hlaine Larkin mk2 wrote:
Thankfully some one has bought up this domain before a nutjob did

I think this is one of those times were we're grateful for small mercies. Alex Jones may be cursing the name of the person who bought it though

Whoever did that, my hat goes off to them.

 Da Boss wrote:
I hope those who were injured recover. What a horrible event.

It does strike me that if something like this happened in Iraq or Afganistan or the Sudan, it wouldn't even be a blip on our radar, let alone the depth of emotion some are experiencing.

A good example of the power of "us" and "them" in psychology, I think.

MGS, MR, I'm glad you and your families were unharmed.

Something did happen in Iraq that day. Several bombs across multiple cites, over 20 dead, over 100 wounded.

Obama is giving a press conference now

**edit**
No firm suspect(s) yet, and he spoke glowingly of the American public who helped in this time of need and that he is determined that those responsible will be brought to justice.

I'm a noted right-wing person on these forums but I must say that the First responders of Boston have been heroic in everything they have done.

President Obama who I do not like has been out front and done a superlative job.

To MGS and anyone else who was in that area or knew someone who was I am so glad to hear that everyone is alright

to the family of that 8 year old boy whose mother is in ICU and whose sister lost a leg, I cannot hope to understand your grief but you have my prayers and every wish that justice will be served.

To the Fething Gakhole who did this. I hope you get what you deserve Coward.

*crackes knuckles*

Time to put this gun culture to use, Autobots transform and roll out!

But seriously, Captain Collius, MGS, and several others have stated it better than I could.

I'm just getting upset with the rare media outlet that is choosing this as a point in time to attack the president for this.

I got to "enjoy" an hour of a sports talk radio discussing this. While one of the hosts was (as always) calm, cool, and collected, his co-host was yelling up a fething storm, outraged that Obama wasn't outraged at this, and that it would be Benghazi all over again, and that he was ticked that our President wasn't angry about an event that attacked our country and caused the death of an 8 year old boy... He didn't like it when a caller pointed out that to assume our President wasn't upset and angry was childish...

I don't have anytime for people trying to use this horrific event to score political points before the bodies are even cold, and while many people are still in surgery or being treated.

 captain collius wrote:
I'm a noted right-wing person on these forums but I must say that the First responders of Boston have been heroic in everything they have done.

President Obama who I do not like has been out front and done a superlative job.

To MGS and anyone else who was in that area or knew someone who was I am so glad to hear that everyone is alright

As the President himself said, these sorts of things transcend political boundaries, and judging by the comments on here and my own feelings on the matter, national ones too.
Though some'll try to take advantage - they always do - the vast majority of people will keep a stiff upper lip, to use the age-old cliche, and show the people responsible that they will not be cowed.
The best response to terrorists is to show that they have no power over you, and carry on defiantly in the face of their actions.

My apolgise for the comment, I let my anger get the better of me.

I've never heard of any teenagers in a modern developed nation detonating a couple bombs just for the lolz. Even teens that would be inclined to mug someone, vandalize property, or commit a burglery. Its a huge step between that and setting a bomb off.

My point was that Teens can do stupid things without thinking of the repercussions, maybe they didn't know tge bomb was going to bs as powerful, hell 3 kids killed a homeless man a few days ago, up there age a bit, add stupididty and drugs and anything could happen

The Dark Apostle wrote:
Haven't read the whole thread so there's prob sone news I don't now,
But anyway, back home in ireland theres some scumbags that call themselves the IRA, (they disgrace the proud name of the IRA that helped liberate my country from british rule) they are scum bags that do what they can for money and drama, they kill when they can and don't care, I'm sorry for this incident in Boston (hell Im 1/4 bostonish) buts Americas gotta stop getting so worked up with this, irelands been a horrible target for "terrorism" yet the only people that care is britian, that's only because there also targeted by the same people. My dearest sympathies to the targets of this, probably just scumbags looking for attention, or teenagers doing something "wild" and having it get out of hand.

Words fail me.

I find the idea of this being cause by teens extremely unlikely, even if coked up to the eyeballs and so full of stupid they could power fifty Fox editorials.
For one thing, the blasts bookended the parade route, which speaks of malicious intent rather than "lol let's scare the bejesus out of some people."

Well, not even 24 hours have passed and we have Congressmen spewing their partisan bile.

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/barney-frank-no-tax-cut-would-have-helped-us-deal_717921.html

Well, Frank is no longer in Congess.

Thankfully.

Yeah, someone wanting to do that is just going to get some firecrackers or something. Not make an actual bomb, which requires a fair amount of planning and malicious intent. Not to mention some skill.

Woah...

http://www.usnews.com/news/politics/articles/2013/04/16/person-briefed-on-probe-bombs-in-pressure-cookers

A person briefed on the Boston Marathon investigation says the explosives were in 6-liter pressure cookers and placed in black duffel bags.
The person says the explosives were placed on the ground and contained shards of metal, nails and ball bearings. The person spoke on the condition of anonymity because the investigation was ongoing.

The person says law enforcement officials have some of the bomb components but did not yet know what was used to set off the explosives.

The Dark Apostle wrote:
**snip**

You aren't the only person on the forums from Ireland, I grew up in the North during the Troubles. What happened in the North doesn't take away from the fact that innocent people have been killed and maimed. Just ask the family of the 8 year old boys who was killed after meeting his father at the finish line, his mother and sister are still being treated in hospital.

So lets concentrate on those caught up in events

Absolutely horrible - and I'm going to take this opportunity to state my opposition to "The Dark Apostle" 's comments - because saying that "Americas gotta stop getting so worked up with this" is completely revolting in it's thoughtlessness.

Saying "Irelands been a horrible target for "terrorism"" doesn't make Boston any less of a terrible act - just because one person feels pain, does not make the pain of others irrelevant.

I hope the people still in hospital pull through.

I give the victims my dearest sympathies